I tested the UG version with Breach in place of Past in Flames and no other changes. It's incredibly reliable (Albeit awkward cause it can be destroyed). When combing off you should have the two lands required to sac for Lotus Field and any amount of Serum Visions, Slight of Hand, opt or whatever supporting cantrips you decide to run. The key is Ideas Unbound. I find it a lot easier to combo off with Breach since I have free reign over my graveyard (Which the problem with Past in flames is that it only applies to the cards in your graveyard upon resolution and is clunky mid combo). Not to mention it's a lot easier to cast. There's a lot more to it but that's just the basics of what I uncovered so far.
Edit: Tl;dr I use Breach to spam Ideas unbound from my graveyard.
Still not sure on the sideboard. I'm trying different things each time I play.
Edit: I've been playing online with the goal of trying to come up with a board that can cover everything that can potentially hose twiddle. Needless to say, there's a lot of ground to cover.
I'm just getting used to Twiddle and I have to ask about the usefulness of Tolaria West. In the few half dozen games I've played its always been a dead draw. More often than not I wished it was just an island.
Edit: I'm using my version of the UG list.
Don't mean to beat a dead horse here but is anyone currently running Aether Vial? I have an extra set and think there is some great synergy with Renegade Rallier[/card]. Especially in regards to allowing you to Ghost Quarter multiple times early in a game.
Wouldn't Mirran Crusader put on enough pressure? It also has the benefit of only dying to Path and Bolt while laughing at powerhouses like Tarmogoyf
Abuse those Exalted triggers!
In terms of making room for 2x Eternal Witness, I think you could cut a few Dryad Militant, or at least put them in your SB. They're pretty dead against affinity and tokens, though they're good against your Jund matchup - but so are your 3 Mirran Crusader, so I think you have room to put militants in your SB.
Same is true for an Aven Mindcensor, if you really want one in your 75, I think you can keep it in the board.
In terms of your SB plan, is there a particular deck that you're facing regularly where you need 4x Leyline of Sanctity? I've found some mix of Rest in Peace and Burrenton Forge-Tender to be really important in my SB these days.
I'd agree with the board options. I didn't look too much into it before I posted but I realize BFT with Mirran is a must.
The reasoning behind Dryad Militant was a way to increase one drop options that still maximize their benefit from Wilt-leaf. In hindsight that was bad logic.
Moving Friday lol. I hope to find a decent LGS this weekend and could hopefully give some updates.
@CosmoKramer Thanks for the suggestions. Honestly the only one I can't do at the moment is Horizon Canopy.
Hey guys, been lurking here for a bit.
I'll be moving to a more prominent MTG scene in a couple weeks so I don't have a meta as of yet.
This list is simply generated with the prominent lists in mind. (Jund, Affinity, Tokens was big in my area)
Esper, Know I'm going to catch some hate for using Serum Visions over Thought Scour but the scry 2 has helped a lot more then the mill 2. I found Serum as a more effective turn 1 play if I couldn't play a crab. Anyone have suggestions for aggro based decks? Working on getting a set of Ghostly Prison but I was wondering if anyone has more effective answer. Heck, I'm even thinking of boarding Wall of Denial at this point.
Haven't played since the treasure cruise ban but my meta otherwise consisted of burn, delver, affinity, soul sisters, and goblins for the most part.
Uncounterable creatures can be answered easily enough with spot removal. Path to Exile, Dismember and the like. Uncounterable spells (i.e. Abrupt Decay) is something we just have to deal with.Twincast can be a silver lining for something that cannot be countered, if you feel like using it against them.
Any thoughts on what would be a good sideboard option against Goblins? Ghostly Prison is the only thing I can think of, but with a meta full of Goblins, Merfolk, Affinity, Infect, RDW, Pod, and Delver I have a hard time finding room for them.
Mesmeric orb would be your friend for a dredgish mill deck. Turns the mill part on auto-pilot, it honestly should be an auto four-of for any mill deck since price isn't an issue. $10ish for a playset, at the moment.
Mill just recently got a Top8. http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=7727&d=244567&f=MO
Now some possible suggestions to make this budget friendly;
-4 Glimpse the Unthinkable
-2 Damnation
-8 Fetches
+4 Mind Scuplt
+2 Supreme Verdict/Day of Judgement
+2 Breaking / Entering
+1 Shelldock Isle
+1 Darkslick Shores
+1 Hallowed Fountain
+5 Isolated Chapel/Glacial Fortress/Drowned Catacombs/Island/Swamp/Plains
The reason I didn't go with those is while they have some synergy with Hedron Crab, it is not worth the reward. Delaying mill that extra turn can cost games. Instead, to make up for the lack of Fetches I went with higher land count, at least compared to what I normally would run for mill. It's a good idea, but IMO, not worth it because of how much removal those crabs tend to eat.
Edit: Tl;dr I use Breach to spam Ideas unbound from my graveyard.
Has anyone tried Underworld Breach yet?
It seems kind of good in storm.
2 Grapeshot
4 Ideas Unbound
1 Merchant Scroll
3 Past in Flames
4 Serum Visions
4 Sleight of Hand
2 Sylvan Scrying
4 Dream's Grip
1 Echoing Truth
4 Peer Through Depths
4 Psychic Puppetry
4 Reach Through Mists
3 Twiddle
4 Botanical Sanctum
4 Lotus Field
4 Snow-Covered Island
4 Yavimaya Coast
Creature (4)
4 Vizier of Tumbling Sands
Still not sure on the sideboard. I'm trying different things each time I play.
Edit: I've been playing online with the goal of trying to come up with a board that can cover everything that can potentially hose twiddle. Needless to say, there's a lot of ground to cover.
Edit: I'm using my version of the UG list.
Abuse those Exalted triggers!
I'd agree with the board options. I didn't look too much into it before I posted but I realize BFT with Mirran is a must.
The reasoning behind Dryad Militant was a way to increase one drop options that still maximize their benefit from Wilt-leaf. In hindsight that was bad logic.
Moving Friday lol. I hope to find a decent LGS this weekend and could hopefully give some updates.
@CosmoKramer Thanks for the suggestions. Honestly the only one I can't do at the moment is Horizon Canopy.
I'll be moving to a more prominent MTG scene in a couple weeks so I don't have a meta as of yet.
This list is simply generated with the prominent lists in mind. (Jund, Affinity, Tokens was big in my area)
1 Aven Mindcensor
3 Dryad Militant
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Mirran Crusader
4 Loxodon Smiter
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Qasali Pridemage
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Voice of Resurgence
2 Wilt-Leaf Liege
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Collected Company
4 Path to Exile
lands (22)
4 Brushland
2 Forest
1 Gavony Township
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
4 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
3 Temple Garden
2 Choke
2 Kataki, War's Wage
4 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Scavenging Ooze
3 Spellskite
2 Stony Silence
I'd like to add a pair of Eternal Witness. Would you guys have any suggestions? I know I can drop the main board Scooze but need one more slot.
4 Hedron Crab
Spell 34
4 Archive Trap
4 Glimpse the Unthinkable
4 Breaking // Entering
4 Serum Visions
3 Path to Exile
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Spell Pierce
2 Visions of Beyond
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Darkness
2 Mind Funeral
1 Crypt Incursion
3 Island
2 Plains
3 Swamp
1 Hallowed Fountain
2 Watery Grave
1 Godless Shrine
1 Oboro, Palace in the Clouds
1 Shelldock Isle
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Marsh Flats
4 Polluted Delta
1 Flooded Strand
1 Echoing Truth
2 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Stony Silence
4 Erase
3 Rest in Peace
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Crypt Incursion
Esper, Know I'm going to catch some hate for using Serum Visions over Thought Scour but the scry 2 has helped a lot more then the mill 2. I found Serum as a more effective turn 1 play if I couldn't play a crab. Anyone have suggestions for aggro based decks? Working on getting a set of Ghostly Prison but I was wondering if anyone has more effective answer. Heck, I'm even thinking of boarding Wall of Denial at this point.
Haven't played since the treasure cruise ban but my meta otherwise consisted of burn, delver, affinity, soul sisters, and goblins for the most part.
2 Darkslick Shores
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Godless Shrine
3 Island
1 Plains
1 Swamp
1 Marsh Flats
3 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
2 Shelldock Isle
1 Watery Grave
4 Archive Trap
2 Crypt Incursion
4 Glimpse the Unthinkable
2 Mesmeric Orb
3 Mind Funeral
4 Path to Exile
2 Supreme Verdict
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Visions of Beyond
4 Thought Scour
Creatures
3 Augur of Bolas
4 Hedron Crab
3 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Oblivion Stone
4 Erase
3 Stony Silence
3 Darkness
4 Marsh Flats
3 Shelldock Isle
3 Darkslick Shores
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Watery Grave
2 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Oboro, Palace in the Clouds
1 Hallowed Fountain
3 Augur of Bolas
4 Archive Trap
4 Glimpse the Unthinkable
4 Mind Funeral
4 Visions of Beyond
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Crypt Incursion
2 Breaking / Entering
2 Damnation
2 Stony Silence
3 Path to Exile
3 Grafdigger's Cage
3 Hurkyl's Recall
2 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Echoing Truth
Mill just recently got a Top8.
http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=7727&d=244567&f=MO
Now some possible suggestions to make this budget friendly;
-4 Glimpse the Unthinkable
-2 Damnation
-8 Fetches
+4 Mind Scuplt
+2 Supreme Verdict/Day of Judgement
+2 Breaking / Entering
+1 Shelldock Isle
+1 Darkslick Shores
+1 Hallowed Fountain
+5 Isolated Chapel/Glacial Fortress/Drowned Catacombs/Island/Swamp/Plains