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  • posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from Hermes_ »


    From my understanding,correct me if i'm wrong, but MH is going to be a Print to demand set so I think it may push prices down a bit maybe by fifty cents or even a dollar


    I don't know if it is or isn't. They never did a masters set to print on demand (which I know this is not) but if it is it will go a long ways to push the MSRP as the actual price of this. I don't have that info but it would kind of surprise me if it is given the nature of the product.

    EDIT: google confirms you are correct that it is not a limited print run. I don't know what that means entirely as far as how much additional product will be available and or for how long.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Random Card of the Day: Barren Glory
    I actually prefer Shattering Spree over Vandalblast in a lot of cases unless I am 3+ colors or splashing red lightly. The ability to double up on targeting is really nice vs someone I think has counter magic.

    This said, I have seen a number of times where I don't have enough versatility in shattering spree. Sure, sometimes there are a bunch of artifact targets that need to die but I have also had several times where there are non artifact things that need to die and the lack of versatility of this card really can bite you in the ass. I sometimes prefer Fiery Confluence due to this as the damage sweeping options of it and or tripple shatter are both effects I find relevant.

    Shattering Spree can still have amazing moments and when its good.... its freaking great but I also think its a card that can decay in your hand to some degree. Different metas will dictate how useful it is in a big way. My favorite kinds of decks to use it in tend to be decks with filter effects as then I can pitch it when its not so great.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from benjameenbear »

    cryo, are you ok? Did you have a hernia action occur because you're so excited?

    I'm happy to acquire copies of the full art basics, simply because of the art. Since there will be a snow-covered land in every pack, I imagine that the supply for Snow Lands will go WAY up, meaning that the prices will go WAY down (hopefully).


    Keep in mind that these products have always been released in limited quantities with higher price tags to the point that usually price tags don't adjust much. Also the use for snow Plains / Forest have always been very questionable as there haven't really been meaningful colored permenants that use them so they are essentially down to the colorless and land effects for them.

    Snow Mountains have really been the only ones that have ever been in high demand and that is mostly due to the card Skred and the fact that its a modern deck. Its possible we see some new snow card that changes this but so far thats sort of been the truth of the matter.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Urza, Lord High Artificer
    Urza doesn't look to be any bigger issue than Thrasios, Triton Hero. They both turn infinite mana into drawing / playing your deck. I don't really see how Urza could suddenly be a problem but Thrasios isn't. I am not saying that these are healthy but Urza really seems like a reskin of Thrasios with a slight tweak in how he functions.

    Thrasios is probably actually stronger due to being in green for tutors and ramp.
    Posted in: Commander Rules Discussion Forum
  • posted a message on Bruna, the Fading Light - Moat Control
    Quote from Kungfu_Hero »
    I asked two of my magic buddies if I should cut Magus of the Moat. They told me I was crazy. lol For the record though, moat has backfired on me. It’s a symmetrical effect. When you play it, it’s like everyone played it. You could be helping your opponents just as much as hurting them. Even if when you played it was a good idea, the game state can change where moat can begin helping another player more than you. When an opponent is running away with the game, the last thing you want to do is prevent the table from attacking him. I’ll definitely keep it in my build, but the card has some drawbacks.

    Similar to the knight-captain, moat doesn’t actually handle their threats. So the same criticism of the knight-captain should be applied to moat, too. They’re similar cards actually. Both prevent them from attacking. Moat only handles grounders. Knight-captain handles anything, but only works twice. Also, there is a subtle but powerful advantage to the knight-captain. Unlike moat, he allows your opponents to attack each other. That’s pretty strong. Moat stops aggro, but the knight-captain sends it another way. That can be so much better. I run Kor Haven, Maze of Ith and Thaumatic Compass/Spires of Orazca for this reason as well. I would go so far as to say those three cards have done more damage for me than any other card in my deck. Letting your opponents do things for you is a big part of multiplayer.


    Its kind of funny because people don't let me play with stuff like that anymore. If they see I have limited defenses like that suddenly everyone at the table won't let me keep it. They will be overly aggressive towards me and force me to use the resource over killing players that they might be able to freely kill. Then again though, I draw aggro as a player not always based on what my board is.

    Timing a moat correctly is a matter of reading the board and the aggression. If someone else is running rampant with some dragons or something its probably not time to stop the ground creatures. As toc said, wraths are also a very good solution if they continue to be a problem. A cool tech answer could be Haazda Shield Mate. I don't run him but I also don't face down a bunch of midsized beaters very often.

    Quote from Kungfu_Hero »

    So what do y’all think about Erratic Portal? It has obvious synergy, but I’ve never actually run it. It’s not like I’ll be bouncing Bruna every turn, and there aren’t a lot of etb creatures in my deck. However, Bruna starts to cost a LOT of mana, and the portal helps with that big time, while also being a nuisance to other players.


    I find that if I can just put more lands in play its usually better than trying to abuse Bruna. She is a lot of mana to try to play with like that so I would rather just push people to answer my board and chump with her if need be and recast. Most people don't find killing Bruna to be that appealing and so I use that with trying to hit a lot of land drops with draw, filter, and transform cards where I can to just make sure I can recast her a bunch in a game.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Bad Bruna's Reanimation and Control Team
    I haven’t really had much of a chance to play test recently to be honest. I’m excited to see how the flying angel machine works, but I guess I’ve been busy bringing other decks up to snuff (Varina, mostly). Partly that’s a reflection of being pretty happy in general with how Bruna is running, but I also try to scale to the table I’m playing against and Bruna hasn’t quite been a decent fit of late. I’ve definitely been meaning to put her through her paces, so I’ll try and do that in the next few days. I’ve also got a couple things to pick up from my LGS, one of which is an Archangel of Thune to drop in here, so I’ve sort of been waiting to make that change.

    Have you made any post-WAR changes? There wasn’t a lot for us there in all fairness, but there were a couple of cool toys.


    No I haven't really touched WAR yet but I think Ugin, the Ineffable and Topple the Statue probably could both be tested at least. Unfortunately those are not angel / humans so I have kind of put it to a lower priority to do so in favor of some new decks.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Jori En - Izzet Cantrips
    Quote from CrashCapt »
    replacing itself is good, and with how many copy effects we are able to run this will often draw 2-3 cards and pump 2-3 creatures for residual damage. I'll test I guess.

    The collected company for sorceries seems like a hard pass for me. I'm not great on evaluating, but I run 21 sorceries and several of them are misses, Finale of promise, Treasure cruise, pore over pages and past come to mind. Also can burn my Mizzium Mortars that is one of two ways I have of clearing a board with the overload.

    I run CoCo in modern and miss often with a way higher % of hits and I miss way too much, I don't see this deck running. I might be wrong but just on't see


    I am also a CoCo player and I know what you mean. The consistency for this deck would be something low like 15% at best which isn't going to fly. These effects just don't work for commander and the inflated deck sizes / singleton nature of the format. I think its an interesting design but I suspect that the fact that this will be legal in modern / legacy is the reason it couldn't be instant or sorcery. This type of card design is limited a lot more by 60 card constructed formats which really keeps them from being used in commander.

    Fists of Flame is probably fine, I don't think its going to be huge but I also don't think its so bad that testing it is wrong. If we had evasion on our commander or there were essentially more similar effects I think it would be a lot more interesting. Psychotic Fury could also be a similarly useful type of card but my issue with them tends to be that there just aren't enough good cards like that.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Bad Bruna's Reanimation and Control Team
    Just seeing if you have any feedback on your above changes and if they have or have not worked out. Several of the changes you made seemed to reflect some of what I was running so I was just curious to see if any of it had or had not worked thus far.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Bruna, the Fading Light - Moat Control
    I have run Intrepid Hero and Knight-Captain of Eos and currently do run Silverblade Paladin.

    Eos is just not meant for this deck. As ISB mentioned, Bruna is remarkably robust, so fog effects end up being a little redundant. Frankly when I’m faced with a daunting board state I’d prefer to blow it up, considering it’s much easier for us to rebuild than a lot of other archetypes. I’ve just generally found fog effects help us survive but don’t help us thrive.

    Hero did pull some weight for me, but having to tap him down and being conditional removal made him a little less than satisfactory in my build. At the same spot in the curve I’ve found Thalia, Heretic Cathar far more helpful. We already ramp pretty heavy early, so having her slow the table down further for us to land some threats is far more helpful. As mentioned, too, Bruna trades well anyway, so the hero is a little redundant, unless you’re clearing the air for a voltron strike.

    Paladin I’ve found more helpful than you guys obviously. Early game he helps our lower end of the curve deal a bit more efficiently with any necessary combat, and Bruna isn’t the only creature he can help get in for serious damage. Bonding with Lyra Dawnbringer, Emeria Shepherd or any of our flying threats has helped make me fairly formidable in combat. If nothing else he’s also worked well as a rattlesnake for me in deterring people from sending their critters my way.

    Bastion Protector I definitely get. It’s very conditional and the conditions are quite obvious. I think Bruna is the reason she stays, purely on account of how easily she can be reanimated. Otherwise, she’s not something you just casually drop into play - she lurks in your hand till the time is right, and there’s a chance that doesn’t happen.

    My thoughts on the moats is that they’re a meta call - I’d definitely rather have the tool there than not, it just depends what threat you’re facing down as to whether you drop them into play or not. The same applies to Magus of the Tabernacle in my build - there’s going to be times it’s not the right play to drop him. Obviously if you’re facing down some swarm he’s a huge middle finger, otherwise just hold him, or filter him through Azor’s Gateway. I sort of treat the humans in my build as a toolbox. I try to find what’s right for the situation and use my reanimation to help it stay in play. I’d love to expand that toolbox more, but there really hasn’t been much come up in white humans to add in recent releases.


    Yea I constantly struggle in that there is clearly tiers of how good a lot of the creatures in this deck are. Several of the less key options can be substituted out for what works for you and or what your meta calls for. Unfortunately I can't get them to give me 3 functional reprints of Lyra Dawnbringer for some reason Rolleyes .

    @Kungfu_Hero don't worry if you want to try out some different things. We adapt our decks based on how they run. I have reasons for what I run but some of those reasons come down to meta decisions. Moats / Tabernacles can be strong but if you constantly see a swarm of dragons it might change how you want to build somewhat. My own current meta consists of a lot of token decks which has driven some of how I build.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Jori En - Izzet Cantrips
    Quote from CrashCapt »
    I find myself winning via residual damage and combat steps and this new spoiler seems interesting. Im sure I'll slot this in


    https://www.mtgsalvation.com/cards/modern-horizons/36362-fists-of-flame


    Fists of Flame - it could be decent. In a lot of cases its going to give like +3/+0 and trample plus cantrip itself as kind of a baseline. I guess the question is how strong would you want it to be before its really solid. Its not all that likely that we would get much out of it on Jori En herself unless you are fork casting it. Its a card that gets better with running forks, without them though its probably going to be a bit so so. Its not really that good of draw being that its two mana with no card selection. I actually think it fits a Feather, the Redeemed deck a little better than it does this list.

    Collected Conjuring - hummmmm this is an interesting card. I think the overall consistency of EDH decks will probably ultimately make it not great here but its interesting. If it could hit instant / sorceries I think we would have been in business but as it stands I think it just narrowly isn't quite good enough due to deck consistancies of 100 card decks.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Edgar Markov - Low Mana Curve Build
    ISBP, I would like to hear your thoughts about an underdiscussed topic, the manabase. Ill start by asking about lands you run and then talk about lands you don’t.

    1. Cavern of Souls: has this helped enough to justify causing casting problems for noncreatures, particularly necropotence? Also nonbos with filterlands. Any reason not to run unclaimed territory too then?

    2. Vault of the Archangel: how often do you use this? For me its been nonbasic wastes thats occasionally a combat threat, since I have not once used it.

    3. Rugged Prairie: since the deck is so heavily black, does the nonblack fixing justify the downsides (may force you to filter a black source into a nonblack one, colorless sometimes, nonbasic)

    4. Why mana confluence but no city of brass? Worried about drawing both sometimes?

    5. Bond land cycle (tapped unless 2+ opponents): would you recommend despite them being bad in 1v1 and sometimes lategame?

    6. Prismatic Vista from modern horizons: swamp is better 80% of the time but that 20% could make a huge difference. Autoinclude?

    7. Modern horizons cantrip cycle (horizon canopies for enemy color pairs): Very torn on this. The mana ability alone is awful. We don’t run painlands for similar reasons. Is the cantrip ability worth the pain? I think probably not in this deck because we could use that life to dig several cards deeper with suicide draw.


    I haven't really done an audit on the landbase in some time so its possible my landbase could be tuned up from where it is right now.

    Cavern vs Unclaimed - I think both are playable and fine. I mostly have not had issues with them. They are really good fixing and while its true that it can't help towards Necropotence the same could be said about any of the lands in the deck that don't produce black naturally. It fixes nicely in able to cast any type of creatures in the first few turns. I honestly haven't found the uncounterable to be crucial yet in part because my meta doesn't run a lot of counter magic but in being slightly more optimal and because I own 6 caverns I included one here. I think its probably fine to run both of these lands or substitute and just run Unclaimed Territory in a pinch. It could bite you in the ass but I also don't always have Necropotence openers either.

    Vault of the Archangel - it really has not come up much for me. I still include it because the chance of me needing it in the mid game as an evasion / trade enabler seems solid still even though it could give me issues in my opener. Its not something I would be overly upset if I were to cut it but I also think the mid / late game use of it could be important sometime which is why I have kept it so far. Its definitely a big of a give and take but I really can't think of a time I have activated it.

    Rugged Prairie - I can't remember if I am actually running it in my paper list or not. Like I said the landbase hasn't been audited in some time which makes it a little harder for me to say if its 100% accurate with what I run. You are correct in that it can be a little awkward in that it doesn't produce black mana but its fixing for nonblack can also be relevant. I can't say for certain if its still in my list or not but I think it could go either direction without there being a definite right answer on to run it or not.

    Mana Confluence - You could run City of Brass as well. Technically Confluence is very very minorly stronger in that if an Urborg is in play you don't have to pay life to make black mana with Confluence but you do with City. You should due to this run Confluence over City if you want to be optimal but you can also run both if you want. I find these lands to be a pain to track though and the landbase is fairly good already which is why I don't have both. If you want to value fixing and don't mind tracking and losing a little life then yes it is a little more optimal to run both.

    Battlebond Lands - My honest opinion of them is that they are fine if you are running a budget or exactly a two color deck that can run them. I don't think they generally are strong enough to out hedge the cycles of lands you want to run in a 3+ color deck assuming you are talking optimal landbases full of fetchlands / ABU duals / Shocks / the whole nine yards of lands. I would generally consider them to be at a similar level as the Dragonskull Summit cycle so if you are considering that cycle of lands then I think its about similar to that for playability.

    Prismatic Vista I am sure I will find room for it somewhere. Its worth mentioning that you don't want to end up with too low of a basic count though and my current count looks to be 6 so I can't say for sure that it would replace a basic just due to concerns of having some basics. Its something I will have to test though so it might come in for a basic swamp and see if I notice an issue with that or not.

    Silent Clearing / Sunbaked Canyon - I am sure I will try them out. Adding a cantrip option to them does help a lot. Its possible I might even up my land count by some amount (maybe like one more lands total for both) to include them in that they can fix the issue of flooding lands. I mostly don't run painlands just because I don't need to but the utility of sacing a land to cantrip is good. The pain in the ass is that I expect all of them to likely be $30+ so it adds yet more money to a landbase. Well, I guess I already ordered two boxes so lets hope they are good.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Bruna, the Fading Light - Moat Control
    Quote from Kungfu_Hero »
    Great write up. I think some of my suggestions are very meta based. My group loves big creatures and dragons. Knight-Captain has been good every time I’ve drawn him. Seraph of the Sword I admit has sometimes done nothing. However, the same is true for Magus of the Moat. In fact, not only has he been a dead card, he’s actually helped an opponent who started running away with the game. He benefitted more from the moat than me. I actually wished I had been able to kill my own Magus.

    You make a good case against Silverblade Paladin. When Bruna dies, I don’t want to be left with nothing but a Grizzly Bears. I went a somewhat toolbox route with my angels/humans, and double strike is a unique effect (plus I run Recruiter of the Guard), but really the paladin is better when I cast him right before attacking. He’s not very good getting him back with Bruna.

    Maybe this is crazy, but Bastion Protector hasn’t been that great for me. I love the theme of this card, but my problem is she’s not good without Bruna in play. And even then, there is so much removal that ignores indestructible. To be sure, there have been times where she was good, but for me it’s too situational.


    Moats - its going to vary from meta to meta and against different opponents. I see a LOT of tokens in my current meta which I respond to with trying to give them a giant middle finger. Its important to not just curve moats into play though, there are a lot of times where I wait for specific boards to play a moat or not play a moat at all. I generally wait to see if someone is getting big enough to cause me a big problem or overwhelm the whole board before I will play one or if someone is coming after me on the ground I will play it but in a lot of cases its not an effect that I will just curve in. For me this is in some regards so that it doesn't just get removed by some random sweeper without doing anything and also as a political effect that a lot of people don't want to remove if and when its holding back a flood of creatures on one board. I play with a lot of moats because 1) I think its cool and flavorful and 2) I see too many swarmy token decks.

    Bastion Protector - its value will vary with how much removal your meta runs that ignores indestructible. A few other things to keep in mind with it though, it turns Bruna into a 3 attack clock where as naturally she is a 5 swing clock. The extra stat buffs change her from bouncing titans off her to killing probably 90+% of creatures in combat as a 7/9. Its actually the same buff to an attack clock as Silverblade Paladin while technically doing less damage its the same number of attacks assuming you had one or the other. In a lot of cases I don't get people targeting Bruna with spot removal though with how I play it because it just means me picking up more value on the next cast so for me its more that it makes her more relevant in combat and gives some protection from wraths in that I have some board immediately. If its not working for you though, I think its far from critical.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Bruna, the Fading Light - Moat Control
    Quote from Kungfu_Hero »
    What’s your take on Intrepid Hero? I’ve had a lot of success with him.

    Also, would Silverblade Paladin be right for this deck? On the one hand, your deck is more defensive. On the other, he makes your angels compete with the bigger creatures that you’ll have to deal with. Bruna soul bonded may earn you a kill that otherwise wouldn’t have happened. And he also has synergy with Archangel of Thune, Mask of Memory, Sword of Fire and Ice, and really any life linker.

    Finally, perhaps more appropriate for this build, how do you feel about Seraph of the Sword and Knight-Captain of Eos? I like them as aggro deterrent, which I find to be a winning strategy. Throw up a fortress. Let them fight amongst themselves. Pick off anyone I can


    Intrepid Hero is a cool card, my main hesitation with it comes from the fear of clones and or theft. Its also a very vulnerable fragile creature who is slow to act in that it needs to tap so my expectation of it living can sometimes be questionable and its value against opposing decks will depend a lot on what they are playing. The value of it against this deck would be a very bad situation for us. Bruna can also be a good offensive and defensive creature against a lot of decks where Intrepid Hero might be good against as well.

    Silverblade Paladin - its fine to include. It makes your clock faster with Bruna but given her mana cost I tend to play this more as a survival kind of a deck rather than trying to speed up my clock much. I don't see an issue with running it. I opted to pass on it given how slow and responsive I tend to play Bruna myself though. Keep in mind as well that some situations where Bruna / equipment might not be relevant (aka a maze or fog bank or something) this card doesn't always make you relevant through. In a lot of cases Double Strike doesn't fix a bad attack situation in my opinion. You will see in my list that I do however include True Conviction in part because its a mass buff and the mass lifelink. I find that to be a more reasonable effect in part because the mana difference between these two cards is less relevant given that we have a more expensive often reactive commander. Its not like I can't afford to pay six mana instead of three the turn after casting my seven mana commander after all. My other issue is that while Silverblade can be rezed by Bruna there is the question of if its a better rez than anything else in our graveyard to which I feel like the answer often might be no. I think this effect is just.... ok. If someone has spot removal for instance this feels like we really only have one good threat in play where as if I were to rez a 5+ mana human / angel instead I often spread out my threats and give opponents multiple targets.

    Seraph of the Sword - Its good on defense but so too is Bruna. It doesn't help vs swarms or trample (it blocks 3 dmg and trample goes over it). It kind of reminds me of a more expensive Fog Bank with a bit of power. If you need more defense vs random beaters it seems fine but I don't like that its kind of only defensive. We have so many tools that can serve as both offense and defense. Baneslayer Angel for instance isn't exactly a stellar angel but it gives a 10 life swing which lets me be both offensive and defensive. Its not really likely that Seraph of the Sword blocks more than 6 damage in an attack so I guess if you are using it against every player its ok but overall I think its a bit lacking in that its sort of redundant alongside Bruna lots of the time because she can often block the same sort of things. It can work but I don't see a lot of situations where someone has multiple mid sized beaters I am trying to repel.

    Knight-Captain of Eos - I like it more than Seraph of the Sword in that it can stop a wider variety of situations even if its a finite resource. This deck is so robust though I try to go a little more offensive when I can though and this is almost entirely a defensive stalling measure. When it comes to fogs you have to ask yourself if buying yourself 1-2 more combats will let you turn the tables on someone.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on question about Extraplanar lens
    Extraplanar Lens is a decent card if you want to combo off the turn you play it. If you are trying to play a fair deck that wants a lot of mana I have found its not worth running. I can't tell you how many times I have seen it cast, remove a land you control, and not exist next turn. If your meta doesn't run removal then sure run it and if you want to combo the turn you play it its fine. Its kind of a narrow card outside of combo decks though if you ask me.

    I stopped playing it YEARS ago. Its not very good for most decks due to the liability of losing you a land as well when it dies. Don't worry about its price tag as its not worth the investment. One of the only places I think its really validated is mono blue combo and maybe in a stretch mono black (but probably not even there).
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Fists of Flame and Zada
    Quote from Boyachi »
    Setup: I control Zada, Hedron Grinder a 1/1, and a 2/2. It is my turn and I have drawn my card for the turn.
    I cast Fist of Flame on Zada, which in turn copies over to the other two creatures.

    What happens?
    I am basing my assumption off of Wirewood Pride that Fists will only check upon spell resolution, not update throughout the turn.
    If I stack the copies so that the 2/2's happens first, it would get +2/+0, the 1/1 would get +3/+0, and Zada would get +4/+0, correct?

    Thank you in advance.


    I believe that is how it will work out. With one shot pump effects like this it only checks when it resolves. With cards that stay on cards to buff them like say Blanchwood Armor its always checking to see what the buff will be but in this case it will just buff based on when it resolves.
    Posted in: Rumored Card Rulings
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