How do you define a horrid board stall? I'm pretty sure I've never had one that fits my definition- two sides with multiple creatures where neither side can attack profitably- with my Cube. Well, except when damn Troubled Healer gets involved.
EDIT: I should also note, though, that my definition may be insane. I kind of defined the term after playing multiple Fallen Empires and Homelands drafts, with no high-power creatures, evasion, or removal and multiple high-toughness dudes with borderline-irrelevant activated abilities. Almost anything better than that but incremental advantage-y generally makes me pretty happy.
Also @ Ratman: Why did you feel like you had too many X spells? I run all of them at 360 and it's great - it adds another dimension to red (and makes it even more powerful).
The first is that yeah, Red's already the best color and I didn't feel a strong need to help it out. The second is that I really, really, really hate how X-spells play. My Common Cube creates great interactions, with regular close games and sweet interactions. X spells have an annoying tendency to take all of those sweet interactions and great board states, and just make them end. There's room for epic topdecks and stuff in the Cube, which is why they're in it at all, but those feelings lose their specialness if they happen too often.
Gold list coming, although you may have noticed I'm not the best at getting those together.
Huh, different playstyles, I guess. Torch technically "turns on" for more cards, but I care far more when Burst turns on than I do when Torch turns on (yes, this is where my love-hate relationship with Troubled Healer comes into play). I cut Torch when I decided I just had too many X-spells (a recent change), and as a player whose main weakness is a tendency to overdraft Blue (I ended up just going monoblue in my last draft, and managed to win!), I was never unable to do something because of Torch's requirement. If I was actually concerned about an X-spell, it was never a big challenge to avoid leaving appropriate counter mana +2 up. I mean, it's a contest of super marginal value, so I guess it doesn't matter too much, but I'll stand by Burst over Torch any day.
Wow, this section is a great reminder of why I hate Red so much. You have to get through so much removal before you even consider picking anything else. There are several cards on many people's top 20s that I don't disagree with placement-wise, but that I don't run because I just have too much removal in the color and want to mix things up a bit.
Anyway, my top 20 (also, sorry for missing the last few. :()
Some notes:
-Wow, Rolling Thunder is just... Nuts. Pyrotechnics gets #2 just by being the closest card to its raw power, and easier on the mana.
-I really don't understand why people run Kaervek's Torch over Lava Burst. I realize they're both X spells with pretty marginal benefits, but this isn't constructed- the extra 2 on the cost doesn't change much.
-Brimstone Volley is so high because it comes damn close to a "3 mana X-spell" most of the time, rather than a 3-mana Incinerate. 5 damage for 3 is HUGE, and easy to trigger.
-Gathan Raiders is the highest Red creature because Red's creatures are awful and I'll play it if I'm not in Red. That's really the only reason.
-Fireslinger at 20 is partially indicative of my personal love of the card, but I also think it's really strong.
I am not running Geistflame or Lava Dart, although I definitely intend to put a Lava Dart in. Geistflame will only go in if Lava Dart ends up being as good as it looks and you say it is. The main problem is that not all of the colors really care that much about pingers, and Red doesn't exactly have a shortage of answers. White is actually probably the color that struggles most with the abundance of pingers- the average creature size is low enough that they're more backbreaking (compare this to, say, fatty Green), but the removal is bad enough that it can't deal with them that efficiently (unlike, say, Red, which loses almost all of its creatures to pingers but doesn't actually care that much).
And sigh... I get why you'd cut Ophidian, but it still breaks my heart. Scroll Thief is a better design in every way, but there will always be be a soft spot in my heart for the Snake. I do also like the plays where Isolation keeps you from attacking profitably with Soltari Troopers, though, for sure.
Yeah, Arrest is a bit of a weirdo on my list. I've definitely considered cutting it, because it's among the weaker pieces of removal, but it's still pretty solid removal. I do think the card's power is partially a product of my previously mentioned pinger problem- it deals with lots of troublesome pingers far better than almost any alternative (O-Ring, Fetters, Isolation, and Journey being the obvious exceptions), and is generally a pretty solid piece of removal.
Pacifism could probably be lower, but I'd still rank it very high. 2 mana is exactly the right cost for this effect, and while it's indisputably worse than Temporal Isolation (although I do love the only-in-Cube interactions where it's not, like with Ophidian), the cards are generally pretty comparable.
01|[CARD]
Also, there's only so much white removal that should reasonably fit into a cube. Cards like Pacifism in a vacuum are better than cards like Kor Skyfisher, but because there's a limit to the removal you run, most cubes won't use pacifism. I chose not to rate any removal spells I don't run. This includes Arrest and Recumbent Bliss.
I agree with this for the most part, but disagree with your evaluation. I think Pacifism is in the top 3 Pacifism variants (loses out to Isolation and Fetters, but nothing else). That's definitely good enough to make it in, IMO. With that said, leaving Arrest and Bliss on the sidelines makes perfect sense to me (I don't run Bliss either, and I'm strongly considering cutting Arrest).
Nobody is rating Sunlance. It kills most creatures and is very mana efficient. You all like Disfigure, but not Sunlance?
I actually don't run Disfigure, so that's my excuse. With that said, it probably is better than at least one other card on my list. I'll reevaluate it.
EDIT: Yeah, it deserves to be on the list way more than Aven Riftwatcher. I know people like that card, but I think it's far more annoying than it is actually good. List changed to reflect that.
1 Faith’s Fetters
2 Guardian of the Guildpact
3 Oblivion Ring
4 Journey to Nowhere
5 Troubled Healer
6 Temporal Isolation
7 Pacifism
8 Porcelain Legionnaire
9 Coalition Honor-Guard
10 Sunlance
11 Bonds of Faith
12 Arrest
13 Kor Skyfisher
14 Blinding Beam
15 Kor Sanctifiers
16 Soltari Trooper
17 Kor Hookmaster
18 Gideon’s Lawkeeper
19 Kor Chant
20 Totem-Guide Hartebeest
Subject to change, but I feel pretty comfortable with this set of rankings.
Some notes:
-I don't see how lists can simultaneously have Bonds of Faith and still put Goldmeadow Harrier over Gideon's Lawkeeper. Is there a tribal justification I'm missing that doesn't favor the Human?
EDIT: I don't love this decision, but I'm willing to work with it.
-I'm going to stick my neck out there for Healer. It's one of the best non-top tier removal reasons to go White.
-Hartebeest is so low because I haven't really had a chance to play with it yet. I want it to be higher, but don't want to put it there until I have more experience with the card.
I'm glad you're trying these out. Just let me know how they turn out for you- I've been enamored with them, but I know my usual Cube group can be a bit of an echo chamber. Honestly, I really hope I'm just wrong about Troubled Healer's power level, since I think it's one of the worst designed cards ever. Oh, Prophecy...
This doesn't make any sense to me. Do you mean that it's colorless in that, if you don't have black, it's not necessarily worthless in your hand?
Basically. It lets you splash with almost none of the risks splashing usually entails, and with no real hit to card quality.
EDIT: It's basically "colorless" in the same way people said Mulldrifter and Shriekmaw were basically colorless in Lorwyn limited. It's an easy splash, something worth splashing, and there's ample late-ish pick fixing to make it work.
I can't get behind this. I rarely want to cycle away removal, and Expunge is worse removal than Eyeblight's Ending. Then again, Terror isn't all that terrible. I guess I just have to keep an eye out for what kind of creatures are usually out there to be killed.
I know people really don't like to cycle removal, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't be doing it from time to time. Let's face it- we play an unusually removal-heavy format. Your hand will get a little glutted with it pretty often. Expunge gets a lot of the same points Bonds of Faith gets (which I've loved so far, by the way), except I'm also more comfortable splashing the card. It does hurt the card a little that its two best uses don't overlap very well (you will probably be less likely to cycle removal if you're so removal-light you're splashing for it), but it plays well in heavy-Black decks or decks splashing for the Expunge alone. It's not worth it if people don't play the card correctly, but if you play with people who don't have a visceral negative reaction to cycling removal, it will serve you well. I'd actually probably rank it as one of my highest picks, since it's darn close to a colorless Terror, in my experience.
EDIT: Troubled Healer is kind of like most Planeswalkers in limited (although obviously at a lower power level). Drop it when you're behind on the board, and it'll be a decent roadblock but probably won't win the game for you. If you play it in a board state that even remotely resembles parity, though, you just gain complete control of the game.
Temple Acolyte: In my opinion, defensive creatures are absolutely key to white control decks that are any kind of consistent. I see too many white sections with random dorks I'd never want to play in control, and not enough defensive guys. A better Bottle Gnomes in white is exactly what control decks want.
I'm glad you like this guy. I keep on thinking of putting it in, but people keep discouraging it. I always end up going with them because aggro needs help while control doesn't really.
Anyway, some of mine:
-Troubled Healer: It's really easy to underestimate this card, because it looks like a pile of butt. But it's actually amazing. It completely takes over games if it sticks around for any period of time. It was really insane in MNP limited, if memory serves, and I actually think it's even better here, where Red has too much removal, your curve is lower, and there are fewer "lands as resources" cards diluting its power.
-Rendclaw Trow: I know a lot of people are running Desecrator Hag, but I prefer Trow on pure power. Hag's drawback is actually a pretty big deal, while Trow is just a great man in either an offensive or defensive capacity. Hag compares pretty poorly to both Black and Green's four-drops, while Trow compares favorably to most of their three drops. The only reason I'd cut Trow would be because it's a little better in Black than it is in Green, which is the opposite of what the colors need from a balance perspective.
-Esper Cormorants: Lots of people are playing Azorius First-Wing as a flier of choice, and I do think that card is better in general. I'm playing Cormorants over First-Wing because I really have not enabled Blue aggro at all, and the kind of creature my WU decks want is a heavier hitter instead a light beater. This is also true of Silver Drake, although that's one that I'm less certain is the right call and it's also there for fun with ETB effects.
-Expunge- I love this card. I think people underestimate the value of cycling on this card since it "feels bad" to cycle it, but it's extremely helpful even if you're doing fine on mana. It is also probably my favorite card in the entire Cube to splash for, which is excellent- it's a fine Black card, but enough decks have access to it that it almost plays like a common Dismember with a less oppressive drawback.
Lowland SpotterW (C)
Creature - Human Soldier 1W: Target creature gains first strike until end of turn.
1/1
[Boros Guildmage and Advance Scout says this is probably alright. Repeatable first strike sink doesn't seem to outweigh the balance too much, especially at the cost of A.) One less mana and B.) Not having First Strike itself.]
I think this is fine Common design. The only concern might be that they've been moving away from "on board tricks" like this one for a few years now, but the power level seems low enough that I think this one's OK.
Royal Arquebusier1W
Creature - Human Soldier
Royal Arquebusier gets +1/+1 as long as it has first strike.
2/1
[I considered this as a 2/2. It's a narrow boon to grant and white contextual bears are usually 2/2. However others like Lost Leonin, which are recent, lead me to believe 2/1 is just as sufficient.]
Maybe a bit weak, but I like it best the way it is. Higher power than toughness makes the First Strike feel more relevant, since the ability functions like high toughness a fair amount of the time.
Guard Caravan2W
Creature - Human
Defender
Reinforce 3 - 3W
0/4
[Most reinforce creatures price their reinforce cost at one CMC above that of the number of counters. 4 seems like an appropriate toughness, but I'd be more content pushing it up.]
I really like this card. Great work! My only concern is that, yeah, 3 +1/+1 counters is a bit high for a common. I might consider Reinforce 2 for 2W (Compare to Burrenton Bombardier).
Suppression Squad3W
Creature - Human Archer T: Suppressor Squad deals damage equal to its power to target attacking or blocking creature.
1/2
[Initially conceived off of the trainee cards from Mirrodin. It's underpowered at the moment, and I'm wondering if that's too low. However, in conception I left his P/T low so that I can make it a mana-less activated ability.]
They've been moving away from pingers at common recently, and I believe they're right to do so. This feels uncommon to me on multiple levels, but I like it quite a bit as an uncommon given what appear to be the themes of your set.
Sunsworn RecruitX3WW
Creature - Human Knight
When Sunsworn Recruit enters the battlefield, you may search your library for an Equipment card, reveal it, and put it on the battlefield attached to Sunsworn Recruit.
2/2
[This feels like an uncommon. At its base cost you can grab a Bone Saw[/mana] and get a vanilla 3/2, or perhaps a Paradise Mantle for a 5 cost mana dork. Its effectiveness is contingent on the mana you sink into it. 8 mana to grab a sword or something hardly seems worth pushing it to uncommon though.]
I agree that this is uncommon. You have an X in the casting cost that isn't reflected anywhere else on the card, just FYI. I get what you're saying, though. Maybe make it rare and make it less variable in equipment it grabs (Go Stoneforge, but not 2 mana, basically)?
Whitestone Sire5W
Creature - Human Mercenary
Whenever Whitestone Sire blocks a creature with power 6 or greater, it gains double strike until end of turn.
2/2
(Also not sure about this one. Commons creatures at 6 mana usually amount to lifegain, high toughness, or an irrelevant 6CMC combat ability like vigilance. But is double strike pushing the curve, even for something this tiny?)
Oof, I don't like this card at all. It seems extremely weak, uses an ability that really shouldn't appear at common, is an extremely niche card, and doesn't even fill that niche particularly well. Double Strike might be OK at common in this weak a context (the big problem is when you attack with it), but this just feels like a bit of a waste to me. I'd just scrap this one, honestly- I don't see it ever doing something that makes up for the initial negative reaction.
I was the one who PM'd Lanaxl about Auramancer. So far from my testing it's been borderline, but it's only been drafted twice so far. It theoretically should be good, recurring cards like Oblivion Ring, Pacifism, Faith's Fetters, etc.
I see the prospective value, but it seems a bit too narrow. It feels like the card's value is getting into answers to answers to answers (the first "question" is a creature, answer is your enchantment, answer to that gets it to grave, answer to that gets enchantment back), which is not a great place to be. I could be completely off, though
There's value here, but Harrow isn't in my Cube any more either. This went first. It is too slow and inefficient as a card quality advantage outlet and ramp source. Also, I feel like most Pauper Cubes need fewer accel outlets.
I just cut this one. It's really not that good. There are enough superior pingers already in Red, and the extra point of damage really doesn't make up for the card disadvantage possibilities.
I'm running it currently, but I'm not a fan. It's mostly in because it does something interesting in Red, and it does give the color some nice outs against problem cards. It's one of the weakest pieces of removal, though.
This guy's good enough if you need a bigger BR beater, but it's really unexciting. I'm not running it currently, and I don't think anyone was ever happy to shuffle him up, but I know I've played him once or twice with minor success in the past.
I had this guy in here for a while, then I cut him. I don't entirely remember why. I think part of it is that it doesn't really do anything GR wants or needs particularly well. For a rather large chunk of the time, Nessian Courser will do a very similar job with far fewer deck demands.
EDIT: I should also note, though, that my definition may be insane. I kind of defined the term after playing multiple Fallen Empires and Homelands drafts, with no high-power creatures, evasion, or removal and multiple high-toughness dudes with borderline-irrelevant activated abilities. Almost anything better than that but incremental advantage-y generally makes me pretty happy.
The first is that yeah, Red's already the best color and I didn't feel a strong need to help it out. The second is that I really, really, really hate how X-spells play. My Common Cube creates great interactions, with regular close games and sweet interactions. X spells have an annoying tendency to take all of those sweet interactions and great board states, and just make them end. There's room for epic topdecks and stuff in the Cube, which is why they're in it at all, but those feelings lose their specialness if they happen too often.
Gold list coming, although you may have noticed I'm not the best at getting those together.
Anyway, my top 20 (also, sorry for missing the last few. :()
1 Rolling Thunder
2 Pyrotechnics
3 Lightning Bolt
4 Brimstone Volley
5 Fireball
6 Disintegrate
7 Lava Burst
8 Arc Lightning
9 Staggershock
10 Firebolt
11 Chain Lightning
12 Incinerate
13 Gathan Raiders
14 Searing Blaze
15 Gorehorn Minotaurs
16 Plated Geopede
17 Ghitu Slinger
18 Keldon Marauders
19 Blood Ogre
20 Fireslinger
Some notes:
-Wow, Rolling Thunder is just... Nuts. Pyrotechnics gets #2 just by being the closest card to its raw power, and easier on the mana.
-I really don't understand why people run Kaervek's Torch over Lava Burst. I realize they're both X spells with pretty marginal benefits, but this isn't constructed- the extra 2 on the cost doesn't change much.
-Brimstone Volley is so high because it comes damn close to a "3 mana X-spell" most of the time, rather than a 3-mana Incinerate. 5 damage for 3 is HUGE, and easy to trigger.
-Gathan Raiders is the highest Red creature because Red's creatures are awful and I'll play it if I'm not in Red. That's really the only reason.
-Fireslinger at 20 is partially indicative of my personal love of the card, but I also think it's really strong.
And sigh... I get why you'd cut Ophidian, but it still breaks my heart. Scroll Thief is a better design in every way, but there will always be be a soft spot in my heart for the Snake. I do also like the plays where Isolation keeps you from attacking profitably with Soltari Troopers, though, for sure.
Pacifism could probably be lower, but I'd still rank it very high. 2 mana is exactly the right cost for this effect, and while it's indisputably worse than Temporal Isolation (although I do love the only-in-Cube interactions where it's not, like with Ophidian), the cards are generally pretty comparable.
I agree with this for the most part, but disagree with your evaluation. I think Pacifism is in the top 3 Pacifism variants (loses out to Isolation and Fetters, but nothing else). That's definitely good enough to make it in, IMO. With that said, leaving Arrest and Bliss on the sidelines makes perfect sense to me (I don't run Bliss either, and I'm strongly considering cutting Arrest).
I actually don't run Disfigure, so that's my excuse. With that said, it probably is better than at least one other card on my list. I'll reevaluate it.
EDIT: Yeah, it deserves to be on the list way more than Aven Riftwatcher. I know people like that card, but I think it's far more annoying than it is actually good. List changed to reflect that.
Yep, I did. Thanks for the heads up! Fixing now.
2 Guardian of the Guildpact
3 Oblivion Ring
4 Journey to Nowhere
5 Troubled Healer
6 Temporal Isolation
7 Pacifism
8 Porcelain Legionnaire
9 Coalition Honor-Guard
10 Sunlance
11 Bonds of Faith
12 Arrest
13 Kor Skyfisher
14 Blinding Beam
15 Kor Sanctifiers
16 Soltari Trooper
17 Kor Hookmaster
18 Gideon’s Lawkeeper
19 Kor Chant
20 Totem-Guide Hartebeest
Subject to change, but I feel pretty comfortable with this set of rankings.
Some notes:
-I don't see how lists can simultaneously have Bonds of Faith and still put Goldmeadow Harrier over Gideon's Lawkeeper. Is there a tribal justification I'm missing that doesn't favor the Human?
EDIT: I don't love this decision, but I'm willing to work with it.
-I'm going to stick my neck out there for Healer. It's one of the best non-top tier removal reasons to go White.
-Hartebeest is so low because I haven't really had a chance to play with it yet. I want it to be higher, but don't want to put it there until I have more experience with the card.
I'm glad you're trying these out. Just let me know how they turn out for you- I've been enamored with them, but I know my usual Cube group can be a bit of an echo chamber. Honestly, I really hope I'm just wrong about Troubled Healer's power level, since I think it's one of the worst designed cards ever. Oh, Prophecy...
Basically. It lets you splash with almost none of the risks splashing usually entails, and with no real hit to card quality.
EDIT: It's basically "colorless" in the same way people said Mulldrifter and Shriekmaw were basically colorless in Lorwyn limited. It's an easy splash, something worth splashing, and there's ample late-ish pick fixing to make it work.
I know people really don't like to cycle removal, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't be doing it from time to time. Let's face it- we play an unusually removal-heavy format. Your hand will get a little glutted with it pretty often. Expunge gets a lot of the same points Bonds of Faith gets (which I've loved so far, by the way), except I'm also more comfortable splashing the card. It does hurt the card a little that its two best uses don't overlap very well (you will probably be less likely to cycle removal if you're so removal-light you're splashing for it), but it plays well in heavy-Black decks or decks splashing for the Expunge alone. It's not worth it if people don't play the card correctly, but if you play with people who don't have a visceral negative reaction to cycling removal, it will serve you well. I'd actually probably rank it as one of my highest picks, since it's darn close to a colorless Terror, in my experience.
EDIT: Troubled Healer is kind of like most Planeswalkers in limited (although obviously at a lower power level). Drop it when you're behind on the board, and it'll be a decent roadblock but probably won't win the game for you. If you play it in a board state that even remotely resembles parity, though, you just gain complete control of the game.
I'm glad you like this guy. I keep on thinking of putting it in, but people keep discouraging it. I always end up going with them because aggro needs help while control doesn't really.
Anyway, some of mine:
-Troubled Healer: It's really easy to underestimate this card, because it looks like a pile of butt. But it's actually amazing. It completely takes over games if it sticks around for any period of time. It was really insane in MNP limited, if memory serves, and I actually think it's even better here, where Red has too much removal, your curve is lower, and there are fewer "lands as resources" cards diluting its power.
-Rendclaw Trow: I know a lot of people are running Desecrator Hag, but I prefer Trow on pure power. Hag's drawback is actually a pretty big deal, while Trow is just a great man in either an offensive or defensive capacity. Hag compares pretty poorly to both Black and Green's four-drops, while Trow compares favorably to most of their three drops. The only reason I'd cut Trow would be because it's a little better in Black than it is in Green, which is the opposite of what the colors need from a balance perspective.
-Esper Cormorants: Lots of people are playing Azorius First-Wing as a flier of choice, and I do think that card is better in general. I'm playing Cormorants over First-Wing because I really have not enabled Blue aggro at all, and the kind of creature my WU decks want is a heavier hitter instead a light beater. This is also true of Silver Drake, although that's one that I'm less certain is the right call and it's also there for fun with ETB effects.
-Expunge- I love this card. I think people underestimate the value of cycling on this card since it "feels bad" to cycle it, but it's extremely helpful even if you're doing fine on mana. It is also probably my favorite card in the entire Cube to splash for, which is excellent- it's a fine Black card, but enough decks have access to it that it almost plays like a common Dismember with a less oppressive drawback.
I think this is fine Common design. The only concern might be that they've been moving away from "on board tricks" like this one for a few years now, but the power level seems low enough that I think this one's OK.
Maybe a bit weak, but I like it best the way it is. Higher power than toughness makes the First Strike feel more relevant, since the ability functions like high toughness a fair amount of the time.
I really like this card. Great work! My only concern is that, yeah, 3 +1/+1 counters is a bit high for a common. I might consider Reinforce 2 for 2W (Compare to Burrenton Bombardier).
They've been moving away from pingers at common recently, and I believe they're right to do so. This feels uncommon to me on multiple levels, but I like it quite a bit as an uncommon given what appear to be the themes of your set.
I agree that this is uncommon. You have an X in the casting cost that isn't reflected anywhere else on the card, just FYI. I get what you're saying, though. Maybe make it rare and make it less variable in equipment it grabs (Go Stoneforge, but not 2 mana, basically)?
Oof, I don't like this card at all. It seems extremely weak, uses an ability that really shouldn't appear at common, is an extremely niche card, and doesn't even fill that niche particularly well. Double Strike might be OK at common in this weak a context (the big problem is when you attack with it), but this just feels like a bit of a waste to me. I'd just scrap this one, honestly- I don't see it ever doing something that makes up for the initial negative reaction.
I see the prospective value, but it seems a bit too narrow. It feels like the card's value is getting into answers to answers to answers (the first "question" is a creature, answer is your enchantment, answer to that gets it to grave, answer to that gets enchantment back), which is not a great place to be. I could be completely off, though
There's value here, but Harrow isn't in my Cube any more either. This went first. It is too slow and inefficient as a card quality advantage outlet and ramp source. Also, I feel like most Pauper Cubes need fewer accel outlets.
I just cut this one. It's really not that good. There are enough superior pingers already in Red, and the extra point of damage really doesn't make up for the card disadvantage possibilities.
I'm running it currently, but I'm not a fan. It's mostly in because it does something interesting in Red, and it does give the color some nice outs against problem cards. It's one of the weakest pieces of removal, though.
We have enough accel available at the one and two drop slot that is far more reliable, IMO.
This guy's good enough if you need a bigger BR beater, but it's really unexciting. I'm not running it currently, and I don't think anyone was ever happy to shuffle him up, but I know I've played him once or twice with minor success in the past.
I had this guy in here for a while, then I cut him. I don't entirely remember why. I think part of it is that it doesn't really do anything GR wants or needs particularly well. For a rather large chunk of the time, Nessian Courser will do a very similar job with far fewer deck demands.