Why are people even mentioning standard with this card? This is not a 40 dollar card because of standard. You guys know it sucks without Brainstorm or JTMS right? Please tell me your not buying this for standard.
The thing I find, is that the card is NEVER bad. I don't run 4, I've tried three. At worst, if you have no spectacular plays, it's-
CU-
Untap all your lands, play an extra land, draw a card.
At best it's totally nuts.
Like I said earlier in testing, my friends have just started giving me the extra turn to keep counters for other stuff. Having a Jace out, than resolving this is awesome.
There are so many awesome plays with this card it makes it worth it. At worst it's a ramp cantrip. This card is nuts. Still not paying 40 for it though.
I have done marginal testing and it's pretty smooth. It's just real easy to miracle with BS and JTMS. Games where it got countered, I ended up sticking Jaces. When it wasn't countered it felt huge.
I know that big 'ol 7 in the corner looks bad, but it really is just so easy to miracle.
Seeing this in your starting hand with a brainstorm is awesome. Which is why this card is so broke. The idea is you DON'T want to see a miracle in your starting hand, but with BS and Jace it's just not a downside.
On top of that, I ran three and just straight up top decked it a couple times and it was always exciting, usually always really good and not once cast for seven.
Here was the worst case scenario with the card, drawing it, and not wanting to cast it for fear of it being countered on a turn where I wanted to spend all my mana for something else. I have seen it on turn 3, played it and been screwed, actually losing a turn. you need to be smart with it.
Favorite plays were turn FOUR Brainstorming, setting this to top, passing and keeping mana up for leak.
Nothing bad came down opp passes, draw it, miracle, they counter, I leak in response, free turn.
Never really got stuck in my hand, even when I had two, they eventually just got cast for 2. Every time.
This just adds more feeling of dread to a resolved JTMS. It's like, every turn he is out is just that much worse for your opponent now. Remember how bad Jace brainstorming across from you felt? It feels even worse now.
I won't say it's broken just yet either, need to test more.
They need to un-ban Mental Misstep in legacy. Plays like this are what that card was born to shut down. If it get's out of control they can try un-banning something to fix the problem instead of banning. So wizards does have a silver bullet in the chamber.
I agree, this is not a conditional time walk in a deck with four BS and even just three JTMS. This is just a Time Walk.
Even if you draw TWO in your starting hand, which is generally bad with miracles, you can find your brainstorm or stick a jace and take TWO extra turns in a row.
The sad fact about this card is that with BS and Jace, it's just too strong. Something is gonna get banned and it's probably gonna be this.
It's not as good in standard but..we know that. With Jace and BS it's just obvious. I really think they know this, and are already prepared to ban it in those formats. It's just so OBVIOUSLY powerful.
There are no downsides to this card in the deck I put it in. It's just always awesome. I find my friends actually letting me take the extra turn, and sitting on counters for other things if they don't have two. So even against other control decks, they either let you take an extra turn, or worry about a jace coming down. It's too strong.
It's good, but the danger is it's so good, with already insane cards, that I see either it, or cards that enable it easily getting banned.
If you get a jace to stick on the board, or have a single brainstorm along with this in hand (god forbid two), it's like....game over. As if planting the jace wasn't strong enough by itself, or the brainstorm being strong by itself, this just... synergizes SO WELL for such a cheap cost, with two of the best true blues the "modern" game has ever seen.
For two blue and a colorless you can cast jace turn three. With this in hand with a single brainstorm Jace can come down turn three, (your fourth their third).
Not only that, but even if you don't have a jace, or anything impressive for the extra turn it's still so crazy it's ban-worthy. Hence why the 30-40 bucks is not worth it. I really think this is gonna get banned.
Pay three, draw three, put two back in any order, untap all your lands, draw a card, play a land, go. WTF? It's not worth the money because it's so good it's gonna get banned and drop in price lmao.
This is not a conditional time walk with jtms and bs. It's just a time walk. That you can cast on your opponents turn btw. Banned.
Yah, I said a few pages back that the card was nuts with jace and brainstorm in particular, which is awesome but still...I think people are going a little too far with this thing. If you have these in your deck, you will NEVER want to draw more than one card, unless you can put them back.
This card seems so good with already insane cards, Jace, brainstorm, top, that it's gonna get banned in legacy than drop to like, 10 bucks. Why pay 40?
40 dollars already? Jeez, the card may be good but has anyone mentioned how god-awful miracles are with card draw? Something every blue deck is gonna want to do?
Any card that COMBOS with brainstorm and JTMS is worth thinking about. Everyone is comparing it to Time walk. Yeah. It's not a Time Walk. It is bad in comparison to ONE OF THE MOST BROKEN CARDS EVER, however in a deck full of JTMS and brainstorm..I don't see how this card is not just...nuts.
It's interesting (balanced) in how it screws drawing multiple cards. Plain 'ol draw spells will want to stay away from this card. How much would it suck to draw this as the second card from your divination? But with jace and brainstorm..jeez. Will jace go UP because of this? Liliana Vess is also a consideration. 3 turns, than have them discard?
This card is just so overhyped. 20 cards in a single graveyard takes forever even in a deck casting sorceries and instants every turn.
This card 90% of the time I promise you is basically an instant speed cycle 1. That's it. Whoop dee doo. I would MUCH rather preordain, and that's a common.
This is what people don't get. This spell does nothing in standard. Don't buy this card for standard.
The same guy who said JTMS was overrated?
CU-
Untap all your lands, play an extra land, draw a card.
At best it's totally nuts.
Like I said earlier in testing, my friends have just started giving me the extra turn to keep counters for other stuff. Having a Jace out, than resolving this is awesome.
There are so many awesome plays with this card it makes it worth it. At worst it's a ramp cantrip. This card is nuts. Still not paying 40 for it though.
I know that big 'ol 7 in the corner looks bad, but it really is just so easy to miracle.
Seeing this in your starting hand with a brainstorm is awesome. Which is why this card is so broke. The idea is you DON'T want to see a miracle in your starting hand, but with BS and Jace it's just not a downside.
On top of that, I ran three and just straight up top decked it a couple times and it was always exciting, usually always really good and not once cast for seven.
Here was the worst case scenario with the card, drawing it, and not wanting to cast it for fear of it being countered on a turn where I wanted to spend all my mana for something else. I have seen it on turn 3, played it and been screwed, actually losing a turn. you need to be smart with it.
Favorite plays were turn FOUR Brainstorming, setting this to top, passing and keeping mana up for leak.
Nothing bad came down opp passes, draw it, miracle, they counter, I leak in response, free turn.
Never really got stuck in my hand, even when I had two, they eventually just got cast for 2. Every time.
This just adds more feeling of dread to a resolved JTMS. It's like, every turn he is out is just that much worse for your opponent now. Remember how bad Jace brainstorming across from you felt? It feels even worse now.
I won't say it's broken just yet either, need to test more.
Edit:Wurmcoil Engine, now with haste.
Edit:Meant to say turn four.
Brainstorm-CUU
Draw three cards, put two from your hand on top of your library, Untap your lands, draw a card, play a land.
Yes, I would pay two life to stop that.
Even if you draw TWO in your starting hand, which is generally bad with miracles, you can find your brainstorm or stick a jace and take TWO extra turns in a row.
The sad fact about this card is that with BS and Jace, it's just too strong. Something is gonna get banned and it's probably gonna be this.
It's not as good in standard but..we know that. With Jace and BS it's just obvious. I really think they know this, and are already prepared to ban it in those formats. It's just so OBVIOUSLY powerful.
There are no downsides to this card in the deck I put it in. It's just always awesome. I find my friends actually letting me take the extra turn, and sitting on counters for other things if they don't have two. So even against other control decks, they either let you take an extra turn, or worry about a jace coming down. It's too strong.
If you get a jace to stick on the board, or have a single brainstorm along with this in hand (god forbid two), it's like....game over. As if planting the jace wasn't strong enough by itself, or the brainstorm being strong by itself, this just... synergizes SO WELL for such a cheap cost, with two of the best true blues the "modern" game has ever seen.
For two blue and a colorless you can cast jace turn three. With this in hand with a single brainstorm Jace can come down turn three, (your fourth their third).
Not only that, but even if you don't have a jace, or anything impressive for the extra turn it's still so crazy it's ban-worthy. Hence why the 30-40 bucks is not worth it. I really think this is gonna get banned.
Pay three, draw three, put two back in any order, untap all your lands, draw a card, play a land, go. WTF? It's not worth the money because it's so good it's gonna get banned and drop in price lmao.
This is not a conditional time walk with jtms and bs. It's just a time walk. That you can cast on your opponents turn btw. Banned.
This card seems so good with already insane cards, Jace, brainstorm, top, that it's gonna get banned in legacy than drop to like, 10 bucks. Why pay 40?
It's interesting (balanced) in how it screws drawing multiple cards. Plain 'ol draw spells will want to stay away from this card. How much would it suck to draw this as the second card from your divination? But with jace and brainstorm..jeez. Will jace go UP because of this? Liliana Vess is also a consideration. 3 turns, than have them discard?
This card 90% of the time I promise you is basically an instant speed cycle 1. That's it. Whoop dee doo. I would MUCH rather preordain, and that's a common.