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  • posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    Quote from Dunharrow »
    Quote from Pappy »
    I just wanna Command the Dreadhorde Deepglow Skate and a walker back.


    Well, that sounds gross. Maybe Muldrotha ... lots of self mill, lots of value, then bam - ult multiple walkers.

    What are the best ultimates in multiplayer?


    I assume you mean "In Sultai" given the Muldrotha comment, which takes away my two favorites (Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God and Tamiyo, Field Researcher). I think the best, roughly in order, are...


    Ugin, the Spirit Dragon: Draw 7, gain 7, play 7 SHOULD just win the game on the spot.
    Liliana, Dreadhorde General: One-sided Tragic Arrogance effect that also hits lands should completely cripple opponents to the point that winning is just a formality, and unlike most of these chumps she sticks around!
    Jace, Architect of Thought: Super duper bribery on all opponents AND a free permanent for you to find any of these other 'walkers or game winning effects. Less good in this specific case compared to the Doubling Season case because if you pull a 'walker you won't necessarily get to ultimate again.
    Jace, Unraveler of Secrets: This doesn't win the game, but Erayo, Soratami Ascendant is banned and this gets you that same effect. Your opponents might just scoop in disgust?

    From there, there are several sort of "Tier 2" effects that aren't as powerful but are still game-winning especially in concert with a few other walkers.

    Mu Yanling: Surprising, for sure, but "take an extra turn and tap all possible blockers" should be a powerful play if not necessarily a game-winning one.
    Liliana Vess: Rise of the Dark Realms on a budget is fun, and she helps you assemble the comboes.
    Kiora, Master of the Depths: 24 power and three fight triggers isn't broken or anything like some of these, but is a good way to end the game in concert with any of these other effects.
    Vraska, Relic Seeker/Sorin Markov: Powerful effects but need some support to make it an instant win.
    Teferi, Temporal Archmage: If you are going for a long, grindy game this emblem makes all your Planeswalkers super powerful and obnoxious.

    Tamiyo, the Moon Sage and Will Kenrith are also usually pretty spicy, but less good in Muldrotha. Jace, the Mind Sculptor is also obviously very powerful but can't ultimate instantly without additional support.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Signature Spell Book Gideon
    This, this I may buy. I do wish we had gotten Gideon of the Trials or Gideon Blackblade or Gideon, Ally of Zendikar but it makes sense to get the most foundational version of him. Path, Martyr's Bond, Blackblade, and Worship are cards I'd love to own or own more of and I dig the new art. And I've never been a huge fan of Gideon (he's like maybe in my top 20 favorite 'walkers) but I found myself a bit heartbroken on that Rest in Peace art. RIP Kytheon Iora of Theros.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Feather - Heroic Combo and Control [Work NO LONGER In Progress (but input still welcome)]
    If you want more cuts, I will say that my Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow deck (which has a similarly low-curve principal with lots of repeated draw effects and cheap mana rocks) is often mana flooded at 34 lands and I've been tempted to go to 33 (especially as I am not currently running Chrome Mox and totally could as I do own a copy). And that deck has a MUCH higher curve since it does want to hit 5 CMC to start slamming Conspiracy or develop ninjas while holding up counterspell mana. Granted Yuriko is only CMC 2 and cheats the commander tax as long as I can keep the weenies coming, but I'd wonder if 35 lands is too much.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Mothership Spoilers 4/18 - Tokens and Planeswalker Decklists
    Great tokens this set - the temptation to buy a box grows daily.

    Also, I have to say that those are some of the strongest intro decks in a long time. They actually feel like old precons in that they are clearly bad but also clearly have a theme that would be fun for the kitchen table and could morph into a tier 2 deck of some sort with some love. Also some rares that feel like they'll have actual value: Oath of Kaya is a nice add to the Gideon deck (although it'd be nicer if the deck had more 'walkers in it) and Command the Dreadhorde is a card with potential, while Jace's deck comes with Bioessence Hydra (again it'd be better with more 'walkers but can't win 'em all) and more importantly Spark Double which is great. These might be the first Planeswalker decks I bother purchasing as well.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Feather - Heroic Combo and Control [Work NO LONGER In Progress (but input still welcome)]
    Man, you continue to be too wise for me - it's why I go read your Phelddagrif primer every few months. That makes a ton of sense for sure; with Feather wanting you to be able to potentially hold up a minimum of like WWWW every round (to make sure you can Gods Willing or Pollen Remedy on every single turn each player takes) you probably won't have the ability to pay 3RW to go tutor for trickery, and like you also say most of your spells are 1 and 2 CMC so you aren't getting full value in the same way a standard Sunforger Package would by pulling out Master Warcrafts and Wild Ricochets and stuff. I was hoping Feather would be the first great home for Sunforger in my collection but seems like it might be a bit win-more and too slow.

    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Feather - Heroic Combo and Control [Work NO LONGER In Progress (but input still welcome)]
    I am addicted to Sunforger, so I am wondering why it isn't on your list? You've got a lot of niche cards for the 'forger to tutor. Heck, you even get to Sunforger Aurelia's Fury, cast it for X = 0, and buy it back with Feather which is fun.

    And I think you have room for it. Feather buys back every spell you cast, so I think running 46 instants and sorceries that interact with Feather is a liiiittttle overkill. I'd try to winnow it down to my favorite 30-35 so that you can boost your creature count and also run a few more sweet utility cards like Sunforger.

    I also wonder if Launch the Fleet is worth running in your list.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    My wife's Varina deck is token heavy and more aggressive so I like Amass, but I view it as more of a bonus than a buildaround. For instance, I dig Lazotep Reaver not because I want to use it to kickstart my amassed army but because it is a 2/3 for 1B over two bodies, which means it gives me two bodies to attack with, gets double the bonus from all the zombie lords, is an extra body to feed to Nantuko Husk to trigger Grave Pact, etc. For that same reason, I think that Dreadhorde Invasion is ridiculously amazing and I think anything else that amasses on EtB is worth testing (so Vizier of the Scorpion and Gleaming Overseer, although the competition at 3 CMC is stiff). There's also a chance that the deck runs Enter the God-Eternals because the deck does have an Undead Alchemist package and appreciates incidental mill.

    Even with all that, I'd be unlikely to just slam, say, Relentless Advance in the 99 of my deck because I actually don't really wanna go full tilt on the horde. And if you aren't doing a token-heavy Varina deck, for sure I'd probably only seriously consider Dreadhorde Invasion as a reasonable inclusion.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    Jesus. With enough mana those Finales look great. Not sure if they’re auto includes but they look fun if nothing else.


    Going down the list in order...

    Finale of Glory: Very powerful in token decks, but not necessarily better than Decree of Justice and Secure the Wastes. Still probably a staple in any W/x token deck, but not quite worth randomly jamming in other lists.

    Finale of Revelation: Instant staple in most U/x spellslinger decks due to how busted it can be with High Tide, Turnabout, rituals, and reducers. Probably a bit too durdly and slow compared to Blue Sun's Zenith and Stroke of Genius otherwise.

    Finale of Eternity: Seems bad. Will struggle to hit enough targets, and is worse than Rise of the Dark Realms as a endgame mana sink.

    Finale of Promise: Even setting aside shenanigans with 0-cost spells (since that's much less likely to work in Commander), this is a lot of graveyard manipulating value and should be an instant staple in any R/x spellslinger deck.

    Finale of Devastation: An instant staple in all green decks minus the odd Primal Surge all creatures list or strange Bant creatureless control list. For one more than Green Sun's Zenith (already a format-defining staple itself), you get to pull stuff out of the grave as well, get to pull creatures of any color, and get to cast the Craterhoof Behemoth overrun effect if you cast it for 12.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    This is the spiciest set for EDH in a long time. On the list of stuff I want for each deck...

    Daretti, Scrap Savant: I run it as a superfriends deck, and so Karn, the Great Creator and Ugin, the Ineffable are instant adds. I am also interested in trying Chandra, Fire Artisan and Sarkhan, the Masterless, I may also experiment with Mobilized District and Karn's Bastion which look powerful even though I prefer to keep my mountain count high for Caged Sun and Koth of the Hammer.

    The Gitrog Monster: The bar is really high for this deck so so far there are no instant additions. I may try Blast Zone out, but am not optimistic on it being super good. I don't think I have enough cards that will interact with Evolution Sage but I'll need to take a second pass - it tickles me enough that I may actually revamp the deck to support it. I may also experiment with God-Eternal Bontu due to its sick interaction with Gitrog. Casualties of War and Deliver Unto Evil may also clear the steep threshold that non-creature, non-land cards have to clear to earn a slot in the deck; cards are crazy strong.

    Doran, the Siege Tower: So far the only card of real interest is Casualties of War. Teyo, the Shieldmage, Nissa, Who Shakes the World, and Sorin, Vengeful Bloodlord are interesting but aren't really what the deck is about and Huatli, the Sun's Heart gets a no from me dog.

    Gahiji, Honored One: I keep this around as my deck to play when I need to lose - I don't always expect to win with it. As a result, it's hard to justify adding powerful cards to it as I don't necessarily want the deck to be super powrful. That being said, I kind of think that Ajani, the Greathearted might be a great fit for the deck since it allows my token army to swing and protect me, rolls up other 'walkers and creatures, and gains life. Finale of Glory (still rumored at this point) also seems like a great finisher for my deck.

    Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow: Not all decks can be winners. Yuriko gains nothing (so far) from this set, but Yuriko has very specific needs. Closest to interesting is Lazotep Plating but honestly I feel like the deck needs less, not more, narrow answers to "get 'em". I may also add Fblthp, the Lost because Fblthp.

    So for my decks actually not a ton, but I am also the keeper of my wife's decks and my oh my...

    Varina, Lich Queen: This set is basically "Varina's magical Christmas". Of particular interest are Dreadhorde Invasion, God-Eternal Oketra, and Eternal Skylord but I'd also be interested to test Eternal Taskmaster, Lazotep Reaver, God-Eternal Bontu, Lazotep Plating, Vizier of the Scorpion, Gleaming Overseer, Liliana, Dreadhorde General, Enter the God-Eternals, and Ashiok, Dream Render. So lots of great additions.

    Jenara, Asura of War: This deck is basically just "fun with Doubling Season and pillowforts, so basically the entire set is an interesting addition to Jenara.

    Nath of the Gilt-Leaf: Liliana's Triumph and Davriel, Rogue Shadowmage fit this deck's theme nicely. Casualties of War is again very powerful.

    From there her decks are more niche as they are all tribal (Merfolk, Cats, and mono-black Vampires) but I do imagine that Liliana's Triumph also makes its way into the Vampire deck.

    This deck also makes me want to build an Izzet or Grixis spells and 'walkers deck, and build Feather, the Redeemed.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Random Card of the Day: Tephraderm
    Quote from DirkGently »
    I don't really have a strong opinion on this, but do you really think vryn's is the best? I think it's a bit wrong to say that the floor is a looter - the flip is not optional, if you want him to stay a looter you don't have that option. If you're sitting on a grave with no spells to flashback, and enemies with boards that will easily kill him once he flips...I'd much rather have a regular ol' merfolk looter in that situation.

    New jace pisses me off. Lab man is already annoying as butts. Hard to say how jace will compare, but it's not my idea of fun.

    Personally, new jace aside for now, I don't think any of the jaces are particularly great. Blue planeswalkers in general tend to either be underwhelming in fair decks, or they're locking down the board with stasis or something in which case, sure, they look good then. I much prefer white/green/black walkers that hold their own without degeneracy. Most of the mono-blue ones just have a bunch of boring draw abilities.


    That's a fair point. I still think he is the best Jace because of his low cost, flexibility, and power when built around (which mostly just requires you running some amount of affordable, powerful instants and sorceries). That means he has a reliable home in decks beyond just mill tribal and planeswalker tribal, which is where most other Jaces belong.

    But I agree with your other point - no Jace is amazing or staple level. Even the top three I listed are going to be "solid roleplayers in the right deck" and not "auto-include all-stars". Planeswalkers are mostly poor in Commander because they draw inordinate hate, are hard to protect, and have diminishing effect in multiplayer. I'd say outside of the "top five" 'walkers (which are in my book Tezzeret the Seeker, Garruk Wildspeaker, Elspeth, Sun's Champion, Dack Fayden, and Daretti, Scrap Savant) most planeswalkers are overrated and run too often in decks that can't really support them and where they aren't really doing anything relevant enough to justify their slot.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Random Card of the Day: Tephraderm
    With WotS, we will have 11 Jaces so time for my ranking of Jaces!

    11. Jace, the Living Guildpact: By far the worst Jace you can get for EDH. The ultimate is okay but not amazing with Doubling Season, and his other effects are super underwhelming. I wouldn't even really run him in Muldrotha, Sidisi, Atraxa, or Tasigur and I'm shocked he has 1200 homes on EDHRecs.
    10. Jace, Arcane Strategist: I will go out on a limb and say that new intro deck Jace is pretty bad. We have a lot of Jaces that can +1 or +2 to draw us cards. His passive ability is interesting but limited to just 1 counter a turn which is weak for six mana, and his ultimate is awful. Should show you how much I disrespect Guildpact that this is still in 10th though.
    9. Jace, Ingenious Mind-Mage: I actually don't hate this Jace; +1 to untap all your creatures could have some uses and he can ultimate right away for a big thievery effect with Doubling Season. 6 mana is just a lot. At 4 or 5, I think I'd run him in a lot of Ux tribal lists, especially ones that cared about tapping and untapping creatures (Elves, Merfolk); at six he's just a tad too slow.
    8. Jace, Cunning Castaway: A reasonable card in need of a good deck. Extremely funny with Doubling Season, but ultimately doesn't actually DO much of anything. Will probably take off when we finally get an illusions commander.
    7. Jace, Unraveler of Secrets: THIS is what we're looking for when we think of nonsense shenanigans with Doubling Season. Extremely powerful with that combo, extremely underwhelming without it.
    6. Jace Beleren: I actually think OG Jace is a bit overrated. He is the second most played Jace in Commander, and you are ultimately paying a lot for a Arena/Howling mine hybrid effect that is very fragile. That's not to say you should never run it, as it can be fine in turbo-fog decks and controlling lists but it isn't the sort of staple that its play stats would indicate.
    5. Jace, Memory Adept: I was surprised at how much this guy is played, but he is really fun in any mill-centric build. I give him props for being good and playable somewhere other than superfriends.
    4. Jace, Architect of Thought: For my money, this is what I really want in Superfriends as he should just win the game if you have DS out which is much better than crippling your opponents. Ultimate, bribery everyone, and go get the new Bolas or OG Ugin or Tamiyo, Field Researcher or whatever out of your own deck. The best Jace in superfriends, and his other abilities make him not unplayable in durdly control decks.
    3. Jace, the Mind Sculptor: The most played Jace feels overrated in this format as well. He's not a natural in Superfriends because he is one of the few Jaces that can't auto-ult. His brainstorm can enable some combos and he's a good 'walker to loop with Muldrotha, but he isn't an autoinclude.
    2. Jace, Wielder of Mysteries: I am also going to go out on a limb and say that putting Laboratory Maniac on a planeswalker that also can Thought Scour every turn to gain loyalty is going to be preeetttttty good. That triple UUU hurts but I see lots of decks, especially monoblue ones, adding this Jace.
    1. Jace, Vryn's Prodigy / Jace, Telepath Unbound: The 3rd most played Jace, but I think he should be played more. The floor here is a looter which is never awful, and the ceiling is a 'walker who can offer a lot of recursion. Tons of fun, can be a commander - clearly the best Jace in EDH.

    TL;DR; Unraveler of Secrets is pretty mediocre and should only be played in Superfriend decks that are too poor to afford all the best 'walkers. I imagine his stock is going to drop a lot come War of the Spark, as there is going to be so much more competition in superfriends lists.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Potential “finale of....” cyclee “CONFIRMED!”
    Now that we know this is real...

    Finale of Destruction (the green one) is bonkers. Adding an extra G to Green Sun's Zenith for sure weakens it, but it can fetch from graveyard and if you manage to conjure 12 mana you also get to win on the spot. The fact that it can seemingly hit ANY creature (and not just green creatures) is also a very big deal. Seems like an instant-add to Elfball decks, a Commander staple, and a possible major player in Modern and Standard.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Finale of Revelation (PcGamer.com preview)
    Seems safe and underwhelming at first glance since XUU to untap only five lands can be blah, but in ye old High Tide engine this has real power since you can go off as early as turn 6 and it draws you waaaay more cards than Time Spiral. I imagine this will become a staple of all Ux combo-ish spellslinger decks. What'll be interesting is to see if it also becomes a major player in 'Tron or Amulet decks in Modern.

    Also this confirms the "Finale" cycle we had spoiled the other day, which means Green gets a spicy new GSZ clone.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God in modern
    I am sorry to double-post, but now I have to take it back - this card may be the real deal in Modern thanks to The Elderspell, which can enable you to instantly win by supercharging Bolas. Here's my take on a uBR Control Deck with such a theme...



    The goal is to get to two walkers on board, and then cast Bolas + The Elderspell to intantly get to 8 and end the game. The Elderspell is able to kill any opposting Teferis or Jaces or Lilis that might be stopping you. Ashiok, Dovin, and your own Lilis are here to run interference, slow opponents down, and protect you while being reay to get Elderspelled, while Karn does something similar while also enabling some bonkers sideboard shenanigans. Beyond that we've got a pretty standard sort of "tap-out control" suite.
    Posted in: New Card Discussion
  • posted a message on war of the spark seems like a high power set
    Wow, after just a few more days we have even more stuff! This set's power level is pretty bonkers indeed. No sure things, but lots of "worth testings":

    Deliver Unto Evil: In addition to having absolutely sick art and a sweet name, this card offers a very powerful effect that is a sort of hybrid of Yawgmoth's Will with the mindgames of Fact or Fiction and Gifts Ungiven (and with no restrictions so you can "cheese it" like folks do with Intuition). The cards I just mentioned are among MtG's most powerful and exciting in history, so I suspect this will make waves even ignoring the Bolas rider. And of course, with the Bolas rider this card is power nine levels of insanity...but that's so unlikely to work that it's more a sidegrade than a real thing.

    The Elderspell: Despite the absolute hysteria happening over in the reveal thread, this is most likely just a sideboard card - but it is a hell of a sideboard card. Also interesting is some sort of Grixis Superfriends that uses this on their OWN walkers to instantly ultimate someone like Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God or Jace, the Mind Sculptor to win the game. That actually seems spicy enough to be worth testing in Modern, especially with a few other revealed cards today...

    Ashiok, Dream Render: Speak of the devil, here's a walker I'd love to have kick around until I was ready to slam UBBBBBR for the instant God-Dragon Elderspell KO. A permanent Shadow of Doubt (or the most relevant part of Stranglehold) would have my attention at 1(U/B)(U/B) and might be worth sideboarding around given how devastating it is in a world of fetchlands. The fact that good ol' Ashi ALSO mills four cards and then exiles their entire graveyard up to five times before they bite the dust is just gravy and lets Ashiok do double-duty as both Grave hate and Tutor hate or help enable mill wins. I'd be tempted to say Ashiok was a sure thing if it wasn't for its wording preventing you from making mischief with Ghost Quarter and Field of Ruin and Path to Exile, but I still think its a contender.

    Ugin, the Ineffable: Six mana is a lot, but making all colorless spells cost 2 less, blowing up permanents, and summoning 2/2 dorks that draw cards is a real card. I could see it being tested in Tron and Eldrazi decks just because of how powerful all his effects are.

    God-Eternal Kefnet: Here me out! This card is VERY gross with extra turn effects. While it is itself a bit slow and easily disrupted and all the good top-of-library manipulation is largely banned, this can easily go off with an extra turn effect and goes infinite with an extra turn effect + Jace, the Mind Sculptor or Scroll Rack. Is it enough to take the "Taking Turns" deck out of meme status and into the realm of a real deck? I would love to test it.



    Posted in: New Card Discussion
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