You know, this might be weird but I like LDV more than I like Tog...
Ok, hear me out on this, it's not that Tog is bad, I love Tog, it's just that I like tutors more. Not only that but Tog is also a 1/2 for 3, and while he's not really a 1/2 for 3, he requires valuable resources to become larger than that and doesn't have a lot of protection naturally. He evades burn to some extent, but to dodge a Lightning bolt he requires either 2 discards or 4 cards from the grave, or some mix of that... Potentially you can get a 0 for 1, but you have to be pretty late in the game for that, and every time to protect him from something, you're losing future pumps making him more of a 1/2. Now that's just Lightning Bolt, and something like Dismember is even harder to dodge, requiring 8 cards from the grave if you want to protect from it. That's a lot of investment.
As for being an engine for things like Reanimator, he's good for that, but we're getting plenty of other engines that allow us to discard. Also, when playing reanimator the outlet is important, but so is the Reanimator spell, and LDV allows you to get one or the other, if not both on some occasions, and that's huge.
More so, we all tend to run the other tutors such as Enlightened and Mystic, and those are more restrictive on most occasions.
I'm with wtwlf123 I think this card is a bomb. It kills almost all things early and has the plus side of hitting 3 planeswalkers. (which putrefying cannot) also it can get enchantments which is big, while still hitting almost all relevant equipments. I think this card should be ran over putrefy in all cubes except cubes large enough to contain both or dragon cubes.
The fact that this spell can't be countered is also very good. It can destroy something like shackles that a lot of decks would just lose to with out worrying about counters.
I think if your (U/B) section isn't built around the artifact deck (mainly no Tezz) it is probably worth trying. Some people like it some don't. It also depends on how strongly your cube supports things like reanimator/twin/other combo decks since it is really strong in those decks.
Yeah, but UW is weak enough that there would have to be at least three better UW cards in this set before I wouldn't cube this. Yes, three better cards than a 4-mana uncounterable Wrath. Not going to happen. I think this is probably the best or second best Azorius card; the guild is weak and this card is strong. Unless you don't play multicolor cards at all, I can't think of a reason not to play this. I'm cutting something for it (probably Absorb) and then I'll get rid of Rout in the white section.
Cheers,
rant
Wow I forgot about absorb (it's in my cube) that card is sick and another good UW control card. It goes well with this card. I think the only 3 non-land auto includes in my a cube are absorb, giest, and now this. So I would definitely be fine with another good card or two.
Not in this deck or in the scenario stated above. Blinking it does nothing and (I'll agree random is better then your opponent choosing) waiting for black cat to die is way worse then making an opponent discard when you choose via a rat.
I know that was sarcasm but it acctually makes sense. This forum is pretty worthless for people who want to talk about the indivudual cards since there are now 73 cards to discuss and growing. There should just be a sub forum that is archived when the next set comes out. It would be a lot cleaner and easier to use.
Azorious Charm WU
Instant
Choose one - Exile target creature you control, then return that card to the battlefield under your control; or return target creature to its owner's hand; or counter target spell unless its controller pays 1. W - Cloudshift U - Unsummon - Force Spike/Mana Tithe
Boros Charm WR
Instant
Choose one - Target creature gains protection from the color of your choice until end of turn; or target creature gains double strike until end of turn; or Boros Charm deals 1 damage to each attacking creature. W - Stave off R - Assault Strobe - Tremor/Marrow Shards
(alternatively design a good card for boros)
Dimir Charm UB
Instant
Choose one - Target opponent reveals his or her hand and discards a noncreature, nonland card; or draw three cards, then put two cards from your hand on top of your library in any order; or target player puts the top five cards of his or her library into his or her graveyard. U - Brainstorm B - Duress - Memory Sluice/Tome Scour
Golgari Charm BG
Instant
Choose one - Target creature gets -2/-2 until end of turn; or target creature gets +2/+2 until end of turn; or return target creature card from your graveyard to your hand. B - Disfigure G - Giant Growth - Raise Dead/Reclaim
Gruul Charm RG
Instant
Choose one - Creatures you control gain haste until end of turn; or target creature you control fights target creature you don't control; or target creature gets +3/+3 until end of turn. R - Burst of Speed G - Prey Upon - Giant Growth/Brute Force
Orzhov Charm WB
Instant
Choose one - Exile target creature that dealt damage to you this turn; or target player loses 2 life, you gain 2 life; or exile target card from a graveyard, then put a 1/1 White Spirit creature token with flying onto the battlefield. W - Reciprocate B - Taste of Blood - Beckon Apparition
Rakdos Charm BR
Instant
Choose one - Each player sacrifices a creature; or each player sacrifices a land; or target player loses 3 life. B - Bone Splinters/Innocent Blood R - Raze/Crack the Earth - Bump in the Night/Lava Spike
(alternatively have the first two abilities read like their root cards [as in targeting])
Selesnya Charm GW
Instant
Choose one - Search your library for a creature card, reveal it, shuffle your library, then put the card on top of it; or untap all creatures you control; or put a 1/1 green Saproling creature token onto the battlefield. G - Worldly Tutor W - Rally the Troops/Mobilize - Sprout/Spiritual Visit
Simic Charm UG
Instant
Choose one - Counter target activated or triggered ability; or search your library for a basic land card, reveal that card, put it into your hand, then shuffle your library; or target creature gains hexproof until end of turn. U - Stifle G - Lay of the Land - Mage's Guile/Ranger's Guile
These are pretty good. The UW goes straight into most cubes.
I'm pretty happy with the amount of black one drops at the moment but I guess a B/R hybrid one drop would be good for red as well. I want some more aggressive black 2 drops so I can cut shadows. I don't like them in cube. I would also appreciate some 3 drop black creatures to go with messenger.
I play all 5, but If I was going to cut them because "I'm sick of them" I would still leave this and the W one in. The white one has some interesting interactions and the G one is the best at promoting the archetypes it fits into. The other three are just finishers, nothing special.
urzas rage, kavu titan,gatekeeper and im sure theres more arnt "garbage without kicker"
2 of those are bears... I'm willing to bet we will see a bear with unleash. Urza's rage is pretty bad by today's standards even when kicked.
I get the impression that you didn't realy read my statement for what it's worth and your were more interested in be the "oh really what about this niche scenario" guy.
Edit - also 2 of those (which are garbage when kicked by todays standards) are rares. This is a common.
Keyword doesn't exist outside of cards. You can't judge it by itself. The desing of keywords doesn't matter, because you don't play with then. It's the cards that matter, not a abstract text wall.
Unleash, like many other keywords, is another way to make "double cards". It's like kicker, except it cost the creature's ability to block instead of mana and it has a standard +1/+1 benefict. This is a interesting take if you ask me. It's like you're choosing the creature stance - defensive or offensive one.
I think comparing it to kicker is pretty apt. How come no one complained about kicker as a mechanic. Doesn't it generally say "pay this cost or this creature is a piece of garbage". That seems pretty lame and narrow to me. This is actually a better design than kicker because the mechanic does something by on it's own, while still having the bonus of being "kicked" with phrases like "if ~ EtB with a +1/+1 counter on it destroy target artifact."
that as a mechanic is horrible. i think the best way to judge a mechanic is to make blank/vanilla cards and put the mechanic on the card. just because a good card has a mechanic on it doesnt make the mechanic.
Here is a great reason to compare it to kicker. Kicker on a vanilla does nothing because kicker does nothing on its own. Add EtB triggers to the kicker and its good. Same with this ability but it has the added bonus of 1) being free to pay 2) giving the creature two different modes. Aggressive or defensive.
Unleash is a crap mechanic. So are pretty much all of the RtR mechanics. So were almost all the original Rav/Dis/GP mechanics.
Seriously, did people forget that outside of dredge, almost none of the guild mechanic cards saw serious constructed play. Gigadrowse, the hellbent Blaze, the radiance protection combat trick, the forcast thing to reanimate 1-drops, maybe a transmute or two. That was it. 1 card from a few guilds + dredge.
Unleash is pretty crap because the type of deck that will run these cards will almost always be aggressive to the point where including them makes you want to have them turned on 90%+ of the time. So they aren't really even a choice. It's like "Oh, that 1 time out of 20 that I need a chump blocker, I can use one."
Also, the odds of getting any card that grants Unleash are slim to none.
Unleash is actually 2 static abilities.
You may have ~this~ enter play with a +1/+1 counter.
and
While ~this~ has 1 or more +1/+1 counter, it may not block.
If you make a card with "All creatures have Unleash." or "All creatures with +1/+1 counters on them have Unleash.", then those are literally equivalent to "Creatures with +1/+1 counters on them cannot block." You are only addressing the second static ability.
If you go with the Bloodlord of Vasgoth template, it would be equivalent to "When you cast a creature, you may have it enter play with a +1/+1 counter.". That only addresses the first static ability.
To address both, you'd need something like "When you cast a creature, it gains Unleash. Creatures you control have Unleash." It's clunky as hell.
You named six cards plus multiple cards with the dredge mechanic that got played in constructed. You missed chord of calling, the hellbent tutor, scab clan mauler, the discard spell with haunt, I'm sure there are others.
In innastrad you had a Delver, master, tragic slip, 5 damage burn, -1/-1 curse, Strangleroot Geist, Messenger, the soul bound wolf, and the miracles.
I'd have to say the original ravnica did pretty good for mechanics considering they were all original and had some playability in constructed other then graft. Innistrad had far less constructed playable cards with new mechanics. It used easily one of the best mechanics ever (flashback), keyworded two mechanics that already had existed (fight and morbid), redid two mechanics (undying as a strictly better persist and transform as fixed kamagawa flippers) and created a worthless mechanic (fate-ful hour). The only real new mechanics in the set that were playable I. Constructed where the miracle mechanic and soul bound, and soul bound was only playable on one card.
What a sac... Haha
I was joking. I just found it funny that you picked the hands down best dimir card to critique in favor of a card that most lists don't play.
Have you ever cast a psycatog?
The fact that this spell can't be countered is also very good. It can destroy something like shackles that a lot of decks would just lose to with out worrying about counters.
Edit -- And Kira!!!
Wow I forgot about absorb (it's in my cube) that card is sick and another good UW control card. It goes well with this card. I think the only 3 non-land auto includes in my a cube are absorb, giest, and now this. So I would definitely be fine with another good card or two.
Not in this deck or in the scenario stated above. Blinking it does nothing and (I'll agree random is better then your opponent choosing) waiting for black cat to die is way worse then making an opponent discard when you choose via a rat.
I know that was sarcasm but it acctually makes sense. This forum is pretty worthless for people who want to talk about the indivudual cards since there are now 73 cards to discuss and growing. There should just be a sub forum that is archived when the next set comes out. It would be a lot cleaner and easier to use.
These are pretty good. The UW goes straight into most cubes.
2 of those are bears... I'm willing to bet we will see a bear with unleash. Urza's rage is pretty bad by today's standards even when kicked.
I get the impression that you didn't realy read my statement for what it's worth and your were more interested in be the "oh really what about this niche scenario" guy.
Edit - also 2 of those (which are garbage when kicked by todays standards) are rares. This is a common.
I think comparing it to kicker is pretty apt. How come no one complained about kicker as a mechanic. Doesn't it generally say "pay this cost or this creature is a piece of garbage". That seems pretty lame and narrow to me. This is actually a better design than kicker because the mechanic does something by on it's own, while still having the bonus of being "kicked" with phrases like "if ~ EtB with a +1/+1 counter on it destroy target artifact."
Edit -
Here is a great reason to compare it to kicker. Kicker on a vanilla does nothing because kicker does nothing on its own. Add EtB triggers to the kicker and its good. Same with this ability but it has the added bonus of 1) being free to pay 2) giving the creature two different modes. Aggressive or defensive.
You named six cards plus multiple cards with the dredge mechanic that got played in constructed. You missed chord of calling, the hellbent tutor, scab clan mauler, the discard spell with haunt, I'm sure there are others.
In innastrad you had a Delver, master, tragic slip, 5 damage burn, -1/-1 curse, Strangleroot Geist, Messenger, the soul bound wolf, and the miracles.
I'd have to say the original ravnica did pretty good for mechanics considering they were all original and had some playability in constructed other then graft. Innistrad had far less constructed playable cards with new mechanics. It used easily one of the best mechanics ever (flashback), keyworded two mechanics that already had existed (fight and morbid), redid two mechanics (undying as a strictly better persist and transform as fixed kamagawa flippers) and created a worthless mechanic (fate-ful hour). The only real new mechanics in the set that were playable I. Constructed where the miracle mechanic and soul bound, and soul bound was only playable on one card.