....I've seen those decks win quite a bit. Again, probably depends on the playgroup...and I don't know what "Tier 1" in a casual format means.
I think what he means as "Tier 1" is a deck that can pretty much be hated on by three other players in a game, and still pull it back and kick ass. Which I've seen Gref, and another player in our playgroup do multiple times.
Its hard to believe that no one has anything to say about a deck that does 31 damage by turn 3 or 4 wow maybe ppl are just to stund jk. Well I like my deck and proud that I can build such a deck without messing with net decks
How do you do 31 by turn 3 is what i want to know.
I like the idea, but there definitely are better ways to go about this. Burning inquiry for the win, is worthless. TOME SCOUR though, is a great way to get the win. If you have both Ascensions online, you drop one tome scour, JUST ONE, for one blue. It copys, they mill 10 cards, they lose 20 life and you gain 20 life. Over burning inquirys 6 cards that go to the graveyard, and 12 life lost/gained. But your also draw/ditching 6 cards also. tome scour, for the same cost, is the win for this deck. It's head and shoulders above burning inquiry.
Obviously the lands can be worked out, but you need the constant 4-of's to make it easier to put pyromancers online, but you need to take their life to put bloodchief online. Foresee is a two of because you ultimately dig six cards. Scry 4, put the buttom, then draw two. Its a great dig spell.
I made a gimmicky grixis bloodchief deck a while back that used staggershocks and bolts to bring bloodchief online, and then archive trap for the kill. See beyonds / preordains to search out combo pieces, mana leaks for a bit of defense. It could go off turn 5 fairly regularly but the wheels came off if I didn't see an ascension in opening hand or first preordain, or if they into the roil / O-ringed the ascension once active.
I have to say that if the deck is based on burning inquiry, which seems to be the key piece here - why not just run the liliana's caress deck and be much more successful?
Put differently - once bloodchief is online... now what? I used archive trap for instant kill, but in a r/b aggro deck what are you expecting out of your ascension? If you're making them discard it might as well be a caress really. And if you're going after their permanents - how? What are they playing and how are you blowing it up?
I ask this for those who have played it... I get that t2 gob guide/ascension followed by t3 staggershock = active BA turn 4... but so what? How are you benefiting from it now?
Using the lifegain to fuel sign in blood and tutelage?
Discard?
Land destruction?
Vapours?
I'm not a fan of the jinxed idol here... it belongs in the bazaar trader build.
You gotta save the manaleaks for O-ring and into the roil. You dont even need archive trap. You just use tomescour. Its so much better of a kill card, and if your did it right, theyre screwed when you pop it. Also you need to keep everything in the deck to a low mana cost if you're running dark tuteluge. If you pull that archive with dark, you just took five to the face, and that might kill you. Archive is WAY conditional, becasue you have to wait till they pop that fetch, and if they don't, double blue is hard to come by sometimes. Tome scour however, you do on your own time, you're not paying double blue, you're not taking 5 to the face via dark, AND you have enough mana to pay for the mana leak when you play it (you should NOT be playing it before turn 4.) And instead of using burning inquiry, you should be using tome scour. I rather not ditch 3 cards from hand, and i might as well just make my blue mana base worth more to me.
Bloodghast i think is completely worthless in this deck. Yes, its a 2/1 body that comes back, but without blocking potential, there are so many better ways, that arent double black, that hit two life. Instead of kraken or halimar, use goblin guide. A 2/2 body, thats swinging every turn, and it can block? heads and shuolders above all three cards previously mentioned. Tome scour, though, is the kill in this deck. You can turn 5 kill.
T1: Swamp, Bloodchief
T2: Mountain, Goblin Guide, swing: 1 counter on Bloodchief, they're at 18
T3: Island(or Drowned Catacombs), Staggershock, Swing with Guide: 2 counters on Blood, theyre at 14.
T4: Stagger rebounds, theyre at 12. Land for the turn, Swing guide, maybe use a terminate.: Bloodchief at 3. Now its online.
T5: Tome Scour. GG. 5 cards to the Graveyard, 10 life is lost.
And thats slow. But it also depends on that 1st turn bloodchief. Tome Scour needs to stay though. Thats the kill for this whole deck. You're probably not going to kill with them just dropping spells everyturn. You need something that can finish them off, and still have mana for that mana leak you know is coming. And tome scour does that brilliantly.
Tome Scour > Burning inquiry. Hands down.
I think what he means as "Tier 1" is a deck that can pretty much be hated on by three other players in a game, and still pull it back and kick ass. Which I've seen Gref, and another player in our playgroup do multiple times.
How do you do 31 by turn 3 is what i want to know.
I like the idea, but there definitely are better ways to go about this. Burning inquiry for the win, is worthless. TOME SCOUR though, is a great way to get the win. If you have both Ascensions online, you drop one tome scour, JUST ONE, for one blue. It copys, they mill 10 cards, they lose 20 life and you gain 20 life. Over burning inquirys 6 cards that go to the graveyard, and 12 life lost/gained. But your also draw/ditching 6 cards also. tome scour, for the same cost, is the win for this deck. It's head and shoulders above burning inquiry.
Heres what I think might be better:
4 Tome Scour
4 Stagger Shock
4 Bloodchief Ascension
4 Pyromancer Ascension
4 Burst Lightning
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Terminate
4 Mana leak
4 Ponder / Preordain (your choice)
2 Foresee
3 Dragonskull Summit
3 Creeping Tarpit
6 Mountain
5 Island
5 Swamp
Obviously the lands can be worked out, but you need the constant 4-of's to make it easier to put pyromancers online, but you need to take their life to put bloodchief online. Foresee is a two of because you ultimately dig six cards. Scry 4, put the buttom, then draw two. Its a great dig spell.
You gotta save the manaleaks for O-ring and into the roil. You dont even need archive trap. You just use tomescour. Its so much better of a kill card, and if your did it right, theyre screwed when you pop it. Also you need to keep everything in the deck to a low mana cost if you're running dark tuteluge. If you pull that archive with dark, you just took five to the face, and that might kill you. Archive is WAY conditional, becasue you have to wait till they pop that fetch, and if they don't, double blue is hard to come by sometimes. Tome scour however, you do on your own time, you're not paying double blue, you're not taking 5 to the face via dark, AND you have enough mana to pay for the mana leak when you play it (you should NOT be playing it before turn 4.) And instead of using burning inquiry, you should be using tome scour. I rather not ditch 3 cards from hand, and i might as well just make my blue mana base worth more to me.
Bloodghast i think is completely worthless in this deck. Yes, its a 2/1 body that comes back, but without blocking potential, there are so many better ways, that arent double black, that hit two life. Instead of kraken or halimar, use goblin guide. A 2/2 body, thats swinging every turn, and it can block? heads and shuolders above all three cards previously mentioned. Tome scour, though, is the kill in this deck. You can turn 5 kill.
T1: Swamp, Bloodchief
T2: Mountain, Goblin Guide, swing: 1 counter on Bloodchief, they're at 18
T3: Island(or Drowned Catacombs), Staggershock, Swing with Guide: 2 counters on Blood, theyre at 14.
T4: Stagger rebounds, theyre at 12. Land for the turn, Swing guide, maybe use a terminate.: Bloodchief at 3. Now its online.
T5: Tome Scour. GG. 5 cards to the Graveyard, 10 life is lost.
And thats slow. But it also depends on that 1st turn bloodchief.
Tome Scour needs to stay though. Thats the kill for this whole deck. You're probably not going to kill with them just dropping spells everyturn. You need something that can finish them off, and still have mana for that mana leak you know is coming. And tome scour does that brilliantly.
Tome Scour > Burning inquiry. Hands down.