Imagine a spectrum of plausible mulligan rules for Limited.
At the right-hand end are the too-permissive solutions, that interact poorly with the wide power distribution of the cards in a Limited deck. At this end, it's too easy to mulligan until you find your Bloodline Keeper.
At left-hand end are the too-restrictive solutions, that interact poorly with Limited's reduced ability to mitigate mana screw or flood compared to Constructed (less efficient card draw and selection, frequently higher curves, fewer powerful cards that can enable a come-from-behind victory, less fixing, etc). At this end there are too many non-games due to bad luck, mainly mana problems.
Right now, I think we're solidly on the left-hand side of the spectrum. Not all the way over, of course, that would be "no mulligans", but I believe we currently get more trouble, on the whole, from left-side issues than right-side issues. I'm not at all concerned that this mulligan rule will make Limited too consistent; rather I think they should go a little further.
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4
Dire Wombat posted a message on New mulligan rule to be tested at Pro Tour Magic OriginsPosted in: Limited (Sealed, Draft) -
1
bateleur posted a message on [Limited] We'll miss you, Birthing Pod.Posted in: ClansQuote from LanxalIt has to be done in one turn, but it can be in multiple shots.
The one turn presumably being turn one?
So basically there's two approaches. Either you begin by playing City of Traitors, a Mox and a Black Lotus and then making infinite mana with Auriok Scavengers but the deck mustn't include a way to convert mana to damage or you set up some kind of finite but vast mana engine (probably involving mana echoes) and then X-spell the opponent.
The former sounds more promising to me. Using four cards for infinite mana (I'm assuming this is Vintage so I can't have two Black Lotus) and a 5th to draw my deck leaves me with 55 cards to deal damage. So, suppose I have Intruder Alarm, Fires of Yavimaya and Essence of the Wild in play and an Ancient Ooze enchanted with Elemental Mastery. Tapping the Ooze the first time gives six 6/6 tokens each of which triggers Intruder Alarm, untapping the Ooze six times. The Ooze also grows by 6 with each token because they're all CMC 6...
...but before we do that we might also want four copies of Doubling Season in play, four copies of Primal Vigor in play and four copies of Copy Enchantment copying Doubling Season. We also probably want three more Ancient Ooze each with its own Elemental Mastery. That's 22 of our 55 cards accounted for. An N/N Ooze becomes 24577N/24577N on activation and results in 16384 Ooze untaps. So for every other creature our deck can generate we increase the Ooze size by 24576^16384.
That's not very good. We can do much better. Suppose that instead of adding all those multiples of cards we just add one Doubling Season and an Opalesence. Then we'll have a copy of Shapesharer and a copy of Conspiracy. That's much better. Now each new token we make can be turned into a copy of Doubling Season instead of being a boring old Essence of the Wild. So and N/N Ooze makes N^X more Doubling Seasons and untaps N^X times, where X is the number of Doubling Seasons that were there before. Since N is roughly X, that means our pile of tokens is growing at the rate g(N), where g(N) means applying the function f(X) = X^X a total of N times starting from N.
But wait, we can play better! After a certain point each copy of Intruder Alarm achieves more than each copy of Doubling Season. I'm not 100% sure, but I think the point at which this becomes true is with only two Doubling Seasons in play. It's complicated because their CMC is different. But certainly you want no more than four Doubling Seasons. Now our pile of tokens grows at the rate more like h(N), which means applying g(N) N times (very roughly).
OK, so that's eight more cards, leaving 47 to play with. At this point our engine is so powerful that all we care about is looping the same engine more times. So, which eleven cards in Magic make the most creatures without going infinite?
* Nomads' Assembly, Parallel Evolution, Devout Invocation and Saproling Symbiosis are the obvious four, since each of those adds another layer of doubling to the engine.
* If we add one Dryad Arbor then Avenger of Zendikar, Howl of the Night Pack, Beacon of Creation, Ulasht, the Hate Seed, Waiting in the Weeds and Last Stand all make the cut.
* Elvish Promenade works because we can make almost everything into an Elf when it resolves.
OK, so that's 58 cards after adding Arbor and four copies of each of the others. The last two should, I think, be copies of Springjack Shepherd. Because Opalescence is White we can make it work a bit like Elvish Promenade by turning almost everything briefly into copies of Opalescence.
That's 60. Hope that helps. -
3
pierrebai posted a message on M15 will have 80 uncommons instead of 60Posted in: Limited (Sealed, Draft)Quote from Barfolomew
Basically, we'll see depending on what they populate in the additional slots.
And how do you plan to evaluate that?
The pessimist: (taking the 20 worst uncommons) "Wow, they really screwed it up by adding these twnety crappy cards to the set!"
The optimist: (taking the 20 best uncommons) "Wow, they made a great job adding these twenty cards! The set would have sucked without them!"
The weirdo: "Phew! Without these twenty additional uncommons there would have been no green uncommons!" -
1
pierrebai posted a message on Grading THS and recent draft formats.Personally, I've found that the holiday cube is an A+ for me. I don't know how well it would hold to play it for two months straights, but I really like the experience so far.Posted in: Limited (Sealed, Draft)
The main thing I like about it is, incidentally, something that set designers have avoided at all costs: a flat power line. Sure it's a very high line, but it's flatter than all other sets I've drafted. I find this reward good drafting and mostly good play. (I suppose MM was similar. I never played it.) Unlike something like Theros where your opponent can go 1-drop into ordeal and just win from that (or wingsteed, or... you know the picture.), you casn always draft enough power and enough answers in cube to deal with anything. (You can also draft a narrow deck that folds to some key cards, but I avoid those decks!) I've found my success rate and my rating has jumped up quite a bit and I enjoy the games more, even when I lose, because I never feel as helpless as in some set. I put this down to not having to draft and play irrelevant cards, and having a lot of good and powerful control and removal. Unlike recent sets. -
133
daygl0 posted a message on [[RTR]] Spoiler-rama
My full set list:
RtR Tokens:
#1 : Bird (1/1, Flying) W
#2 :
#3 :
#4 :
#5 :
#6 : Goblin (1/1) R
#7 : Centaur (3/3) G
#8 : Ooze (*/*) G
#9 : Rhino (4/4, Trample) G
#10 : Saproling (1/1) G
#11 : Wurm (5/5, Trample) G
#12 :
===============
RtR Proper:
White
#1 :
#2 : Armory Guard
#3 : Arrest
#4 : Avenging Arrow
#5 : Azorius Arrester
#6 : Azorius Justiciar
#7 : Bazaar Krovod
#8 : Concordia Pegasus
#9 : Ethereal Armor
#10 : Eyes in the Skies
#11 : Fencing Ace
#12 : Keening Apparition
#13 : Knightly Valor
#14 : Martial Law
#15 : Palisade Giant
#16 : Phantom General
#17 :
#18 : Rest in Peace
#19 : Rootborn Defenses
#20 : Security Blockade
#21 : Selesnya Sentry
#22 : Seller of Songbirds
#23 : Soul Tithe
#24 : Sphere of Safety
#25 : Sunspire Griffin
#26 : Swift Justice
#27 : Trained Caracal
#28 : Trostani's Judgment
Blue
#29 : Aquus Steed
#30 : Blustersquall
#31 : Cancel
#32 : Chronic Flooding
#33 :
#34 : Crosstown Courier
#35 :
#36 : Dispel
#37 : Doorkeeper
#38 : Downsize
#39 : Faerie Imposter
#40 : Hover Barrier
#41 : Inaction Injunction
#42 : Inspiration
#43 : Isperia's Skywatch
#44 :
#45 : Mizzium Skin
#46 : Paralyzing Grasp
#47 : Psychic Spiral
#48 : Runewing
#49 :
#50 : Skyline Predator
#51 : Soulsworn Spirit
#52 : Sphinx of the Chimes
#53 : Stealer of Secrets
#54 : Syncopate
#55 : Tower Drake
#56 : Voidwielder
Black
#57 : Assassin's Strike
#58 : Catacomb Slug
#59 : Cremate
#60 : Daggerdrome Imp
#61 : Dark Revenant
#62 : Dead Reveler
#63 :
#64 : Destroy the Evidence
#65 : Deviant Glee
#66 : Drainpipe Vermin
#67 : Grave Betrayal
#68 : Grim Roustabout
#69 : Launch Party
#70 : Mind Rot
#71 :
#72 : Ogre Jailbreaker
#73 :
#74 : Perilous Shadow
#75 : Sewer Shambler
#76 : Shrieking Affliction
#77 : Slum Reaper
#78 : Stab Wound
#79 : Tavern Swindler
#80 : Terrus Wurm
#81 : Thrill-Kill Assassin
#82 : Ultimate Price
#83 :
#84 : Zamikev Locust
Red
#85 : Annihilating Fire
#86 :
#87 : Batterhorn
#88 : Bellows Lizard
#89 : Bloodfray Giant
#90 : Chaos Imps
#91 : Cobblebrute
#92 : Dynacharge
#93 : Electrickery
#94 : Explosive Impact
#95 : Goblin Rally
#96 : Gore-House Chainwalker
#97 : Guild Feud
#98 : Guttersnipe
#99 : Lobber Crew
#100 : Minotaur Aggressor
#101 :
#102 : Pursuit of Flight
#103 : Pyroconvergence
#104 : Racecourse Fury
#105 : Splatter Thug
#106 :
#107 : Survey the Wreckage
#108 : Tenement Crasher
#109 : Traitorous Instinct
#110 :
#111 : Vandalblast
#112 : Viashino Racketeer
Green
#113 : Aerial Predation
#114 : Archweaver
#115 : Axebane Guardian
#116 : Axebane Stag
#117 : Brushstrider
#118 : Centaur's Herald
#119 : Chorus of Might
#120 : Deadbridge Goliath
#121 : Death's Presence
#122 : Drudge Beetle
#123 : Druid's Deliverance
#124 : Gatecreeper Vine
#125 : Giant Growth
#126 : Gobbling Ooze
#127 : Golgari Decoy
#128 : Horncaller's Chant
#129 : Korozda Monitor
#130 : Mana Bloom
#131 : Oak Street Innkeeper
#132 : Rubbleback Rhino
#133 : Savage Surge
#134 : Seek the Horizon
#135 : Slime Molding
#136 : Stonefare Crocodile
#137 : Towering Indrik
#138 : Urban Burgeoning
#139 : Wild Beastmaster
#140 :
Multicolor
#141 :
#142 : Archon of the Triumvirate
#143 :
#144 : Auger Spree
#145 :
#146 : Call of the Conclave
#147 : Carnival Hellsteed
#148 : Centaur Healer
#149 : Chemister's Trick
#150 :
#151 : Common Bond
#152 : Corpsejack Menace
#153 : Counterflux
#154 : Coursers' Accord
#155 :
#156 : Dramatic Rescue
#157 :
#158 : Dreg Mangler
#159 : Epic Experiment
#160 : Essence Backlash
#161 : Fall of the Gavel
#162 :
#163 : Goblin Electromancer
#164 :
#165 : Grisly Savage
#166 : Havoc Festival
#167 : Hellhole Flailer
#168 : Heroes' Reunion
#169 : Hussar Patrol
#170 : Hypersonic Dragon
#171 :
#172 : Izzet Charm
#173 : Izzet Staticaster
#174 :
#175 :
#176 : Korozda Guildmage
#177 :
#178 :
#179 :
#180 : Mercurial Chemister
#181 : New Prahv Guildmage
#182 : Nivix Guildmage
#183 :
#184 :
#185 : Rakdos Ragemutt
#186 :
#187 : Rakdos, Lord of Riots
#188 :
#189 : Righteous Authority
#190 : Risen Sanctuary
#191 : Rites of Reaping
#192 : Rix Maadi Guildmage
#193 : Search Warrant
#194 :
#195 : Skull Rend
#196 : Skymark Roc
#197 : Slaughter Games
#198 : Sluiceway Scorpion
#199 : Spawn of Rix Maadi
#200 :
#201 :
#202 : Teleportal
#203 : Thoughtflare
#204 : Treasure Find
#205 : Trestle Troll
#206 : Trostani, Selesnya's Voice
#207 : Vitu-Ghazi Guildmage
#208 :
#209 : Wayfaring Temple
Hybrids
#210 :
#211 : Blistercoil Weird
#212 : Cryptborn Horror
#213 : Deathrite Shaman
#214 :
#215 : Frostburn Weird
#216 : Golgari Longlegs
#217 : Growing Ranks
#218 :
#219 : Nivmagus Elemental
#220 : Rakdos Cackler
#221 : Rakdos Shred-Freak
#222 :
#223 : Sundering Growth
#224 : Vassal Soul
Artifacts
#225 :
#226 :
#227 : Civic Saber
#228 :
#229 : Golgari Keyrune
#230 : Izzet Keyrune
#231 :
#232 : Rakdos Keyrune
#233 : Selesnya Keyrune
#234 : Street Sweeper
#235 :
#236 :
Land
#237 : Azorius Guildgate
#238 : Blood Crypt
#239 : Golgari Guildgate
#240 : Grove of the Guardian
#241 :
#242 : Izzet Guildgate
#243 :
#244 : Rakdos Guildgate
#245 : Rogue's Passage
#246 : Selsenya Guildgate
#247 :
#248 :
#249 : Transguild Promenade
#250 : Plains
#251 : Plains
#252 : Plains
#253 : Plains
#254 : Plains
#255 : Island
#256 : Island
#257 : Island
#258 : Island
#259 : Island
#260 : Swamp
#261 : Swamp
#262 : Swamp
#263 : Swamp
#264 : Swamp
#265 : Mountain
#266 : Mountain
#267 : Mountain
#268 : Mountain
#269 : Mountain
#270 : Forest
#271 : Forest
#272 : Forest
#273 : Forest
#274 : Forest
Tokens
White
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/82bfd64a.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/3b3af9cd.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/af372323.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/55a8d77f.jpg
Blue
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/4b94d20f.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/b50827ec.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/7aae9a2a.jpg
Black
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/b017a3d8.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/4618fc16.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/79c7fdf0.jpg
Red
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/e70c011f.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/8adc55a3.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/eb5f4aa6.jpg
Green
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/fdeb9343.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/8822a4d9.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/a7df6d9c.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/608e1cf4.jpg
Gold
Blue+Red
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/b31f388d.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/42113d0f.jpg
Blue+White
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/1bf72ac6.jpg
Black+Red
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/21228abf.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/18144e27.jpg
Green+Black
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/befaa18e.jpg
Green+White
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/3294049e.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/1951333e.jpg
Hybrid
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/f2e9b79d.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/22dae032.jpg
Artifact
Non-Basic Land
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/68149bec.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/60f8e32b.jpg
Basic Land (DO I KNOW NO BOUNDS?)
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/32f9ea1e.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/8d299c1f.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/cc542e64.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/80db8918.jpg
http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r639/daygl0/38f93ea3.jpg
and thus concludes lkasgfkldhasf - To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
1
1
1
Worst pairs: BR - the most controlling color and the most aggressive color; and UG where there is actual zero synergy.
1
I lost g1 (finals of an 8-4) to Mastery of the Unseen, so I did some creative sideboarding... and it totally worked out.
1
I don't think your conclusion is correct here. Sene's predictions were made after the drafts - so he was judging the drafted decks. The three decks drafted in a certain seat might be weaker than those drafted in another seat - but that doesn't necessarily mean that seat was a priori worse. To check that, you'd have to analyze the null hypothesis.
Assume the seat does not influence the strength of the drafted deck. So essentially the 24 decks drafted are of a random relative strength. Sene then judges that strength by assigning 3, 2, 1 or 0 match wins to each deck. Then we add up the match wins per seat. For each seat, that means the odds of that seat being assigned a total of 0-9 wins are:
9 0.2%
8 1.8%
7 7.0%
6 16.4%
5 24.6%
4 24.6%
3 16.4%
2 7.0%
1 1.8%
0 0.2%
That means that on average, we'd expect (slightly less than) 4 of the 8 seats to have either 4 or 5 match wins, and 9% of seats to fall in both the 2- and the 7+ match wins group (so a bit less than 1 in 8). What we got now is 2 3 3 4 5 5 6 7. This looks slightly more skewed than the average, but not enough that I'd say it's a huge indication that the null hypothesis is invalid. (Of course, to formally prove it invalid, we'd have to run many more experiments - with just this one, we can't prove anything either way. That last statement is merely my interpretation of the numbers.)
Of course it's logical to assume that the seat has some influence on the resulting strength of the decks drafted there, but if anything, I'd say this experiment shows only a slight influence. Calculating the variance of the null hypothesis (1.23) versus the result we got (1.375) suggests this too.
I personally don't think you'll see much correlation with the precise seat. The behavior of your neighbours is at least as relevant, especially in this format. In simple non-gold formats it might be easier to predict decks based on seat, but here it's just too hard to predict which deck ends up where.
10
It's not even that I care about any of those cards or decks. It's just the completely wrong attitude to have. They should aim to not ban as long as it's possible, but they're just wielding the ban-hammer like a child waving a stick around and hitting whatever it hits. Dig Through Time, seriously? The card wasn't even played much. Let's just ban cards before they have a chance to even affect the format.
Well, I always thought 95% of the posts in the banlist thread were silly, but now, I don't know anymore. Suggestions like banning Kitchen Finks, Abrupt Decay or Gitaxian Probe aren't so ridiculous anymore. Anything is on the table, let's have another four months of the wildest speculation 'cause who knows what gets banned next.
1
Why does Krosan Grip (or Abrupt Decay) not cut it? Sure Sword is immune, but you kill Thopter Foundry.
Even besides that, between:
- the combo being quite slow (needs some mana to really start doing anything)
- there being playable (and played) answers in the format
- many decks being able to ignore it
- the combo not actually having a good shell ready for it
I don't see it breaking much.
What decks actually get hurt by this? Pod, Twin, etc can go over the top with infinite combo's. (Note that there are more combo decks / ways to go over the top in the format now then when ThopterSword was big.) The actual combo decks ignore it. Burn can race it, and will succumb if it can't, but that's just how burn goes. It probably hurts Delver, but that's kind of the point, and they still have plenty of ways to fight back, between racing, disrupting, and sideboarding cards like Izzet Staticaster. Junk plays Stony Silence and Scavenging Ooze. UWR has Stony Silence and Staticaster if it wants. Against Affinity it will eventually murder them, but the ThopterSword player will still need several pieces of interaction before the combo will be good enough.
I honestly think ThopterSword would maybe be a deck, and definitely not break anything. Is it really a better finisher for control than Scapeshift? I don't think so. I guess it would see more play than Bitterblossom, somewhere in the range of Wild Nacatl. AKA, harmless.
1
g2 He puts pressure with Heir of the Wilds and Awaken the Bear, while I unmorph a Pine Walker to kill his Archer's Parapet. Somewhat strangely, he decides to race - twice he attacks with Heir and then plays a Sultai Scavenger, but I have two Savage Punches to get rid of the Scavengers while getting ahead in the damage race. He is then forced into blocking mode and I draw a pair of Glacial Stalkers after we both empty our hands, which is enough to get there.
g3 T2 Rakshasa on the play. :-( I play Monastery Flock on t3 to slow him down, and my plan is to use Glacial Stalker + Savage Punch once he's tapped out. Unfortunately I miss on my fifth land. I use Crippling Chill to help me find it, but the draw + next draw step still whiff so I'm forced to use Sultai Charm to find the missing land. Next turn I play Sultai Soothsayer (seeing four lands now, which is actually good at this point, as it means I get to take the sixth land while getting rid of three more). I then play Riverwheel Aerialists, which meets Rite of the Serpent but that gives me the opening to punch the Deathdealer! I now have a hand full of gas while he's out of things, and I'm only being clocked by Archer's Parapet. I play the second Aerialists, which goes to town, punches left and right. My DTT chains into Treasure Cruise and I find more fatties to put on the board and then the game is ours soon!
Victory!
1
1
I get to start the first game, which is good cause my draw is slow. Luckily it turns out his deck produces a somewhat awkward start. I Crippling Chill his morph, he plays a Timely Hordemate and then his 2-drops show up in the form of a pair of Valley Dashers. I play a Hooded Hydra with x=4, which eats the Hordemate, gets Crater's Clawed and then trades some more, letting me stabilize. Dig Through Time finds an Aerialists, a pair of Savage Punches lets me clean up and kill him quickly.
In the second game he curves out with Valley Dasher into Mardu Hordechief into Timely Hordemate (bringing back the Dasher which traded with my morph) into more Valley Dasher and Monastery Swiftspear. I have a decent draw but get overrun.
The third game is a longer affair, I have Wetland Sambar to trade with a Valley Dasher, which eventually comes back due to Timely Hordemate. But we have about the same amount of creatures so I can stop the offense. He's forced to use Crater's Claws on Sagu Archer, but the board still stalls when my Sultai Flayer and Heir of the Wilds face off against Mardu Hordechief and 3 1/1 tokens, with both of us out of cards at around 14 life each. We play draw-go for a while, at some point my larger creatures show up. A Pine Walker and a massive Hooded Hydra soon reduce him to chump-block mode and once he runs out of chump-blockers, the game and the match go to the Durdle Turtles.