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  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Uuuuuughh okay

    I'll see if I can leave class early or something

    In your heart, Last, who do you think it is?
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Ok, I'll be around at 2:30 at my computer to reread and finalize the lynch

    Gonna make a judgement call then
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    I have the irrational fear that the silver Asta team is like next leveling us atm, that's why Asta unvoted

    But ill do some clearer thinking when I'm not on my phone
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    I'm gonna wait until I get access to a computer to make a final decision

    30 minutes should be a healthy amount of time
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Squeeze gambit is when the last two members of the mafia team fight in f6/f5 lylo so when one of them gets lynched the other looks clear in the f4/f3 lylo

    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Maybe it is just friggin fulcrum/Silver and they're pulling some insane squeeze gambit rn idk

    Man that fulcrum rebuttal of my case last night just made me super unsure of what's going on
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Ughhh I'm on my phone until the last half hour of deadline

    This all makes no sense Frown
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Asta, in the world where fulcrum is town, I'm town, and you're town, who is the scum team?

    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    I'll probably end up hammering fulcrum closer to deadline but really thought we had the extra time this evening

    Blegh
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Sighhh I'm friggin busy this morning, was planning on doing everything afternoon/evening

    Kill me now
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Yeah I think deadline is in 4 hours, wow I thought that we had the entire Friday

    Sigh

    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Nah I'm town

    Plan on doing final reread tonight

    Also if you're scum you've played this day absolutely marvellously
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Well, this is me not hammering, so.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Bedtime.

    More rereading tomorrow I suppose

    It's just frustrating because I know that all the answers to this game are literally somewhere, but because this game is 5.9k posts it's literally impossible to concisely digest the game history because there's so much sh*t. Like, so much has gd happened this game, lol.



    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia - April Tempests love Scum Remnants Mafia Victory
    Quote from fulcrum »
    I think you're really overstating how clearing this should be for Silver. It was a blank vote to start the game off with no explanation other than pings behind it. It looks good for Silver later when Rhand flips, but doesn't convince anyone that Rhand's scum or put him in danger. It's easy distancing.
    That's true, but Silver continues to push Rhand for ~halfway of Day 1, and he moved onto another buddy at the end there. If he moved his vote to Mindreaver or KCC and stayed there at the end then that's a different story, but I feel like scum Silver would have moved off on Rhand earlier.

    Quote from fulcrum »
    Nacho /asked/ Silver if his read on Rhand was changing and Silver didn't feel comfortable enough to back off of Rhand because me, Axel and Nacho were already starting to push Rhand. Also, Silver did try to start pivoting off Rhand and onto an easy mislynch in mindreaver before this:

    ...

    Notice that he went after Mindreaver for lightly townreading Rhand, setting him up for a mislynch even if Rhand flipped first. Obvious scumplay is obvious.


    Don't think you're right about this one - Nacho was townreading Rhand early here:


    Post 260:
    Quote from Nachomamma8 »
    Light town read on Rhand's #194; in particular, the expanded empathy defense.


    ..and I think Nacho wanted to hear about if Silver's scum-read would be impacted by Rhand's big reads post.

    I wouldn't call Axelrod's post (#308) and your posts (#313), (#320) as exactly "pushing Rhand". Nacho had a big post that he addressed to Rhand about his wall as well (#366) but I wouldn't call your narrative correct. Silver was the only person voting Rhand as of the votecount on that page.

    Quote from Fulcrum »
    Notice that he went after Mindreaver for lightly townreading Rhand, setting him up for a mislynch even if Rhand flipped first. Obvious scumplay is obvious.
    You have me on this point; his post to Mindreaver did read as thought it was a attempt to springboard a vote onto him.

    Quote from Fulcrum »
    You cut off half the ******* post to just include the part that looks good for Silver, what the ****.
    I cropped out only the part that I thought was relevant (Silver talking about Rhand). Apologies about that.

    Quote from Fulcrum »
    Silver was literally setting up the mindreaver push away from Rhand /in this post./ And his whole angle for approaching this is too clear himself. His focus is on himself, saying how Rhand must be tmiing him as town, so that if anyone latches onto the reasoning enough to kill Rhand they'll /have/ conclude Silver is town off of it, because the reasoning is based on Rhand knowing Silver is town. It's something then set up in their chat, to make it looks like Rhnad has a bit of tmi on Silver so they can never be together. And if anyone suspects Silver, they then wouldn't have wanted to go after Rhand, because they made it look like Silver flipping scum clears Rhand. It was all set up to clear one of them when the other flipped, without even making that flip much more likely.
    Sure he says he's switching to Mindreaver, but I still think that they would have set this up more naturally if they were scum together. I think that Silver and Rhand would have gotten into an argument or had each scumread the other if they wanted to start distancing on Day 1. I think your reasoning here is a little faulty - I don't necessarily think that people would latch onto Silver's argument to vote Rhand, they would just cite some of Rhand's posts to vote him

    Quote from Fulcrum »
    That's not what they're doing, though. Rhand is townreading Silver, and Silver is doing a big song and dance about how he can never be scum with Rhand, but not actually pushing Rhand about it. Silver was at the head of a wagon on Rhand at this point, but was doing nothing to actually bury him, that was all me and Nacho. But he gets the credit and the unaligned read, while you push me for being on there later, as if it wasn't my logic that was one of the main threats to Rhand in the first place. If other people hadn't attacked Rhand for independent reasons, Silver's "pressure" would have done nothing but make them look unaligned.
    You're right in that Silver isn't actively burying Rhand exactly at this point, but Silver is still voting Rhand when he could have easily moved to Mindreaver or anyone else. I can't say what Silver was going to do if, say, Gemma never posted her misgivings WRT Rhand, but I'm just going purely off the information presented to me.

    Quote from fulcrum »

    Alright, so let's actually look at what he did in this post.
    1.He repeated the Tmi stuff, to clear himself and extended it to Nacho, which makes it sound more legit and doesn't hurt scum when everyone was townreading Nacho by then anyway.
    Fair. Think it's reasonable for town Silver to have a read like this, personally

    Quote from Fulcrum »
    2. He restated one of my points against Rhand without adding anything:
    Think this is correct, something I didn't notice because I wasn't in the game at the time.

    Quote from Fulcrum »

    3.Called Rhand's reads "fine" but progression weird, which was, again, just restating what I said but somehow making it a bit better for Rhand.
    4. He linked two town in Axel and Vezok to Rhand as well, setting up mislynchs for whenever Rhand flips.

    How exactly is this "guns blazing" Proph? Especially when there were already multiple people voting Rhand and both Gemma and I had cased him like a few posts above this.
    I think this was guns blazing because it was when Silver started to seriously push his Rhand read and treat it as a scumread rather than go "yeah I think Rhand's scum but I'm gonna keep poking in these other directions".

    You might disagree with me on this, but I think he would have probably used some different reasoning if he was scum with Rhand rather than agree with you and restate his prior reasoning. Feels like he would better position himself to bus Rhand rather than list reasoning from the top of his head, which is what he did here and I don't think he had any specific agenda in mind when making this anti-Rhand post.

    Quote from Fulcrum »
    I ******* love how you spin this as Silver "taking responsibility" for the Mind lynch, like it's not scummy for him to shove away from Rhand and onto the lynch he was angling for since the early game just because he posted reasoning for it. Silver literally said "the case is made several times over" instead of making the case for himself. He took no responsibility, he was just telling people to lynch the guy who wasn't here.
    IMO he's taking responsibility here because he's voting Mindreaver and taking ownership of the fact that he might be telling people to lynch someone who isn't there. Again, I feel like if Silver was scum, he'd probably word it in a different way where he'd probably talk about how scummy Mindreaver was vs saying "yeah, we need to clear out the lurker here because everyone else is too town".

    Quote from Fulcrum »
    Just, disagree, Silver is setting up a mislynch after the Mindreaver mislynch, and backing off now that the thread as a whole has let go of Rhand and he feels like they look unaligned up. How else, exactly, should they have played this as mafia? Because Rhand had very little real lynch pressure from Silver, and Silver got to emphasize how they're not together over and over again? How is that not an ideal scenario for a scumteam that knows Rhand often dies early?
    You have a fair point here; can't really argue against this.

    Quote from Fulcrum »
    Ask, and ye shall receive, witch.

    tl:dr Proph omitted important context. Y'all need to actually read what happened for yourselves, stop letting scum craft the only narrative of the game.
    OK, I admit that after reading this my townread on Silver has wavered a bit (as in, I can see a hypothetical world where Silver is mafia). Still think that if Silver is mafia that he pivots to KCC at EoD as opposed to slaying dkings unless he's like, super bus-heavy scum (which I guess is theoretically possible).

    Would at least like Silver to respond to some of fulcrum's stuff, but I'll give this a long sleep and think on it

    Sorry if some of the above isn't coherent, I am writing this at 2:45 AM so yeah.

    What do you make of Silver being the first one aside from vezok to push Rhand Day 3?

    Posted in: Mafia
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