About Phyrexian Revoker: as I was working in MWS I noticed that the card hit planeswalkers/Fauna Shaman, and I had one of those "oh duh!" moments, the card is worth fitting in and I renounce my past statement. Thnaks for pointing it out though.
I really like the idea of at least one Wurmcoil as a finisher/later Metamorph target. With all the fishing you can do with Tezz/Jace (if your running him) its seems like a good idea.
I see the deck as being very slow, and thats typical of a Stax-ish deck, however you need something to help you avoid their creatures with your Tezz 5/5's and what not. A board clear of some sort like Ratchet Bomb or Black Sun's Zenith might work.
What does the Phyrexian Revoker stop that your Torpor Orb doesn't? I just don't see the value in that card. I'd drop it in favor of some more disruption or CA.
Mana Leak needs a spot in this deck. It really likes people having to spend more to play spells. Also, did you consider Norn's Annex over Dissipation Field?
I really like your deck and with a control shell I think it could be very solid overall. I'm going to try and put together a list including some of the changes I mentioned and see what you guys think. I'll have it up later.
MWS Nickname: [MTGS]Monopause Country: United States, Pennsylvania Timezone: GMT -05:00 Availability: Pretty random, however most days before 5pm, and most nights after 11pm.
Currently Testing: Bant/Superion aggro, and GWB Birthing Pod Toolbox.
Tier 1: I'm working on putting all the decks together so I can play and learn them.
Special Notes: I recently started playing magic again, and I want to get to know the format. Also i'm new to MWS so I may be a bit slow.
World Queller does seem Lackluster at best which was a major issue in the original R/W list, and more than likely will be coming out for Baneslayer Angel, but I wanted to try him out at least to make sure. I like Kitesail because I can tutor for it, and thats really the only reason for it being there. I does seem to help getting over problem creatures.
Instead of being defensive I wanted more offense, which is why I didn't include Wall of Denial, which doesn't mean it shouldn't be in here.
This deck evolved from what originally started as a R/W World Queller deck. Not having any game early really put a damper on my testing against Vampires and Boros. I eventually added blue for cards like Treasure Hunt and Into the Roil, and Knight of the White Orchid from white to help with the early onslaught and mana fixing. I thought the potential for a solid mid-range deck was there, so this is what I came up with:
The issue I'm having with this thread is that we're talking about very different decks. I can easily see the upside/downside of the two more popular lists. (RW and Bant) There are issues with both.
I understand that mana ramping into a turn 2 resounding wave is really good, however relying on mana dorks to get the job done is unreliable at best. As Tessie said: cheap, efficient removal is everywhere, and most likely a Noble hierarch/Birds of paradise will just get bolted/removed in some way, however Pulling it off can send your opponent into a never ending spiral of denial. On the other end in the RW version starting too late is devastating, however their permanent denial in scepter of dominance and Ajani Vengeant can provide and the stepping stones to provide a soft lock on the opponent and consistent survivability. I really think RW needs to stop trying to destroy lands, and consist of more permanent denial.
We're discussing two very different decks, and thats something that needs to be realized. With that said after much deliberation my friends and I came up with this RW version.
We just don't think that land destruction is the way to go, we wanted to focus more on permanent denial. So no Roiling Terrain, Tectonic Edge, or Goblin Ruinblaster. Theres just not enough decks running enough Non-basic Lands to make those cards worth while main. I'm not trying to say we're not going to destroy lands with this deck, I think we just want to do our best to make them plateau on development. We needed to strain the mana as much as possible, which is why Lodestone golem and Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs are significant creatures. If anyone is good with rulings, does Lodestone Golem make cascaded spells cost 1 to play? We were pretty sure it does, similar to how Chalice of the void counters Hypergenesis.
We also considered enchantments like Oblivion Ring and Journey to Nowhere. They just didn't seem to mesh well with Queller against a decent number of decks, we'd rather keep it tapped down or make you sac it with queller.
I took out Ethersworn Canonist in favor of mass removal. Odds are your going to want to wrath on turn 4/3 if you can so I didn't want any of my dudes getting in the way, also he was thoroughly underwhelming. Knight of the White Orchid was also considered for the same spot, however its not guaranteed mana ramp and it also gets in the way of our wrath effects.
The mass removal is for the early game mostly. It clears a path for our significant creatures. Martial Coup is a great card for this deck, especially followed by a Queller. Having 5 1/1 dudes really helps you name creature if you have to.
I'm not 100% sold on Intimidation Bolt and may want to replace it with something like Angelsong, but I'll know what needs to be changed after some more serious testing.
I saw two cards from World Wake that really stood out to me, Wolfbriar Elemental and Smother. So I started to break down the Elemental and realized how great it could be. Four mana for a 4/4 isn't good enough in this format anymore, however five mana for a 6/6, six mana for an 8/8, and 7 mana for a 10/10, all seem pretty solid. Smother on the other hand seems really good right now too, hitting many solid creatures in many decks.
Those two cards were my inspiration to make this deck:
As much as it seems like its going to be very mana intensive it really isn't, most of the deck revolves around holding them off until you can beat them down with 2/2's and solid creatures (like Rock). The deck seems to have a solid early presence in the creatures/removal.
I'm looking for some input on how to improve the deck before I continue with testing and was hoping to see if anyone here had solid ideas for inclusion/removal. Thanks ahead of time for the input.
I put your deck in tags so its easier to look over. A few notes:
1. 99% of the time Sculler and Day shouldn't be in the same list, especially without instant speed discard, i.e. Esper charm 2. With the amount of card advantage in most decks simple discard is nothing more than an annoyance, unless your creating 2 for ones, i.e. blightning and Esper charm. 3. I like the rats in combination with the Rises for Marauder, Iona, and Sculler. However 4 Rises just doesn't seem like enough graveyard recursion to get the control that your looking for, and rotting rats are a horrible top-deck late game.
I think you should focus on more answers and CA. Try dropping 1 Liliana and the disfigures for O-rings, and Scullers for Duress and/or an extra Day.
On progenitus: I don't think we need him, we can cast Iona on our own, which is nice, we can't do that to progenitus. Iona creates a lock which often keeps our opponent from killing us, and protects Iona. Progenitus still dies to Day, and allows them to still cast spells to kill us with, even though their on a two turn clock. Progenitus just isn't good against control, (day, Safe Passage, angelsong.) where as Iona is good against all types of decks.
Demonic Tutor? Yeah, I play that card every week in my standard decks...
I'm fairly certain we all knew he meant Diabolic tutor... Thanks for the input though.
Anyway. I really don't think tutors are necessary. We should have enough draw to keep our hand full of what we need, which is why things like courier's capsule and into the roil are great inclusions at instant speed.
Also if you want to run Wall of Denial I don't thin you run Day of Judgment. They both have their bonuses however I think we will almost always want to clear the board before Iona hits and thats what Day will do for us.
I've been testing out this deck with a few tweaks. I really want to try out Angelsong and Kiss of the Amesha. Maybe dropping a combination of capsules, negates, and agony warps for 2 kiss and 3 angelsong. It would look like this:
It's missing Day of Judgment. Without it you won't be able to keep the board clear enough for Iona to save the day.
I like ponder, its good for fixing draws, however I think you just need to draw more cards. So instead of that maybe consider courier's capsule, or Divination. Preferably capsule because it draws at instant speed.
I also feel like Angelsong should be in here. It's good against aggro, and against control it draws you more cards.
Try: -1 Sphinx, -1 Iona, -1 o-ring, -4 ponder, +4 Day of Judgment, +3 Courier's capsule.
Also: -4 Cancel, +4 Flashfreeze. (Most of the time Flasfreeze is worth it, unless your meta is all control, or Vampires.)
I wouldn't be surprised if they just do allied man-lands. I don't think that it would necessarily take the place of Valakut however. I mean we might as well be running Gargoyle Castle or something then.
Also, Valakut doesn't die to creature removal, man-lands will. As stated before our creatures better be able to create more than a 1 for 1 otherwise they aren't worth running, even if they're a land.
Jazzy: I noticed that your still running Lavaball Trap. So I was wondering what kind of implications does it have over Path and Hell's Thunder MB? I was wondering because I've been toying with the idea of running it MB over Earthquake. My experinces point me away from Earthquake MB against Jund, often it seemed mediocre at best. However with Lavaball trap MB it seems to really wreck their board, Broodmate included. There is a decent bit of jund in my meta along with control, and Lavaball trap just seems better against both decks.
What does earthquake help us with really? Weenie decks mostly, (Boros) however it dosen't help much against RDW, Vampires (An online Nocturnus completly kills it), Jund. Also with the SGC's, Day, and direct Damage against decks like Boros we should be able to hold them off until we establish board control anyway.
Earthquake can win you the game in an instant, your at 6 and they are at five and you earthquake for five. It really does help get that damage in, however do we really need it? I'd like to know what you guys think? Mainly in the matchup against jund, which general consensus is to out run it with the Hell sideboard.
How do people think they're able to target Deft Duelist with Gigantiform?
I've been following this thread for a while and I can't believe people are still asking the same question, not even three pages back I think there's an explanation. There are even websites that provide rulings on cards, and 99% of the time they will answer any question you might have. However...
A kicked Gigantiform or a trigger from Sovereigns, neither of which actually target anything.
Edit: Also, clicking on a link from one of the posted decks brings up the rulings to the right of the cards picture in the page that pops up.
Round 1: Bant Midrange- Game one was a little intense, I never really had enough removal to kill off his second Rhox War Monk which kept him in the game longer than he should have been. An online Valakut, and a well used Panorama finish him off in the end. No sideboard here.
In game 2 I kill a first turn Hierarch, and he dosen't see a third land until after I have a Vengeant in play and he scoops shortly after. 2-0
Round 2: Grixis Discard- Game one he hits me with a few direct damage spells/blightning, but I manage to stabilize. Around turn 7 or so, I'm sitting at 8 life and he has 2 specters in his graveyard, he unearths them while I have no removal and finishes me off with a burst lightning. - 1 Martial Coup, -2 Day, +3 Purge.
Game 2 he gets really mana screwed and never really gets to pull anything on me, however I couldn't draw a finisher for the life of me, I drew all four Sphere's had all my mountains and plains in play, along with one Valakut that I played after most of my lands were already in play. Finally after much waiting I draw a Vengeant and he clinches the finish.
Game 3 He gets mana screwed again... However valakut runs like a dream (finally) and makes short work of him via SGC. 2-1
Round 3: More Bant Midrange- Game 1 the bant deck curves out perfectly, has a great draw, via Battlegrace angel, Escort, and Brave the elements . He climbs to 28 life and i fall to 8. I see my hand, and I'm sitting pretty with a martial coup, SGC, Bolt and chandra. However I need to survive 2 more turns to get the mana necessary to play it with the alternate effect, and I need to kill the Escort. I draw a land and play Siege gang. Next turn he attacks and deals me 5 with his angel, the destroys my SGC. I'm down to 3 life. I draw into a vengeant, play a land(now at 6), I play my vengeant keeping his angel tapped and bolt the Escort, finally killing it, I wasted at least three burn spells trying to kill it. He then goes and attack with a Hierarch and I block, no responses. Next turn I play a land and cast a chandra killing off his Angel, and keeping one of his lands tapped with vengeant. I'm pretty sure he draaws into land and passes the turn. I finally cast my martial coup kicked and take board control with 2 planeswalkers in play. He dies shortly after through a combination of 6 tokens and Hell's thunders.
Game 2 he gets mana screwed and I get a vengeant to 7 counters and pop it once he's about to stabilize a bit, not a whole lot else happens and I win. 2-0
Round 4: GW reliquary- Game one I don't see much of his deck and I'm not too sure what hes trying to do, however a surviving SGC finishes him off. No boarding.
Game 2 I see his lotus cobra which in combination with a reliquary turn two reliquary lets him kill one of my two lands on his turn 3 keeping me behind the rest of the game until he reliquary's me to death.
Game three I get the necessary removal and a good hand, however I could'nt draw a fifth land until turn 8, removal keeps him at bay and I start to play the bombs in my hand, but its not enough to stabilize and the late land-d keeps me off my board sweepers. 1-2
So I could have easily one that last game if I had a. Drawn a fifth land when I should have, and b. If I had remembered to side in my Needles for the reliquary, because that's what really killed me. It allowed all the necessary ramp for the cobra, and got huge.
This deck is not easy to play. My thought process usually goes something like 1. What land to play 2. Do I need to remove anything on his turn. or is what he has in play irrelevant, which leads me to 3. In how many turns will it take me to kill him? The deck needs planning, three turns in advance. I think my lack of success usually comes from bad plays on my part.
Things that really stuck out to me: Hell's Thunder really helps finish things off. I think Martial coup may be better suited as a 2 of. 90% of the time I get it off its enough to finish the game. I didn't come across any top tier decks, which was a bit disappointing, so I don't feel like it was a significant test, however I was happy with my performance, outside my consistency issues which can be chalked up to player error more than anything else. (there were 2 Vampire decks, and an Eldrazi green deck, and the Jund players didn't show up.)
I really like the idea of at least one Wurmcoil as a finisher/later Metamorph target. With all the fishing you can do with Tezz/Jace (if your running him) its seems like a good idea.
What does the Phyrexian Revoker stop that your Torpor Orb doesn't? I just don't see the value in that card. I'd drop it in favor of some more disruption or CA.
Mana Leak needs a spot in this deck. It really likes people having to spend more to play spells. Also, did you consider Norn's Annex over Dissipation Field?
I really like your deck and with a control shell I think it could be very solid overall. I'm going to try and put together a list including some of the changes I mentioned and see what you guys think. I'll have it up later.
MWS Nickname: [MTGS]Monopause
Country: United States, Pennsylvania
Timezone: GMT -05:00
Availability: Pretty random, however most days before 5pm, and most nights after 11pm.
Currently Testing: Bant/Superion aggro, and GWB Birthing Pod Toolbox.
Tier 1: I'm working on putting all the decks together so I can play and learn them.
Special Notes: I recently started playing magic again, and I want to get to know the format. Also i'm new to MWS so I may be a bit slow.
Instead of being defensive I wanted more offense, which is why I didn't include Wall of Denial, which doesn't mean it shouldn't be in here.
2 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Knight of the White Orchid
4 Sejiri Merfolk
2 World Queller
2 Cunning Sparkmage
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Scepter of Dominance
1 Fabricate
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Into the Roil
3 Treasure Hunt
1 Basilisk Collar
1 Kitesail
3 Ajani Vengeant
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
4 Arid Mesa
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Glacial Fortress
5 Plains
2 Island
4 Mountain
2 Halimar Depths
2 Cunning Sparkmage
3 Celestial Purge
2 Basilisk Collar
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Kor Firewalker
3 Magma Spray
The deck evolved into a kind of hybrid aggro-control build often winning via permanent denial in Scpeter of Dominance, Oblivion Ring, and Ajani Vengeant, followed with 5/3 beaters and Sejiri Merfolk. I really liked Cunning Sparkmage/Basilisk Collar against aggro and decided to include it.
Thanks for the input ahead of time.
I understand that mana ramping into a turn 2 resounding wave is really good, however relying on mana dorks to get the job done is unreliable at best. As Tessie said: cheap, efficient removal is everywhere, and most likely a Noble hierarch/Birds of paradise will just get bolted/removed in some way, however Pulling it off can send your opponent into a never ending spiral of denial. On the other end in the RW version starting too late is devastating, however their permanent denial in scepter of dominance and Ajani Vengeant can provide and the stepping stones to provide a soft lock on the opponent and consistent survivability. I really think RW needs to stop trying to destroy lands, and consist of more permanent denial.
We're discussing two very different decks, and thats something that needs to be realized. With that said after much deliberation my friends and I came up with this RW version.
4 Arid Mesa
5 Mountain
12 Plains
4 World Queller
4 Lodestone Golem
2 Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Martial Coup
3 Day of Judgment
4 Scepter of Dominance
4 Everflowing Chalice
4 Ajani Vengeant
4 Celestial Purge
3 Banefire
3 Rest for the Weary
3 Goblin Ruinblaster
2 ?
We just don't think that land destruction is the way to go, we wanted to focus more on permanent denial. So no Roiling Terrain, Tectonic Edge, or Goblin Ruinblaster. Theres just not enough decks running enough Non-basic Lands to make those cards worth while main. I'm not trying to say we're not going to destroy lands with this deck, I think we just want to do our best to make them plateau on development. We needed to strain the mana as much as possible, which is why Lodestone golem and Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs are significant creatures. If anyone is good with rulings, does Lodestone Golem make cascaded spells cost 1 to play? We were pretty sure it does, similar to how Chalice of the void counters Hypergenesis.
We also considered enchantments like Oblivion Ring and Journey to Nowhere. They just didn't seem to mesh well with Queller against a decent number of decks, we'd rather keep it tapped down or make you sac it with queller.
I took out Ethersworn Canonist in favor of mass removal. Odds are your going to want to wrath on turn 4/3 if you can so I didn't want any of my dudes getting in the way, also he was thoroughly underwhelming. Knight of the White Orchid was also considered for the same spot, however its not guaranteed mana ramp and it also gets in the way of our wrath effects.
The mass removal is for the early game mostly. It clears a path for our significant creatures. Martial Coup is a great card for this deck, especially followed by a Queller. Having 5 1/1 dudes really helps you name creature if you have to.
I'm not 100% sold on Intimidation Bolt and may want to replace it with something like Angelsong, but I'll know what needs to be changed after some more serious testing.
Those two cards were my inspiration to make this deck:
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Oran-Rief, the Vastwood
8 Forest
5 Swamp
4 Putrid Leech
4 Vampire Nighthawk
3 Wolfbriar Elemental
2 Master of the Wild Hunt
3 Fleshbag Marauder
3 Duress
3 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Rampant Growth (Vines of the Vastwood?)
2 Garruk Wildspeaker
2 Rise from the Grave
3 Eldrazi Monument
4 Great Sable Stag
4 Infest
3 Mold Shambler
1 Duress
1 Maelstrom Pulse
2 Bloodhusk Ritualist
As much as it seems like its going to be very mana intensive it really isn't, most of the deck revolves around holding them off until you can beat them down with 2/2's and solid creatures (like Rock). The deck seems to have a solid early presence in the creatures/removal.
I'm looking for some input on how to improve the deck before I continue with testing and was hoping to see if anyone here had solid ideas for inclusion/removal. Thanks ahead of time for the input.
I put your deck in tags so its easier to look over. A few notes:
1. 99% of the time Sculler and Day shouldn't be in the same list, especially without instant speed discard, i.e. Esper charm
2. With the amount of card advantage in most decks simple discard is nothing more than an annoyance, unless your creating 2 for ones, i.e. blightning and Esper charm.
3. I like the rats in combination with the Rises for Marauder, Iona, and Sculler. However 4 Rises just doesn't seem like enough graveyard recursion to get the control that your looking for, and rotting rats are a horrible top-deck late game.
I think you should focus on more answers and CA. Try dropping 1 Liliana and the disfigures for O-rings, and Scullers for Duress and/or an extra Day.
On progenitus: I don't think we need him, we can cast Iona on our own, which is nice, we can't do that to progenitus. Iona creates a lock which often keeps our opponent from killing us, and protects Iona. Progenitus still dies to Day, and allows them to still cast spells to kill us with, even though their on a two turn clock. Progenitus just isn't good against control, (day, Safe Passage, angelsong.) where as Iona is good against all types of decks.
I'm fairly certain we all knew he meant Diabolic tutor... Thanks for the input though.
Anyway. I really don't think tutors are necessary. We should have enough draw to keep our hand full of what we need, which is why things like courier's capsule and into the roil are great inclusions at instant speed.
Also if you want to run Wall of Denial I don't thin you run Day of Judgment. They both have their bonuses however I think we will almost always want to clear the board before Iona hits and thats what Day will do for us.
I've been testing out this deck with a few tweaks. I really want to try out Angelsong and Kiss of the Amesha. Maybe dropping a combination of capsules, negates, and agony warps for 2 kiss and 3 angelsong. It would look like this:
3 Sphinx of Lost Truths
3 Path to Exile
3 Day of Judgment
3 Rise From the Grave
3 Esper charm
3 Courier's Capsule
2 Flashfreeze
2 Negate
2 Agony Warp
2 Into the Roil
3 Angelsong
2 Kiss of the Amesha
4 Drowned Catacombs
4 Glacial Fortress
4 Marsh Flats
4 Island
4 Plains
3 Swamp
1 Flashfreeze
1 Negate
1 Agony warp
2 Into the Roil
3 Essence Scatter
4 Duress
3 Celestial Purge
Any thoughts?
I like ponder, its good for fixing draws, however I think you just need to draw more cards. So instead of that maybe consider courier's capsule, or Divination. Preferably capsule because it draws at instant speed.
I also feel like Angelsong should be in here. It's good against aggro, and against control it draws you more cards.
Try: -1 Sphinx, -1 Iona, -1 o-ring, -4 ponder, +4 Day of Judgment, +3 Courier's capsule.
Also: -4 Cancel, +4 Flashfreeze. (Most of the time Flasfreeze is worth it, unless your meta is all control, or Vampires.)
Also, Valakut doesn't die to creature removal, man-lands will. As stated before our creatures better be able to create more than a 1 for 1 otherwise they aren't worth running, even if they're a land.
What does earthquake help us with really? Weenie decks mostly, (Boros) however it dosen't help much against RDW, Vampires (An online Nocturnus completly kills it), Jund. Also with the SGC's, Day, and direct Damage against decks like Boros we should be able to hold them off until we establish board control anyway.
Earthquake can win you the game in an instant, your at 6 and they are at five and you earthquake for five. It really does help get that damage in, however do we really need it? I'd like to know what you guys think? Mainly in the matchup against jund, which general consensus is to out run it with the Hell sideboard.
I've been following this thread for a while and I can't believe people are still asking the same question, not even three pages back I think there's an explanation. There are even websites that provide rulings on cards, and 99% of the time they will answer any question you might have. However...
A kicked Gigantiform or a trigger from Sovereigns, neither of which actually target anything.
Edit: Also, clicking on a link from one of the posted decks brings up the rulings to the right of the cards picture in the page that pops up.
2 Plains
3 Naya Panorama
4 Arid Mesa
4 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
4 Siege-Gang Commander
3 Hell's Thunder
3 Chandra Nalaar
3 Ajani Vengeant
2 Earthquake
1 Martial Coup
3 Day of Judgment
3 Path to Exile
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Burst Lightning
4 Armillary Sphere
3 Sunspring Expedition
3 Celestial Purge
3 Banefire
3 Pithing Needle
1 Day of Judgment
1 Martial Coup
1 Hell's Thunder
Round 1: Bant Midrange- Game one was a little intense, I never really had enough removal to kill off his second Rhox War Monk which kept him in the game longer than he should have been. An online Valakut, and a well used Panorama finish him off in the end. No sideboard here.
In game 2 I kill a first turn Hierarch, and he dosen't see a third land until after I have a Vengeant in play and he scoops shortly after. 2-0
Round 2: Grixis Discard- Game one he hits me with a few direct damage spells/blightning, but I manage to stabilize. Around turn 7 or so, I'm sitting at 8 life and he has 2 specters in his graveyard, he unearths them while I have no removal and finishes me off with a burst lightning. - 1 Martial Coup, -2 Day, +3 Purge.
Game 2 he gets really mana screwed and never really gets to pull anything on me, however I couldn't draw a finisher for the life of me, I drew all four Sphere's had all my mountains and plains in play, along with one Valakut that I played after most of my lands were already in play. Finally after much waiting I draw a Vengeant and he clinches the finish.
Game 3 He gets mana screwed again... However valakut runs like a dream (finally) and makes short work of him via SGC. 2-1
Round 3: More Bant Midrange- Game 1 the bant deck curves out perfectly, has a great draw, via Battlegrace angel, Escort, and Brave the elements . He climbs to 28 life and i fall to 8. I see my hand, and I'm sitting pretty with a martial coup, SGC, Bolt and chandra. However I need to survive 2 more turns to get the mana necessary to play it with the alternate effect, and I need to kill the Escort. I draw a land and play Siege gang. Next turn he attacks and deals me 5 with his angel, the destroys my SGC. I'm down to 3 life. I draw into a vengeant, play a land(now at 6), I play my vengeant keeping his angel tapped and bolt the Escort, finally killing it, I wasted at least three burn spells trying to kill it. He then goes and attack with a Hierarch and I block, no responses. Next turn I play a land and cast a chandra killing off his Angel, and keeping one of his lands tapped with vengeant. I'm pretty sure he draaws into land and passes the turn. I finally cast my martial coup kicked and take board control with 2 planeswalkers in play. He dies shortly after through a combination of 6 tokens and Hell's thunders.
Game 2 he gets mana screwed and I get a vengeant to 7 counters and pop it once he's about to stabilize a bit, not a whole lot else happens and I win. 2-0
Round 4: GW reliquary- Game one I don't see much of his deck and I'm not too sure what hes trying to do, however a surviving SGC finishes him off. No boarding.
Game 2 I see his lotus cobra which in combination with a reliquary turn two reliquary lets him kill one of my two lands on his turn 3 keeping me behind the rest of the game until he reliquary's me to death.
Game three I get the necessary removal and a good hand, however I could'nt draw a fifth land until turn 8, removal keeps him at bay and I start to play the bombs in my hand, but its not enough to stabilize and the late land-d keeps me off my board sweepers. 1-2
So I could have easily one that last game if I had a. Drawn a fifth land when I should have, and b. If I had remembered to side in my Needles for the reliquary, because that's what really killed me. It allowed all the necessary ramp for the cobra, and got huge.
This deck is not easy to play. My thought process usually goes something like 1. What land to play 2. Do I need to remove anything on his turn. or is what he has in play irrelevant, which leads me to 3. In how many turns will it take me to kill him? The deck needs planning, three turns in advance. I think my lack of success usually comes from bad plays on my part.
Things that really stuck out to me: Hell's Thunder really helps finish things off. I think Martial coup may be better suited as a 2 of. 90% of the time I get it off its enough to finish the game. I didn't come across any top tier decks, which was a bit disappointing, so I don't feel like it was a significant test, however I was happy with my performance, outside my consistency issues which can be chalked up to player error more than anything else. (there were 2 Vampire decks, and an Eldrazi green deck, and the Jund players didn't show up.)