What do you think of Mindmoil? It seems like the better alternative for Teferi's Puzzle Box, because it's one-sided. So you actually end up by only playing a land + the best spell in your hand and finding key cards way faster.
i think i had my eye on that a while ago. at the time, it was just sub par compared to the puzzle box, with it being 1 more mana and not ruining our opponent's hand, but now, with the proliferation of people who play spirit of the labirinth and notion thief, at least in my meta, could have some uses.
both are likely the worst wheel we could have, because they don't make card advantage, and i have had many games in which my hand was down to 2 or 1 when my only play was the puzzlebox.
Isn't Puzzle Box just better? It prevents your opponents from casting miracle, it disrupts their tutors and control cards, and most players don't know how to play with Puzzle Box and try to empty their hands as quick as possible while we get to see a lot of cards by keeping our spells in hand... also, it gets around "drawing a card" as mentionned (Chains of Mephistopheles is also something).
Also, Puzzle Box can be used for some shenanigans with Goblin Welder and Daretti.
I don't know, I'm not playing it anymore, but Mindmoil just seems a lot worse.
Okie so I had a game today where my friend played my Norin deck and I used Toshiro against him in a 1v1.
He started off strong with a Norin into Genesis Chamber. Turn 3 Imperial Recruiter -> Kiki-Jiki. At this point all I have is a Toshiro on board. I have Bile Blight and Tragic Slip in hand with 4 mana open to take out his tokens, imp recruiter and kiki later on.
Turn 4 he has 5 mana. I expect the Kiki, he surprises me with an Outpost Siege instead. Cursing, i kill his 5 or so tokens in response and tragic slip the imp recruiter. On my turn, i tap out to play darksteel plate and equip to toshiro, feeling safe.
Turn 5 he plays kiki and copies a myr token to attack me. I laugh at him. His dumb play makes me stupid as well. I make the mistake of not killing his kiki, instead playing necropotence to bump up my devotion count for next turn's nykthos. Open mana of 2, but the only removal in hand is a Diabolic Edict.
Turn 6 he plays Hellkite Tyrant, copies it with Kiki to give it haste and smacks me to steal my Darksteel Plate. He then plays mana crypt and pays 2 to equip the plate to kiki. EoT, the token dies and adds 1 damage from his Norin targeted at Toshiro. My devotion count drops. On my turn, I Dark Ritual, and replay Toshiro.
Turn 7 he plays Purphoros and Feldon. Swings with everything (2 Dragons). I block one of his myrs with mine. He targets toshiro with the Outpost Siege trigger. (This adds up to the previous Norin trigger) In response, I activate nykthos for 5 devotion, flashback bile blight to kill kiki-jiki. He targets Outpost Siege trigger at Toshiro yet again. In response, I flash tragic slip on the Hellkite Tyrant. Stack resolves and Toshiro dies again. I play entomb to search my library for Puppeteer Clique and put it in the yard. On my turn, i corpse dance the Puppeteer Clique, fetch kiki, copy the Puppeteer Clique, fetch Hellkite and swing, stealing all his artifacts and myrs. I then cast Diabolic Edict on his last remaining Feldon. By playing a spell this turn i drop to 11 life (Outpost Siege). EoT Norin comes back and i take 4 more from Purphoros. 7 Life. I have an exsanguinate and gray merchant in hand to stabilize next turn. On his turn, he plays a memory jar, cracks it, finds a beetleback chief and calls game.
That was a killer game. Never in my god knows how many years of playing Norin have I ever gotten 3 freaking engines online, and here my friend does it against me. All in all, even though i didn't get to use it personally, Outpost Siege looks to be a solid addition to the deck in terms of versatility and it's ability to apply pressure.
...and the moral of the story is: don't run Hellkite Tyrant.
Rach,
It's a pleasure to have you and your brilliant ideas on here. I am in the same boat and rarely get to play Magic, but I absolutely enjoy playing this deck when I do. Thank you for sharing it with us, and your feedback on our ideas. I will be hanging around as well in case you do add anything to any of your deck lists on here. I hope you check back here every so often in case things ease up with work and IRL stuff.
What am I considering removing from the deck for this new addition?
What does the new card offer that the old card didn't?
Do I care if my opponents have this creature/artifact/enchantment?
For me, I'd vote against Soul of New Phyrexia because it is something I DO NOT want my opponents to have, but that's just me.
Hi soapzz,
Not to reply for Rachmiel; I have a little commentary on your post.
I too run this deck (mostly the same - just a few differences that I rotate in and out to make it a surprise)... I played at a tourney and this is NOT the deck for competitive play. When prizes are on the line, cut throat decks come out. I won on turn 3 with my Karador/Hermit Druid deck. Literally no fun was had. No thanks were given.
EDH weaksauce. Another Tibalt for that format, though still much better than Tibalt the unplayable. this is why red is considered the weakest color in that format.
The fact that we constantly see these type of threads, ie Red being weak in EDH, says something.
Yep it says that players whine when they can't play something well. Or it says red is bad when MLD is banned out in playgroups.
Those are far more likely than the color being awful.
Don't over react. I didnt say the color is aweful.
...and it's not just people whing or not being able to play. It is very much a reflection on the color from the general player pool. Please don't dismiss other people's opinions so quickly. The number of these threads is higher than the number of "(insert another color) needs some love" threads. Red is harder to play and win witb in EDH in my experience.
The fact that we constantly see these type of threads, ie Red being weak in EDH, says something.
I have now mono Rex decks than any other color; in my humble opinion, is a lot more difficult to win with them than mono green or black for example. I've also noticed that my decks have a lot of cards over lap in red cards because they are must haves in mono red decks. A lot of artifacts.
Perfect response. QFT
Correct. .we win via Troll.
...and the moral of the story is: don't run Hellkite Tyrant.
QFT
It's a pleasure to have you and your brilliant ideas on here. I am in the same boat and rarely get to play Magic, but I absolutely enjoy playing this deck when I do. Thank you for sharing it with us, and your feedback on our ideas. I will be hanging around as well in case you do add anything to any of your deck lists on here. I hope you check back here every so often in case things ease up with work and IRL stuff.
What am I considering removing from the deck for this new addition?
What does the new card offer that the old card didn't?
Do I care if my opponents have this creature/artifact/enchantment?
For me, I'd vote against Soul of New Phyrexia because it is something I DO NOT want my opponents to have, but that's just me.
Not to reply for Rachmiel; I have a little commentary on your post.
I too run this deck (mostly the same - just a few differences that I rotate in and out to make it a surprise)... I played at a tourney and this is NOT the deck for competitive play. When prizes are on the line, cut throat decks come out. I won on turn 3 with my Karador/Hermit Druid deck. Literally no fun was had. No thanks were given.
This deck is GREAT, but not for tournament play.
Don't over react. I didnt say the color is aweful.
...and it's not just people whing or not being able to play. It is very much a reflection on the color from the general player pool. Please don't dismiss other people's opinions so quickly. The number of these threads is higher than the number of "(insert another color) needs some love" threads. Red is harder to play and win witb in EDH in my experience.
I have now mono Rex decks than any other color; in my humble opinion, is a lot more difficult to win with them than mono green or black for example. I've also noticed that my decks have a lot of cards over lap in red cards because they are must haves in mono red decks. A lot of artifacts.