Mikaeus + Triskelion wins the game outright it is hard to come up with anything more effective than that he will also go into ghave for me. My Ghave deck is going to get a massive overhaul from this set it is nuts
You'll still need a sac outlet. Triskelion is a 1/1 by itself and would be a 2/2 with Mikaeus out.
I would suggest going with Karador, Ghost Chieftain. He lets you reuse your dead creatures and can be really cheap to cast in the late game. Plus, adding black gives you access to Graveborn Muse and Bloodgift Demon for card draw. My friend a creature-only deck with Karador that was pretty impressive despite its drawbacks.
It's that card that I always see in a trade binder and want to make good but know it won't be. The biggest problem it has is that it's black, and black usually wants to play with its opponents' graveyards, so turning those bombs into 2/2 lifelinking zombies is usually a step back.
It could be good in the right situation or in a zombie tribal deck, but most of the time, it doesn't make the cut.
Yes, it will be an Obliterator with the upkeep ability. Copy effects copy the printed card AND any copy effects, which would include being an Obliterator with an upkeep ability.
I'm actually not a big fan of the card. Tapping for green is a plus, but entering the battlefield tapped and then having a pretty mediocre ability usually makes it not good enough for me. It basically sets you two turns back, when you play it and keeping it up to pump your guys.
We are talking about EDH here. Kitchen Finks is far from a good card. It's actually a pretty bad card. Four life and two blockers is pretty irrelevant in the long run.
First thing slippery slope is a logical fallacy therefore it is of no help in an argument if you are trying to prove something which I think is what you were trying to do. And secondly I agree with you that there by his argument there is nothing wrong with your suggestions however I was calling you out as they were irrelevant to the current discussion. Finally your hypothetical unhappiness is just that, hypothetical. If you came up to me and wanted to play edh with your 2000 card goblin snow man deck I'd try to find a way for it to work.
Because the website you quoted said it was a "logical fallacy" doesn't make it any less likely. Really think about it for a second. Secondly, a playgroup is one thing. The OP is suggesting a systematic change to the structure of the format. If he wants to play without color restrictions with his playgroup, why would I care? But that's not what he is suggesting. If I met him (or anyone that shares his opinion) in real life, I would have no problem playing a game with whatever deck he happened to think up. But no, I don't agree with what he is proposing.
Hey you mind if my goblin ski patrol takes a ride down your slippery slope? In all seriousness that's not really a legit way to answer his challenge to the rules. Of course it would change the format a bit but so does any change to the rules. In addition the core is still there. There is still a general championing a singleton 100 card deck. If you happen to not know what a slippery slope is check out this:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope
Now onto my opinion. Personally I like the legend rule. I think it is fun to build around and I do enjoy being slightly restricted. However if this kid doesn't like that who are we to tell him he can't have fun too. It doesn't ruin my fun if he wants to run a Falkenrath Aristocrat as a general. And heck I don't care at all if he does so.
I do kinda agree with what everyone is saying about the color rule though. However I think it wouldn't break it too much if we said maybe you could run a second color if you only had a one color general.
Also correct me if I'm wrong but highlander doesn't have a general. Thats what makes the ED part of EDH. The Elder Dragon Highlander. Now if you guys think that having 100 card singleton is the same as having 100 card singleton with a general is the same thing then you are sorely mistaken.
I do know what a slippery slope is, and that's exactly what he is proposing. You seem to think that a slippery slope argument is invalid, but it's a legitimate concern. Explain to me how my suggestions were any different? If I thought they were fun, then they fit under the OP's criteria for changing the rules of an established format, right? Why does his unhappiness with the legend and color identity rules trump my hypothetical unhappiness with deck size limits and singleton restrictions? Under his criteria, they don't.
I also think that we should not be limited to only one of each card. And 100 cards isn't enough either. I'd like to run at least 350 cards. Plus, why can we only run Magic: the Gathering cards? I've got boxes of old Dragonball Z cards that I'd like to put in my 2,000-card Goblin Snowman deck.
I think you see my point by now. Commander has always had its color identity rule and its legendary creature as a commander/general rule. They aren't arbitrary; they're what the format was built on. What you're talking about is a different format altogether. If that's what you want, go ahead. Just wait and see when someone starts complaining that they can't use the card they just invented because, "Hey, it's a casual format, right?"
Except that I need either coffers with at least 3 other swamps or coffers with urborg and another land in play before I get any value out of it.
And you're also in the best color for tutoring, period. Getting both of these guys out is not as hard as you think, and it pays big dividends. The only problems I see with it are a) you start making getting those two cards out you first objective every game and b) your opponents start making getting you out their first objective every game.
If those two reasons don't apply to/bother you, then I say that it's definitely worth it.
You say you put moldgraf back in. But you sacced it before, don't you need to exile it when you sack it? How did you get it back?
Could you also explain how the infinite mana works with just temple, rings, mana reflection and some lands. You can't copy mana abilities with rings. And i don't see any untap stuff in there that would make you able to untap mana producers.
Also i think you should not criticize someone for playing a blue horseman general with infect slapped on if you play spawnsire of ulamog and slap a load of eldrazi on the table that you didn't care enough about to put in your deck.
Just Entomb Sun Titan! It will win you games, your Vish Kal won't get much or any millage.
I'm not sure what you mean by, "won't get much or any millage." This deck isn't supposed to be cutthroat. The games aren't supposed to be over before turn seven, so I will be able to cast my general.
I'm also not sure how Sun Titan helps without a reanimation spell. I understand it's a good reanimation target, but I specifically said I'm looking for other suggestions.
I picked up an Entomb for my Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter deck. Besides the obvious dropping a bomb in the graveyard and reanimating it, what other neat tricks can I do with this card?
For example, Entombing for Unburial Rites then flashing it back.
Thanks for the help, guys.
Edit: Basically what I am asking is: Are there any cards in those colors that function especially well from the graveyard?
The last time I won a game, the first thing I said in the game winning sequence was
"phyrexian metamorph, copying nothing".
I got a few eyebrows over that one.
The relevant permanents on board were: Mirari's Wake, Gilded Lotus, Eternal Witness, Rings of Brighthearth, Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker (11 loyalty), and several untapped lands.
I tapped the Lotus and 3 lands to add UUUUUUUUU to my pool and announced Rite of Replication, with kicker, targeting the Phyrexian Metamorph.
(there was a small counterwar, which I won)
4 copies came into play, and copied Gilded Lotus. The 5th came in as a Witness, and got my Rite back. Lather, rinse, repeat, I had infinite mana (actually, I had 100^100^100^100^100^100^100^100^100^100th mana, but whatever). I then substituted Rings of Brighthearth for Gilded Lotus in my copy extravaganza. Finally, I announced Nicol Bolas' ultimate - copied once by each copy of Rings (999,999, plus the original).
each player had to sacrifice 7,000,000 permanents, discard 7,000,000 cards.... or would have but for the 7,000,000 damage. Lolz
I love that combo.
That's the most incredible crazy play I've heard in a long time. That's pretty impressive.
You'll still need a sac outlet. Triskelion is a 1/1 by itself and would be a 2/2 with Mikaeus out.
It could be good in the right situation or in a zombie tribal deck, but most of the time, it doesn't make the cut.
It does have its place in token decks, though.
We are talking about EDH here. Kitchen Finks is far from a good card. It's actually a pretty bad card. Four life and two blockers is pretty irrelevant in the long run.
Because the website you quoted said it was a "logical fallacy" doesn't make it any less likely. Really think about it for a second. Secondly, a playgroup is one thing. The OP is suggesting a systematic change to the structure of the format. If he wants to play without color restrictions with his playgroup, why would I care? But that's not what he is suggesting. If I met him (or anyone that shares his opinion) in real life, I would have no problem playing a game with whatever deck he happened to think up. But no, I don't agree with what he is proposing.
I do know what a slippery slope is, and that's exactly what he is proposing. You seem to think that a slippery slope argument is invalid, but it's a legitimate concern. Explain to me how my suggestions were any different? If I thought they were fun, then they fit under the OP's criteria for changing the rules of an established format, right? Why does his unhappiness with the legend and color identity rules trump my hypothetical unhappiness with deck size limits and singleton restrictions? Under his criteria, they don't.
I think you see my point by now. Commander has always had its color identity rule and its legendary creature as a commander/general rule. They aren't arbitrary; they're what the format was built on. What you're talking about is a different format altogether. If that's what you want, go ahead. Just wait and see when someone starts complaining that they can't use the card they just invented because, "Hey, it's a casual format, right?"
And you're also in the best color for tutoring, period. Getting both of these guys out is not as hard as you think, and it pays big dividends. The only problems I see with it are a) you start making getting those two cards out you first objective every game and b) your opponents start making getting you out their first objective every game.
If those two reasons don't apply to/bother you, then I say that it's definitely worth it.
I think you mean Grimgrin is to Thraximundar as Havengull Lich is to Sedris, otherwise I'm confused on your comparisons.
I'm pretty sure he means Deserted Temple not Temple of the False God.
It's not infinite. You can only do as much damage as you draw cards, which is usually about two players depending on late in the game it is.
I'm not sure what you mean by, "won't get much or any millage." This deck isn't supposed to be cutthroat. The games aren't supposed to be over before turn seven, so I will be able to cast my general.
I'm also not sure how Sun Titan helps without a reanimation spell. I understand it's a good reanimation target, but I specifically said I'm looking for other suggestions.
I picked up an Entomb for my Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter deck. Besides the obvious dropping a bomb in the graveyard and reanimating it, what other neat tricks can I do with this card?
For example, Entombing for Unburial Rites then flashing it back.
Thanks for the help, guys.
Edit: Basically what I am asking is: Are there any cards in those colors that function especially well from the graveyard?
That's the most incredible crazy play I've heard in a long time. That's pretty impressive.