On the other hand, I'd like to know if we could please talk a little about our Lingering Souls. I've played them in modern and they're nuts. In this deck, what's their main role?
I see them as blockers, Jace protectors and as bodies for Batterskull and Jitte. Any other ideas for them?
Cheers.
cabal therapy out of the side as well. Sacrifice souls to flashback the discard.
Just a *small* list of cards that are variably good in modern combo matchups..
-Thoughtseize
-Spell snare
-Mana leak
-Spell pierce
-Thalia
-Relic or Progenitus, Grafdigger's Cage, Tormod's Crypt, Rest in Peace, Leyline of the Void
-Stony silence
-Dryad Militant
-Deathrite Shaman
-Leyline of Sanctity
-Runed Halo
-Nevermore
-Meddling Mage
-Ethersworn Canonist
-Path to Exile
-Slaughter Games
-Vendilion Clique
-Inquisition of Kozilek
-Trickbind
-Angel's Grace
-Leonin Arbiter
-Aven Mindcensor
-Trinisphere
-Chalice of the Void
-Thorn of Amethyst
-Silence
-Gaddock Teeg
-Tidehollow Sculler
-Qasali Pridemage
These are all "answers" to combo decks that can typically be played before combo decks can achieve a win. The only difference between legacy and modern answers are that the modern answers aren't free, but they don't need to be since very few combo decks are doing anything relevant before turn 3-4 anyway, and most of these answers cost 1-2 mana regardless.
Additionally, Modern has had far fewer combo decks top 8 any relevant tournament than Legacy has, so I'm not sure where you're basing your opinion from.
The entire point of my post, was that a combo like hypergenesis (you know, the part I quoted) hardly has an open like that. Legacy has a ton of 0-1 mana countermeasures, including some main deck hate, that is not available in legacy. You can't begin to argue that modern has anywhere near the amount of main deck worthy cards to hate combo.
And those countermeasures don't exist. I was talking about countermeasures that legacy has that modern obviously does not have. There's nothing to stop someone's 3 color landbase (wasteland), there's nothing like daze or force to stop someone from combo-ing out with 1 mana cards, there's pretty much discard and thalia.
In addition, you list a bunch of 2 mana creatures and path to exile (??) as combo hate (Along with yes, a few discard and 1 mana answers that are entirely narrow) with a list that didn't have much to do with my post at all.
The format isn't very strong for control, which is why eggs was able to just take it for a joyride. After a few sets, its more than likely going to become a format of aggro vs combo.
A friend of mine just showed me his legacy hypergenesis deck:
He: You don't believe me? Here. Let me play a hand. /shuffles, draws 7/
Me: Come on! That's BS, you can't do it!
He: /plays a sac land tapped, untaps, draws, plays another land, plays a spell with cascade for 3, cascades into hypergenesis, puts down a warstorm surge and a blightsteel colossus./
Me: That's INSANE!
He: Yup
Yeah and that hardly every happens. You have a format of force of will, daze, wasteland, stifle, thalia, and some of the most unforgiving sideboards.
Nice thing about legacy, there's countermeasures for everything. And giving "examples in a vacuum" is a false representation of it. By that logic, MUD (artifacts based around Metalworker is the best deck ever with its consistent turn 2 blightsteel equipped with lightning greaves.
And now you get to why a lot of people dislike modern, those countermeasures just don't exist. Combo seems to be better in modern because of this, at least compared to legacy.
Reading this forum makes me understand why wizards doesn't want to reprint Counterspell. Many people simply don't know how to interact with counterspells and I suspect that they lose to themselves more than anything else.
I have absolutely no idea how counterspells are a problem and discard is not.
Counterspells are actually easier to play around, since you control when they can counter (you play the spell).
Discard can happen before you even play that 1st land.
the graveyard is such a strong resource, especially with so many of the newer cards focusing on it. Hell, it's even a free resource really. The best creatures in the format right now are essentially ways to interact with grave while still being relevant.
A good 50% of the meta right now uses the graveyard as a serious resource, and even those that don't can be affected by hate against it (rest in peace vs high tide, those time spirals do a lot less and cause fizzles when combo-ing out).
When you look at match ups (especially after side decking), it's like running not enough basics vs RUG/BUG delver and even playing around stifle or daze sometimes. Does that person have a way of just shutting off your/both graves? Do they have repeatable grave hate (ooze, shaman) that will act like stifle/daze to your snapcasters or reanimates?
And I think that's why decks like Miracles is going to soar, it runs a ton of basics and doesn't give a rats behind about the grave. 3 or 4 cards of everyone's side is graveyard hate, and some even run it main deck.
I like this though, the more resources we can use and hate, the more interesting the game becomes.
It's called Rhystic magic. It was a pretty bad mechanic, especially the land.
oh yeah, forgot about that because it was pretty god awful
I think we'll get another cycle of something else in gate.
it's just weird to have a cycle counter one color specifically, outside of can't be discarded (black) I don't see a similar "hate cycle"as I don't think another color has a definite mechanic like that
eh, i hope gatecrash gets the opposite of the "can't be countered" cards. Cards that are nuts powerful, but countered for a mere 1.
like reprint demonic tutor this way, hah.
As for the people hating on counters, do you also hate that black can discard ANY card for 1? White can remove ANY creature for 1?
blue has to hit it when it's coming in
black has to hit it when it's in the hand
red and white have to hit it when it's on the field
green, um.. grows.
I know I've seen it on here before, but nothing recently.
What are the thoughts on groping counterbalance to the side and playing tezzy AoB to sit behind a bridge/ humility, build up a large enough thopter count and ult for the win?
I think it's just a tad too slow for the current meta. Outside of humility, the entire thing dies to qasali pridemage and abrupt decay. Graveyard hate is also pretty high even maindeck, and having the entire combo depend on sword staying in graveyard doesn't help.
It's really, really fun though. And still remains my multiplayer deck of choice
I lost the roll, 1st match was pretty much a battle of tarmogoyf vs batterskull. Swords did work against delvers and a tarmogoyf. Didn't see any stifles, but he did land a sylvan library. I had enough mana essentially to play everything I drew and took the game.
*I sided out force of wills and 1 jace, brought in the supreme verdicts, nihil spellbombs and a lingering souls, 2 swords to plowshares came out for path to exiles. I really didn't know what to bring outside of nihils and verdicts.
Going second again, this time I get wastelanded out. 1 stifle attempt got spell pierced. I know to play around daze so that wasn't an issue, I do a decent job of swords/path-ing everything but mongoose gets me after a while. Mishra's factorys did a good job of keeping some things at bay.
Third game got grindy, we trade removal for a long while. I don't have any issue with lands, get all 4 basics in and start hitting with factorys. The game ends up going to time right after I Engineered Explosives a tarmo. I had 20+ life to his 13, an unequipped batterskull on the field (he dismembered it) with 7 lands, and a card in hand. He had a mongoose and 1 card as well in hand.
Again, factorys did a ton of work here, but alas... time.
I think I could have taken it, but the game just got timed out, so draw
Really fun match, hope to play him again.
(0-1-0)
Game 2:
High Tide
1st game I save snapcasters for every discard spell I can, spell pierce the first high tide attempt, and batterskull seals it after a meditate from him.
I side in surgicals, duress and extra inquisition, out 4 swords to plowshares, and i take out 1 engineered explosives for disenchant.
2nd game goes really quick. Discard + surgical on high tide, and that's pretty much it. I don't know what he can do after that, I'm sure candelabra and turnabout can still mill me out so i just make sure to take care of those.
(1-1-0)
Game 3:
Elves (mirror entity)
1st game I just swords everything I can, counter the glimpse of nature attempt and go down to (I think) 3 life. But jitte on a stoneforge takes it. Snapcasters flashbacking swords to plowshares to block and remove pretty much did everything. Close game though, I was at 3 before the jitte stuck.
I swap out spell pierces and force of wills, bring in path to exiles, lingering souls, supreme verdicts. 1 Thoughtseize comes out for a inquisition (why not? everything costs 3 or less)
2nd game he doesn't see any of the cards he side decked in. I can tell because I didn't see choke or krosan grips at all. Engineered Explosives takes 3 elves, and I just clock him from there. Cool guy though!
The mishra's factorys definitely helped here, they blocked a lot of early aggro.
(2-1-0)
Game 4
Nic Fit - Valakut
I'm terrible with dice so lose the roll again.
1st game I get cabal therapy'd like 4 times, I do my best to brainstorm to hide cards. Veteran Explorer gets sac'd once, but the lands actually helped me a bit, I was free to cast stoneforge and hold mana back for a counter. Which ended up dragging the game out for a while. batterskull gets therapy'd, snapcaster does a great job of getting my cards back from the grave.
Squire mode stone forge takes a good 5 points of health, and a factory finishes it off. I hardcast force of will a good 3 times this match. Was fun.
*I have no idea what to side here, so 2 engineered explosives come out for supreme verdict, and that's it. I figure it will at least hit titans.
Game 2 was pretty much the same as the first, except now carpet of flowers comes down 1st turn. So I play a fetchland, then a plains, then a mishra's factory
mishra's and a jitte equipped stoneforge take the game. Cabal therapy hits a vendilion clique and attempts to hit a snapcaster. I know my snapcaster is the target so i decided to hide it.
I brainstormed in response to a therapy, I had a force, a swords to plowshares and a snapcaster... On top of the deck was a force, a swords to plowshares and a tundra.. all I swapped was the snapcaster for a tundra. All I needed at this point was removal.
(3-1-0)
So got second place, not bad!
I am definitely swapping the detention spheres for oblivion rings. I am scared of omnitell, especially the ones popping up with leyline of sanctity. I have no idea how to combat that. Any tips? I haven't had to play against it yet, so if anyone has advice please tell.
so not the most helpful of reports, the deck is just solid and does well even in topdeck mode. I love the factorys.
I find miracle to be a "soft prison" deck if that makes any sense.
I looked at your list ilazul. I play a very similar list except I run a full sixty cards.
Yours is not the first list I have seen lately with wastelands, and I haven't found them to be useful in most match ups. In my experience stoneblade can always find ways to use its Mana so sacrificing a land to deny your opponent usually hurts us more than them.
LOL didn't notice that for some reason I forgot the jaces!
I find the wastelands pretty helpful in many matchups. I agree that Ith isn't the greatest of worries, but I actually like the wastes against goblins sometimes, and merfolk.
I don't use it as mana denial, but I guess depending on the meta i'd like to shift to -3 wastes, +2 basics, +1 academy ruins.
Engineered Explosives is so good right now, I'd love to use them a couple times in a single match.
EDIT (10/22)
so after playing this weekend, then watching some of the ssg legacy matches with esper, i'm 100% putting both engineered explosives in the maindeck and side-ing detention sphere as a 2-of.
I also really liked how Lauren was using mishra's factorys. I might copy that as a 3 of as well (instead of wastes). Adds pressure with a jitte, hits on an empty field, kills planeswalkers, and can hold off goblins fairly well in a pinch.
The added clock is also something that's pretty damn important in a lot of situations.
I was playing miracles before it exploded. I spent a month preparing for scg buffalo with counter top miracle. I abandoned miracles 2 weeks after scg buffalo, I found the deck for durdlely and many matches would end up going to time. If you 2 slow decks matched up there is no way you're finishing.
UB stoneblade is my deck of choice, I like the proactive control plan and I love the sideboard strategy.
that pretty much reinforces what I've been thinking as well. I tried miracles for a bit but just found it too narrow in many matches. It's also painfully slow.
I really missed having a bit more creatures, the discard, and even the life gain.
Also, if counter/top isn't the best strategy, there goes a lot of dead cards.
I like miracles, but I think it needs a little more than what it has I guess.
Sometimes the flex spot is Lingering Souls or what's relevant at the time.
The list is very standard, and over miracles I find the discard really helpful. Miracles obviously has more wipes than esper, but is a much slower deck and has to find jace or entreat to win.
Since Supreme Verdict is a card now I don't know if the wipes are all that much of an advantage and I guess it comes down to "is aggro or control a bigger threat in your meta?"
Has anyone else noticed a drop in esper or is it just me?
I find the list runs fine, but as twndomn said above, I am having trouble with BUG and sometimes Esper blade. Goblins seem to be here and there depending on how many explosives, terminus, and verdicts I can resolve.
my sideboard is fairly straightforward to combat maverick, vial decks, the mirror (and other control decks), and the graveyard.
Even if you take out BUG's graveyard, liliana of the veil to remove removal + manlands gets us. Abrupt Decay obviously shuts off counterbalance, but I'd argue it's not really needed since everyone will be on topdeck mode.
I also might try and throw academy ruins in my main 60. EE can just straight win against aggro decks, and relic is what gives me almost all my RUG wins. I'd like to have recursion and even get back a countered relic.
I sold some crap on eBay and got myself a pair of underground seas as the "secret Christmas present I wouldn't ask anyone else for"
cabal therapy out of the side as well. Sacrifice souls to flashback the discard.
The entire point of my post, was that a combo like hypergenesis (you know, the part I quoted) hardly has an open like that. Legacy has a ton of 0-1 mana countermeasures, including some main deck hate, that is not available in legacy. You can't begin to argue that modern has anywhere near the amount of main deck worthy cards to hate combo.
And those countermeasures don't exist. I was talking about countermeasures that legacy has that modern obviously does not have. There's nothing to stop someone's 3 color landbase (wasteland), there's nothing like daze or force to stop someone from combo-ing out with 1 mana cards, there's pretty much discard and thalia.
In addition, you list a bunch of 2 mana creatures and path to exile (??) as combo hate (Along with yes, a few discard and 1 mana answers that are entirely narrow) with a list that didn't have much to do with my post at all.
The format isn't very strong for control, which is why eggs was able to just take it for a joyride. After a few sets, its more than likely going to become a format of aggro vs combo.
Yeah and that hardly every happens. You have a format of force of will, daze, wasteland, stifle, thalia, and some of the most unforgiving sideboards.
Nice thing about legacy, there's countermeasures for everything. And giving "examples in a vacuum" is a false representation of it. By that logic, MUD (artifacts based around Metalworker is the best deck ever with its consistent turn 2 blightsteel equipped with lightning greaves.
And now you get to why a lot of people dislike modern, those countermeasures just don't exist. Combo seems to be better in modern because of this, at least compared to legacy.
I have absolutely no idea how counterspells are a problem and discard is not.
Counterspells are actually easier to play around, since you control when they can counter (you play the spell).
Discard can happen before you even play that 1st land.
A good 50% of the meta right now uses the graveyard as a serious resource, and even those that don't can be affected by hate against it (rest in peace vs high tide, those time spirals do a lot less and cause fizzles when combo-ing out).
When you look at match ups (especially after side decking), it's like running not enough basics vs RUG/BUG delver and even playing around stifle or daze sometimes. Does that person have a way of just shutting off your/both graves? Do they have repeatable grave hate (ooze, shaman) that will act like stifle/daze to your snapcasters or reanimates?
And I think that's why decks like Miracles is going to soar, it runs a ton of basics and doesn't give a rats behind about the grave. 3 or 4 cards of everyone's side is graveyard hate, and some even run it main deck.
I like this though, the more resources we can use and hate, the more interesting the game becomes.
oh yeah, forgot about that because it was pretty god awful
I think we'll get another cycle of something else in gate.
it's just weird to have a cycle counter one color specifically, outside of can't be discarded (black) I don't see a similar "hate cycle"as I don't think another color has a definite mechanic like that
like reprint demonic tutor this way, hah.
As for the people hating on counters, do you also hate that black can discard ANY card for 1? White can remove ANY creature for 1?
blue has to hit it when it's coming in
black has to hit it when it's in the hand
red and white have to hit it when it's on the field
green, um.. grows.
Sounds like "shot in the Dark" http://www.mtgdecks.net/decks/view/26276
I think it's just a tad too slow for the current meta. Outside of humility, the entire thing dies to qasali pridemage and abrupt decay. Graveyard hate is also pretty high even maindeck, and having the entire combo depend on sword staying in graveyard doesn't help.
It's really, really fun though. And still remains my multiplayer deck of choice
curio cavern is right outside of Springfield mall, good players there. I've seen a bunch of them on star city live streams.
They do legacy twice a week with around 15 people one day and almost 30 another. So i'm happy camping out there
As someone who hasn't played in anything requiring a DCI number since 2003, I'm really happy with the deck
I got 2nd place (1st game went to time, 2-0 the other three)
my list real quick:
4x Flooded Strand
4x Polluted Delta
4x Tundra
3x Underground Sea
1x Scrubland
2x Island
1x Plains
1x Swamp
3x Mishra's Factory
1x Karakas
4x Snapcaster Mage
4x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Vendilion Clique
Artifacts (4)
2x Engineered Explosives
1x Batterskull
1x Umezawa's Jitte
Instants (15)
4x Brainstorm
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Force of Will
1x Counterspell
2x Spell Pierce
2x Thoughtseize
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
Planeswalkers (3)
3x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Side:
1x Duress
1x Disenchant
2x Detention Sphere (will become Oblivion Rings)
2x Supreme Verdict
2x Surgical Extraction
2x Nihil Spellbomb
2x Path to Exile
2x Lingering Souls
1st game was against RUG delver
I lost the roll, 1st match was pretty much a battle of tarmogoyf vs batterskull. Swords did work against delvers and a tarmogoyf. Didn't see any stifles, but he did land a sylvan library. I had enough mana essentially to play everything I drew and took the game.
*I sided out force of wills and 1 jace, brought in the supreme verdicts, nihil spellbombs and a lingering souls, 2 swords to plowshares came out for path to exiles. I really didn't know what to bring outside of nihils and verdicts.
Going second again, this time I get wastelanded out. 1 stifle attempt got spell pierced. I know to play around daze so that wasn't an issue, I do a decent job of swords/path-ing everything but mongoose gets me after a while. Mishra's factorys did a good job of keeping some things at bay.
Third game got grindy, we trade removal for a long while. I don't have any issue with lands, get all 4 basics in and start hitting with factorys. The game ends up going to time right after I Engineered Explosives a tarmo. I had 20+ life to his 13, an unequipped batterskull on the field (he dismembered it) with 7 lands, and a card in hand. He had a mongoose and 1 card as well in hand.
Again, factorys did a ton of work here, but alas... time.
I think I could have taken it, but the game just got timed out, so draw
Really fun match, hope to play him again.
(0-1-0)
Game 2:
High Tide
1st game I save snapcasters for every discard spell I can, spell pierce the first high tide attempt, and batterskull seals it after a meditate from him.
I side in surgicals, duress and extra inquisition, out 4 swords to plowshares, and i take out 1 engineered explosives for disenchant.
2nd game goes really quick. Discard + surgical on high tide, and that's pretty much it. I don't know what he can do after that, I'm sure candelabra and turnabout can still mill me out so i just make sure to take care of those.
(1-1-0)
Game 3:
Elves (mirror entity)
1st game I just swords everything I can, counter the glimpse of nature attempt and go down to (I think) 3 life. But jitte on a stoneforge takes it. Snapcasters flashbacking swords to plowshares to block and remove pretty much did everything. Close game though, I was at 3 before the jitte stuck.
I swap out spell pierces and force of wills, bring in path to exiles, lingering souls, supreme verdicts. 1 Thoughtseize comes out for a inquisition (why not? everything costs 3 or less)
2nd game he doesn't see any of the cards he side decked in. I can tell because I didn't see choke or krosan grips at all. Engineered Explosives takes 3 elves, and I just clock him from there. Cool guy though!
The mishra's factorys definitely helped here, they blocked a lot of early aggro.
(2-1-0)
Game 4
Nic Fit - Valakut
I'm terrible with dice so lose the roll again.
1st game I get cabal therapy'd like 4 times, I do my best to brainstorm to hide cards. Veteran Explorer gets sac'd once, but the lands actually helped me a bit, I was free to cast stoneforge and hold mana back for a counter. Which ended up dragging the game out for a while. batterskull gets therapy'd, snapcaster does a great job of getting my cards back from the grave.
Squire mode stone forge takes a good 5 points of health, and a factory finishes it off. I hardcast force of will a good 3 times this match. Was fun.
*I have no idea what to side here, so 2 engineered explosives come out for supreme verdict, and that's it. I figure it will at least hit titans.
Game 2 was pretty much the same as the first, except now carpet of flowers comes down 1st turn. So I play a fetchland, then a plains, then a mishra's factory
mishra's and a jitte equipped stoneforge take the game. Cabal therapy hits a vendilion clique and attempts to hit a snapcaster. I know my snapcaster is the target so i decided to hide it.
I brainstormed in response to a therapy, I had a force, a swords to plowshares and a snapcaster... On top of the deck was a force, a swords to plowshares and a tundra.. all I swapped was the snapcaster for a tundra. All I needed at this point was removal.
(3-1-0)
So got second place, not bad!
I am definitely swapping the detention spheres for oblivion rings. I am scared of omnitell, especially the ones popping up with leyline of sanctity. I have no idea how to combat that. Any tips? I haven't had to play against it yet, so if anyone has advice please tell.
so not the most helpful of reports, the deck is just solid and does well even in topdeck mode. I love the factorys.
LOL didn't notice that for some reason I forgot the jaces!
I find the wastelands pretty helpful in many matchups. I agree that Ith isn't the greatest of worries, but I actually like the wastes against goblins sometimes, and merfolk.
I don't use it as mana denial, but I guess depending on the meta i'd like to shift to -3 wastes, +2 basics, +1 academy ruins.
Engineered Explosives is so good right now, I'd love to use them a couple times in a single match.
EDIT (10/22)
so after playing this weekend, then watching some of the ssg legacy matches with esper, i'm 100% putting both engineered explosives in the maindeck and side-ing detention sphere as a 2-of.
I also really liked how Lauren was using mishra's factorys. I might copy that as a 3 of as well (instead of wastes). Adds pressure with a jitte, hits on an empty field, kills planeswalkers, and can hold off goblins fairly well in a pinch.
The added clock is also something that's pretty damn important in a lot of situations.
that pretty much reinforces what I've been thinking as well. I tried miracles for a bit but just found it too narrow in many matches. It's also painfully slow.
I really missed having a bit more creatures, the discard, and even the life gain.
Also, if counter/top isn't the best strategy, there goes a lot of dead cards.
I like miracles, but I think it needs a little more than what it has I guess.
I find I do pretty much the same playing either list.
4x Polluted Delta
4x Flooded Strand
1x Marsh Flats
3x Tundra
2x Underground Sea
1x Scrubland
2x Island
1x Plains
1x Swamp
3x Wasteland
1x Karakas
4x Stoneforge Mystic
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Vendilion Clique
Artifacts: 2
1x Batterskull
1x Umezawa's Jitte
Instants: 16
4x Brainstorm
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Force of Will
2x Spell Pierce
2x Counterspell
2x Thoughtseize
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
Planeswalkers: 3
3x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Flex Spots: 2
1x Detention Sphere
1x Engineered Explosives
Sometimes the flex spot is Lingering Souls or what's relevant at the time.
The list is very standard, and over miracles I find the discard really helpful. Miracles obviously has more wipes than esper, but is a much slower deck and has to find jace or entreat to win.
Since Supreme Verdict is a card now I don't know if the wipes are all that much of an advantage and I guess it comes down to "is aggro or control a bigger threat in your meta?"
Has anyone else noticed a drop in esper or is it just me?
My deck is fairly standard:
4x Flooded Strand
4x Scalding Tarn
2x Arid Mesa
5x Island
2x Plains
2x Tundra
2x Volcanic Island
1x Karakas
2x Snapcaster Mage
2x Vendilion Clique
Artifacts & Enchantments: 8
4x Sensei's Divining Top
4x Counterbalance
Instants: 16
4x Brainstorm
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Force of Will
2x Counterspell
2x Spell Pierce
2x Entreat the Angels
4x Terminus
Planeswalkers: 4*
4x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
*Depending on what I think I'm going to face, 1 terminus and 1 jace sometimes swap out for an Engineered Explosives and/or a Detention Sphere
I find the list runs fine, but as twndomn said above, I am having trouble with BUG and sometimes Esper blade. Goblins seem to be here and there depending on how many explosives, terminus, and verdicts I can resolve.
My sideboard has been working well:
4x Pyroblast
2x Supreme Verdict
1-2x Engineered Explosives (these are amazing when you side out the counterbalances for vial decks and against maverick
1x Disenchant
2x Surgical Extraction
2x Relic of Progenitus
1x Humility
1x I wish I owned a Moat slot
my sideboard is fairly straightforward to combat maverick, vial decks, the mirror (and other control decks), and the graveyard.
Even if you take out BUG's graveyard, liliana of the veil to remove removal + manlands gets us. Abrupt Decay obviously shuts off counterbalance, but I'd argue it's not really needed since everyone will be on topdeck mode.
I also might try and throw academy ruins in my main 60. EE can just straight win against aggro decks, and relic is what gives me almost all my RUG wins. I'd like to have recursion and even get back a countered relic.