There's probably enough life gain to balance out all the fetching in that deck anyway, GMax. I agree that it is thinning your deck but if the stats show, from 13 years ago yes, it doesn't give you any more nonlands than not thinning until turn 25 then it's not really needed. It's sort of like getting 2 lottery tickets; you technically increase your odds but so minisculely that it's pretty much negligible.
And butthole was a little hostile there but I enjoyed the link, thanks.
GMax how are you liking the Skullhunters, I found them lackluster in an early Warriors build of mine but love the card. Like rush of battle here, too. There's no plan to get around anything but it's so fast you just go wide and hope they don't have sweepers? Then if so you brought in Return to the Ranks.
Yeah I noticed the hostility that why I said I wasn't going to argue. In previous posts I've mentioned that I still flooded out in a few games and I understand running the fetches only lowers the percent by so much but it still helps. Skullhunter has been pretty good for me. Out of all the times I've played him my opponents have only discard one land ever. I know this is going to change the more I play this but so far so good lol. Return to the Ranks is my sideboard mvp. The funny thing is I picked up my Returns for a modern deck I was working on but scrapped that idea and love them in here.
I'm not going to argue this but it is a FACT that running fetches lowers the chances of drawing a land. Ok turn 1 you play your fecthland. You get a land out of your deck. So on turn two you have 42 cards in your deck instead 43. There are other factors in there with having lands in hand too. But 42 vs 43 on turn two just proved my point. You have a slightly better chance to draw a non land than a land card, then with using other fetches increases this even more.
Of course. This should be obvious to anyone.
However, you're missing the most important concern: is taking 1 card from your deck worth losing 1 life?
Nice article from 2002, if you want to post an article about it post one that's recent not from 12 years ago.
I hate calling ad hominem (cuz it's overused as hell), but this is a textbook case. You're ignoring the contents of the article to focus on the fact that it's old, therefore invalid. Math doesn't change over time. The article is sound.
Yes it is worth the one life there is too much life gain with Rush, Sorin and Woe-Reapers. There have been games where I've been at 40-60 life before the end of the game.
I did enjoy reading the article too its just there was some parts that was completely irrelevant. Magic has changed so much since then and way the game was played back then is way different than how its played now. It was very informative cause the guy who made the article had been playing for awhile back then and it shows., and he is very smart too. I just figured there would have been a similar article but a more recent one. I was a little flustered when I first replied but I just shook it off TS<3
It's hard to take deckbuilding advice from someone who advocates deck-thinning, something that has been proven inconsequential. It makes some sense if you run delve cards, which this deck does not, but any other perceived advantage from it is in your head.
Any other perceived advantage from it is in my head?
You must not know somethings called math and percentages.
Nice article from 2002, if you want to post an article about it post one that's recent not from 12 years ago.
I'm not going to argue this but it is a FACT that running fetches lowers the chances of drawing a land. Ok turn 1 you play your fecthland. You get a land out of your deck. So on turn two you have 42 cards in your deck instead 43. There are other factors in there with having lands in hand too. But 42 vs 43 on turn two just proved my point. You have a slightly better chance to draw a non land than a land card, then with using other fetches increases this even more.
I ended up playing 10 or more games against Jeskai tokens, and I felt that this deck really had no chance. Mostly because I was playing a version that lacked removal. Bile Blights and Hero's Downfalls are so important.
My only removal is Downfall and I've played Jeskai tokens alot. I only had two decks to playtest with beofre taking this to tournaments, Abzan (my friend's deck) & Jeskai tokens (my old deck). Both decks never stood a chance. I lost one game to Abzan due to flooding again. And I hardly saw Downfall against tokens. They needed to chump block and never had the chance to anything productive. Everyone's lists is going to be different but I strongly encourage everyone to play Rush of Battle. Now everyone who was playing a similar deck did not run Rush, one person even said its not good and another said its too slow. The funny thing is I've placed and they didn't. I'm not saying anyone else's list is bad or anything but if you're playing this deck you need to copy my exact 75.
I'm loving this deck. Rush of Battle is too sick not to run in a Warrior Tribal deck. So far I've only played two tournaments and I've placed both times. PPTQ top 8 lost to flooding out some how with fetches. Monday night Standard tied for 1st. It is great against all match ups. The thing I don't understand is why no one is running any fetches. Being able to thin the deck is so great. Shadowspear is solid for bringing back Champions. This deck also has the opportunity to attack for 20+ lifelink on turn four with 2 1 drops & 2 2 drops, but you don't even need that to win. Some of you are going to question why I'm running Mardu Hordechief. This guy is nuts. The token is great with Rush of Battle, its a good chump blocker to help protect Sorin if need be. The token can also attack a turn sooner than Strike Leader's token, and some times that matters with Rush of Battle. Battle Brawler can take over the game so easily getting the first strike is great right now. So many Siege Rhinos needing to chump block with the Brawler still living. Skull Hunter's discard comes in handy alot too. I've had lots of fun playing this. I'll be playing this until Khans rotates. It can only get better lol.
Since they decided to screw PS owners with their love for XBox, I've stopped caring about it.
I'm pretty sure they would love to have this on the ps3 but there is a huge issue with the promos for ps3. PS3 users were able to get unlimited promos. All you had to do was make a new account load the game and it would give you a different code to enter on the website.
Since I haven't seen anything posted about this yet I figured I would share my new deck idea. I've been trying to build a deck around Whispering Madness since it was released and now we have Notion Thief which combos excellently together. Now I've only had this built for a lil more than a week now I've only had one tournament with it so far. I got some decent results over Esper Control, Jund, Junk Aristocrats, Act II, and Flash. Now onto the deck:
3 Pithing Needle
3 Duress
4 Dispel
2 Mutilate
2 Far / Away
1 Sever the Bloodline
Now the point of this deck is to have Notion Thief out then play Whispering Madness. This combo makes both players discard their hands and you draw both your cards and the cards your opponent would draw. Against most decks this is very backbreaking. Depending on how many cards were drawn you should be able to have the answer to anything they should play. There is a good mix of counters and kill in this deck. After you have the combo going and you are drawing most of your deck Aetherling will be finishing off your opponent. A quick fyi for you all, if you play against Esper Control with this deck you will win hands down. Now also, some of you will ask about Cavern of Souls, now please look and see that I run Ghost Quarter to stole that problem.
Combo
This doesn't exist in standard right now, but Chandra wouldn't help the cause even if it did.
Combo is still in standard right now. The older ones aren't seeing much play but there is a new one that I'm surprised isn't being played but I've gotten some excellent results from it so far in the week I've had it built.
Yeah I noticed the hostility that why I said I wasn't going to argue. In previous posts I've mentioned that I still flooded out in a few games and I understand running the fetches only lowers the percent by so much but it still helps. Skullhunter has been pretty good for me. Out of all the times I've played him my opponents have only discard one land ever. I know this is going to change the more I play this but so far so good lol. Return to the Ranks is my sideboard mvp. The funny thing is I picked up my Returns for a modern deck I was working on but scrapped that idea and love them in here.
Yes it is worth the one life there is too much life gain with Rush, Sorin and Woe-Reapers. There have been games where I've been at 40-60 life before the end of the game.
I did enjoy reading the article too its just there was some parts that was completely irrelevant. Magic has changed so much since then and way the game was played back then is way different than how its played now. It was very informative cause the guy who made the article had been playing for awhile back then and it shows., and he is very smart too. I just figured there would have been a similar article but a more recent one. I was a little flustered when I first replied but I just shook it off TS<3
Any other perceived advantage from it is in my head?
You must not know somethings called math and percentages.
Nice article from 2002, if you want to post an article about it post one that's recent not from 12 years ago.
I'm not going to argue this but it is a FACT that running fetches lowers the chances of drawing a land. Ok turn 1 you play your fecthland. You get a land out of your deck. So on turn two you have 42 cards in your deck instead 43. There are other factors in there with having lands in hand too. But 42 vs 43 on turn two just proved my point. You have a slightly better chance to draw a non land than a land card, then with using other fetches increases this even more.
My only removal is Downfall and I've played Jeskai tokens alot. I only had two decks to playtest with beofre taking this to tournaments, Abzan (my friend's deck) & Jeskai tokens (my old deck). Both decks never stood a chance. I lost one game to Abzan due to flooding again. And I hardly saw Downfall against tokens. They needed to chump block and never had the chance to anything productive. Everyone's lists is going to be different but I strongly encourage everyone to play Rush of Battle. Now everyone who was playing a similar deck did not run Rush, one person even said its not good and another said its too slow. The funny thing is I've placed and they didn't. I'm not saying anyone else's list is bad or anything but if you're playing this deck you need to copy my exact 75.
Creatures: 30
4 Mardu Shadowspear
4 Mardu Woe-Reaper
4 Bloodsoaked Champion
4 Chief of the Edge
4 Battle Brawler
3 Mardu Skullhunter
4 Mardu Hordechief
3 Brutal Hordechief
Sorcery: 4
4 Rush of Battle
Instant: 3
3 Hero's Downfall
Planeswalker: 2
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
Lands: 21
4 Caves of Koilos
3 Polluted Delta
3 Flooded Strand
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
5 Swamp
5 Plains
Sideboard:
1 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
1 Hero's Downfall
2 Mardu Strike Leader
3 Return to the Ranks
4 Chief of the Scale
4 Abzan Advantage
I'm loving this deck. Rush of Battle is too sick not to run in a Warrior Tribal deck. So far I've only played two tournaments and I've placed both times. PPTQ top 8 lost to flooding out some how with fetches. Monday night Standard tied for 1st. It is great against all match ups. The thing I don't understand is why no one is running any fetches. Being able to thin the deck is so great. Shadowspear is solid for bringing back Champions. This deck also has the opportunity to attack for 20+ lifelink on turn four with 2 1 drops & 2 2 drops, but you don't even need that to win. Some of you are going to question why I'm running Mardu Hordechief. This guy is nuts. The token is great with Rush of Battle, its a good chump blocker to help protect Sorin if need be. The token can also attack a turn sooner than Strike Leader's token, and some times that matters with Rush of Battle. Battle Brawler can take over the game so easily getting the first strike is great right now. So many Siege Rhinos needing to chump block with the Brawler still living. Skull Hunter's discard comes in handy alot too. I've had lots of fun playing this. I'll be playing this until Khans rotates. It can only get better lol.
I'm pretty sure they would love to have this on the ps3 but there is a huge issue with the promos for ps3. PS3 users were able to get unlimited promos. All you had to do was make a new account load the game and it would give you a different code to enter on the website.
This might seem like a silly question but does the token have the mana cost of 1B?
4 Notion Thief
4 Whispering Madness
2 Aetherling
4 Warped Physique
2 Far / Away
2 Dimir Charm
3 Tagic Slip
2 Ultimate Price
1 Mutilate
4 Think Twice
3 Essence Scatter
3 Negate
2 Syncopate
4 Watery Grave
3 Ghost Quater
8 Island
9 Swamp
Sideboard
3 Pithing Needle
3 Duress
4 Dispel
2 Mutilate
2 Far / Away
1 Sever the Bloodline
Now the point of this deck is to have Notion Thief out then play Whispering Madness. This combo makes both players discard their hands and you draw both your cards and the cards your opponent would draw. Against most decks this is very backbreaking. Depending on how many cards were drawn you should be able to have the answer to anything they should play. There is a good mix of counters and kill in this deck. After you have the combo going and you are drawing most of your deck Aetherling will be finishing off your opponent. A quick fyi for you all, if you play against Esper Control with this deck you will win hands down. Now also, some of you will ask about Cavern of Souls, now please look and see that I run Ghost Quarter to stole that problem.
A combo based around Notion Thief and Whispering Madness.
Combo is still in standard right now. The older ones aren't seeing much play but there is a new one that I'm surprised isn't being played but I've gotten some excellent results from it so far in the week I've had it built.
Vengevine only checks creature spells and the tribal instants like you mentioned are just instants and not creatures.