Mohamed's breathing was ragged. The hot, dry weather was oppressive and his joints weren't a young mans anymore. But at least it had been a successful day, this cousin's cousin believed he wanted to serve the caliphate. Now the hard work began but at least this young man was a reliable (if misguided) source. As he trudged back to his place the mission started to fade and it came back to his mind.
Who was killing agents?
And was he a target?
He'd never had a problem with the CIA or any of their people. Or MI6. As he walked up to his 2nd floor flat he couldn't stop thinking about the why. Rogue agents don't want to draw that sort of heat. Extortioners ask for money. Terrorists don't keep things this quiet. This looked like a vendetta but the targets seemed to have so little in common other than being spies.
The explosion was instantaneous. There was no time for fear, pain, or dread. Just a sudden overwhelming rush of heat, power, and rubble and then it was all over. Which was a small mercy.
Tomsloger has been killed. He was Mohamed El-Khoury town researcher
Neapolitan Cop: Each night you may spend 1 coin to investigate a player and learn whether they are Vanilla town or not.
You've worked in some of the most dangerous places on earth and you've learned you really have to know someone before you can trust them. So you've made that your life's business. Making sure you know people before you let them work with you.
It is now Day 5. Deadline is in 14 days on Sunday the 3rd at 7pm EST. With 5 alive, majority is 3. You may post.
Rhand has been lynched. He was Yuri Takahata Rich Vanilla Town
This name was an unfortunate case of convergent evolution. Please don't google it at work or in front of children.
You begin the game with 1 coin in your possession.
China always made you just a bit jealous. Sure their citizens had next to no privacy the government watched their every move. But that's the case everywhere. And having that sort of industrial complex in place makes it a lot easier to track terrorist activity rather than having to wait for watch lists to give you names and doing the surveillance manually.
Action deadline is in 24 hours roughly 7 pm EST on the 17th of Feb.
It is now N4 please do not post.
Sorry I'm effectively V/LA today. At a scan the unofficial VC tom did looks correct. Will do an official one as soon as I can but out of time right now.
German's aren't known for being the friendliest of people but Thomas was one of the nicest people you'd ever meet. Or at least he gave you that impression. If you needed a lift he was your man, if you needed advice he was your man, if you needed a shoulder to cry on he brought luxurious handkerchiefs. Being that well connected is helpful when you need to stroll into the local council building at 7pm without raising eyebrows, or join a table at the fanciest resturant in town on a friday night.
Unfortunately it makes you well known. And in the spy game that can be a liability. So when he heard the door open behind him in his favorite resturant in Hong Kong he turned drawing his gun. Unfortunately that wasn't quick enough.
Rumanshi has died. He was Thomas Schulz town networker.
Informants (Tracker): Each night you may have someone followed. You learn who they targeted with their night actions that night.
Mugging (Roleblock): Once per game you may pay an unsavory associate of yours 2 coins to prevent a player of your choosing from taking any actions that night.
You know everyone. Well not everyone. But you have people in every city. If a certain man sneezes in Dubai, you know about it. If a certain man boards a plane heading to Singapore you'll know what color the walls of his room are before he checks in to his hotel.
Day 4 has now started you may begin posting. You have 2 weeks. Deadline is set for 4pm EST on the 27th.
Not voting (4): Cantripmancer, Rhand, GentlemanJohnny, Ecophagy
GentlemanJohnny has died: he was
Lachie Jones Rich Vanilla Mafia.
You begin the game with 1 coin in your possession.
Everyone likes Aussies. It's a known fact. And for their relatively small population you see Aussies everywhere. They are prodigious travellers. Which is fortunate for you. Sure it's not an elegant life crashing at hostels all over the world but it gives you perfect cover.
It is now Night 3, please do not post.
This night will last only 48 hours. Please get your actions in before 3pm EST Wednesday.
Injuries at work tend to make everyone more cautious. People will be extra careful using heavy machinery or using proper lifting mechanics. The same holds true for spies when their fellows start getting compromised. No one wants to be next.
Interesting the matrix 12 definitely contradicts my opinions. I'll admit that stance on balance might be off base.
@Cantrip I'd argue pretty strong against the roleblock stopping a 1st unpreventable kill on a GB. Feels wrong to be able to block an unstoppable kill.
@Cantrip The redirection strikes me as wrong but I'm not actually sure now that I think about it. I think as scum I'd be surprised and angry if that happened but that doesn't mean I'm right to feel that way.
I think this game is basically even but that's because I think a game with 12t 4w, a 1 shot vig and a bodyguard is basically even. If you disagree then we can move on but it's really difficult to judge power levels by scum roles as they are largely reactive. I think that is where our differences are coming from. I see a game with 1 more scum than I'd expected for an all vanilla game and try to see if the average town use through interference is worth that extra team member.
You appear to be looking at it from a position of stacking the roles against each other.
The more I think about it the more I dislike assigning point values to roles to determine if a setup is balanced. It me it's more about getting the game to the correct number of virtual mislynches.
For the record a Mountainous 15er (12T 3W) is often played on MU don't know if it is statistically balanced, but it is widely played.
Yeah so one more mafia is highly suspect.
Well not exactly. Mafia power is usually disruptive to town power. It doesn't usually add strength beyond numbers. It tends to be used to rein town power in. Town power adds to the game more often. It either provides additional alignment information, town controlled flips, or prevented mafia night kills. Those give the effect of adding additional mislynches to a game. Very few mafia roles (and none present in this game) change the clock. Town has at the most stringent reading 1.5 roles that do. The ghostbusters and the doc. The mafia roles are very disruptive/good at gathering information but none of them are truly additive beyond the numbers. Town has some that are.
If we accept 11/2 and 12/3 as roughly balanced but slightly scum favored then I'd guess without knowledge that 13/4 is also close as a 17er. Maybe growing linerally doesn't work but if it does then you just have to ask if town will gain on average value equivalent 1 mislynch through use of their PR's through mafia disruption. And I'd say the doctor and ghostbusters provide that on average.
Also I'm deeply skeptical of that grids scoring. A pair of Masons (with our standard confirmed town definition) are not half a point weaker than a watcher and a full point weaker than a cop. It's a useful heuristic but I don't agree with all it's judgments.
Its .5 per. So that's a 1 for the mason group. If they know its town its double at 2.
So same power level as a cop.
You can't have a group of 1 though. It specifically says it's a two person group at .5. And I'd agree with that as I'd definitely not weigh a neighborhood without confirmation as being equivalent to a tracker or Doc. So basically I don't trust that point system at all.
I see what you mean now about the ability failing. You're correct, but I think it's still possible to resolve those two abilities in a non bastard way. That's why I'm very curious as to how Cantrip would resolve it. I think (I believe in agreement with you) that it would be bastard to not notify the busdriver somehow that their redirection failed, I think a message along the lines of "You sucessfully busdrove x and y, but there was an ability that you failed to redirect" would have been an appropriate and expect notification.
And the ability to reevaluate after a day vig is why I think it's noticeably more powerful than a regular vig.
I do agree the kill through protection on a GB can lead to bastard situations like you described. Though I imagine they wouldn't have been handled in a bastard fashion as a RB or redirection I hope would have been told their ability failed. If not then it would be bastard.
The redirect wouldn't have failed really. It just would have been bypassed.
Yeah IDK, its that the mafia have so much disruption and then on top of it the free gimmes in the can't be targeted and the strong man.
Do people in general like the can't be targeted on scum?
To me as I've said it just punishes town for using their limited knowledge correctly.
I'd argue that is a tiny semantic difference. I'd be really curious to know how cantrip would have handled it. To me the obvious ruling would have been to notify the redirector that their redirection failed, and not doing so would be bastard. Given the usually first resolving priority of redirects bypassing it would be bastard to me.
On the Doc/Guard the lingering nature of the protection just makes it so unlike both roles that it's hard to evaluate. It's closest to a doc that can only target each player once with a mandatory burnout N3 to lightning rod the kill. I mean not really, but it's just a completely different role with the left behind protection.
On your PR counting: I just don't agree with your valuation of vigs at all. Maybe I'm way off base but a day vig is substantially stronger than a standard vig and having the vig be diffused across several people makes it stronger to me. Plus I generally value a 1 shot vig to be similar power level to a full watcher. So the gradation of the watcher being a half point more strikes me as wrong. But I get that is your central point (that I'm overvaluing vigs).
Also I'm deeply skeptical of that grids scoring. A pair of Masons (with our standard confirmed town definition) are not half a point weaker than a watcher and a full point weaker than a cop. It's a useful heuristic but I don't agree with all it's judgments.
Mohamed's breathing was ragged. The hot, dry weather was oppressive and his joints weren't a young mans anymore. But at least it had been a successful day, this cousin's cousin believed he wanted to serve the caliphate. Now the hard work began but at least this young man was a reliable (if misguided) source. As he trudged back to his place the mission started to fade and it came back to his mind.
Who was killing agents?
And was he a target?
He'd never had a problem with the CIA or any of their people. Or MI6. As he walked up to his 2nd floor flat he couldn't stop thinking about the why. Rogue agents don't want to draw that sort of heat. Extortioners ask for money. Terrorists don't keep things this quiet. This looked like a vendetta but the targets seemed to have so little in common other than being spies.
The explosion was instantaneous. There was no time for fear, pain, or dread. Just a sudden overwhelming rush of heat, power, and rubble and then it was all over. Which was a small mercy.
Tomsloger has been killed. He was Mohamed El-Khoury town researcher
You've worked in some of the most dangerous places on earth and you've learned you really have to know someone before you can trust them. So you've made that your life's business. Making sure you know people before you let them work with you.
It is now Day 5. Deadline is in 14 days on Sunday the 3rd at 7pm EST. With 5 alive, majority is 3. You may post.
Enjoy this evidence of how much trailers have changed in ~15 years.
Rhand (4): tomsloger, Ecophagy, Cantripmancer, Vaimes
Ecophagy (1): Rhand
Not voting(2): Highroller, LnGrrrR
Rhand has been lynched. He was Yuri Takahata Rich Vanilla Town
This name was an unfortunate case of convergent evolution. Please don't google it at work or in front of children.
China always made you just a bit jealous. Sure their citizens had next to no privacy the government watched their every move. But that's the case everywhere. And having that sort of industrial complex in place makes it a lot easier to track terrorist activity rather than having to wait for watch lists to give you names and doing the surveillance manually.
Action deadline is in 24 hours roughly 7 pm EST on the 17th of Feb.
It is now N4 please do not post.
German's aren't known for being the friendliest of people but Thomas was one of the nicest people you'd ever meet. Or at least he gave you that impression. If you needed a lift he was your man, if you needed advice he was your man, if you needed a shoulder to cry on he brought luxurious handkerchiefs. Being that well connected is helpful when you need to stroll into the local council building at 7pm without raising eyebrows, or join a table at the fanciest resturant in town on a friday night.
Unfortunately it makes you well known. And in the spy game that can be a liability. So when he heard the door open behind him in his favorite resturant in Hong Kong he turned drawing his gun. Unfortunately that wasn't quick enough.
Rumanshi has died. He was Thomas Schulz town networker.
Mugging (Roleblock): Once per game you may pay an unsavory associate of yours 2 coins to prevent a player of your choosing from taking any actions that night.
You know everyone. Well not everyone. But you have people in every city. If a certain man sneezes in Dubai, you know about it. If a certain man boards a plane heading to Singapore you'll know what color the walls of his room are before he checks in to his hotel.
Day 4 has now started you may begin posting. You have 2 weeks. Deadline is set for 4pm EST on the 27th.
With 7 alive 4 is majority.
Flavor to be added.
Note to self pre write flips for each character in the future.
GentlemanJohnny (5): Rumanishi, Highroller, Tomsloger, Vaimes, LnGrrrR
Not voting (4): Cantripmancer, Rhand, GentlemanJohnny, Ecophagy
GentlemanJohnny has died: he was
You begin the game with 1 coin in your possession.
Everyone likes Aussies. It's a known fact. And for their relatively small population you see Aussies everywhere. They are prodigious travellers. Which is fortunate for you. Sure it's not an elegant life crashing at hostels all over the world but it gives you perfect cover.
It is now Night 3, please do not post.
This night will last only 48 hours. Please get your actions in before 3pm EST Wednesday.
No one has died.
With 9 alive it takes 5 to secure a majority.
Deadline is on Saturday the 23rd at 4 PM EST.
Good luck.
@Cantrip I'd argue pretty strong against the roleblock stopping a 1st unpreventable kill on a GB. Feels wrong to be able to block an unstoppable kill.
@Cantrip The redirection strikes me as wrong but I'm not actually sure now that I think about it. I think as scum I'd be surprised and angry if that happened but that doesn't mean I'm right to feel that way.
You appear to be looking at it from a position of stacking the roles against each other.
Well not exactly. Mafia power is usually disruptive to town power. It doesn't usually add strength beyond numbers. It tends to be used to rein town power in. Town power adds to the game more often. It either provides additional alignment information, town controlled flips, or prevented mafia night kills. Those give the effect of adding additional mislynches to a game. Very few mafia roles (and none present in this game) change the clock. Town has at the most stringent reading 1.5 roles that do. The ghostbusters and the doc. The mafia roles are very disruptive/good at gathering information but none of them are truly additive beyond the numbers. Town has some that are.
If we accept 11/2 and 12/3 as roughly balanced but slightly scum favored then I'd guess without knowledge that 13/4 is also close as a 17er. Maybe growing linerally doesn't work but if it does then you just have to ask if town will gain on average value equivalent 1 mislynch through use of their PR's through mafia disruption. And I'd say the doctor and ghostbusters provide that on average.
You can't have a group of 1 though. It specifically says it's a two person group at .5. And I'd agree with that as I'd definitely not weigh a neighborhood without confirmation as being equivalent to a tracker or Doc. So basically I don't trust that point system at all.
I see what you mean now about the ability failing. You're correct, but I think it's still possible to resolve those two abilities in a non bastard way. That's why I'm very curious as to how Cantrip would resolve it. I think (I believe in agreement with you) that it would be bastard to not notify the busdriver somehow that their redirection failed, I think a message along the lines of "You sucessfully busdrove x and y, but there was an ability that you failed to redirect" would have been an appropriate and expect notification.
And the ability to reevaluate after a day vig is why I think it's noticeably more powerful than a regular vig.
I'd argue that is a tiny semantic difference. I'd be really curious to know how cantrip would have handled it. To me the obvious ruling would have been to notify the redirector that their redirection failed, and not doing so would be bastard. Given the usually first resolving priority of redirects bypassing it would be bastard to me.
On the Doc/Guard the lingering nature of the protection just makes it so unlike both roles that it's hard to evaluate. It's closest to a doc that can only target each player once with a mandatory burnout N3 to lightning rod the kill. I mean not really, but it's just a completely different role with the left behind protection.
On your PR counting: I just don't agree with your valuation of vigs at all. Maybe I'm way off base but a day vig is substantially stronger than a standard vig and having the vig be diffused across several people makes it stronger to me. Plus I generally value a 1 shot vig to be similar power level to a full watcher. So the gradation of the watcher being a half point more strikes me as wrong. But I get that is your central point (that I'm overvaluing vigs).
Also I'm deeply skeptical of that grids scoring. A pair of Masons (with our standard confirmed town definition) are not half a point weaker than a watcher and a full point weaker than a cop. It's a useful heuristic but I don't agree with all it's judgments.