Am I the only person that thinks Mox Opal and SSG fit the ban criteria? I even like the decks these cards are part of but find them to hedge out literally 20+ decks that could find new footing with them gone.
And Death's Shadow is only doing well because people have broken a tutor. Color me surprised that a 1 mana tutor is broken in a format where you can turn it on without issue. Pair it with a deck that proactively strips other decks ability to play their game and you have a very consistent version of Jund. Shocking that Jund is good...
You can beat Jund as mentioned previously. It takes effort and people changing decks. Which is a HUGE expense in Modern so it doesn't happen without a ton of people fighting it.
Origins is honestly the best start point. Fetches need to go as does delve. I love Rabblemaster but the cleanest way to handle the format is to start at Origins.
My local shop does, for now. It's hitting 10-12 players a week. If it gets to 16-25 by the end of the month the store will run a win a box. If it doesn't it may be knocked back to a couple events a month.
Frontier holds the same market share in my area as Legacy and Commander. People have decks but there isn't a ton of players who are getting into it.
On the plus side, you could definitely see Preordain coming back one day. Now that probe is gone, Infect wouldn't become absolutely crazy nuts with probe and preordain in the same deck. It still probably won't happen, but it's a possibility.
I want Ponder back more than any other card in Modern.
I played the Ponder Preordain version of Modern Storm, which was my all time favorite version of storm.
Well, first off. While who created the deck isnt spam, because it still has to do with the deck... It diffidently derails the thread. But since everyones so stuck on it:
I used to hold modern cockatrice tournaments on this sub because back then modern wasnt all that popular. I remember in 2012, a user named "poopingmypants" ran a gifts version of storm. Looking back on it, heres a link:
Using my mod like powers, as far as I can tell this is the EARLIEST the words "gifts" and "storm" were said in the same post together. A guy named James Zornes was the first to use that tech. Feb, 2012 Grand Prix Detroit, top 16.
Here we go, even further back. Blippy was the first guy to really keep track of meta stuff in modern, back when it was the wild wild west. heres one of his articles: http://www.mtgoacademy.com/overdriven-54/
Storm, 2013, gifts, electromancer, pre seething song ban, 4-0ing a modern daily.
Credit where credits due, Lord Hazanko has been vouching for gifts version for a very long time. I think searching back on it, since he started his account in mtgsalvation, thats 5/12/13 But looking at dates, the MTGO 4-0 finish was 2/4/13, 4 months prior to that, Lectrys called the synergy 10 months prior, and the first gifts storm list that won a bigger event was a year prior.
While it might not seem like it, I am an OLLLLLLDDDDD mod here, and I have seen the birth of modern, and remember when cute tech turned into real, and when real tech was either banned, or got worse.
I think that settles it. Now, please move back on to the deck and not each other.
😬
I believe I won exactly one round with the deck. We had access to Seething Song back then and the cost reducers weren't yet printed.
Push seems to allow the deck to operate without the need of Bridge. I've never been a Bridge super fan and have been on the Smallpox cheer squad for 3 threads now.
So with that said I'm also loving the 4 GQ list as it helps with the toughest match up which is ramp, specifically Tron. Push helps against manlands and the deck has always been soft to the 2 Nexus lands. It's also nice to have an answer to Nacatyl early other than Smallpox.
I'm glad that Rob's baby is still alive. I may not post like I did when we were brewing the deck but I still like to see the deck as it evolves.
Dude, the Vehicles stay on the board and players can just hold a dude in hand. They'll cast a dude after you sweep the board and or bring back the Scrounger at the end step. Sweepers are not the answer to this deck, it wasn't least season either.
You run artifact removal for the vehicles. My point is that the deck can be hated out. However there isn't much left, variety wise, to use.
Let's just be honest and say that vehicles were a mistake. Just like Delve, Phyrexian mana, Dredge, Affinity, and so on.
Welcome to the New World Order that is full of garbage commons and uncommons to supposedly make draft better. Which is a joke. People are just too dumb to realized that WotC is using that to push all chase cards into Mythic so they sell packs.
The game is losing players at an alarming rate and the future sets dont look to be better as they were made by the same clowns that put the last set together.
I mean it may not be their fault as the plan was to go on a 18 month set cycle. I'm sure this messed up the development of sets. However we currently only have 6 sets so that's not really true.
Radiant Flames just mops the Mardu deck up. The lack on a good old 4 mana sweeper makes life tough.
The Mardu deck is just playing the best removal.UD kills both the Car and Saheeli in 1 card. RB control might be a thing. Possibly Grixis. Sadly I doubt it.
The lack of printed hate cards which hurt people's feelings are at the center of this recent Magic problem. When we have little to no way of actually dealing with a certain card type (planeswalkers) it makes entire deck choices invalid.
In the 23 years I've been playing Magic this is one of the most poorly designed block of sets ever. It's telling when I'd prefer to play Homelands based decks than put up with vehicles or energy. My sons are newer players and they find both to be incredibly strange. So your sets are poorly made, don't appeal to new or old players, and are low in monetary return due to the way the sets are made. Why would I buy a pack of cards for the past 2 sets? This is coming from a person who bought 2 boxes of Kamigawa. Which was a wonderful set to draft and left a great Standard to play.
Here's an idea, BRING BACK THE CORE SETS! This let's you print answers that don't mess with your precious 2 set drafts.
zzzz. so you and your sons don't like or understand current block? 10/10 anecdotal evidence, would draw conclusions out of this. Also, in case you actually didn't know this, people have been begging for WOTC to make standard cheaper. this will effect the EV of booster packs and there's just no way around it.
how the **** are you going to "hate" planeswalkers out? any removal spells like Dreadbore and Hero's Downfall are inherently bad because they STILL let you take value out of the walkers in question. furthermore, saying that planeswalkers are what make the game bad is just your opinion. there is nothing inherently bad about walkers. the only reason people play saheeli now is because of the combo with guardian.
but yeah, guess what the real hate cards for PWs are? Evasive cheap aggressive threats that are resilient to removal spells. if you can't see the paradigm we're discussing here then I can't help you. there is always going to be something "broken" in standard. the only meaningful point of discussion is how high we are going to set our bar of tolerance for one or two decks' metagame dominance before WOTC should take action.
I don't hate the current situation we're in, even though I'm a bit salty that my old deck got banned out of the format as a collateral damage, as the metagame back then was very "fine". of course things have to evolve from this point, and that's usually what happens. we get our new broken powerful decks and people move on to ***** and complain about other things. of course if jeskai saheeli keeps on this trajectory then we're certainly looking at a new ban.
You are aware you agreed with me? My point wasn't about having a couple removal spells. It's about the lack of cards that efficiently attack them.
My point is that we don't have, haven't had, a Rock Paper Scissors format in forever.
Set design is obviously poor as they has to ban 3 cards. This isn't the hallmark of quality design. And when people want cheaper standard they mean decks like little kid red.
You don't have to like what I say or my opinion. One of my longtime friends is a store owner. He has removed all but 1 standard event for February. He has replaced them with Frontier and Modern events. He's done this because standard events haven't had the 8 man minimums to run while a non sanction format(Frontier) has 20-25 players per event. Modern is up in the mid 50's and a huge earner for his store. The newer players, you know the future of Magic, are all starting with Frontier as it's cheaper and there are more decks to play with.
There might be hidden decks that the pros have waiting. I'm hoping so. But in my area standard is dead and the past 2 weeks aren't bringing it back.
I can understand situations like your friend's of Standard being seemingly dead. However I also think this situation is more a matter of location. There's a plethora of reasons of Standard not being popular and issues with the format itself are just a few. From what I've seen, Standard also tends to attract more competitive people and that also turns away more casual players. I'm sure if you look around your area you can find stores where Standard is very much alive but it'll likely be one with more serious players. Also Frontier is NOT necessarily cheaper to start with nor is it a format with fewer problems than Standard. However this is all a different topic entirely so let's move this discussion elsewhere if you want to continue.
More importantly, Standard is a format comprised of only the most recent sets, so of course there's going to be a limit on diversity. So then it shouldn't come as a surprise when Standard is dominated by a few select archetypes. I think an important thing to note here is that despite two decks dominating this and the last SCG, we're not seeing one card being present in 60% of decks, like Smuggler's Copter was.
My buddy's shop is the PPTQ size biggest in the area shop. He supplies smaller satellite stores with product. We aren't talking about a small store that recently opened either. He's had a store for close to 20 years. This is the first month he's pushed Standard out. Khans standard events fired at 60 people on average for the win a case events.
Sunday's mystery repack draft drew 49 people. The Modern win a box on Friday had 65 people. He has a hall that seats 150 people that we have filled for events.
I've been a part of every Standard. Everyone of them. This is around the same level as post 5th Dawn attendance. The bans were good but the damage is done. Kaladesh having another likely ban is not a good look. If your car had a recall it's not because they did something right. Basic economics tells you that bans severely damage consumer confidence.
The lack of printed hate cards which hurt people's feelings are at the center of this recent Magic problem. When we have little to no way of actually dealing with a certain card type (planeswalkers) it makes entire deck choices invalid.
In the 23 years I've been playing Magic this is one of the most poorly designed block of sets ever. It's telling when I'd prefer to play Homelands based decks than put up with vehicles or energy. My sons are newer players and they find both to be incredibly strange. So your sets are poorly made, don't appeal to new or old players, and are low in monetary return due to the way the sets are made. Why would I buy a pack of cards for the past 2 sets? This is coming from a person who bought 2 boxes of Kamigawa. Which was a wonderful set to draft and left a great Standard to play.
Here's an idea, BRING BACK THE CORE SETS! This let's you print answers that don't mess with your precious 2 set drafts.
zzzz. so you and your sons don't like or understand current block? 10/10 anecdotal evidence, would draw conclusions out of this. Also, in case you actually didn't know this, people have been begging for WOTC to make standard cheaper. this will effect the EV of booster packs and there's just no way around it.
how the **** are you going to "hate" planeswalkers out? any removal spells like Dreadbore and Hero's Downfall are inherently bad because they STILL let you take value out of the walkers in question. furthermore, saying that planeswalkers are what make the game bad is just your opinion. there is nothing inherently bad about walkers. the only reason people play saheeli now is because of the combo with guardian.
but yeah, guess what the real hate cards for PWs are? Evasive cheap aggressive threats that are resilient to removal spells. if you can't see the paradigm we're discussing here then I can't help you. there is always going to be something "broken" in standard. the only meaningful point of discussion is how high we are going to set our bar of tolerance for one or two decks' metagame dominance before WOTC should take action.
I don't hate the current situation we're in, even though I'm a bit salty that my old deck got banned out of the format as a collateral damage, as the metagame back then was very "fine". of course things have to evolve from this point, and that's usually what happens. we get our new broken powerful decks and people move on to ***** and complain about other things. of course if jeskai saheeli keeps on this trajectory then we're certainly looking at a new ban.
You are aware you agreed with me? My point wasn't about having a couple removal spells. It's about the lack of cards that efficiently attack them.
My point is that we don't have, haven't had, a Rock Paper Scissors format in forever.
Set design is obviously poor as they has to ban 3 cards. This isn't the hallmark of quality design. And when people want cheaper standard they mean decks like little kid red.
You don't have to like what I say or my opinion. One of my longtime friends is a store owner. He has removed all but 1 standard event for February. He has replaced them with Frontier and Modern events. He's done this because standard events haven't had the 8 man minimums to run while a non sanction format(Frontier) has 20-25 players per event. Modern is up in the mid 50's and a huge earner for his store. The newer players, you know the future of Magic, are all starting with Frontier as it's cheaper and there are more decks to play with.
There might be hidden decks that the pros have waiting. I'm hoping so. But in my area standard is dead and the past 2 weeks aren't bringing it back.
The lack of printed hate cards which hurt people's feelings are at the center of this recent Magic problem. When we have little to no way of actually dealing with a certain card type (planeswalkers) it makes entire deck choices invalid.
In the 23 years I've been playing Magic this is one of the most poorly designed block of sets ever. It's telling when I'd prefer to play Homelands based decks than put up with vehicles or energy. My sons are newer players and they find both to be incredibly strange. So your sets are poorly made, don't appeal to new or old players, and are low in monetary return due to the way the sets are made. Why would I buy a pack of cards for the past 2 sets? This is coming from a person who bought 2 boxes of Kamigawa. Which was a wonderful set to draft and left a great Standard to play.
Here's an idea, BRING BACK THE CORE SETS! This let's you print answers that don't mess with your precious 2 set drafts.
And Death's Shadow is only doing well because people have broken a tutor. Color me surprised that a 1 mana tutor is broken in a format where you can turn it on without issue. Pair it with a deck that proactively strips other decks ability to play their game and you have a very consistent version of Jund. Shocking that Jund is good...
You can beat Jund as mentioned previously. It takes effort and people changing decks. Which is a HUGE expense in Modern so it doesn't happen without a ton of people fighting it.
Frontier holds the same market share in my area as Legacy and Commander. People have decks but there isn't a ton of players who are getting into it.
I played the Ponder Preordain version of Modern Storm, which was my all time favorite version of storm.
😬
I believe I won exactly one round with the deck. We had access to Seething Song back then and the cost reducers weren't yet printed.
I would love to have Seething Song back.
Thanks Lantern!
So with that said I'm also loving the 4 GQ list as it helps with the toughest match up which is ramp, specifically Tron. Push helps against manlands and the deck has always been soft to the 2 Nexus lands. It's also nice to have an answer to Nacatyl early other than Smallpox.
I'm glad that Rob's baby is still alive. I may not post like I did when we were brewing the deck but I still like to see the deck as it evolves.
You run artifact removal for the vehicles. My point is that the deck can be hated out. However there isn't much left, variety wise, to use.
Let's just be honest and say that vehicles were a mistake. Just like Delve, Phyrexian mana, Dredge, Affinity, and so on.
Welcome to the New World Order that is full of garbage commons and uncommons to supposedly make draft better. Which is a joke. People are just too dumb to realized that WotC is using that to push all chase cards into Mythic so they sell packs.
The game is losing players at an alarming rate and the future sets dont look to be better as they were made by the same clowns that put the last set together.
I mean it may not be their fault as the plan was to go on a 18 month set cycle. I'm sure this messed up the development of sets. However we currently only have 6 sets so that's not really true.
The Mardu deck is just playing the best removal.UD kills both the Car and Saheeli in 1 card. RB control might be a thing. Possibly Grixis. Sadly I doubt it.
Though Walking Balista is pricey.
My buddy's shop is the PPTQ size biggest in the area shop. He supplies smaller satellite stores with product. We aren't talking about a small store that recently opened either. He's had a store for close to 20 years. This is the first month he's pushed Standard out. Khans standard events fired at 60 people on average for the win a case events.
Sunday's mystery repack draft drew 49 people. The Modern win a box on Friday had 65 people. He has a hall that seats 150 people that we have filled for events.
I've been a part of every Standard. Everyone of them. This is around the same level as post 5th Dawn attendance. The bans were good but the damage is done. Kaladesh having another likely ban is not a good look. If your car had a recall it's not because they did something right. Basic economics tells you that bans severely damage consumer confidence.
You are aware you agreed with me? My point wasn't about having a couple removal spells. It's about the lack of cards that efficiently attack them.
My point is that we don't have, haven't had, a Rock Paper Scissors format in forever.
Set design is obviously poor as they has to ban 3 cards. This isn't the hallmark of quality design. And when people want cheaper standard they mean decks like little kid red.
You don't have to like what I say or my opinion. One of my longtime friends is a store owner. He has removed all but 1 standard event for February. He has replaced them with Frontier and Modern events. He's done this because standard events haven't had the 8 man minimums to run while a non sanction format(Frontier) has 20-25 players per event. Modern is up in the mid 50's and a huge earner for his store. The newer players, you know the future of Magic, are all starting with Frontier as it's cheaper and there are more decks to play with.
There might be hidden decks that the pros have waiting. I'm hoping so. But in my area standard is dead and the past 2 weeks aren't bringing it back.
In the 23 years I've been playing Magic this is one of the most poorly designed block of sets ever. It's telling when I'd prefer to play Homelands based decks than put up with vehicles or energy. My sons are newer players and they find both to be incredibly strange. So your sets are poorly made, don't appeal to new or old players, and are low in monetary return due to the way the sets are made. Why would I buy a pack of cards for the past 2 sets? This is coming from a person who bought 2 boxes of Kamigawa. Which was a wonderful set to draft and left a great Standard to play.
Here's an idea, BRING BACK THE CORE SETS! This let's you print answers that don't mess with your precious 2 set drafts.