This guy actually pays attention when testing. Seriously there is no real need to go for a splash. Other than screwing you with CitP tapped lands so you can play a card that might stop a god or give you 1% in the mirror. Really the discussion at this point should be match-up based. Talk about ways to help in tough matches and sequences for when to play what card. Sorry but the core and color scheme of this deck are in place. Why mess with what is the best deck thus far?
Have u even tested splashing a color before posting this? Playing the Mono black through a gauntlet i thought the same thing, but then tested a splash of green through it... Now i wouldnt say i have a terrible match up at all. All match ups are not difficult to win, especially after board.
Splashing green in my experience has been much better then just straight mono black. Green allows u to deal with all the threats that u pretty much conceded to with mono black. I dont remember a single time that i won when some one got a god online, or played assemble the legions. Green allows u to deal with gods, kill assemble the legions, dismantle mono blue even more, and helps insanely against the mirror, and other whip decks. Scavenging Ooze shuts down whip decks if it get out and going, the green allows u to kill the whip after side board also. In the mirror and against B/W ppl sided in Erebos, God of the Dead and i lost almost instantly. Fade into Antiquity beats the gods quite hard, helps in almost every match up that u are weak against. I have never had problems with casting Thoughtseize a turn later. As for RotW, i feel it is a fine card, but i am not taking anything out for it, and Demon is just better then it.
So where i play at standard tournaments are on wed so here is what i played i ended up going 4-0. Here is what i played. sorry if deck tag thing i messed up i havent posted on the forums in a while.
1st Round: Mono blue devotion- Game one i mulled down to 5 as i didnt see lands in first 2 hands, and kept a not so good hand, but a hand i thought would be better then going down to 4. He basically got Thassa out with the devotion and steam rolled me. Game 2 what it came down to was him having 2 Bident of Thassa's out and Owls, and him playing master the waves, i them proceeded to board wipe with golgari charm and then just beat him down with Demons, and dropping out Gray Merchants. Game 3 He had a very similar hand as his first one, but this time i had a good hand. Basically he did the first 2 turns that mono blue does, turn 1 cloud fin turn 2 tidebinder turn 3 thassa, and then had Spectre in hand, what happened diffrently this game is i had Fade into Antiquity and basically won off that and dropping out Pack Rat and ran him over with the rat squad and gray merchants.
Round 2: Esper Control- Game 1 i just ran him over with dudes he board wiped i whipd then just won basically. Game 2 i sided in pithing needle, Duress, and Eerebos knowing he would be putting in Bloodbarons, and to stop Sphinxs Revs heal. I just Durresd and thought seized him out of the game, he played blood baron i played Erebos and just beat him down with Demons and such.
Round 3: G/W Aggro more of the tokeny one, basically like the one that won the star city. Game 1 he just beat me straight up. Rootborn Defense won that game for him. Game 2 he had me on the ropes most the game got me down to 5 health before i dropped a turn 6 gray merchant, then turn 7 merchant. Then i beat him down with those. Game 3 Nuts hand for me turn 1 thought seize turn 2 pack rat. Turn 3 Lifebane turn 4 lifebane turn 5 gray merchant. WIN.
Round 4: U/W Control- I was against one of my friends who i test with alot, who is a very very solid player, best in the area that i play at, he basically taught me a lot of what i know now. We ended up drawing and splitting the prize pool, but then we played for the extra pack. Game 1 i just thought seize him out of the game and eneded up killing him with Erebos with him being online through 2 under world connections which he had detention sphered, but i just abrupt decay them. Game 2 was the best game of magic i think i have ever played, basically it went into top deck wars after i thought seize and durresed him out of the game. Then the fun part started where every draw was an answer for the others person play. He top decked elspeth to kill my demon, i top deck heros downfall to kill elspeth. He top deck Atherling, i top decked pithing needle. He drew Detention sphere for my Pithing needle, i drew abrupt decay. Then after that i got under world connections out, and that won me the game.
After playing in this tournament i dont think that i would make any changes, especially for where i play at. If i decide to go to a bigger tournament i may make some changes on what the big decks are, but they wouldnt be big at all. Maybe add another abrupt decay, but 3 felt like the perfect about, i saw them when i needed them. Green was def the best color to splash for brings what u need for the board, and helps alot against other whip decks i decided like an hour before the tourny started to add the green in. Me and my friends have a gauntlet going, so i am going to be testing against all the popular decks, and other ones.
having a hard time coming up with a solid decklist with no info on the meta
that being said from the cards we have available in standard I think R is weak for Control and that 3 colors might not work if Burning Earth is popular
we obviously have some awesome U cards and the 2nd strongest is W followed closely by B and honestly I am not an esper fan but I do think that would be where its at if you were to go 3 colors
things to consider:
I like red in control decks, as they have decent draw for the cost of blue and red, other then Sphinx's Revelation they have the only draw that i feel is actually worth it, i really like Thoughtflare, i feel Steam Augury is decent but i was told it was a U/R Fact or Fiction, so it just feel like eh for that reason. Stormbreath Dragon is a great win con, burn is always good, and Chain to the Rock is my favorite removal in standard from what i have play tested. I am going to have to play test red more in my control deck to find out if it is as good as i feel it could be. This is just my feelings right now after the play testing i have done, which isnt a ridiculous amount, but it isnt a small amount.
Clan Defiance with Boros Reckenor on the field is pretty nuts for me during my play testing. If u have some ramp in the deck list, clan defiance can pretty easily be used for 6 if not more, (Xenagos really synergizes with Clan Defiance as it helps produce mana while having ur beaters out) but if have 8 mana to use hitting a Clan Defiance 6 to the opponent then 6 to ur reckenor that is 12 dmg, though this does lose u ur reckenor it is usually enough to end the game if u have had creatures on the board. This is personally what i have liked through play testing with the group of ppl that i play magic with, who are all good players. I have had pretty good results. Against what both they feel and i feel will be good decks once rotation happens.
I play a nath the guilt leaf edh deck and here are some good cards i think you should add. Dread, No MercyLethal Vapors help you stall out until you get what you need. Syphon Mind is a good card. Geth's Grimoire is great. Cunning Lethemancer is another good discard per turn card like Necrogen Mist and bottomless pit, also Mindslicer is great. Quest for the Nihil Stone is amazing if you can keep them down to no cards. Opression is a nice card to have, but what i think the best card imo is Painful Quandary, i would run this card in any black edh deck as it is a huge pain for other players especially with quest for nihil stone out. Also tutors are always good in edh idk if you have these in your decklist, but i just wanted to bring them up Demonic Tutor, Beseech the Queen, Vampiric Tutor, Liliana Vess which i know you have in. I would defeinitly add in Painful Quandary as it is amazing.
Made a deck just like this that is playing very well, hardest match up humans because it is a race, but i have enough life gain and lifelink, to just win. posted decklist is in the b/r Blood Artist thread heres a link.
You think you can run Noble in a mana base which is base black and has 8 dual lands? You do realise 4 of those will come in tapped turn 1 anyway right? Noble is only effective coming in turn 1.
Noble doesnt have to come in turn 1..... It can come in later and still be as strong with Nocturnus out on the field as it would be flying and get bigger and bigger every turn. And i would most definatly run noble this over Vampire interloper and and Child of the night. Also with stormkirk captain and the other vampire lords this could be a 1 drop that is very powerful. I wouldnt run Noble as a 4 of, as i would not want to see it with Nocturnus, but i think as a 2 , maybe 3 but i dont think i would go up to 3. Honestly i think Noble would be a strong card even as a 2 of, and it wouldnt affect your mana base. I am also very dissapointed in seeing that ppl think that noble is useless if not played turn 1.....
Basically the deck doest what most grand arc decks do but u are get out a wurmcoil and just clone it as many times as possible, that means turn 4 wurmcoil turn 5 phyrexian metamorph and phantasmal image. 3 wurm coils out turn 5 is pretty scary imo.
Have u even tested splashing a color before posting this? Playing the Mono black through a gauntlet i thought the same thing, but then tested a splash of green through it... Now i wouldnt say i have a terrible match up at all. All match ups are not difficult to win, especially after board.
Side Board is:
As for the matchups i played
1st Round: Mono blue devotion- Game one i mulled down to 5 as i didnt see lands in first 2 hands, and kept a not so good hand, but a hand i thought would be better then going down to 4. He basically got Thassa out with the devotion and steam rolled me. Game 2 what it came down to was him having 2 Bident of Thassa's out and Owls, and him playing master the waves, i them proceeded to board wipe with golgari charm and then just beat him down with Demons, and dropping out Gray Merchants. Game 3 He had a very similar hand as his first one, but this time i had a good hand. Basically he did the first 2 turns that mono blue does, turn 1 cloud fin turn 2 tidebinder turn 3 thassa, and then had Spectre in hand, what happened diffrently this game is i had Fade into Antiquity and basically won off that and dropping out Pack Rat and ran him over with the rat squad and gray merchants.
Round 2: Esper Control- Game 1 i just ran him over with dudes he board wiped i whipd then just won basically. Game 2 i sided in pithing needle, Duress, and Eerebos knowing he would be putting in Bloodbarons, and to stop Sphinxs Revs heal. I just Durresd and thought seized him out of the game, he played blood baron i played Erebos and just beat him down with Demons and such.
Round 3: G/W Aggro more of the tokeny one, basically like the one that won the star city. Game 1 he just beat me straight up. Rootborn Defense won that game for him. Game 2 he had me on the ropes most the game got me down to 5 health before i dropped a turn 6 gray merchant, then turn 7 merchant. Then i beat him down with those. Game 3 Nuts hand for me turn 1 thought seize turn 2 pack rat. Turn 3 Lifebane turn 4 lifebane turn 5 gray merchant. WIN.
Round 4: U/W Control- I was against one of my friends who i test with alot, who is a very very solid player, best in the area that i play at, he basically taught me a lot of what i know now. We ended up drawing and splitting the prize pool, but then we played for the extra pack. Game 1 i just thought seize him out of the game and eneded up killing him with Erebos with him being online through 2 under world connections which he had detention sphered, but i just abrupt decay them. Game 2 was the best game of magic i think i have ever played, basically it went into top deck wars after i thought seize and durresed him out of the game. Then the fun part started where every draw was an answer for the others person play. He top decked elspeth to kill my demon, i top deck heros downfall to kill elspeth. He top deck Atherling, i top decked pithing needle. He drew Detention sphere for my Pithing needle, i drew abrupt decay. Then after that i got under world connections out, and that won me the game.
After playing in this tournament i dont think that i would make any changes, especially for where i play at. If i decide to go to a bigger tournament i may make some changes on what the big decks are, but they wouldnt be big at all. Maybe add another abrupt decay, but 3 felt like the perfect about, i saw them when i needed them. Green was def the best color to splash for brings what u need for the board, and helps alot against other whip decks i decided like an hour before the tourny started to add the green in. Me and my friends have a gauntlet going, so i am going to be testing against all the popular decks, and other ones.
I like red in control decks, as they have decent draw for the cost of blue and red, other then Sphinx's Revelation they have the only draw that i feel is actually worth it, i really like Thoughtflare, i feel Steam Augury is decent but i was told it was a U/R Fact or Fiction, so it just feel like eh for that reason. Stormbreath Dragon is a great win con, burn is always good, and Chain to the Rock is my favorite removal in standard from what i have play tested. I am going to have to play test red more in my control deck to find out if it is as good as i feel it could be. This is just my feelings right now after the play testing i have done, which isnt a ridiculous amount, but it isnt a small amount.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=419163&page=13
My deck list is 9 posts down.
Creatures
3 Restoration Angel
4 Manic Vandal
2 Sun Titan
Artifacts
4 Liquidmetal Coating
2 Mimic Vat
4 Ichor Wellspring
4 Ancient Grudge
4 Faithless Loooting
4 Devine Offering
2 Revoke Existence
3 Day of Judgement
2 Crush
4 Evolving Wilds
7 Plain
4 R/W land
6 Mountain
1 Forest
I like having the White for the for sure board wipe and for sun titan and moar artifact hate.
Noble doesnt have to come in turn 1..... It can come in later and still be as strong with Nocturnus out on the field as it would be flying and get bigger and bigger every turn. And i would most definatly run noble this over Vampire interloper and and Child of the night. Also with stormkirk captain and the other vampire lords this could be a 1 drop that is very powerful. I wouldnt run Noble as a 4 of, as i would not want to see it with Nocturnus, but i think as a 2 , maybe 3 but i dont think i would go up to 3. Honestly i think Noble would be a strong card even as a 2 of, and it wouldnt affect your mana base. I am also very dissapointed in seeing that ppl think that noble is useless if not played turn 1.....
4 Grand Architect
4 Wurmcoil Enging
4 Phantasmal Image
4 Pyhrexian Metamorph
4 Merfolk Looter
4 Snapcaster Mage
1 Spellskite
4 Gixtian Probe
4 Vapor Snag
1 Batterskull
2 Ghost Quarter
15 Island
Basically the deck doest what most grand arc decks do but u are get out a wurmcoil and just clone it as many times as possible, that means turn 4 wurmcoil turn 5 phyrexian metamorph and phantasmal image. 3 wurm coils out turn 5 is pretty scary imo.