Hmm... I would play Lark, from the Sideboard, only against Tron and Grind. Grind meaning control or, for example, Jund. But it does have potential, although that doesn't mean I in the end would run it.
And I know I keep saying potential, but that is only in the reference window that I would have tried it eventually within a year of testing. I have no idea how many of the people reading and participating in the this thread played Kiki-Pod back in the day, but I will remind you that there were only two revolutions within three years. First was a major, the shift from Melira-Pof to Kiki-Pod and the second was a minor, the "discovery" of Deceiver Exarch Then came mother ******* Siege Rhino! and the cute little deck I had been running for almost three years, that actually needef brains to run, turned into an abomination!
But keep on brewing. I'm just an Old Beard who had seen enough stuff to know what can work and what won't work.
what about body double as a 5cmc target? I'm still thinking about reveillark substitutes, because it does nothing when searched for, if I remember it right.
Body Double copying what? Remember that when it copies a creature its CMC becomes the copied creatures CMC.
I think I'm going to test Sylvan Safekeeper as an alternative to Spellskite to protect Kiki-Jiki that I can tutor up with Ranger of Eos.
If it is good enough for Legacy I think it has a fair shot in Modern.
Whell now comrades. All the potential cards that I come up with and find from other peoples decks and suggestions have been listed. If you got any suggestions give me holler. Next up the descriptions of the cards, why you should and shouldn't play them.
Well that was a fun format. See you in 2019 when they finaly unban Pod, since as an unemployed I can't afford a new deck.
(Hint there has been only one format in past two years that I've been playing.)
For mana, you really should be able to go UGw and keep a stable manabase. UGWR is definitely hard to support though.
The mana base is... rough to say the least. Heck, I've been considering going just UGR, but we lose too many "board states" with that.
I've been considering dropping Hallowed Fountain and Steam Vents in the case that I eventually end up on that side of the line that Ifeel like I am shocking myself too much. It all really depends on how much aggro there is in the environment.
What do you guys think of Eldritch Evolution? Do you believe that it can fit somehow in this variant? I'm currently testing and I'm unsure wether it can be useful or not.
Eldritch Evolution is, as I seem to be repeating, an option. It has potential. It would be competing with Chord of Calling and not Prime Speaker Vannifar.
It had not the repeatability of Vannifar which places on the same approach as Chord. Now between Chord and Evolution I prefer Chord simply because we don't have to have the right creature on board and because it is an instant which is huge because of all thr shenanigans that we can do when pur opponent passes the turn. What Evolution has to defend itself is its cost, it will always be easier to cast at least in the terms of mana.
But Evolution is on the list it has some potential.
I think this deck will actually be viable. Vannifar is Bolt-proof and, courtesy of Chord, produces a Twin-like effect on opponents who want to use their mana. This creates artificial tempo advantages which the Vannifar player can use to just create pressure. The basic Chord toolbox shell is also viable in itself (see Cragenwick decks most recently), which gives me further confidence in her success
The former is kinda what I'm after in designing the deck, but I do see the latter as a viable option aswell.
As for names, I wouldn't get too cute with it. This deck will almost certainly be called Vannifar Pod if it makes it big, or something to that effect.
I'm not trying to be too cute, just a bit. The People's Pod, maybe?
Also freaking SGears joins the thread, suddenly the people from I read about from, oh so many years ago, are joining in.
As they say, the beauty is eye of the beholder.
I see him as cute lill' guy who is charging up to his real power level. Just waiting in the deck until Nappa asks the most important question.
Running Ranger adds 2 cards (Ranger + Witch, you already have enough one drops so no need to add Teardrop Kami) for the possibility to basically always combo off, doesn't sound that bad to me tbh. Heck, Witch on it's own is decent enough, cause it can pump your attacking creature.
I will be considering that. I actually am pondering about just dropping Kitchen Finks and go all in with the Combo and Silver bullets.
Also, how much do you know about the current Modern meta? Cause it seems to me that you are basically stuck in the 2015 metagame, where things like Slaughter Games, Revoker and other (crappy) cards got played
Is my perspective slightly date? Absolutely. I've out sourced the knowledge of the meta to the other members of my play group and they are bringing me back up to speed. And we did do a little thinking about the Redcap and I think that the Deputy of Detention might actually be a proper option to bring from the Sideboard straight into the Main Deck.
(just as a note, the Bant version of Kiki Chord is really good atm)
Greetings,
Kathal
I'll check it out.
My attitude towards deck creation and tuning, unless it is Standard, is that the deck that I am building and playing with can always made better, but it probably does have some good ideas, especially if it has a green tutor card... Which is every deck I have played outside of Standard now that I think about it.
When it comes to the lands you have zero to two slots for utility lands. Here comes the choice between consistency and gambling on winning certain matchups. I did consider Minamo, School at Water's Edge and Hall of the Bandit Lord, because like you said, they fit into our strategy. I ignored Hanweir Battlements because well it does increase Vannifar's casting cost by two if you play her from your hand.
Running Ranger is a balancing act between having one more board state to Pod of to Kiki-Jiki, having enough silver bullets and being able to just present enough warm bodies and grind your opponent down, if for whatever reason you are locked out of Kiki-Jiki, for example Slaughter Games. It is not a bad idea, but it is a choice you have make. I personally think that using up three slots is too much.
The Revoker example was jsut something I pulled out of my hat, but that isn't the only reason I play Redcap. He is in the end our only form of main deck removal. I kinda want to have something that reads: "Break glass, in case of an emergency."
Either way, where should the discussion about Vannifar.deck take place, here or in the Kiki-Chord thread? Have some thoughts and ideas and I do not want that a possible discussion get split up into two places.
Greetings,
Kathal
Unfortunately, the OP maintainer for the current Kiki Chord thread, Ludafish, indeed posted that s/he will update with Vannifar lists, so chances are that discussion will get split. I initially posted a slightly older Vannifar list in the Kiki Chord thread, but I'll post an updated one here.
We will see what time brings. Maybe it will all fall under the Kiki Chord umbrella, maybe it will diverge. Vannifar does play blue and if it evolves to have Vannifar as its central pillar it will probably diverge, just like the Melira Chord lists diverged from Melira-Pod lists back in the day.
Either way, where should the discussion about Vannifar.deck take place, here or in the Kiki-Chord thread? Have some thoughts and ideas and I do not want that a possible discussion get split up into two places.
Greetings,
Kathal
Maybe here for a moment, until somebody is brave/good enough to write an actual primer and has enough time to maintain it.
I'm not a great fan of Rhythm of the Wild in this deck, mainly because it's not a creature and it therefore cannot be tutored for, tapped for Convoke, or fed to Vannifar. Unlike Domri, Chaos Bringer, it cannot dig for threats (but, also unlike Domri 2.0, it can enable a Turn 3 Vannifar-fueled combo).
Unlike with the slower-to-assemble-combos Kiki Actual Pre-Ban Pod, I'm no longer convinced Murderous Redcap or Zealous Conscripts are necessary; while I may give Redcap a pass if you keep Rhythm of the Wild, Conscripts only enables 4-drop Persist and double 4-drop chains along with comboing with Kiki-Jiki and kidnapping the occasional hate permanent for a hefty 5 cmc. I ditched Conscripts and Redcap early into developing my heavy Vannifar build to enable cheaper chains instead, and I haven't wanted these guys back.
We're just testing Rhythm of the Wild to see if it helps at all or not, the alternative being either Domri, Chaos Bringer or just to +2 Prime Speaker Vannifar and a Kitchen Finks or a Restoration Angel. The choice is basically dependent on how much control there is in my enviroment and what kind of control it is. If it turns out to be an endless sea of Draw-Go, I'll stick with the enchantment. If it is Supreme Verdicts, Wrath of Gods and Damnations for days, I'll go with the new Domri. But if neither manages to surface I'll just add some more redundancy and pack in a few more creatures.
Also I like to play one Redcap incase there is say a Phyrexian Revoker on the field and a Glen Elendra Archmage if I have a suspicion that my opponent is holding on to an answer for Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker and the Zealous Conscripts is there so that I can Pod off the Redcap and off the Archmage with same assistance.
But all that is still in the testing phase.
And I know I keep saying potential, but that is only in the reference window that I would have tried it eventually within a year of testing. I have no idea how many of the people reading and participating in the this thread played Kiki-Pod back in the day, but I will remind you that there were only two revolutions within three years. First was a major, the shift from Melira-Pof to Kiki-Pod and the second was a minor, the "discovery" of Deceiver Exarch Then came mother ******* Siege Rhino! and the cute little deck I had been running for almost three years, that actually needef brains to run, turned into an abomination!
But keep on brewing. I'm just an Old Beard who had seen enough stuff to know what can work and what won't work.
Body Double copying what? Remember that when it copies a creature its CMC becomes the copied creatures CMC.
On a more serious note. What are peoples' favourite cards for protecting Kiki-Jiki?
Mine are Shalai, Voice of Plenty, Spellskite and Negate.
Also, do we still call using the ability that Vannifar has Poding?
If it is good enough for Legacy I think it has a fair shot in Modern.
The mana base is... rough to say the least. Heck, I've been considering going just UGR, but we lose too many "board states" with that.
I've been considering dropping Hallowed Fountain and Steam Vents in the case that I eventually end up on that side of the line that Ifeel like I am shocking myself too much. It all really depends on how much aggro there is in the environment.
Eldritch Evolution is, as I seem to be repeating, an option. It has potential. It would be competing with Chord of Calling and not Prime Speaker Vannifar.
It had not the repeatability of Vannifar which places on the same approach as Chord. Now between Chord and Evolution I prefer Chord simply because we don't have to have the right creature on board and because it is an instant which is huge because of all thr shenanigans that we can do when pur opponent passes the turn. What Evolution has to defend itself is its cost, it will always be easier to cast at least in the terms of mana.
But Evolution is on the list it has some potential.
The former is kinda what I'm after in designing the deck, but I do see the latter as a viable option aswell.
I'm not trying to be too cute, just a bit. The People's Pod, maybe?
Also freaking SGears joins the thread, suddenly the people from I read about from, oh so many years ago, are joining in.
As they say, the beauty is eye of the beholder.
I see him as cute lill' guy who is charging up to his real power level. Just waiting in the deck until Nappa asks the most important question.
I will be considering that. I actually am pondering about just dropping Kitchen Finks and go all in with the Combo and Silver bullets.
Is my perspective slightly date? Absolutely. I've out sourced the knowledge of the meta to the other members of my play group and they are bringing me back up to speed. And we did do a little thinking about the Redcap and I think that the Deputy of Detention might actually be a proper option to bring from the Sideboard straight into the Main Deck.
I'll check it out.
My attitude towards deck creation and tuning, unless it is Standard, is that the deck that I am building and playing with can always made better, but it probably does have some good ideas, especially if it has a green tutor card... Which is every deck I have played outside of Standard now that I think about it.
When it comes to the lands you have zero to two slots for utility lands. Here comes the choice between consistency and gambling on winning certain matchups. I did consider Minamo, School at Water's Edge and Hall of the Bandit Lord, because like you said, they fit into our strategy. I ignored Hanweir Battlements because well it does increase Vannifar's casting cost by two if you play her from your hand.
Running Ranger is a balancing act between having one more board state to Pod of to Kiki-Jiki, having enough silver bullets and being able to just present enough warm bodies and grind your opponent down, if for whatever reason you are locked out of Kiki-Jiki, for example Slaughter Games. It is not a bad idea, but it is a choice you have make. I personally think that using up three slots is too much.
The Revoker example was jsut something I pulled out of my hat, but that isn't the only reason I play Redcap. He is in the end our only form of main deck removal. I kinda want to have something that reads: "Break glass, in case of an emergency."
We will see what time brings. Maybe it will all fall under the Kiki Chord umbrella, maybe it will diverge. Vannifar does play blue and if it evolves to have Vannifar as its central pillar it will probably diverge, just like the Melira Chord lists diverged from Melira-Pod lists back in the day.
Maybe here for a moment, until somebody is brave/good enough to write an actual primer and has enough time to maintain it.
We're just testing Rhythm of the Wild to see if it helps at all or not, the alternative being either Domri, Chaos Bringer or just to +2 Prime Speaker Vannifar and a Kitchen Finks or a Restoration Angel. The choice is basically dependent on how much control there is in my enviroment and what kind of control it is. If it turns out to be an endless sea of Draw-Go, I'll stick with the enchantment. If it is Supreme Verdicts, Wrath of Gods and Damnations for days, I'll go with the new Domri. But if neither manages to surface I'll just add some more redundancy and pack in a few more creatures.
Also I like to play one Redcap incase there is say a Phyrexian Revoker on the field and a Glen Elendra Archmage if I have a suspicion that my opponent is holding on to an answer for Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker and the Zealous Conscripts is there so that I can Pod off the Redcap and off the Archmage with same assistance.
But all that is still in the testing phase.
You can thank the English language and my laziness for that, and I can add that it's nice that Finnish only has a pronoum for all the people.