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  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    The original "Industry Counters" were inspired by Liquid Metal Coating from SoM. They worked well in the original set, but had problems with memory issues. Given those problems, I'd like to stray away from the use of "depletion" counters and stick with Auras, if possible.

    Edit: P.S. Would it be possible to get some of the newer suggested cards over on the multiverse set? I think we can hash out a lot of the overall issues with a more succinct discussion format. Mtgs is awesome for overall set development but is lacking when it comes to individual cards and concepts.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    I feel like the only reason why Grimlins were black in Antiquities and NPH was because they occupied the same set as Goblins and had to be distinctive.

    The traditional antics of Grimlins fall into two categories:

    1) Mischievous annoyance and chaos (red)
    &
    2) Malicious destruction and a masochistic streak (black)

    Which color they belong in depends on which version we want to go with.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    I think white is in a good spot, I'd be fine with moving on to black. I just brought up tokens because it seemed relevant to the discussion moving forward.

    On that note, I like to see Gremlins Tokens make an appearance even if nothing else does, whether they should be Red or black is another discussion, but the flavor is pretty perfect for Grimlins in the set.

    I'm ok with Thopters in R/W mana and possibly U, while Grimlins settle into B (though I'd prefer Grimlins in red mana I'm not married to it.) I'm not sure about what green should have. My gut says something like 3/3 Artifact Beast tokens would work but that might be a little too good with windup. Idk, we'll have to think about it a bit.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    I've only just realized we have a startling lack of Token Generators (besides the Thopters.) Anyone have an idea of what tokens we might want? We have quite a few kinds in the old archester, (Gremlins in particular stand out as something we might be interested in.)

    Edit: Just realized tokens will be awesome with Exploit, Upgrade, and Windup (if they're artifact tokens) too. We definitely need more tokens.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    I went to the Oath prerelease and had Cohort.deck (no colorless costs but plenty of producers too.) Where cohort really shined was in small Incremental advantages over the course of a few turns. MVPs include (in no particular order) Vampire Envoy, Ondu War Cleric, Spawnbinder Mage, Munda's Vanguard, and Drana's Chosen. I had more Colorless Mana producers than I needed (6 total, only ran 4 all of them as color fixers; no Wastes Frown )

    Where Cohort was it's best was when it was used at the Opponent's EoT. Most of them weren't very aggressive to start with but that changed after a couple of support cards (which bodes well for our Windup stuff as they are combinations of the two abilities.) I never lost a game if I untapped with Drana's Chosen, Munda's Vanguard never lived to untap and Ondu War Cleric/Vampire Envoy are one hell of a life gain combo.

    Overall, If the Cohort abilities had been Sorcery speed, I'd have been screwed. It was hard enough stabIlizing when I had things to defend myself with, if I'd needed to tap them on my turn I wouldn't have gotten past the 3rd round.

    As far as Colorless Mana , I saw a lot of people splashing it but only a few running a lot of it. Splashing seemed relatively easy given the fixers and Wastes (almost all of the wastes were 1-ofs, I didn't see anyone who opened more than 1, which seems a little odd for a double common)

    Overall, Oath made me excited for both its draft format and Archester. I'm looking forward to playing with both.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    I'm ok with switching to SP.2, I would just prefer that we don't have any that require just a single Colorless Mana at common. The commons should need at least Colorless Mana Colorless Mana + if for no other reason than to differentiate them from oath's commons.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    I believe Moon-e was referring to something like this...

    Crazied Frontiersman 1R
    Creature - Human [C]
    Exploit (reminder text)
    ~ may exploit a land as though it were a creature.
    When ~ exploits a creature, add RRR to your mana pool.
    He'll throw anything on his campfire.
    2/1

    What's the point of using exploit as a jumping off point if we just throw it out in favor of a strictly better mechanic?
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    Quote from MOON-E »
    Modification - Modify?
    ...
    Some structural questions:
    - Now that steampowered is not attached to two-brids, should we drop the number from 5 per color to 4?
    - Should we have any two-brid steampowered cards at common?


    I'm ok with Modification/Modify.

    The reason I don't really like SP.2 is that, when Steampowered can be as little as a single :symc:, those SP cards operate in a very similar design space to the kozilek brood Eldrazi do in Oath (eg. you can splash for Colorless Mana without having to fully commit). Yes, you might get a little more value if you have more but you don't have as much incentive to go all-in like you did with SP.0. I'm not saying we can't do SP.2, but I believe the commmon SP cards should have to require multiple Colorless Mana to be effective and we should leave the ones that can be only lightly splashed up in the higher rarities. That'll help distinguish Archester from Oath.

    As to the number of twobrids and their commonality with regards to SP, 5 is probably fine since it will allow us a little design space to work with and I believe that the SP twobrid commons should be limited to U/R mana to encourage that archetype's deck.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    Hello all,

    On the topic of SP:

    I feel like SP.0 is still the best of the three suggestions even if it does eat up our Twobrid cards. SP.0 is splashy, grokable, and, most importantly, simple. The variable cost of SP.1 adds substantial complexity to an already complicated set and SP.2 falls a little to close to Oath's C for my tastes.

    On Trash:

    It's current wording works well with the set, it interacts well with Exploit and artifact creatures and it's quite a bit more flavorful as it is over tarmo-Trash (how would and instant or sorcery windup as trash?)

    On Windup:

    I was particularly impressed with Cohort during the Oath Prerelease and I believe Windup has the same potential for awesomeness. I'd like to keep it in its current form and perhaps add some Artifacts (and possibly Artifact Creatures) that generate small effects when they are tapped (similar to Vampire Envoy from Oath) to increase the incentive to use windup rather than simply being aggressive since windup is weaker than Cohort since its restricted not only to artifact creatures (of which there will no doubt be plenty, but it is still a restriction) and at sorcery speeds.

    On Exploit:

    I love the idea of adding a rider to some of the exploit cards to let them sac lands. I think they should be in black though, not red since, while it makes sense in the shortsighted thinking of red, the Depletion/lands in graveyard sub-theme in (U/B) would work better mechanically. Who knows maybe it would be interesting in both colors.

    On Upgrade:

    While I agree the disconnect between Upgrade and Component is a little jarring, I think we're sort of stuck. Component is and awesome name for these artifacts, because that's exactly what the Components you assemble (I'm sad that assemble is already linked to Contraption, it'd have fit really well) to create a larger machine. Most of the words that mean what we want simply don't work for one reason or another and we've sort of been left with choosing between less than optimal words. Aside from the word names, we don't have to worry Components. They are going to be awesome, we just haven't worked on them much because they're at the end of the commons. Their day in the sun is coming.

    Tl;Dr:
    Steampower: #SP.0FTW
    Trash: awesome as it is.
    Windup: Semi-Cohort = Awesome
    Exploit: sounds great
    Component/Upgrade: Words not ideal but we're limited in options for good names.

    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    Quote from MOON-E »
    Quote from Raptor1210 »
    In reference to how many cards produce colorless mana in the old archester, I'll point you towards OGW. It has ~16 sources and its accounting for things only having to cost a single colorless mana. If anything I think we might have been low in the old archester, not high.
    The difference is the quality of the fixers, not the volume. OGW has lots of C fixers, but all of them produce a single C. This makes it play like a sixth color that you have to splash for. In Archester, we had slightly fewer fixers but many of them tapped for multiple C. We had a land cycle that tapped for CC, and even cards that filtered 1 into C. This meant that you had to more specifically draft the archetype, but when you did you had access to costs like Cx5 or Cx6 much more easily.


    True, I was simply pointing out that the concentration of C wasn't as high as it seemed, especially taking the fact that it's a large set rather than a small set into consideration.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    In reference to how many cards produce colorless mana in the old archester, I'll point you towards OGW. It has ~16 sources and its accounting for things only having to cost a single colorless mana. If anything I think we might have been low in the old archester, not high.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    Slightly off-topic but something that needs to be brought up...


    What are our thoughts on "Wastes"?

    Should we include it in the set? It would substaintially improve Steampowered and our other colorless mana matters cards.

    Would it bring us too close to OGW & BFZ?
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    I feel like "Clock In" would be more interesting as a Sorcery, given the precedent in "Rush of Battle". Also making it a sorcery would allow it to interact with Wind Up in interesting ways. Not to mention, it's a little strong if it's a combat trick.

    I love your reworked version of "Sheriff's Warning", it fits the flavor perfectly and doesn't have the same wonky wording of the original. Good job.

    Overall I think the white commons are awesome.
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    Quote from grimGrendel »
    MOON-E expressed the desire to start working on all the colors, that's why I submitted a U batch of non-creature spells


    Must have missed that, I'll start thinking about various colors then. Grin
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
  • posted a message on The Archester Revival Thread! (Steampunk Set)
    Hello all. Sorry for my absence, it's been a crazy couple of months but now I'm back. Grin

    Like many of you, I'm excited about the potential ✧ has in the set. I agree with Moon-E that I think the set can support itself on it's own with out ✧ in the costs of cards (aside from the previously mentioned "Steelforged Golem".)

    Have we nailed down the white commons we want yet? Or are they still up in the air?
    Posted in: Custom Set Creation and Discussion
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