MTG Salvation

Considering next to gifts, this deck did second best at states, all T8's being 3rd place or higher... It's easily tier1 right alongside mono blue control.

Don't have the list on me but I think I remeber it...



The sideboard is specefically for that deck by the way. I'm not really concerned weather or not this becomes the offical thread, but more to answer the question as to why there is not one....

Quote from cornflake_pirate »

Clearly your opponent is a retard, Iwamori is obviously terrible against BG Control. However, you're taking it out of context.

Iwamori is used SIDEBOARD against RW Aggro. This is because RW can sideboard out their Jittes, random 1/1s etc and instead load up on burn spells, while BG brings in their now-useless Hideous Laughters. Obviously this is a bad idea, since this means the RW player has strategic superiority (unless you have a bunch of life gain) so the BG player instead brings in cards like Iwamori and Yukora which red decks have difficulty handling. It's called the "Fattie Plan" and is highly effective against red decks. In this case Iwamori has minimal drawback - what's the worst they can do?

Ohhhh nooo not a 2/2 with no evasion!!! My 5/5 is quivering in fear!!

5/5 trample ends the game faster than 1/1 flying.


:iagree: In terms of usefulness against Burning Skies, Kagemaro > Kokusho > Iwamori > Yukora > Ink-Eyes.

Multiple miscalcs here.
1. If you wanna run your fattie plan for WR aggro. WWr, etc. Then why not run Arashi over this????
2. for a 4cc slot Loxodon Hiearch is no drawback and life gain all at -1/-1 from Iwamori
3. This is un-useable against control
4.
5. Profit!

Fact is Iwamori is terrible vs control and barely sub-par vs aggro. If you want fat vs aggro bring in arashi or just run white and some Hiearchs/ Congregaton at dawn.

EDIT: eh, I prefer Persecute over nightmare void. To me its personal preference, I can't call it right out bad cause plenty of people at sttes used it and loved it. I just find myself rather holding a Persecute or even a Cranial Extraction. If you find something like combo-control in your area you can run some voids in addition to cranials.

Remedy4Destruction: Saying that some cards are only good in certain decks, thus making them bad cards, isn't a realistic argument. That's like saying that Yawgmoth's Will is bad because you can't play it in decks that run alot of creatures. That's an inaccurate statement. Some cards just have to have synergy with the deck that they're in. The only cards that you can just randomly throw in any deck(IMO) are A)card draw and B)removal. And even then, you have to justify running whatever color they're in if you're not running it already.

well, yeah, it's only good in a deck that can get 1rr and wants to burn out its opponent's creatures. just like arcbound ravager is only good in a deck with lots of artifacts. are you going to argue that ravager is bad just because i can't stick it into my mono-blue control deck?

The only reason the card see's play in creature decks is because creature decks have targets, so it can support using it on turn three....The card only does it's job in THOSE DECKS and no other.

According to your logic, and using your sentence, Jitte is a "bad" card because it can only be used with decks with creatures.

Not to mention "clearing for a 6/1" mountain isn't exactly a "bad" thing.

Nice job.

My post was directed at the topic creator in saying it is NOT good in a deck like WR control. I'm quite aware it is good in Rw aggro.

Good is just a matter of opinion, good can mean effictive to some people and broken to others, so flaming someone for saying its a good/bad card isn't really necessary.

Good is also relative to the deck it is being played in. Jitte is in fact crap in a creatureless deck. Yawgmoth's will is bad in deck with 0 black sources.
In this topic, the creator asked if OA was secret tech for CONTROL, not Rw aggro.

The short answer: No
The long answer: a WR control deck has better mor efficent answers to small creatures such as pyroclasm and the like. Running a 1/3 2 a turn at a cost of 3 to yourself type creature is a wasted slot, espically with the 8+ board sweepers you should be running.

I'm quite aware OA works wonders in Rw aggro deck, that was the entire point of my post kashmyr.

Not only in magic but in many other things in life, you mustent prove something to be false or bad, the opposing side must prove it to be true or good.

Until someone can give evidence of this card doing anything in a deck other than Kjins Rw aggro or any non boros guildmage/genju of the spires aggro then it stays on the table as bad.

The only reason the card see's play in Rw aggro is because Rw aggro is heavy red, so it can support double red on turn three. Also, it serves as 2 to the dome every turn or a path clear for a 6/1 mountain. The card only does it's job in THIS DECK and no other.

Unless of course someone wants to use results and matchup analysis to prove me wrong...

Quote from stevo »

I disagree,
Why i dont play kagemaro:
1. to play and activate kage is 3BBB, not 2BB
2. When i have six mana i'd rather play: Kokusho, Ink-Eyes, or Gleancrawler
3. Hideous laughter is mid game (3rd-4th turn). Much longer after that, the weenie rush has killed u anyway.
4. By the time u can play kagemaro, theres a good chance u wont 2-3 cards in hand.
5. They can see the effect coming, they see it in play and u have B available, what do think they think you are going to do.

Anyway, i dont like kagemaro in this sideboard in this environment at all...
However, i am not flaming u or meaning too, just discussing it

Kage is the best boardsweeper available to us. It works as a massive beater which only gets more insane with arena, and it wipes the field of all creature threats.
To answer all your reasons...
1. correct, however you also get a larger one with legs for 1B more.
2. Kage doesnt cost 6 mana he cost 5. and I would rather play the board sweeper first. Just started playing rock?
3.Kage normally drops turn 3-4 making him mid game as well, but bigger and on legs...
4. Normally when I play kage I play him on turn 3-4 as my first threat and I have 4-5 cards in hand.
5. Dur, his effect is counterintuitive... Your opponent has to make you pop him otherwise they must deal with a growing beater. They dont lay creatures, you don't pop and beat face with big fat, they do, you pop for board swipe. This is the main reason Kagemaro is so frekaing good.

EDIT: About Iwamori, He got played against me TWICE against a BG aggro running three of him, 1st time I dropped a Ink-eyes, then putrefyd it EOT. Next turn he played another, I drop Koksuho and Rend Flesh it. then reviel another kokusho in my hand and he just concedes.

Summary: Don't play Iwamori, not good in this enviroment yet.

Quote from Shade »

Okay, time for another update. I'm not liking the GG combo much anymore -- it's just too easily disrupted. And each time I pull a Void, I wish it was a Cranial instead.

Golgari RockMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
//Creatures (22) 4 Birds of Paradise 2 Gleancrawler 1 Grave-Shell Scarab 1 Ink-Eyes, Servant of Oni 2 Kagemaro, First to Suffer 3 Keening Banshee 1 Kodama of the North Tree 4 Kokusho, the Evening Star 4 Sakura-Tribe Elder //Spells (16) 2 Farseek 4 Last Gasp 3 Phyrexian Arena 2 Plague Boiler 4 Putrefy 1 Sensei's Divining Top	//Lands (22) 5 Forest 4 Llanowar Wastes 1 Miren, the Moaning Well 1 Okina, Temple to the Grandfathers 4 Overgrown Tomb 1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse 1 Svogthos, the Restless Tomb 5 Swamp	//Sideboard (15) 4 Cranial Extraction 3 Hideous Laughter 4 Naturalize 4 Rend Flesh

You are aware your running 5 one-of's without anyway of geting them into your hand?

You need to solidify your deck list into a stronger more consistant build...

Why the jank like farseek?

Quote from IbeatTomGuevin »

Ill put it in terms of playing the game;
ok your opponent has a 3/3 kudzu online with a jitte on the board, for arguments sake they have 0 cards in hand. They untap, upkp, draw, go to main phase and announce they are going to be equipping, youre like hmm... I have this putrefy in my hand along with a meloku, 4 lands on the board and sakura to block with. Obviously the correct play is to putrefy the jitte, chump the plant,rampant growth, next turn lay down the air force. so, he goes to equip and you happily announce putrefy targeting the pointy thing, your opponents like sure why the hell not... after you putrefy he slaps down another jitte, as that was the card he drew... there was no other way you could have played that, in terms of correctness the play you made had the most impact on the game. There was no way you could have known the man had another jitte... thus bringing me to my point;

Well the correct play would have been in rsp to attackers, putrefy jitte, make tokens and chump thus he can slap down another jitte mp2 wiith no creatures or counters and you would be set fine.

But I do agree with you. I have always been a IBTG fan and I respect his opinions as a whole.

I played a deck just like this at states (it was a BGW one with kokusho and vengeance)

Got trashed game one, boarded in 4 cranial extractions and 4 naturalize and it was 2 easy wins after that.

So how does this combo deck stop the obvious disruption with no counters or thw what not?

Quote from {G}PiLeDrIvEr »

You don't need to *cut* anything. There are a few cards that are less than superior to this one. Just because its not hot vs. aggro doesn't mean its useless.

It stops Reaches, Sakuras, Cranials, Transmuters, Gifts, and a slew of other things that can buy you cheap disrupton vs control. Most of those things are incorporated in Gifts anyway, and BG Control needs all the help it can get vs Gifts.

Gifts is dying. I agree a well drawn well built gifts deck can be tough but its not impossible and certainly doesnt require any more boarding other than cranial extraction. Cranial does the job better and against alot more decks.

My list (one page back) is so airtight I can't possible imagine what I could cut to put it a crappy anti gifts card..

I would even distress over this

Jeez you want trample run Loxodon Warhammer

and it gains life and turns even meloku tokens into massive threats...

I would like full match descriptions. No deck has those results against the entire field.

Argument moot until an actual meta of tiers evolves as opposed to only one tier of 30 or so diffrent decks.

Forgot about Arashi, so I dropped the spider for him.
(great tutor for CaD seeing as you can put it on top then channel it next turn)

States results have thrown alot more aggro into the enviroment other than just WWr. so I opted for last gasps.

Well any deck that wins is going to be leaked.

I've only played a few matches against it but it wasn't really a problem. I just boarded in 4 naturalize and 4 cranials and won without fail. 3 persecutes, 4 cranial, 4 naturalize was auto win.