Hey so I'm making a deck around Jinxed Choker and a question has popped into my head. Basically I make it so that I make infinite mana and activate it's ability as many times as I want. Once my turn ends and I pass it to someone, they die. My question is when they die, does Jinxed Choker go back to me? Or do they still get to choose who gains control of it? Sorry I don't have the link to the card cause I'm a noob. Ready set answer. Reference rules pls
First off, you should not be posting this here. This is a rules question, not a competitive legacy combo deck.
Second, in regards to competitive legacy decks, 1v1, they die, you win, game over. Shuffle up and board for game two. In multiplayer, you will regain control, losing the game during your next upkeep unless you can remove all counters.
I have decided to start messing around with Doomsday for fun and see the reaction from my lgs. So I have looked over the sheet from the premier and I am trying to understand all those piles. The only ones I cannot understand are the lines with the card "X" in the hand. What is "X"? I keep messing up and I have not come across those scenarios yet so...
Hey guys. So my LGS had a tournament and first place was a revised dual land. This was my first tournament in over three years and the only deck I had after selling off all my dual lands and everything. I ran the following list.
I had no idea what the meta was but I felt this is the most streamlined.
Round 1 - Elves (0-1)
0-2
Game 1 - I missed played the end of this game bad. He 5 life left and I was at 2. He had Deathrite Shaman with no creatures or spells in the yards so I stupidly slam 2 Fireblasts at the same time. He lets the first resolve and eats it.
Game 2 - I am on the play. He mulled to 5 so I figured I could suspend my Rift Bolts turn 2. He was able to get 15 dudes on the field, finding the hoof to kick my teeth in... I had both a Pyrostatic Pillar and an Eidolon of the Great Revel in my hand. I think it may have been those "first" tournament jitters.
How do we fight elves? Do we kill off their sources? Race them? How do you guys combat them?
Round 2 - 12 Post (1-1)
2-1
Game 1 - I won the roll and burnt him out before anything really happened.
Game 2 - I got him down to 2 and tried to bolt him, but he triple crop rotated in response for 2 Glimmer Posts and a Vesuva, gaining 15. I was hellbent and he got Primeval Titan, gaining more life.
Game 3 - He, again gained a ton of life with Glimmer Post's affect but this caused him to have 12 nonbasic lands, allowing my 2 Price of Progresses to win me the game.
Round 3 - Lands (2-1)
2-1
Game 1 - I won the roll, winning right in the cross hairs of a Marit Lage.
Game 2 - Turn 3 Marit Lage, turn 4 dead...
Game 3 - Same as one... Is lands really this consistent?
Round 4 - Lands (3-1)
2-0
This round was completely different. First, this was against my buddy who I have never defeated in a tournament. I got him into magic and then I took my hiatus and sold almost everything.
Game 1 - He played 5 lands and... game 2.
Game 2 - He go a turn 2 Chalice of Void which I hit with a turn 2 Smash to Smithereens. He gambled twice and I rolled for those exact cards. He then drew and congratulated me on my first win against him. Lands is not as consistent as I thought.
Cut to Top 4
So I made it 3-1, 4th seed. I was having so much fun and the deck was running great, minus round 1. It was just like the old times.
Semi-Finals - Miracles 2-0
Game 1 - He never found Counter Balance. All my spells hit mostly uncontested.
Game 2 - Exquisite Firecraft is amazing. With how slow the matchup, I understand why its is at least a 3 of. He was at 3 with the lock. I waited 2 turns until I had a 2 bolt effects. I fired off a Lava Spike to test the waters. He topped, and tapped it, allowing me to respond with Lightning Bolt for game.
Finals - Death and Taxes 2-1
Game 1 - He hit a turn 3 Batterskull. I see where my hand sucked. I could not keep up with the 4 life a turn.
Game 2 - He got a turn 2 Thalia but Grim Lavamancer helped keep her off the board. This allowed me to burn him out quicker.
Game 3 - I got 3 Goblin Guides out and burnt his board out of the way. After 4 turns, I won the Underground Sea.
I honestly did not go in there expecting to win or anything. But I do have some questions.
First, how do we beat Elves? Are they just a combo deck we need to out run? Hope they do not have a nuts draw? And would Grafdigger's Cage be appropriate to bring in?
Second, Grafdigger's Cage, what are better options? What suggestions would you have to optimize the sideboard?
And lastly, I have read the past 10 or so pages and I have seen the numbers, but, not based on numbers, how has everyone's experiences been with Monastery Swift? It seems like you are more go go go but I play very... control like? I like to hold back depending on what is going on, what spells I have, but with her on the field, it seems like you need to unload all the time, every turn.
Let me know what you guys think and what you have experienced.
I think throwing the Troll into Living End would be pretty darn powerful. Maybe even Madrush Cyclops would be worth running, then.
Living end would make GGT enter as a 0/0, and it would die. Unless you mean making them dredge their creatures, but then they would risk milling their Cascade cards or Living End.
"If an effect puts Golgari Grave-Troll onto the battlefield from your graveyard, Golgari Grave-Troll counts itself as one of the cards in your graveyard and gets a counter accordingly." - Ruling on Gatherer. He is at least a 1/1. Maybe he sees the others too? Not sure on this but he is a 1/1 minimum.
Karn Tron is ramp. It really doesn't feel like it is anything else. Get a lot of mana, blow up the field a little, play a fatty, gg. Or do the board wipes count it as another category?
Try not to be too sad that Ritual Gifts is so much better than UR Storm.
Why aren't there too many numbers supporting the deck? According to mtgpulse, there are only 11 decks to place in events in paper, and ur storm has 112... and these are from GP Philly on (97 vs. 1325 including online). Unless you are going by golf scoring, Ritual Gifts is not better. Maybe the MU is better for gifts, but overall, ur storm has it.
You may want to place in a few more paper tournaments so you can have facts backing your your claims. One good MU does not make a deck better. Your claim is like me saying Karn Tron beats Jund and Pod so it is the best deck, it beats 2 tier one decks.
Holy poop... you are right... i was looking through my deck and idk why it didnt click... I do that all the time. I have no idea what I was thinking sorry... idk which deck I had on my mind... better not pull something like this tonight >.< haha
this deck plays liliana, confidant, tidehollow sculler, meddling mage, revoker.
g1: try to combo off but am 1 mana short of winning. he kills with geist
g2: land a turn 2 blood moon and he scoops
g3: he plays inquisitions and thoughtseizes but i land ascension. make 18 goblins and attack. he casts zealous persecution to wipe my board. second main phase i combo out again and kill with grapeshot
Can you post your list or at least explain how you were able to get a turn 2 Blood Moon? Do you run Spirit Guides? With my deck, turn 3 is the fastest I have gotten Blood Moon down. What accelerators do you run? I went back 4 or 5 pages looking to see if you posted a list but I did not see one.
If game one, your opponent tapped out each turn for the first 3 or 4 turns, keep them in. If they left mana up most the time, board them and react game 3.
So it is City of Brass without the minor draw back. Looking at several lists, Gemstone Mine is the worst rainbow land we have. But when ever I play, the counters rarely, if ever matter. I think it hindered me in one game, but even then, I do not recall a way I could have won. The Legacy Thread is talking about this card and I was wondering what your opinions were. What should our "revised" mana base look like? Unlike in Legacy Rishadan Port sees no (or little but I have not personally ran into it) play, and if it did, would it really hinder us that much to tap down one land to deal one damage to us? I feel that their goal should not be mana denial but GY denial... Or am I missing something super important about this card?
I'm curious, do the non-DR versions just nickle and dime the opponent with 2/2 zombies over several turns? Or is there something I'm missing? I used to play Dredge, as Beralt mentions, back when it was called Ichorid. Relying on Unmasks and Cabal Therapy to hopefully clear the way for an alpha on turn 2 or so, courtesy of a Flame-kin Zealot and a bunch of zombies. Is this still the way Dredge wins?
The non-DR deck was in response to the overwhelming number of shop decks that were seeing play. Storm was down, so we didn't need to race, and all our free abilities meant that there was no reason we had to worry about mana. Reoccurring our guys and getting zombies mean a pretty decent match up for us. The titan list from 2011, which now runs Griselbrand to dredge more and essentially win, has a much faster path to victory. It has its turn 2 wins a good chunk of the time. But as I mentioned before, its easier to disrupt and hate out from my own experience, while the non-DR list can withstand a little more hate but has a rough time with combo. What do you see yourself playing against?
So a friend of mine raised an interesting question/challenge that I'm hoping someone here might be able to answer:
Using a 60-card vintage-legal deck, with all the cards in the deck stacked, playing against an opponent with an infinite life total who is running a 60 basic lands deck, what is the highest finite amount of damage you can do, without using any infinite combos, by having your deck perform the Ackermann function in a single turn if you were on the play and this was turn one? Note: You are not allowed to use any of your opponent's cards.
In listed form, here's the challenge:
What is the highest amount of damage you can do using the Ackermann function?
Constraints:
-No infinite combos at any time (no infinite mana, turns, combat, etc.)
-Your deck must contain only 60 cards--no more, no less
-Your deck must be vintage legal
-You are on the play
-Your deck is stacked optimally
-Your opponent's deck has nothing but basic lands
-Your opponent's life total is infinite
-You are not allowed to use any of your opponent's cards
Belcher could deal 112 damage. That is the first thing that popped into my head when I read this. Mull to 4. Opening hand: Belcher, Black Lotus, Mox, LED. Last card in Deck is a mountain. No other lands.
I like this challenge... time to start thinking about other decks and how they can work out.
First off, you should not be posting this here. This is a rules question, not a competitive legacy combo deck.
Second, in regards to competitive legacy decks, 1v1, they die, you win, game over. Shuffle up and board for game two. In multiplayer, you will regain control, losing the game during your next upkeep unless you can remove all counters.
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Goblin Guide
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Sorceries(12)
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
Instants(16)
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Price of Progress
4 Searing Blaze
4 Fireblast
1 Pyrostatic Pillar
2 Sulfuric Vortex
Lands (19)
3 Arid Mesa
3 Bloodstained Mire
3 Scalding Tarn
3 Wooded Foothills
7 Mountain
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Pyrostatic Pillar
2 Searing Blood
2 Smash to Smithereens
1 Sulfuric Vortex
2 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Exquisite Firecraft
I had no idea what the meta was but I felt this is the most streamlined.
Round 1 - Elves (0-1)
0-2
Game 1 - I missed played the end of this game bad. He 5 life left and I was at 2. He had Deathrite Shaman with no creatures or spells in the yards so I stupidly slam 2 Fireblasts at the same time. He lets the first resolve and eats it.
Game 2 - I am on the play. He mulled to 5 so I figured I could suspend my Rift Bolts turn 2. He was able to get 15 dudes on the field, finding the hoof to kick my teeth in... I had both a Pyrostatic Pillar and an Eidolon of the Great Revel in my hand. I think it may have been those "first" tournament jitters.
How do we fight elves? Do we kill off their sources? Race them? How do you guys combat them?
Round 2 - 12 Post (1-1)
2-1
Game 1 - I won the roll and burnt him out before anything really happened.
Game 2 - I got him down to 2 and tried to bolt him, but he triple crop rotated in response for 2 Glimmer Posts and a Vesuva, gaining 15. I was hellbent and he got Primeval Titan, gaining more life.
Game 3 - He, again gained a ton of life with Glimmer Post's affect but this caused him to have 12 nonbasic lands, allowing my 2 Price of Progresses to win me the game.
Round 3 - Lands (2-1)
2-1
Game 1 - I won the roll, winning right in the cross hairs of a Marit Lage.
Game 2 - Turn 3 Marit Lage, turn 4 dead...
Game 3 - Same as one... Is lands really this consistent?
Round 4 - Lands (3-1)
2-0
This round was completely different. First, this was against my buddy who I have never defeated in a tournament. I got him into magic and then I took my hiatus and sold almost everything.
Game 1 - He played 5 lands and... game 2.
Game 2 - He go a turn 2 Chalice of Void which I hit with a turn 2 Smash to Smithereens. He gambled twice and I rolled for those exact cards. He then drew and congratulated me on my first win against him. Lands is not as consistent as I thought.
Cut to Top 4
So I made it 3-1, 4th seed. I was having so much fun and the deck was running great, minus round 1. It was just like the old times.
Semi-Finals - Miracles 2-0
Game 1 - He never found Counter Balance. All my spells hit mostly uncontested.
Game 2 - Exquisite Firecraft is amazing. With how slow the matchup, I understand why its is at least a 3 of. He was at 3 with the lock. I waited 2 turns until I had a 2 bolt effects. I fired off a Lava Spike to test the waters. He topped, and tapped it, allowing me to respond with Lightning Bolt for game.
Finals - Death and Taxes 2-1
Game 1 - He hit a turn 3 Batterskull. I see where my hand sucked. I could not keep up with the 4 life a turn.
Game 2 - He got a turn 2 Thalia but Grim Lavamancer helped keep her off the board. This allowed me to burn him out quicker.
Game 3 - I got 3 Goblin Guides out and burnt his board out of the way. After 4 turns, I won the Underground Sea.
I honestly did not go in there expecting to win or anything. But I do have some questions.
First, how do we beat Elves? Are they just a combo deck we need to out run? Hope they do not have a nuts draw? And would Grafdigger's Cage be appropriate to bring in?
Second, Grafdigger's Cage, what are better options? What suggestions would you have to optimize the sideboard?
And lastly, I have read the past 10 or so pages and I have seen the numbers, but, not based on numbers, how has everyone's experiences been with Monastery Swift? It seems like you are more go go go but I play very... control like? I like to hold back depending on what is going on, what spells I have, but with her on the field, it seems like you need to unload all the time, every turn.
Let me know what you guys think and what you have experienced.
"If an effect puts Golgari Grave-Troll onto the battlefield from your graveyard, Golgari Grave-Troll counts itself as one of the cards in your graveyard and gets a counter accordingly." - Ruling on Gatherer. He is at least a 1/1. Maybe he sees the others too? Not sure on this but he is a 1/1 minimum.
Why aren't there too many numbers supporting the deck? According to mtgpulse, there are only 11 decks to place in events in paper, and ur storm has 112... and these are from GP Philly on (97 vs. 1325 including online). Unless you are going by golf scoring, Ritual Gifts is not better. Maybe the MU is better for gifts, but overall, ur storm has it.
You may want to place in a few more paper tournaments so you can have facts backing your your claims. One good MU does not make a deck better. Your claim is like me saying Karn Tron beats Jund and Pod so it is the best deck, it beats 2 tier one decks.
Holy poop... you are right... i was looking through my deck and idk why it didnt click... I do that all the time. I have no idea what I was thinking
Can you post your list or at least explain how you were able to get a turn 2 Blood Moon? Do you run Spirit Guides? With my deck, turn 3 is the fastest I have gotten Blood Moon down. What accelerators do you run? I went back 4 or 5 pages looking to see if you posted a list but I did not see one.
So it is City of Brass without the minor draw back. Looking at several lists, Gemstone Mine is the worst rainbow land we have. But when ever I play, the counters rarely, if ever matter. I think it hindered me in one game, but even then, I do not recall a way I could have won. The Legacy Thread is talking about this card and I was wondering what your opinions were. What should our "revised" mana base look like? Unlike in Legacy Rishadan Port sees no (or little but I have not personally ran into it) play, and if it did, would it really hinder us that much to tap down one land to deal one damage to us? I feel that their goal should not be mana denial but GY denial... Or am I missing something super important about this card?
The non-DR deck was in response to the overwhelming number of shop decks that were seeing play. Storm was down, so we didn't need to race, and all our free abilities meant that there was no reason we had to worry about mana. Reoccurring our guys and getting zombies mean a pretty decent match up for us. The titan list from 2011, which now runs Griselbrand to dredge more and essentially win, has a much faster path to victory. It has its turn 2 wins a good chunk of the time. But as I mentioned before, its easier to disrupt and hate out from my own experience, while the non-DR list can withstand a little more hate but has a rough time with combo. What do you see yourself playing against?
Belcher could deal 112 damage. That is the first thing that popped into my head when I read this. Mull to 4. Opening hand: Belcher, Black Lotus, Mox, LED. Last card in Deck is a mountain. No other lands.
I like this challenge... time to start thinking about other decks and how they can work out.
List looks stock. What do you see Pyroclasm coming in for? Maybe drop a mountain for the 4th Sulfuric Vortex?