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  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia Signups
    No hydras please.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia Signups
    No deadlines. Games end when there are no replacements left on the planet.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Ever Changing Seasons Mafia Signups
    /in. I only like summer and hate all other seasons.

    I'm not opposed to this autumn where we still have 25C in November (this never happened before)
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    I also felt that this game was very enjoyable. I liked playing with all of you.

    I was lucky enough to be able to night kill everyone who suspected me.

    Also I enjoyed last's gambit, but I would have liked a bit more preparation. I really like gambiting as scum cause it makes the game more fun.

    I was afraid I'd blew it all when KJ made the comment about me waiting for them to pounce on each other. That was exactly what I was doing and I could find no way to dismiss it so I just chose to ignore it.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    Quote from Killjoy »
    Note: Also had a thought that the Vaimes kill was more likely vez.


    I pondered killing you and claiming bodyguard who got blocked on the emiko kill, but I was afaraid that Vaimes would figure me out.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    At least you didn't get mislynched cantrip.

    Wisp replaces in and claimed the peek without deliberation in scum chat. We just rolled with it. I was scared I'd just screw myself at the end, but it worked out better than expected. I really tried to put work into the last two game days.

    It didn't really help my motivation when my last buddy replaced out and Sir Chris simply didn't post anything. I'm glad I could carry it to the end.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    Sorry guys. Nice game, but this LyLo was nerve wracking.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    vote killjoy
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    It's on this and the previous page. I don't have time to write another big post.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    I will give Cantrip 9 and a bit hours from this post to post whatever he still wants to post and then I will vote. I have stuff to do today and do not have time for big reviews. I wanted to finish yesterday, but I didn't because Cantrip asked for.more time.

    I am not going to answer such question at the end of the game for KJ. I think I've been pretty clear about why I think Cantrip is scum.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    Quote from Cantripmancer »
    Quote from Vaimes »
    My dream is a CFD onto LW.
    Can you point out what moved you from 614, town-reading Wisp and 638, still seem to be town reading Wisp to 784, adding Wisp to your would kill list?



    While looking through more Cantrip posts I found this.

    Quote from Vaimes »
    Quote from Lastwhisper »
    you can probably lynch me in a couple day phases if I dont radiate towniness
    LMAOOO I am DUMB, I thought Meg posted this.

    Also why would any villager claiming a PR ever say this.


    Vaimes posted this literally 3 posts before 784 that is a reason and pretty self explanatory. I think it comes from scum Cantrip scanning the thread for his buddies names and missing that a post relates to them just through a quote.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    Quote from Cantripmancer »
    I really liked KJ's Tom/Silver unalignment (explained further in later posts). I'm sure there's scum motivation to bust up that town catfight, but most scum would be content to let town slap it out.


    He calls them not both scum. Busting up the fight would imply some sort of convincing tom and silver to stop or at least calling them both town. But I agree that scum would rather let it play out.


    I get a slight "mediator"/"conductor" vibe from some of KJ's posts. Like in 357 where he unvotes Rhand, then asks Rhand a question, then hedges on a Tom read (but says he'll look into it), then pushes Tom to look at KCC, then asks KCC about her Vez read, then asks Vez about KCC as well. That said, his responses to Silver in that post feel very natural, and at the end of the post when I tinfoil scum!Silver/scum!Tom theatre, KJ dismisses it pretty quickly and completely, which doesn't feel like a choice scum makes.

    The secret way to read scum!Tom would be a rather brilliant bit of posturing from scum!KJ.


    Agree with all this.


    KJ is rather vague on why he likes Rhand's post, just saying that it has none of the things KJ associates with scum!Rhand and some things that seem town!Rhand (without going into any detail). Hmm, in 886 he tells Megs that he's not going into detail on purpose so that he can later catch Rhand as scum. Oh, he eventually goes into detail in 1664, but that's after Rhandslot flipped scum.

    That is certainly how stuff happened. I don't think scum KJ townreads a buddy for such vague reasons. This is too wolfy to be a wolf territory and I believe the story he peddled.


    Quote from Killjoy »
    Something to keep in mind vis a vis the n0 peek was that the last (possibly only?) game it was in here on MTGS was by the same mod.

    tom: Why does scum!Last fakeclaim immediately after the end of Modern given what happened?
    This could be inside info, but just as easily could be KJ happening to make that connection. The last line is the kind of argument that I'd expect Wisp's buddies to push, but I also pushed it, lol.

    I also played in that game and knew about Bur's role. I assume other people knew and it feels like KJ being helpful more than him coordinating with buddies.

    Not sure about the Modern claim connection. Seems pretty NAI seeing as how both of you did it and one of you is town. Cantrip is probably being cheeky here.

    Quote from Killjoy »
    So, a few things before I start.

    I'd say based on his posts, Last is slightly more likely town than scum. Even if we forget the claim debacle in Modern, there's a real engagement in his posts that aren't usually there as scum. I will not help you lynch Last today.

    Now that Rhand has posted some more, I can say this for sure: Rhand is town. I started having a few doubts because he started getting snipey, but then he posted some more and I can say for (mostly) sure that this is pure town Rhand.

    Also, I was thinknig about it at work: Rhand/Tom are likely unaligned for 633:
    Quote from tomsloger »
    Dont think the rhand wagon is too fast or spewy or whatever. First 3 votes are clearly town to me, and vez/megs are possible scum that im not seeing as unaligned with him anyway
    This is a weird position to take on a scumbuddy. Letting people think that the wagon speed pushes him in the town direction would be playing to his wincon if they were buddies, and letting him hang here doesn't make tom look good so there's no reason for him to do it if they're buddies.

    That said, Last was the one who declared the wagon fast enough to make Rhand town be likely. And last pushes it a little. So there's some scum equity for the two of them... but for that to be true I'd have to be wrong on both of them. I'm putting it in my notes nonetheless.
    I initially liked the Tom/Rhand unalignment here, but... KJ, why do you "supertown" Rhand here, then try to suss Tom's alignment from how Tom would treat Rhand if they were buddies?

    This is one of the posts that I have a hard time believing comes from scum. KJ's scumreading Tom and Silver posts an unofficial votecount and naked votes Tom and KJ questions Silver.

    I've noticed several drops of "I've done this before". Current one is at the end of 935, but I know there were others. Could be an attempt to reinforce the feeling of "this is normal (town) KJ".


    I think this is a bit reachy. I see the point, but pairs of unalignments are different than reads on individuals.


    Another example of a conductor post, using Vez's read on Megiddo in conjunction with Megiddo's self-meta to involve both in a conversation. But that could probably come from town, as well, wanting to get reads (vs. stirring the pot).
    [quote from="Killjoy »" url="/forums/community-forums/mafia/814379-eurovision-mafia-day-5-no-love?comment=1068"]Id just like to point out that that KK and Cantrip (at the 11th hour) somehow found more support than the Meg wagon despite the fact that it's been kinda holding on all Day. That is a thing that could be relevant.
    KJ, what conclusion were you coming to with this observation?

    1209. KJ highlights my D1 suspicion of Megiddo for being a counterwagon and asks if I think Rhand could be scum instead of Megs, which doesn't really feel like a buddy move. Comments to Emiko about the Wisp/Vez relationship could be trying to get Emiko thinking Vez is scum, but the questions there don't feel manipulative, just inquisitive.

    KJ says I wasn't a Rhand/Meg counterwagon, just a CFD, and asks me who the scum on my wagon were. Which is pretty savvy if KJ knows that my wagon was all-town.

    Actually, I sorta get the impression of KJ waiting to spring a trap in 1225 and 1239. Like he's trying to build associations between me and Rhand.

    I don't think KJ ever doubts KCC after her claim? Which feels slightly less likely to come from town than from scum.

    I probably should have kept track of the number of times KJ towned Wisp/Rhand and/or pushed away from them. It happens a lot.
    Quote from Killjoy »
    Apperently I never quoted it. Frown

    I'll try to find it over night and hope I'm alive enough to post it.

    Scum very likely just all in [Cantrip, Last, Meg, Vaimes, with Chris a distant 5th]
    This post does the opposite for me that it seems to do for Vez: there's no progression I can see between KJ thinking Rhand is town and here. There are a few posts where he says one of Megiddo or Rhand is probably scum, but then he pushes Megiddo all over the place. In fact, his very next post has KJ asking people to summarize why Rhandslot is scum. Several mentions of wanting to let Chris talk before he gets lunched.


    I kinda got bored, but I don't really have much to say here except about the distant 5th part. Just mentioning a buddy as a lycnh candidate who you previously suspiciously townread isn;t the best place to be. You draw attention to him when you probably don't want to.

    The last part of the post is just an appeal to emotion.

    I'm Domenico Modugno - Nel Blue Dipinto Di Blu maybe better known as Volare. Also a vanilla townie.

    I'm certainly leaning heavily on Cantrip at the moment, will see what you post while I'm asleep and decide on a vote when I wake up.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    I finiahed work, but I'm going out for a bit. I will answer all outstanding questions when I get home.
    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    @KJ: Can you point out other posts from Rhand where you feel he "has decent progression on people and (not usually, pretty much always) asks questions that he cares about. Town!Rhand makes similar posts to 549" ?

    Posted in: Mafia
  • posted a message on Eurovision Mafia - Game Over - Europe will crumble
    KJ RVS vote on Rhand is a bit weird, but his reaction to being questioned is solid.

    #357 has questions for Rhand where he asks about tom/silver and comments on shadow not giving a direction when saying we shouldn't focus on tom/silver.

    Could be interaction with buddies or simply noting stuff.

    Quote from Killjoy »
    Quote from shadowlancerx »
    @Vaimes: kinda think I want to go this direction, Vote KK

    I do not like his “Tom may have dropped down to 75%, but I’m at more like 80%”, that’s awkward enough to look manufactured.
    Thank you. More posts like this please. I can't read you if you don't do anything.


    Feels a bit like coaching.

    #455 also feels a bit like coaching Rhand to post more, but can also come from town trying to solve.

    Quote from Killjoy »
    Quote from Rhand »
    Caught up bit skimmed parts of tom vs silver.
    If there is scum in tom/silver, it’s tom. Scum!silver wouldn’t draw all that attention to himself and would have dropped it when there was no support coming, while scum!tom has the confidence to push a mislynch like this and get away with it afterwards.

    That said, I think it’s more likely KK is scum and tom and silver both town.
    The way he picked a side at a moment where multiple people were saying that we should move our focus elsewhere makes a lot of sense from a scum standpoint that wants to continue this fight.

    Megs has a post somewhere that almost reads like a confession. Will look it up when not on the phone.

    My current world is KK/Megs/Vaimes?
    The Vaimes read is still flimsy though.

    @tom: where did KJ show he likes your fight?
    @silver It has none of the features I attribute to scum Rhand, and some of the things town Rhand tends to do. So more town than not.

    If he can maintain it then he's probably town. It should start to really see after a few more posts like this one.


    This feels like positioning for a Rhand town read.

    Quote from Killjoy »
    A few things before I start catching up fully again:

    I'm pretty sure Rhand is town. The way he's handling the game is very much in line with his town game. His wagon should be informative to dissect.

    I think Last is lying about his claim, but I don't think he's scum for it. He's probably >rand town for his claim actually. He just got off a game where he lost a game by blowing his claim. He came into this game immediately claiming. It would be... pretty ballsy to risk fakeclaiming so immediately after Modern.
    Actually, if shadow didn't get to pick his target, as was my role in Death in the Family... maybe it's real. I was gonna say that shadow 110% picks tom for an n0 peek but he may not have had a choice.

    I feel like there was something else. I can't remember.


    Calling both scum town in a single post. This feels like a pretty balsy thing to do as scum. I'd assume scum KJ would at least mention another person to muddy the waters. Overall I think this post comes from town more often than scum.

    #749 is a defense of Rhand's activity, but it's a fair point.

    Quote from Killjoy »
    So, a few things before I start.

    I'd say based on his posts, Last is slightly more likely town than scum. Even if we forget the claim debacle in Modern, there's a real engagement in his posts that aren't usually there as scum. I will not help you lynch Last today.

    Now that Rhand has posted some more, I can say this for sure: Rhand is town. I started having a few doubts because he started getting snipey, but then he posted some more and I can say for (mostly) sure that this is pure town Rhand.

    Also, I was thinknig about it at work: Rhand/Tom are likely unaligned for 633:
    Quote from tomsloger »
    Dont think the rhand wagon is too fast or spewy or whatever. First 3 votes are clearly town to me, and vez/megs are possible scum that im not seeing as unaligned with him anyway
    This is a weird position to take on a scumbuddy. Letting people think that the wagon speed pushes him in the town direction would be playing to his wincon if they were buddies, and letting him hang here doesn't make tom look good so there's no reason for him to do it if they're buddies.

    That said, Last was the one who declared the wagon fast enough to make Rhand town be likely. And last pushes it a little. So there's some scum equity for the two of them... but for that to be true I'd have to be wrong on both of them. I'm putting it in my notes nonetheless.

    Now, on to reading some more.I'll probably make a t/s list before the end of the night.

    Oh, @Silver: Why are you willing to lynch half the game right now? 5 people is a bit much for D1, isn't it?


    Another defense on both Rhand and Last. The fact that KJ switched to defending KCC and trying to get last lynched later speaks to this being a genuine read at that moment more than faking a townread on a scumbuddy.

    #864 is a read list with KCC at the top, followed by Rhand and last. Makes sense to believe KCC more than last if she is on higher on your readlist.

    #1099 is an attack on last. Not sure why scum would attack a buddy after townreading them all game. Maybe they discussed during the night to distance from each other? Seems implausible as it's just not a good strategy.

    Quote from Killjoy »
    I think that KCC is town here. Her play this game of poking around is EXACTLY how a cop would probably act. Of the two I'd lynch Wisp, but I want it to be said that I don't actually want to lynch between them until we have a full claim going on. I'd like to know the full set up before I decide there's a dichotomy. I can't remember the game, but there were two roleblockers on town and I think we lost because of that in it.

    I'm still on town Rhand. My view on him is similar to KCC's view on me. I'm confident I can read him. I think he's town this game.

    I actually think Wisp+Vezok is a very real possibility given Vezok's play+positions. She hasn't given Wisp a fair shake, I feel.

    My world is kinda at Megs < Wisp(+Vezok?) < Vaimes < Cantrip.


    Wisp went from third townread to second likeliest scum. The progression makes sense though. Still thinking Rhand is town and being very sure of it.
    I don't like the fact he wants a full claim and doesn't want to lynch between the cops.

    #1394 is a big defense of KCC. Solid arguments. The scum strategy I see from this play and the previous post is to bus last hard and push for a mislynch on me later down the road, except KJ didn't do that. He continued to question the whole game and hasn't focused on me at all. This again points to KJ being town.

    Quote from Killjoy »
    Apperently I never quoted it. Frown

    I'll try to find it over night and hope I'm alive enough to post it.

    Scum very likely just all in [Cantrip, Last, Meg, Vaimes, with Chris a distant 5th]


    This post kinda seals the deal for me. Why would KJ who townread Chrisslot all game suddenly add him as potential scum candidate and totally drop me, who he can push after last dies. This seems like the worst path imaginable to take as scum in this situation.

    KJ on day 3 asks people to wait so Sir Chris can talk more. Could be scum trying to wait for a buddy to save himself, but I'd assume they talk in scumchat about this and decide on a plan.

    Quote from Killjoy »
    @Vaimes: I would have answered had the day not ended so soon. I fell asleep, then when I woke up the day was over.

    Since my Rhand meta is apparently outdated, there's no point in holding it back now. Town!Rhand doesn't know who the scum are. Town!Rhand (usually) has decent progression on people and (not usually, pretty much always) asks questions that he cares about. Town!Rhand makes similar posts to 549. Scum!Rhand doesn't care about his questions, has fake progression overall.

    The problem with reading Rhand based on typical mafia tells is he makes a lot of them as town. I've tried that, it doesn't work for me. So I tried this, and it was working until now. So, thats why I read Rhand that way. I will note that I did notice/eyebrowed (but didn't really put too much stock into that because I thought my meta was much stronger than it was.

    Now, like I said that post I quoted there was the only thing I had noted as people with scum equity together, so I was getting ready to at least reanalyze Rhand. Which is why I was saying that we should give Chris a chance to speak. I wanted to talk to him. I wanted to see if he ALSO didn't question my read on him. You'll notice in my post following his replace I said I had a townread on him with for no reason or whatever... I wanted to see his reaction to that. But then Day ended.

    Do you have any questions for me about my scumread of you from earlier? I thought I explained that. (I think that might have been wrong now, but it was for sure there at one point.)


    This feels like a good explanation of why he townread Rhand. I really like the part where he said he wanted a response from Chris for sayinghe townreads the slot for undisclosed reasons.

    Overall I really hoped I'd find more in my reread to point to KJ being town, but his read progression is pretty solid. I'm going to reread Cantrip one more time before I vote, because I really expected more townniness from KJ's iso.


    Posted in: Mafia
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