ed2: I'd also also like to extend the customary "comments on my play" question. Shalako had a lot to say about how scummy I was, so I clearly was raising some alarm bells there...
Lemme check my Notes:
1. Not using the information gained players Deaths.
That was the biggest one for me. It was like you were just trying to lynch people who you had preconceived notions about.
The Fluff posting and asking questions that had just been asked also sent up red flags.
Shalako, I would like to know why you think Meg was a stupid/bad kill for us?
Wait did you guys Kill Meg and Nyx Tried to Kill Tordeck?
Wtf.
You came out firing that Tordeck was the obvious Mafia NK (which you prevented) and Meg had to have been a Vig kill. Why?
Razor.
As a final note, I had a chance to hammer Nyxu for the likely win in MyLo, but I've seen enough Scum teams lose a game they had won because they jumped the gun and started gloating too early. So I called for a vote count and delayed my vote just as a good Townie should do. And I did it just in case there was some unknown factor that could still stop us.
I had a one-shot Self Protect that I used on the Last night hoping that you would try to kill me.
I think one of the things that helped doom you was Shalako's conviction that Meg was a Vig kill and the attempt on Tordeck was a Scum attempt. I don't think he ever re-thought that position once you claimed. Had he stopped and thought about it, he might have realized he was being too narrow minded.
That doesn't matter.
I knew there was a Vig anyways and would have backed Nxu the same way I backed Tordeck if I had gotten to Post.
If that had happened, I was prepared to claim Peeta with an ability I didn't want to divulge.
I think in this meta that would just have gotten you killed.
To be honest though, as soon as you claimed 1-shot Vig, Town should immediately have gone for a No Lynch. But nobody except me apparently considered that and I wasn't about to suggest it.
Ahylis, you definitely deserve the MVP you played a solid game and came across townie for it all.
Nyxu, you played scummily and got lynched. It sucks that it happened and caused us to lose. But step up and accept that you had a part in this loss instead of blaming everyone else.
He's right to be upset.
He was town and an unCC'd Power Role.
And for the Second time this game sloppy Town play by not asking for a CC.
Basic setup AFAIK is 3 Town Power 1 Scum Power. We’ve lost one Town Power. I could be wrong.
And %95 that Scum Power Role is a What?
And what has there been no evidence of there being in this game at all?
You seem to have quite a bit of knowledge as to who was vig’d and who was Mafia Killed. How do we know that it wasn’t the other way around?
Because Megs would just be the worst NK ever. And Razor says that the guy who was so NK once is the likely NK again.
Because the plural of “you” is so much better in this case.
It's a classic Scum Entrenchment Technic.
You know what’s really suspicious? You fabricating a quote from me- despite quoting this same post twice before. For reference:
Yeah it was due to the new fangled Quote Nesting. I meant Ahly.
Quote from AnotherQuoteMangledduet NestingasanExampletoNyx »
How are you confirmed town?
.
Quote from GodIhatetheNestingQuotes »
Why are you ignoring that Boy D8 was a VT? He’s saying that the squares are rectangles. You are arguing that he’s wrong because you have a rectangle that is not a square.[quote]
Do I need to point out how The Scientific Method works to you?
[QUOTE=Nyxu;/comments/10849891]
No Kill or Protective.
No Kill Night One is ridiculousness.
Bad question. You haven't been CC'd yet. This does not mean you will not.
You didn't even consider asking for a CC because You knew I wouldn't be CC'd.
Why did you factually misrep me in a quote?
Mistake due to Nesting.
Why do you believe your circular logic is valid?
Why do I believe that the Man I protected TWICE from the Night Kill is Confirmed Town?
How do you know the target of Scum vs the target of Vigilante?
Shalako, Tordeck; neither of you have presented a good case against me. I welcome healthy suspicion but wasting time on fruitless attempts to mislynch doesn't bode well for anyone. For today at least, consider another suspect unless you can actually build a case.
Given your claim of doc and the assertion of there being a vig I suggest we go ahead with a mass claim; I doubt town pr #3 is going to be a bigger target to scum than a doctor if your claim is to be believed
Well... you're trying to lynch an unCC'd doc for one. And you're trying to draw out any other PR that hasn't already claimed. And that's just in this post.
Given the lack of a nightkill N1, and no one claiming RBer or anything, Shal's claim is certainly to be beleived. No reason not to.
So, claim now please.
Will you vote him now since he refused to claim like he said he would after your post?
Well. this certainly throws a wrinkle into things. Shalako's claim, coming as it does in MyLo, isn't as believable as it would have been earlier.
Why would I have outed myself earlier?
Why would I have outed myself if neither Tordeck or Myself were Under suspicion?
I still think one of Nyxu or Tordeck is Scum. Shalako's claim could just as easily be a gambit to try to save Tordeck and win the game for Scum as it could be honest and trying to save Tordeck and win the game for Town.
Why don't you ask for a CC list instead of slinging mud on the Two Confirmed Towns?
Perhaps. Or perhaps something else stopped the NK on Night 1 and you're just trying to use it for benefit of your claim now.
What.
What could have stopped the NK on Night One besides the Town Doctor.
I could easily see a gambit from Scum to no kill on Night 1 so they would have something convenient to use on a later date if they needed it. I'm not saying that's more likely than what you are claiming, but I am saying it is possible.
That's incredibly more unlikely then the Doctor Protecting.
As for last night, I see no "proof" there is a second kill. I see nothing that proves you stopped a kill while a heretofore unknown second kill suddenly got used.
Well, you are going to look dumb when the Vig shows up later.
Quote from Ahyl »
I'm willing at this point to say either Nyxu is Scum or both you AND Tordeck are. IF you are telling the truth, then it is a solid point against Nyxu. but I'm nowhere near convinced you are telling the truth and not pulling a gambit in MyLo to try to win for Scum.
UNCOUNTER CLAIMED DOCTOR
WHO STOPPED TWO KILLS
BUT WHATEVER
Slight modgaming, but one I'm fully comfortable with. Peeta and Thresh are very likely in the game, and if they are, they are much more likely to be the power roles than they are to be Vanilla and some random tributes be the power roles.
Nothing. What part of Rue was generic to you?
That's not how this works.
You have a Theory. Due to the Facts that have come to light it has been disproved.
Therefor the Theory must be abandoned.
The problem with that is, I'm still uncertain which side I believe more.
It's amazing the lengths you've gone to cast doubt on Tordeck and Myself.
Do you see a vote? An FoS? Misrep me more please. He's claimed doc and at the time nobody had been around to cc. His post is full of bad circular logic but the claim and reasonings behind it leave doubt. I can't be sure if he's scum or doc and playing bad that post. We cannot confirm people town without flips because that is how this game works. We can believe claims if evidence holds. There is no damning cc to lynch shalako on. Just bad logic.
Part of his claim is we have a vig or something. Claimed doc probably dies before claimed vig. Mass claim can't hurt us more than shalako claiming doc.
Doctor.
Protected Target from NK.
Bad Circular logic.
PART THE FIRST: We are not at LYLO, it is currently MYLO. There are two remaining scum, four remaining town. By my understanding of the game, there's three living power roles and one of them is scum.
Please explain how you came to the conclusion that there are 3 Living Power Roles and One of Them is Scum?
SHALAKO The person you were gunning for as scummy was town. This reflects poorly on you. What is your response to this flip?
He was so Scummy he was Vig'd. That's my response to his flip.
This game is entirely in the hands of the Town. If we do not have absolute certainty of a correct lynch, we must not make it
Tordeck jumps immediately to the forefront for me. He recognizes we're in a mylo/lylo situation, yet he comes out of the gate firing at Nyxu without providing any case to go with it. And while Meg died Town, that doesn't mean he was right about Nyxu. On the other hand, I don't like Nyxu's insinuation that Town is in good shape right now.
Why do you feel this way tordeck?
What's the last game we played in? CC, Math Mafia or TF2?
Arithmetic Mafia game was a Game I knew Tordeck was not In.
I was the Doctor:cool2:
Also way to take a Stance.
At this early stage of the day, I'm thinking we need to lynch either Nyxu or Tordeck IF (and only IF) we decide not to go the No Lynch route. I'm not saying I wouldn't consider lynching anyone else if someone can come up with a good case. I'm just saying that I think one of Tordeck or Nyxu is scum. Right now I'm leaning more towards Tordeck than Nyxu.
We've had no indications that there is a second killing role in the game, and if we DO have a 1-shot Vig or something,
I thought a lot about if I should draw attention to this or not.
But considering this game needs a Kick in the Pants I'm going to.
There IS a second Killing Role in this game. The Fact that Nyxu just happens to mention this after Last Night The Scum Found out there is one is suspicious as hell.
Mafia can easily hide in generic VT claims with little risk of being counterclaimed. And that's assuming they weren't provided with fake claims to begin with. But more importantly, the only "power" role revealed so far is a 1-shot Neighborizer. A mass claim is more likely to help Scum kill power roles than it is to help Town catch Scum.
Just my opinion though. If the group consensus is to mass claim, I'll go along with it.
Why do you assume that The Generic people are the VT?
@Everyone There are three outcomes to this day under the assumption that my count is correct:
LYNCH SCUM: Scum NK, we move on to 3 Town, 1 Scum. MYLO continues.
LYNCH TOWN: Scum NK, 2 Town, 2 Scum. Scum Wins.
NO LYNCH: Scum NK, we move on to 3 Town, 2 Scum. LYLO.
This game is entirely in the hands of the Town. If we do not have absolute certainty of a correct lynch, we must not make it
This math looks good to me. Also I agree with the last part.
Re: massclaim: It really depends on the confidence of the lynch today. If we're ABSOLUTELY sure we're lynching scum, then it can wait a day. If not, we need to do it now to help with the elimination process.
Jesus Christ provide some ****ing Content for Once.
We have 6 people still alive and presumably 2 scum among them. What happens when we massclaim and reveal who Katniss, Peeta and Thresh are to the Mafia? Although I suspect Katniss may not actually be in the game since the Mod seems to be playing the part of Katniss in the day/night flavor posts. Still, we'll tell the Mafia who Peeta and Thresh are while the remaining Mafia hide among the 4 generic claims we'll almost certainly get.
I'm gonna keep my Name under my Hat because it's not needed info.
We may even be pushing Town to lie in order to protect their role. Something to think about. (Yes, I am assuming our power roles will be among the named characters and not among the generic roles. That's the norm that I've seen from past games with flavor that had a few well known roles. Those roles are almost always the power roles. But I admit that's a bit of modgaming on my part.)
So again why are you ignoring that FoxFace was a VT?
Quote from kill-joy »
Normally a massclaim would be fine at this stage, if we had all powerroles revealed, or we the remaining suspected power roles have lost their usefulness. Only flip we've had today is a 1shot friendly neighbor. From a logical perspective, there's at least one more out there, and we don't even know what categlory it falls under (Protective, Investigative, etc), though we can assume from n1 there could be a doc or a roleblocker, due to the fact that there was no kill. I'm not willing to reveal either of those just yet.
Gaming the setup is a bad idea. We can't say for sure that any of those people are power roles. We aren't even sure that they're being used in the setup.
That said, your point is essentially the same as mine, in that we don't want to reveal too much info to the scum at this time.
So, yea. No massclaim right now.
What a Load of non-scum hunting and attempting to skate under the Radar.
Unknown. Curse turtled up, Hannes is MIA. Would you buy a forum with a seething community already throwing rocks? No, you wouldn't. Likely we've all pissed the bed enough that it can be seen from orbit; you'd have to be crazy to buy in now.
What was the state of the community when they first offered to buy the Site;)
Hmm, maybe it was just someone speculating about it then. Around 2009 I think. I remember it was quite a surprise to me that it could be done and was the first thing that I thought of when I saw the suggestion.
"It's been done before, but it really isn't appropriate here."
I thought.
Oh well, whatever. I was just trying to point out it wasn't an original idea is all.
It came out in the Gloves Thread that there were members on this site who were included in the "Bad User" Group who would be randomly signed out and other such Nonsense.
Rin~(?) Denied knowing how anyone was included into that group and claimed that the "Bad User" Group was wiped.
The fact that I thought Nxy was being a jerk leads me to relize that I have a gut town read on him because otherwise I would have called him out for mudsligging instead of just being a jerk.
Why did you kill the Un'cc'd Proven Vig Tordeck?
What made you decide to go with 3 Goons A.I.?
Well Played Mafia.
Me using Az/Seppel's "Suspect the Experienced player who is still alive nearing Endgame.
Yeah I have no idea how I'm going to tell if Ahlyis is Town from now on
Lemme check my Notes:
1. Not using the information gained players Deaths.
That was the biggest one for me. It was like you were just trying to lynch people who you had preconceived notions about.
The Fluff posting and asking questions that had just been asked also sent up red flags.
I think this is the Best way to play Mafia.
Wait did you guys Kill Meg and Nyx Tried to Kill Tordeck?
Wtf.
Razor.
I had a one-shot Self Protect that I used on the Last night hoping that you would try to kill me.
It's a large part of why I claimed for no reason.
That doesn't matter.
I knew there was a Vig anyways and would have backed Nxu the same way I backed Tordeck if I had gotten to Post.
I think in this meta that would just have gotten you killed.
Why no lynch?
Well sure if you flavor game
He's right to be upset.
He was town and an unCC'd Power Role.
And for the Second time this game sloppy Town play by not asking for a CC.
And %95 that Scum Power Role is a What?
And what has there been no evidence of there being in this game at all?
Because Megs would just be the worst NK ever. And Razor says that the guy who was so NK once is the likely NK again.
It's a classic Scum Entrenchment Technic.
Yeah it was due to the new fangled Quote Nesting. I meant Ahly.
.
No Kill Night One is ridiculousness.
You didn't even consider asking for a CC because You knew I wouldn't be CC'd.
Mistake due to Nesting.
Why do I believe that the Man I protected TWICE from the Night Kill is Confirmed Town?
I'll answer this question at a later time.
Don't try and flail onto another wagon.
Belated Well Wishes for Tordeck
Will you vote him now since he refused to claim like he said he would after your post?
Why would I have outed myself earlier?
Why would I have outed myself if neither Tordeck or Myself were Under suspicion?
Why don't you ask for a CC list instead of slinging mud on the Two Confirmed Towns?
What.
What could have stopped the NK on Night One besides the Town Doctor.
That's incredibly more unlikely then the Doctor Protecting.
Well, you are going to look dumb when the Vig shows up later.
UNCOUNTER CLAIMED DOCTOR
WHO STOPPED TWO KILLS
BUT WHATEVER
That's not how this works.
You have a Theory. Due to the Facts that have come to light it has been disproved.
Therefor the Theory must be abandoned.
It's amazing the lengths you've gone to cast doubt on Tordeck and Myself.
Doctor.
Protected Target from NK.
Bad Circular logic.
Stop stalling and Claim like KJ asked you.
Why am I not going to be counterclaimed?
Why did you complain that Tordeck just won't die after I saved his ass for a Second Time?
Don't throw out blind votes Bro.
Because Tordeck is Confirmed TOWN
He was Protected Night One From The Night Kill and AGAIN on Night Four.
Please explain how you came to the conclusion that there are 3 Living Power Roles and One of Them is Scum?
He was so Scummy he was Vig'd. That's my response to his flip.
"We" "We"
Tordeck is Confirmed Town.
I breadcrumbed this in here:
Arithmetic Mafia game was a Game I knew Tordeck was not In.
I was the Doctor:cool2:
Also way to take a Stance.
Nope.
What do you think of KillJoy?
I thought a lot about if I should draw attention to this or not.
But considering this game needs a Kick in the Pants I'm going to.
There IS a second Killing Role in this game. The Fact that Nyxu just happens to mention this after Last Night The Scum Found out there is one is suspicious as hell.
Why do you assume that The Generic people are the VT?
What part of FoxFace is generic to You?
Jesus Christ provide some ****ing Content for Once.
Yeah I'm confirmed Town And that wasn't a Slip.
To bad you don't care enough to read and are instead are pushing for whatever Lynch you can get.
Did you not read Tordeck's posts at the end of the Last Day?
Of course I have SUSPECTS.
Jesus what a ridiculous question... Sorry That was a Bit Harsh.
Yes I have a Town/Scum list. I haven't provided one this game for obvious reasons.
Already been over the First part.
Nis doesn't have a Case. He's flailing for anything he can get.
I'm gonna keep my Name under my Hat because it's not needed info.
So again why are you ignoring that FoxFace was a VT?
What a Load of non-scum hunting and attempting to skate under the Radar.
FOS:KJ
(Gratz on 14,000)
What was the state of the community when they first offered to buy the Site;)
The Curse Head Honcho and The Liaison that Nai refers to.
Please.
It came out in the Gloves Thread that there were members on this site who were included in the "Bad User" Group who would be randomly signed out and other such Nonsense.
Rin~(?) Denied knowing how anyone was included into that group and claimed that the "Bad User" Group was wiped.
The fact that I thought Nxy was being a jerk leads me to relize that I have a gut town read on him because otherwise I would have called him out for mudsligging instead of just being a jerk.
The HORROR