It's worth noting that casting Mind's desire into Doomsday is an auto win.
The point was to illustrate how storm decks have a heavy blue manabase. I think you should learn to read the the context you wish to argue rather than nitpicking a point and relating to something that was discussed in another paragraph. The point you stated provides no constructive input to the discussion. Snarky comments like that prove your incompetence and lack of knowledge in analyzing and evaluating the effects of cards to this format.
Loyal Retainers ($100+) and Imperial Recruiter ($150+) were reprinted in Commander's Arsenal and Judge Promo respectively. Didn't really dent the original printings of said cards. Promos are a fraction of the cost.
I think the case is different for Force of Will. It's a defining 4x staple in eternal formats. I would hate to see to the price people would be willing to pay for a foil FoW since it's priceless at the moment.
i think you have no reason to start being rude. This discussion has been held a 1000 times and there have been plenty of arguments as to why mind's desire is worse than most existing engines
We don't need people with tunnel vision here, if you are going argument for an unbanning, give us decent argument and not just assumptions.
Besides, Narah is right, if you have 9 storm, what would you rather cast, mind's desire? or tendrils? which one wins on te spot?
Mind's desire's performance, like said a thousand times will probably be less consistent than PiF or Ad nauseam. Why? because you need to storm up to a certain amount before you can cast it which makes it much more difficult. Second: it's blue, it's off color for any ritual, this makes it even harder to cast.
Ad nauseam on the other hand is on color for the rituals, gives you as many cards as you want and probably wins on the spot. As an extra you can just cast it off your lands and 1 rit last game if needed and you'll still win.
now let's compare it to time spiral in high tide. Again, time spiral draws 7 with certainty and probably wins you the game on the spot. Mind's desire requires you to storm up to it and have 6+ storm to be effective.
Unlike PiF or Ad Nauseam, Mind's Desire is much more difficult to be dealt with by countermagic in control decks. That is the key reason why you don't see combo controlling the meta, and this card breaks the equilibrium of the format with respect to pillars of the format keeping decks in check. The card would be even more consistent now with PiF. I think you should try playing 3-4 copies of this card in old extended decks to understand the extent of its resilience and effectiveness as an storm engine.
UU isn't that hard to make in storm decks, Diminishing Returns is played in TES wishboards and sometimes you see Time Spiral in Doomsday wishboards, when the deck was played in good numbers. Also, the manabases contain more lands that produce U, such as rainbow lands and U/X duals, than any other mana-producing land in storm shells.
I hear Mind's Desire into ten cards is worse than just casting Tendrils of Agony.
It's a draw engine, like Ad Nauseam but lacks a consequence for its use and functions as a pseudo-Omniscience in play. I think you should go back to understanding functions of cards and their purpose.
As a side note, listing "Krosan Grip" as a way to deal with Memory Jar only works if they don't crack it right away. After it resolves, they have priority, and if they use it right away, you can't Krosan Grip it because they've already sacrificed it.
Though I'm not sure if Mind's Desire would be that bad. It's strong, but so is Ad Nauseam, which has quite a few advantages over Mind's Desire (cheaper, on-color with Dark Ritual, and requires no Storm setup)
I heard Mind's Desire into 10 other cards including another Mind's Desire is pretty good. You should try playing 4x the card with mana acceleration and cantrips.
I didn't list Krosan Grip as a way to deal with Memory Jar, I was responding to it.
From the vault versions tend to be worth pretty close to the original's value. So no, foiling in this case likely doesn't increase the value of the cards. There is a probable exception for FoW if it makes it, due to the insane level of demand for foil legacy tournament staples combined with the fact that there is no other way to foil a FoW w/o putting a sticker on it. Most other cards wouldn't have that premium attached.
Not for 4 of staples in eternal formats. The cards for casual do tend to be the same but if you're reprinting Jace, FoW, Mana Drain, and Wasteland, I think you'll find see a trend of the prices.
Perhaps gaea's cradle was taken into consideration with the banning of earthcraft? I am not sure.
Frantic search seems fine to me. I think the only decks that would really benefit are High Tide and maybe reanimator.
Memory jar...i cant even think of a deck that would pick that up in the current meta. Its much too slow for the combo decks at a cost of 5 mana, MAYBE hightide or combo elves once they get their mana generation real high?
Frantic search would be ridiculous in any deck that uses High Tide as a mana accelerator. The one-sided card filtering that untaps mana to net gain mana and get cards you want is ridiculous.
Memory Jar would be played in combo decks, it would allow the user to draw 7 at 5 colorless mana, a card that can be tutored for with ease early game with E.Tutor. It allows decks, such as belcher, to continue keep their net mana gain cards and draw into their win at only a colorless mana cost.
what about memory jar? i wouldn't mind see that unbanned... it is incredibly strong, but it is 5 mana and krosan grip is a thing so is pithing needle...
Mind's Desire is 6 mana and there's flusterstorm/mindbreak trap in the format. Tinker is 3 mana and there's serenity and hurkyl's recall in the format. Just because you can name cards that can stop the card doesn't provide a valid argument of an unbanning.
Would Black Vise really be that dangerous to unban? I recall reading in this thread the possibility of Burn perhaps having a new toy in it's arsenal; aside from Burn, what other decks would abuse it?
The idea of unbanning Black Vise should taken into more consideration other than burn decks. Tempo decks that focus on mana denial with Wastelands and Stifle, and Stax decks that focuses on preventing your opponent casting spells by taxing them should also be evaluated.
Wizards aren't going to make the mistake of having a 20th anniversary product that's not even worth MSRP.
I'm 99% confident that at least one of Jace, FOW, Wasteland and Mana Drain will be in here. I wouldn't be surprised to see two. Foil JTMS seems like a shoo-in because it was pretty much the only money card at the time and it's ridiculous that a foil card mass-printed three years ago goes for more than a Mox Jet.
Lolwut.
The list of cards nonfoil is well worth the MSRP already, so foiling them only increases it. I also high doubt you're going to see any of those cards if Wizards already has moderately valuable cards such as possibly Arcbound Rav and Noble Hierarch as foils in this. I thought it seemed pretty obvious that Wizards isn't going to throw you a couple of hundred dollars in one card as seen from the previous From the Vaults.
I believe the deck you're talking about is enchantress, not reanimator.
Serra's sanctum is banned in block constructed, so i assume it did something absurd. I didn't play back then though, so probably better to default to an older player.
It use to run wild growth effects on their lands and had cloud of fairies so you'd tap untap a Serra's and the land with a bunch of wild growths and I assume you can understand what you can do with a lot of mana.
I searched out moats for sale, not moats that were sold. I asked to have someone show me a moat for sale at that price which there are none, infact the cheapest one available at this time is $244.99. So it is pure lies to say it's $170 when there's not one for sale at that price.
Actually there's 6 under that price and lowest is at 210$ w/ free shipping. Anyways the one you found is still under your 26X.00$ if you're going to argue like that lol. Argue all you want but good talk bro.
The point was to illustrate how storm decks have a heavy blue manabase. I think you should learn to read the the context you wish to argue rather than nitpicking a point and relating to something that was discussed in another paragraph. The point you stated provides no constructive input to the discussion. Snarky comments like that prove your incompetence and lack of knowledge in analyzing and evaluating the effects of cards to this format.
I think the case is different for Force of Will. It's a defining 4x staple in eternal formats. I would hate to see to the price people would be willing to pay for a foil FoW since it's priceless at the moment.
Unlike PiF or Ad Nauseam, Mind's Desire is much more difficult to be dealt with by countermagic in control decks. That is the key reason why you don't see combo controlling the meta, and this card breaks the equilibrium of the format with respect to pillars of the format keeping decks in check. The card would be even more consistent now with PiF. I think you should try playing 3-4 copies of this card in old extended decks to understand the extent of its resilience and effectiveness as an storm engine.
UU isn't that hard to make in storm decks, Diminishing Returns is played in TES wishboards and sometimes you see Time Spiral in Doomsday wishboards, when the deck was played in good numbers. Also, the manabases contain more lands that produce U, such as rainbow lands and U/X duals, than any other mana-producing land in storm shells.
It's a draw engine, like Ad Nauseam but lacks a consequence for its use and functions as a pseudo-Omniscience in play. I think you should go back to understanding functions of cards and their purpose.
I heard Mind's Desire into 10 other cards including another Mind's Desire is pretty good. You should try playing 4x the card with mana acceleration and cantrips.
I didn't list Krosan Grip as a way to deal with Memory Jar, I was responding to it.
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Not for 4 of staples in eternal formats. The cards for casual do tend to be the same but if you're reprinting Jace, FoW, Mana Drain, and Wasteland, I think you'll find see a trend of the prices.
Frantic search would be ridiculous in any deck that uses High Tide as a mana accelerator. The one-sided card filtering that untaps mana to net gain mana and get cards you want is ridiculous.
Memory Jar would be played in combo decks, it would allow the user to draw 7 at 5 colorless mana, a card that can be tutored for with ease early game with E.Tutor. It allows decks, such as belcher, to continue keep their net mana gain cards and draw into their win at only a colorless mana cost.
Also relevant to Memory jar:
Mind's Desire is 6 mana and there's flusterstorm/mindbreak trap in the format. Tinker is 3 mana and there's serenity and hurkyl's recall in the format. Just because you can name cards that can stop the card doesn't provide a valid argument of an unbanning.
The idea of unbanning Black Vise should taken into more consideration other than burn decks. Tempo decks that focus on mana denial with Wastelands and Stifle, and Stax decks that focuses on preventing your opponent casting spells by taxing them should also be evaluated.
Lolwut.
The list of cards nonfoil is well worth the MSRP already, so foiling them only increases it. I also high doubt you're going to see any of those cards if Wizards already has moderately valuable cards such as possibly Arcbound Rav and Noble Hierarch as foils in this. I thought it seemed pretty obvious that Wizards isn't going to throw you a couple of hundred dollars in one card as seen from the previous From the Vaults.
Okay. Thanks for the help.
oh edit: That was the whole point Mr.Mod. Didn't noticed you changed it but lol.
:>
However with fetchlands and other shuffle abilities, it usually makes ponder better since you're not stuck with 2 bad cards next to the card you want.
And if you're looking for asian singles I guess you can cry on my shoulder, idk.
It use to run wild growth effects on their lands and had cloud of fairies so you'd tap untap a Serra's and the land with a bunch of wild growths and I assume you can understand what you can do with a lot of mana.
Actually there's 6 under that price and lowest is at 210$ w/ free shipping. Anyways the one you found is still under your 26X.00$ if you're going to argue like that lol. Argue all you want but good talk bro.