There are a number of playable High cost soldiers in Extended plus Changlings, The Colossus bieng one of them. Personally I think that G/W has some serious potential, you have two good plainswalkers, you have Sunlance for targeted removal, you have efficient creatures, you have mana accel. Tell me, What exactly, is bad about attacking with the Captain and putting a Chamilian Collosus into play and pumping him for 10 damage (you have a borial or Llanowar elves in play.)?
You guys are nuts. Can you imagine what this does on a decent aggro control deck?
your turn:
You-Wrath
Him-Delay
His turn: Play this, draw 5 cards.
Thats game.
In which case he has allready won, since he has five creatures on the board and three turns to beat you...
Outside of U/G tribal, this card is unimpressive.
Going Clantacular on Halo 3 Multiplayer sporting that spiffy Hyubasha Ninja Armor. Campaign is Legendary with all skulls save Black Eye, Blind, Tilt, and Famine. (Who doesn't like to go up against an army of crazy smart, 300% health, Spec Ops. Brutes and Grunts who throw grenades way way to good?
Awesome card I didn't even know about that one. I'm thinking -4 Razormane Masticore, +4 Guile, what'd you think? Thanks for the suggestion, any one else have some advice? Also any suggestions for a board control artifact ala Nevinyrrals Disk/Powder Keg? Just got back into MTG recently and have not found any besides Oblivion Stone which I don't think would go well with this deck. Do you guys think it would? Thanks for any help.
[CARDEngineered Explosives[/CARD] would fit that niche nicely as many threats cost 1-2, you could splash white/green to help broaden its power.
I fell like there should be a splash for W...It gives access to Soul wardens for added redundancy, additionally it gives acces to Teeg, which manages to stop Wraths and Damns, Profane and Cryptic Commands, thus forcing terrors and other removal onto him. Sounds solid to me. Painlands won't particularly matter as you can go off.
This should be treated as a standard varient of life deck, It sets up the pieces while going on the offensive if possible, or the defensive if nessisary, then the combo hits and...well, nothing really matters at that point.
See, the thing with planeswalkers is that they are VERY vulnerable. It's all over once they get touched and so the ones that can't protect themselves are next to useless. Generally speaking, none of the planeswalkers are really playable, but they're great for Timmy to drool at. I see not everyone agrees with your list though.
I'm disappointed with the planeswalker outcomes. After all this time, people persist in their denial that planeswalkers plainly suck. People discuss them as if they are viable cards that can be used in competitive play. Whereas for other cards, they take the competitive meter stick to measure their worth, they take the casual play meter stick for planeswalkers and say, 'It isn't the worst rare in the set. It's completely better than a bunch of worthless cards!'
This is sad. What have planeswalkers honestly done to take on such attention? It is sad how we are disputing over why chandra is better than jace or such and such. We don't dispute why Profane command is better than Cryptic Command and both of them have solidly more potential than any planeswalkers. Our words are being wasted on cards that are not even worth the paragraph I am typing. These cards are slow (taking TURNS to develop), expensive, vulnerable, and have useless abilities. Oh wow. I would just pay 5 mana for Ajani's avatar. Yeah, right. I would probably not consider the cost even if we got the token directly in the form of a sorcery card.
I put my argument to rest that the significance of which planeswalker is best is irrelevant. They do not deem such discussion. Of course, if I were to take sides, my opinion of which is best most closely compares to that of the OP. I would swap chandra and jace, however.
You obviously haven't played with plainswalkers, Garruk and Ajani both instantly swing the game when they hit play, if not outright win it.
Garruk at worst untaps your lands and acts as a moment's peace with/without flashback. Often he pops 2 3/3s off sometimes 3. for 2GG and no further mana commitment...that's REALLY good. His untap abillity effectively make him a Serra Avenger (creates a 3/3 with 2 mana to protect him). And his last abillity just wins if you have more than 2 creatures...
So, how...just how is that, one card, four mana, in GREEN, not good?
Ajani is actually good in both aggro and control. His life gain is deceptively decent, players have to commit turns to kill Ajani he has 5 loyalty...they have to attack twice most of the time. Meanwhile you have gained 4 life. This coushin buys you AT LEAST two turns, often more... Last time I checked, a triple timewalk for 2WW was solid. The great thing is, they HAVE to attack Ajani, cause he gives you 2 life a turn, buying you one to two turns, then creating a massive win-condition. If you can protect him, (W control has amazing creature control) He wins...
Wrath, then huge token... Win cause you counter their creature kill (if they have any). That's just control! Aggro he pumps, then builds up for a post wrath kill...
Jace is pretty basic, he starts with 5 loyalty against agro, replaces himself, at the cost of giving your opponent a card. Against almost any control build out there, he is a phyrexian arena that howling mines every third turn. That swings games...The fact that Agro has to waste valuable time killing jace also hurts...
I haven't played against or with Chalandra, though she looks a tad weak. (Though I try to see her as a one sided wrath for 5)
I have encountered Vess twice, both times they were unpleasent...Mbc can protect her, she starts stradling control the turn she hits, (chances are she will) against agro, she buys a turn and fetches Damnation/tendrils/tendrils.
Against Agro (and often control) she is a win condition. Her third abillity picks up every creature you have killed or chump blocked with, every Serra Avenger, Tarmogoyf, Aeon Chronicler, Goblin, Kithkin, Elemental Elf ect.
and sets them up to alpha strike...Lets hope they have a Wrath...
In general, the plainswalkers inevitably do one of three things, buy tempo, buy card advantage/card quality, or both whether or not the opponent can deal with them.
Considering the most expensive are 5 mana, at the very worst, you get a timewarp... at the best, you win the game in 1-3 turns...
There's a reason people slap hybrid mana on creatures with two or three color abillities/keywords: WOTC can't follow their own rules. See Giant Solifuge. Shround is red? Trample is Red? Haste is Green pre Planar Chaos? In my opinion, some of the color-pie shenanigins are going to be semi-perminant changes. Designers should be able to follow that trend, or blaze their own trails. It is, after all, a game.
Your absolutely right, firststrike owns Giant Solifuges and Groundbreakers. But Rumbling Slum and Troll Ascetic are nice and fat. I actually have only faced one deck (ww) that ran a creature with firststrike, and the match was good.
As for removal, Flametongue Kavus are going back in the sideboard as they pwn everything with legs and 4 or less toughness. Also, Umezawa's Jitte IS removal, creature pump, and life gain. And most good decks only need 2. Jitte is not the focus of the deck, merely a good way to use the mana to accelerate into a win. Also about Evlish Piper, It is a TERRIBLE card. It costs 4, making it slow without the vineyard effects, something you are suggesting to remove. Second it has a 1/1 body, making it a chump blocker at best, and a dismal attacker. Third it doesn't have haste, so it can't use its activated abillity the turn it comes into play, making it fair game for every form of targeted removal. Fourth and finally, the highest costing spells in One Night Stand cost 4 to play anyway, making it a risky, flimsy mana, non-agressive play. Burning-Tree-Shaman should have been better than it turned out to be, we will try playing him again.
Thanks for the feedback people!
P.S. ANY advice for fairy stompy would be welcome!
Burning Tree Shamans didn't pack the punch we were hoping for. The death fork has been difficult for us, it acts as a mana sink, it gives a creature +4+4, it gives them emergency life, and it kills groundbreaker, both Magi and Elvish Spirit Guide. So, we took a long look at the deathfork, and we realized that it is amazing. Testing has confirmed it. It kills enemy jettes, it kills random crap, it gives life in a close race. Its in! Slum has been really good, so we pumped it up to 3. Finally, we are testing out Viridian Shamans to help out with affinity and Stax (turns out this is a closer match than we thought, it basically depends on their abillity to get crucible and stax out in 3 turns, Shaman's hedge this bet.) If it doesn't help, we'll return to Flametogue Kavus.
Also, Fairy Stompy is still a bad match up, any suggestions?
Reports
W/B agro control 2-1 One game he vindicated my crap and got a hippy lock, the others he was buried by a city block and a rolling forest. Magus of the Moon turned his Scrublands into the flattest mountains you ever saw.
Draco Explosion 2/1 He owned me via draco and ivory mask with eratic and pyromancy, I hit him down to 3 before he damnation and stabilized and I ran out of gas. He got owned with the 20/5 groundbreaker turn 3 in the last game.
Satanic Sligh 2/1 He owned me hard first game. Second game I FTKavued his Popet he got hellbent with almost no board position, game followed.
Also Fairy Stompy is a terrible match up. Drunken Meadow wins 1 in 3 games roughly. Woot 30% win...
Xanith: Which is why we have 3 Flametongue Kavu in the side. I will be personally testing Drunken Meadow/One Night Stand agianst affinity on wensday. Pithing Needle for Ravager/Cranial Plating and Chalice, and Kavu should deal with it post side. If Meadow loses, then the sideboard will be adjusted.
As for the Gemstone: Its entirely up to the player to run Stomping Grounds in their deck. It's a good mana fixer, but we found that Gemstone often performs better because it doesn't shock you, and it often turns into a re-usable mountain with Magus of the Moon in play. It could replace the two basic mountains perhaps, but life is a fairly preseuse resource against agro.
King Canute: We did consider Summoner's Pact. Unfortunatly the card doesn't fit in the deck for 2 reasons.
1. It only searches for green creatures, so no Magus trix.
2. This is the biggie. You need 4 mana durring your upkeep. Vineyards add mana durring your precombat main phase, too late to save you from the mean credit people. This deck usually has 3 lands in play, sometimes going up to five. Perhaps if one focused on the Groundbreaker for 20 combo...But that is not the focus of the deck, merely a possiblity.
Some news from testing.
Drunken Meadow v. Tog 2/1
Drunken Meadow v. WW. 1-1 (Paralax Wave won this game by keeping a Rumbling Slum at bay for 5 turns.)
Drunken Meadow v Icorid 2-0 (The first game ended on turn 1 with a Magus of the Moon hitting play off the backs of two spirit guides. The next game saw the awsome might of a 20/5 Groundbreaker crashing into the skull of the poor player. The only reason we found out that he was playing Icorid was a single Narcomeba in the grave. Obviously, we need more testing to see what happens when Drunken Meadow doesn't draw crazy s**t.)
Modifications to the deck:
Right now we are trying out 2 Burning Tree Shamans and taking out 1 groundbreaker and the 1 Open Fist. We will see how that works out. I have high hopes.
Thank you everyone for your helpful comments, keep swinging!
King: Well, yes, the groundbreakers work very well, as they always swing for 6, dealing at least 5 and taking a creature with it. They often swing for 8-10 depending on rancor or Might of Old Krosa, and they can on rare occasion swing for 20 with Might of Old Krosa and Beserk. Oddly, Groundbreaker has often been allowed to swing, and when it has been killed, it was burn that could have helped them win the damage race, or a stp that should have been saved for Magus of the Moon/Rumbling Slum. Mog Fanatic is really the only thing that hurts it, and Sligh is an easy match-up in general Groundbreakers and Moon Magi are sided out in favor of Pithing Needle and Flametongue (Which are insane).
Burning Tree Shaman is VERY interesting, this deck has almost no activated abillities that are non mana, just the Troll, and Fetches. The deck is so tight though, sideboard status replacing Flametongue?
Chalice of the Void does hurt alot of decks. But it functions best in the side, if I see alot of hate for magi like smother, delay ect...or see werebears watchwolves ect... Or I'm getting burned by incinerate ect, then Chalice goes in, often replacing Groundbreakers. My fave, second turn for two against Landstill, watch them counter it, then play Magus of the Moon to see them scoop.
As for Winter Orb, Magus of the Moon often does it better, and Blood Moon comes in. The deck owns control pretty straight up on its own. 7 Creatures have shroud, 4 end the game if they have more than 10 non-basic lands, and the rest either have haste or are 2-3 turn clocks.
Combo, now THERES a problem. But Green and red don't have very good combo tech.
Burkey Boy: Yup 8 vineyard effects, and the mana sink is pretty nice, the deck is more or less a mana sink. You have assured 3 mana turn 2, most likely 4 as you play another land. All the creatures cost 3 or 4 mana with the exeption of Magus of the Vineyard. For reusable mana sinkage, the Troll just makes a regeneration shield and calls it good. This deck has taken mabey 15 points of mana burn in the 70-something games it has played.
Fun Fact: Magus of the Moon owns two of the three cards you mentioned so they often get to die of mana burn. Teaches them right for not holding their liquor!
Thanks for the BTS idea, I hope we can fit it in, we'll certainly try!
That's nearly the same list, and all of the same things I said above still apply: your red cards suck (to elaborate, the only good thing about you running red is Blood Moon, which kinda makes Groundbreaker hard to play), you need ESG, maybe SSG, four petals, Berserk, etc.
Edit: oh hey, you know what might be super secret tech for this? Pact of Negation. If you do the smart thing and use Berserk/Fling, that is; alpha striking for 20 on turn two is pretty good, I'd focus on that.
That's some constructive C you got goin on there... Seriously, if you played this deck you would understand just how devestating a turn 2 rumbling slum is aginast agro decks. He's HUGE. He races better than the stuff they can pump out. Goblins can barely use Vine mana, sligh can't use it at all. Against control, he's a 3 turn clock by himself, and with support a 2 turn clock, which is always the case. Yes, he can be stped. But he will draw out a counterspell first game if you play him, allowing for a Magus of the Moon the next turn. With MooK and Beserk (Which is now in, good point btw!) he ends games.
Speaking of Game ending, if you read my report, and Cybrose will confirm it, Magus of the Moon ends games when he resolves, if he isn't countered, (and there's a good chance because you play threats before him because you are a smart agro player) Threshold, Stax, Landstill, and any other dual heavy non red deck scoops. Last time I checked, Threshold and Landstill were pretty good, and beating them with a single card was really good. As for the groundbreaker "problem" you have duals, granted they turn into mountans, but there are usually forests on hand or elven spirit guides/lotus peddles. Mana is simply not a problem.
Not to sound ungrateful, Beserk and ESG have both improved the deck, for that you have our thanks.
We have an updated, better sideboard.
4 Pithing needle
4 Blood Moon
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Flametongue Kavu
Hello, I am the friend of Cybrose. Two days ago, I was struggling with a Legacy Control build. After several dismal matches my friend suggested that we build something light and fun, involving mono-green beatdown with Crush of Wurms
I took him up on the green part. Now, I have always liked Elidamri's Vineyard, none of that silly Alluran non-sense. With its Magus appearing in Future Sight. I thought that legacy might be keen to see both in the same deck. But what to spend the mana on? Anyone who has seen the threads on the Magus knows that on the second turn, 4 mana is easily possible. With this knowledge in mind, we set out to get a bit tipsy!
The current build is as follows.
The sideboard is no longer weak! And the deck is disturbingly strong. Last night, Cybrose and I double playtested similar builds across mtgsalvation. We found two disturbing trends:
1. When the opponent doesn’t play green or have many large mana sinks, (which happens more than you think) they lose significant amounts of life to mana burn, when two vineyard effects hit the board, that life loss in conjunction with hasted and/or untargetable beats is often fatal.
2. Magus of the Moon often seals games in of himself. I cannot count the number of times (ok, I can, its 16) that a non/almost non-red non-basic deck (namely Landstill and Stax) scooped to the Magus. This also hoses the very dual heavy builds of Threshold. Also, if they arnt playing green, then they get to contend with 2-4 points of mana burn along with his swinging.
So, here are the match ups.
Goblins 55-45. This can be a tough match up, namely depending on your initial plays. If you can start out with a Might of Old Krosafied Groundbreaker, then the game quickly shifts to your favor, since they lose 10 points of life. Mogg Fanatic can be trouble, so simply swing with the breaker, then might in resp. Another winner is Rumbling Slum+Rancor. Troll Ascetic is a versatile creature, blocking a rabid piledriver and living. Magus is often worthless, though it disables Rishodin Ports (not a big deal.) (2). The only thing that can wreck you is Siege Gange Commander, who is often the one thing that can utilize vineyard mana efficiently and effectively. The simple fact of the matter is, Goblins often don’t have the burnpower to end you, and their creatures, short of a huge Piledriver wont be able to break through a fortress of 5/5 bodies. I have had 2 games (out of 12) where Goblins simply dies to mana burn while I held off their offensive with big things.
Post side –4 Magus of the Moon +4 Chalice of the Void
Affinity- No matches as of yet. But I would guess that it would be in your favor as you have Magus of the Moon to turn their artifact lands into basic mountains. Sure they get their extra mana, so they can get frogmites easily, only to be steeped on by a hearty 5/5 going into the red zone. Pulverize with red floating for red Magus makes for game post side.
Sligh- 70-30, This is a very good match. They often can’t use any of the mana unless they get Mirsha’s Factory, burning for 1-4 a turn as a result. This in combination with the beatial blitz of Hasted and/or Trampling nastiness is often too much to race against. Their creatures are too small, their burn is often directed at slowing the unending tide of fat rather than your face, forcing them to run out of gas, while you don’t. Magus of the Moon is sub-par, but none-the-less effective as he hoses Factories and Ports which would otherwise act as mana sinks.
Zoo-75-25 This is an even better match up. They have efficient creatures, but you have bigger creatures, and they sink green mana. Zoo’s attack almost always stalls, then is crushed under the weight of a Mighted/Rancored Rumbling Slum/Fist/Ascetic. Magus of the Moon forces them to play sub-par Sligh, often sealing the game.
Landstill 60-40 A solid match. They have disruption, and it often comes down to them countering magus of the moon, which is an auto win if it lands. Fake them out with big threats, then go in for the kill with Magus of the Moon. Giant Solifuge is a problem for them, Groundbreaker can get them into striking distance. Ascetic is the bane of their existence, especially when rancored as the have absolutely no solution to it. Post side turns this match into a route as 4 Blood Moon come in.
Threshold 40-60 This is a tough one. If they hold you back with counters early game and get 2 threshold critters online, then its game. Easily done for them as you’re giving them free mana. Groundbreaker and Solifuge quickly lose their potency and must be used early. If they area dual heavy, fake them out with Troll then follow up with Magus of the Moon. Which will spell game if they have no basic forests. Post side, lose the groundbreakers and Solifuge infavor of blood moon and Chalice. Blood moon adds redundancy and numbers to override their counter wall, while chalice for 2 kills Werebears, delays. Memory lapses, ect. Post side the match swings drastically in your favor. Ranging from 50-50 to 60-40 depending on how many duals they run.
Flash Hulk/Solidarity 0-100 Mabey if you draw a lotus peddle two magus of the vinyard, groundbreaker and two might of old Krosas , and you go first, you can win. That means turn 2 you attack with both magi, and a 14/9 ground breaker. Dealing 16 points of damage, enough to kill them if they burned for 4 in the last turn. Not likely, just shuffle up for game 2.
and side in chalices and hope to god you draw them…Post side 20-80. On the bright side, Flash will probably be banned or erataed within 6 months. Solidarity remains this deck’s big problem.
Endorsements for this Deck.
“You F***ing lucky newblet, this deck sucks! <System> Player lost
-Threshold player when a Blood Moon hit the board after he delayed or countered 3 other moon or Maguses.
This is a newb jank piece of S**t that can’t beat any good decks. <System> Player Lost
-Landstill Player after Magus of the Moon resolved with a Rumbling Slum after it.
Why couldn’t you play a good deck?
-Threshold player one turn before a double rancored Slum went into the redzone, ending him.
Good Game <System> Player lost.
Almost every agro deck that played against Drunken Meadows.
So there you have it, Drunken Meadows is a potent force that has great potential. I would recommend running it in a month or two.
Just so you know, you heard it from Cybrose and Me first.
In which case he has allready won, since he has five creatures on the board and three turns to beat you...
Outside of U/G tribal, this card is unimpressive.
This should be treated as a standard varient of life deck, It sets up the pieces while going on the offensive if possible, or the defensive if nessisary, then the combo hits and...well, nothing really matters at that point.
You obviously haven't played with plainswalkers, Garruk and Ajani both instantly swing the game when they hit play, if not outright win it.
Garruk at worst untaps your lands and acts as a moment's peace with/without flashback. Often he pops 2 3/3s off sometimes 3. for 2GG and no further mana commitment...that's REALLY good. His untap abillity effectively make him a Serra Avenger (creates a 3/3 with 2 mana to protect him). And his last abillity just wins if you have more than 2 creatures...
So, how...just how is that, one card, four mana, in GREEN, not good?
Ajani is actually good in both aggro and control. His life gain is deceptively decent, players have to commit turns to kill Ajani he has 5 loyalty...they have to attack twice most of the time. Meanwhile you have gained 4 life. This coushin buys you AT LEAST two turns, often more... Last time I checked, a triple timewalk for 2WW was solid. The great thing is, they HAVE to attack Ajani, cause he gives you 2 life a turn, buying you one to two turns, then creating a massive win-condition. If you can protect him, (W control has amazing creature control) He wins...
Wrath, then huge token... Win cause you counter their creature kill (if they have any). That's just control! Aggro he pumps, then builds up for a post wrath kill...
Jace is pretty basic, he starts with 5 loyalty against agro, replaces himself, at the cost of giving your opponent a card. Against almost any control build out there, he is a phyrexian arena that howling mines every third turn. That swings games...The fact that Agro has to waste valuable time killing jace also hurts...
I haven't played against or with Chalandra, though she looks a tad weak. (Though I try to see her as a one sided wrath for 5)
I have encountered Vess twice, both times they were unpleasent...Mbc can protect her, she starts stradling control the turn she hits, (chances are she will) against agro, she buys a turn and fetches Damnation/tendrils/tendrils.
Against Agro (and often control) she is a win condition. Her third abillity picks up every creature you have killed or chump blocked with, every Serra Avenger, Tarmogoyf, Aeon Chronicler, Goblin, Kithkin, Elemental Elf ect.
and sets them up to alpha strike...Lets hope they have a Wrath...
In general, the plainswalkers inevitably do one of three things, buy tempo, buy card advantage/card quality, or both whether or not the opponent can deal with them.
Considering the most expensive are 5 mana, at the very worst, you get a timewarp... at the best, you win the game in 1-3 turns...
Many thanks
As for removal, Flametongue Kavus are going back in the sideboard as they pwn everything with legs and 4 or less toughness. Also, Umezawa's Jitte IS removal, creature pump, and life gain. And most good decks only need 2. Jitte is not the focus of the deck, merely a good way to use the mana to accelerate into a win. Also about Evlish Piper, It is a TERRIBLE card. It costs 4, making it slow without the vineyard effects, something you are suggesting to remove. Second it has a 1/1 body, making it a chump blocker at best, and a dismal attacker. Third it doesn't have haste, so it can't use its activated abillity the turn it comes into play, making it fair game for every form of targeted removal. Fourth and finally, the highest costing spells in One Night Stand cost 4 to play anyway, making it a risky, flimsy mana, non-agressive play. Burning-Tree-Shaman should have been better than it turned out to be, we will try playing him again.
Thanks for the feedback people!
P.S. ANY advice for fairy stompy would be welcome!
Updated Decklist!
Lands 18
4 Taiga
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Gemstone Mine
4 Forest
2 Mountain
4 Elidamri’s Vineyard
4 Magus of the Vineyard
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Troll Ascetic
3 Giant Solifuge
3 Rumbling Slum
4 Magus of the Moon
2 Umezawa's Jette
3 Rancor
3 Might of Old Krosa
3 Beserk
4 Pithing Needle
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Viridian Shaman
Burning Tree Shamans didn't pack the punch we were hoping for. The death fork has been difficult for us, it acts as a mana sink, it gives a creature +4+4, it gives them emergency life, and it kills groundbreaker, both Magi and Elvish Spirit Guide. So, we took a long look at the deathfork, and we realized that it is amazing. Testing has confirmed it. It kills enemy jettes, it kills random crap, it gives life in a close race. Its in! Slum has been really good, so we pumped it up to 3. Finally, we are testing out Viridian Shamans to help out with affinity and Stax (turns out this is a closer match than we thought, it basically depends on their abillity to get crucible and stax out in 3 turns, Shaman's hedge this bet.) If it doesn't help, we'll return to Flametogue Kavus.
Also, Fairy Stompy is still a bad match up, any suggestions?
W/B agro control 2-1 One game he vindicated my crap and got a hippy lock, the others he was buried by a city block and a rolling forest. Magus of the Moon turned his Scrublands into the flattest mountains you ever saw.
Draco Explosion 2/1 He owned me via draco and ivory mask with eratic and pyromancy, I hit him down to 3 before he damnation and stabilized and I ran out of gas. He got owned with the 20/5 groundbreaker turn 3 in the last game.
Satanic Sligh 2/1 He owned me hard first game. Second game I FTKavued his Popet he got hellbent with almost no board position, game followed.
Also Fairy Stompy is a terrible match up. Drunken Meadow wins 1 in 3 games roughly. Woot 30% win...
As for the Gemstone: Its entirely up to the player to run Stomping Grounds in their deck. It's a good mana fixer, but we found that Gemstone often performs better because it doesn't shock you, and it often turns into a re-usable mountain with Magus of the Moon in play. It could replace the two basic mountains perhaps, but life is a fairly preseuse resource against agro.
King Canute: We did consider Summoner's Pact. Unfortunatly the card doesn't fit in the deck for 2 reasons.
1. It only searches for green creatures, so no Magus trix.
2. This is the biggie. You need 4 mana durring your upkeep. Vineyards add mana durring your precombat main phase, too late to save you from the mean credit people. This deck usually has 3 lands in play, sometimes going up to five. Perhaps if one focused on the Groundbreaker for 20 combo...But that is not the focus of the deck, merely a possiblity.
Some news from testing.
Drunken Meadow v. Tog 2/1
Drunken Meadow v. WW. 1-1 (Paralax Wave won this game by keeping a Rumbling Slum at bay for 5 turns.)
Drunken Meadow v Icorid 2-0 (The first game ended on turn 1 with a Magus of the Moon hitting play off the backs of two spirit guides. The next game saw the awsome might of a 20/5 Groundbreaker crashing into the skull of the poor player. The only reason we found out that he was playing Icorid was a single Narcomeba in the grave. Obviously, we need more testing to see what happens when Drunken Meadow doesn't draw crazy s**t.)
Modifications to the deck:
Right now we are trying out 2 Burning Tree Shamans and taking out 1 groundbreaker and the 1 Open Fist. We will see how that works out. I have high hopes.
Thank you everyone for your helpful comments, keep swinging!
Burning Tree Shaman is VERY interesting, this deck has almost no activated abillities that are non mana, just the Troll, and Fetches. The deck is so tight though, sideboard status replacing Flametongue?
Chalice of the Void does hurt alot of decks. But it functions best in the side, if I see alot of hate for magi like smother, delay ect...or see werebears watchwolves ect... Or I'm getting burned by incinerate ect, then Chalice goes in, often replacing Groundbreakers. My fave, second turn for two against Landstill, watch them counter it, then play Magus of the Moon to see them scoop.
As for Winter Orb, Magus of the Moon often does it better, and Blood Moon comes in. The deck owns control pretty straight up on its own. 7 Creatures have shroud, 4 end the game if they have more than 10 non-basic lands, and the rest either have haste or are 2-3 turn clocks.
Combo, now THERES a problem. But Green and red don't have very good combo tech.
Burkey Boy: Yup 8 vineyard effects, and the mana sink is pretty nice, the deck is more or less a mana sink. You have assured 3 mana turn 2, most likely 4 as you play another land. All the creatures cost 3 or 4 mana with the exeption of Magus of the Vineyard. For reusable mana sinkage, the Troll just makes a regeneration shield and calls it good. This deck has taken mabey 15 points of mana burn in the 70-something games it has played.
Fun Fact: Magus of the Moon owns two of the three cards you mentioned so they often get to die of mana burn. Teaches them right for not holding their liquor!
Thanks for the BTS idea, I hope we can fit it in, we'll certainly try!
That's some constructive C you got goin on there...
Speaking of Game ending, if you read my report, and Cybrose will confirm it, Magus of the Moon ends games when he resolves, if he isn't countered, (and there's a good chance because you play threats before him because you are a smart agro player) Threshold, Stax, Landstill, and any other dual heavy non red deck scoops. Last time I checked, Threshold and Landstill were pretty good, and beating them with a single card was really good. As for the groundbreaker "problem" you have duals, granted they turn into mountans, but there are usually forests on hand or elven spirit guides/lotus peddles. Mana is simply not a problem.
Not to sound ungrateful, Beserk and ESG have both improved the deck, for that you have our thanks.
We have an updated, better sideboard.
4 Pithing needle
4 Blood Moon
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Flametongue Kavu
I took him up on the green part. Now, I have always liked Elidamri's Vineyard, none of that silly Alluran non-sense. With its Magus appearing in Future Sight. I thought that legacy might be keen to see both in the same deck. But what to spend the mana on? Anyone who has seen the threads on the Magus knows that on the second turn, 4 mana is easily possible. With this knowledge in mind, we set out to get a bit tipsy!
The current build is as follows.
Lands 18
4 Taiga
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Gemstone Mine
4 Forest
2 Mountain
Mana 10
4 Elidamri’s Vineyard
4 Magus of the Vineyard
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Groundbreaker
4 Troll Ascetic
3 Giant Solifuge
2 Rumbling Slum
4 Magus of the Moon
1 Iwamori of the Open Fist
Spells that make Nasty Things Nastier 8
4 Rancor
3 Might of Old Krosa
3 Beserk
4 Blood Moon
4 Pithing Needle
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Flametongue Kavu
The sideboard is no longer weak! And the deck is disturbingly strong. Last night, Cybrose and I double playtested similar builds across mtgsalvation. We found two disturbing trends:
1. When the opponent doesn’t play green or have many large mana sinks, (which happens more than you think) they lose significant amounts of life to mana burn, when two vineyard effects hit the board, that life loss in conjunction with hasted and/or untargetable beats is often fatal.
2. Magus of the Moon often seals games in of himself. I cannot count the number of times (ok, I can, its 16) that a non/almost non-red non-basic deck (namely Landstill and Stax) scooped to the Magus. This also hoses the very dual heavy builds of Threshold. Also, if they arnt playing green, then they get to contend with 2-4 points of mana burn along with his swinging.
So, here are the match ups.
Goblins 55-45. This can be a tough match up, namely depending on your initial plays. If you can start out with a Might of Old Krosafied Groundbreaker, then the game quickly shifts to your favor, since they lose 10 points of life. Mogg Fanatic can be trouble, so simply swing with the breaker, then might in resp. Another winner is Rumbling Slum+Rancor. Troll Ascetic is a versatile creature, blocking a rabid piledriver and living. Magus is often worthless, though it disables Rishodin Ports (not a big deal.) (2). The only thing that can wreck you is Siege Gange Commander, who is often the one thing that can utilize vineyard mana efficiently and effectively. The simple fact of the matter is, Goblins often don’t have the burnpower to end you, and their creatures, short of a huge Piledriver wont be able to break through a fortress of 5/5 bodies. I have had 2 games (out of 12) where Goblins simply dies to mana burn while I held off their offensive with big things.
Post side –4 Magus of the Moon +4 Chalice of the Void
Affinity- No matches as of yet. But I would guess that it would be in your favor as you have Magus of the Moon to turn their artifact lands into basic mountains. Sure they get their extra mana, so they can get frogmites easily, only to be steeped on by a hearty 5/5 going into the red zone. Pulverize with red floating for red Magus makes for game post side.
Sligh- 70-30, This is a very good match. They often can’t use any of the mana unless they get Mirsha’s Factory, burning for 1-4 a turn as a result. This in combination with the beatial blitz of Hasted and/or Trampling nastiness is often too much to race against. Their creatures are too small, their burn is often directed at slowing the unending tide of fat rather than your face, forcing them to run out of gas, while you don’t. Magus of the Moon is sub-par, but none-the-less effective as he hoses Factories and Ports which would otherwise act as mana sinks.
Zoo-75-25 This is an even better match up. They have efficient creatures, but you have bigger creatures, and they sink green mana. Zoo’s attack almost always stalls, then is crushed under the weight of a Mighted/Rancored Rumbling Slum/Fist/Ascetic. Magus of the Moon forces them to play sub-par Sligh, often sealing the game.
Landstill 60-40 A solid match. They have disruption, and it often comes down to them countering magus of the moon, which is an auto win if it lands. Fake them out with big threats, then go in for the kill with Magus of the Moon. Giant Solifuge is a problem for them, Groundbreaker can get them into striking distance. Ascetic is the bane of their existence, especially when rancored as the have absolutely no solution to it. Post side turns this match into a route as 4 Blood Moon come in.
Threshold 40-60 This is a tough one. If they hold you back with counters early game and get 2 threshold critters online, then its game. Easily done for them as you’re giving them free mana. Groundbreaker and Solifuge quickly lose their potency and must be used early. If they area dual heavy, fake them out with Troll then follow up with Magus of the Moon. Which will spell game if they have no basic forests. Post side, lose the groundbreakers and Solifuge infavor of blood moon and Chalice. Blood moon adds redundancy and numbers to override their counter wall, while chalice for 2 kills Werebears, delays. Memory lapses, ect. Post side the match swings drastically in your favor. Ranging from 50-50 to 60-40 depending on how many duals they run.
Flash Hulk/Solidarity 0-100 Mabey if you draw a lotus peddle two magus of the vinyard, groundbreaker and two might of old Krosas , and you go first, you can win. That means turn 2 you attack with both magi, and a 14/9 ground breaker. Dealing 16 points of damage, enough to kill them if they burned for 4 in the last turn. Not likely, just shuffle up for game 2.
and side in chalices and hope to god you draw them…Post side 20-80. On the bright side, Flash will probably be banned or erataed within 6 months. Solidarity remains this deck’s big problem.
Endorsements for this Deck.
“You F***ing lucky newblet, this deck sucks! <System> Player lost
-Threshold player when a Blood Moon hit the board after he delayed or countered 3 other moon or Maguses.
This is a newb jank piece of S**t that can’t beat any good decks. <System> Player Lost
-Landstill Player after Magus of the Moon resolved with a Rumbling Slum after it.
Why couldn’t you play a good deck?
-Threshold player one turn before a double rancored Slum went into the redzone, ending him.
Good Game <System> Player lost.
Almost every agro deck that played against Drunken Meadows.
So there you have it, Drunken Meadows is a potent force that has great potential. I would recommend running it in a month or two.
Just so you know, you heard it from Cybrose and Me first.