Some stupid questions I've been pondering. I haven't played in a while, and certainly not legacy. So I was wondering what the format is like:
1.) Do the top decks lose their "power" after a while? Or once on top, stays on top?
2.) Why is Bant decks call Bant? and Why is Staxx called Staxx?
3.) Does the legacy environment change a lot?
Questions are very rarely, if ever, stupid. The ones that go unasked are the stupid ones I'll chime in with my two cents, hope these answers help.
1+3.) Looking at your question at a surface level, no, decks do not "lose their power" over time. Interactions such as those between Standstill and variousmanlands or cycling cards never strictly lose power - once those interactions are discovered, they're pretty much set. The second part of this answer is tied to your third question.
What DOES happen is that the environment those decks operate in change and adapt to those top decks. A LONG while back, a control deck called Landstill packed the above interactions, backed up with countermagic and was considered to be among the top decks. The interaction, the "power" itself hasn't changed, but the environment and the opposing decks Landstill faces has - Landstill is no longer considered as powerful as it used to be. That is what causes shifts in the "metagame," the generally expected placing of different decks. Decks with the strongest interactions or synergies tend to place well, and then the meta changes to try and beat those interactions and synergies.
Sooo, too much merfolk and very little combo which means the red splash would've been better, also need more basics. Went 1-2 drop, there was no way I could place. I would've done much better with SneakShow. I'm going to keep practicing with UWx miracles but until I'm more confident and make less misplays I'm competing with unfair decks.
Mhm, would love to see what list you brought.
How many basics are you running? If you know you're gonna be fighting a lot of Fish, I'd suggest at least 6 basics. My own list could have gone up to 8 in hindsight, though that's only really only an option if you wanna do silly things that other decks won't expect.
And yea. This deck is definitely one that gets better with practice, so don't get discouraged! Eventually, you'll start seeing lines of play based on little nuances you wouldn't have noticed before Keep at it!
It's very much a Landstill deck, that happens to abuse Miracle. No matter how you slice it, forcing your opponent to give you three cards anytime they want to do something useful is a good proposition. Combine it with the fact that you can abuse the "even" states caused by StandstillHumility, and you have an interaction that will be pretty hard to get rid of entirely. There's simply too much that Landstill can do under a Standstill to ignore its potential, and all of it is either card advantage, or card quality.
The problem there is "potential." Landstill is notoriously finicky when it comes to setting up the perfect lock and game state. That comes with time and experience, and even then, it's still a headache to pilot.
Don't give up on it though, it's oh so satisfying when it all works out.
U/W Miracles is somewhat close to this. Both this deck and miracles spawned from a kind of Landstill shell. The only difference being Miracles running 3-4 Terminus and Entreat the Angels as a faster wincon with less lock pieces. Miracles has been showing decent results at tournaments lately.
Pretty much this. If you're more into the "silver bullets" approach to a matchup, instead of the general catch-all "read and react" plan, than You're probably going to want to try piloting Counterthopter first if you're on the fence. Thankfully, there's a lot of overlap in cards between the two decks, do that isn't too much of a problem if you already have the building blocks.
That being said, both decks represent very viable plans to any given tournament, and they both perform MUCH better when you have a lot of knowledge about the environment you'll be piloting in.
The reason discussion seems to bit a stale on this particular thread (and this happened every weeks or so), is that this is a reactive deck to begin with. With the main DTB pretty fairly established, all focus goes onto improving match-ups against that particular part of the field. When a general agreement is found, we tend to wait for the next shift, and then adapt to it. It's the nature of the control deck Barring new tech to be used in a given match-up, a lot of discussion concerns the nitty-gritty of particular match-ups or deckbuilding.
What's further compounding things at the moment is the viability of a deck that shares a lot of core cards with UWx Miracles: the Thoptertop/Thopterbalance/Counterthopter/etc.etc. deck. With the printing of Miracles, the upping the count of SDT to make certain cards more reliable was logical. When the SDT count went up, the use of othercards that played well with SDT also seemed logical. So what we're left with are two very distinct decks, in objective and playstyle, that are closely related to each other in terms of what they're actually built from. Personally, I've been lurking on both threads the most these days since they both contain a lot of great info.
@Spell Snare As crazy as it seems, I've thought about doing that (cutting them for Spell Pierce and/or Spell Snare). Have 'em in the board of course, but I keep going back and forth because of the games that are randomly blowouts because I had Spell Pierce/Spell Snare. *shrugs*
Most miracle lists seems to be splashing black for better sunburst and random Vindicate / Surgical Extraction. I feel there is better colour to be chosen if it is mostly for sunburst: Red and Fire / Ice.
Honestly, I like the access R gives to Firespout, REB and Pyroblast, better than Fire/Ice. Sparki's spot on too with the random Blood Moon, just make sure you got the basics count to support it.
I love you.
This is exactly how I feel. The core of landstill is dead. I'm talking way outdated and inefficient. When you boil it down, white weenie and landstill suffer the same fate: good, but not great. You look at the pool of cards both have and go "omfg these together would be amazing"...nope.
The same feeling can be said for vindicate, the unloved child of legacy. For all it does, the card is very good. However, it's not great.
The entire strategy is just inefficient. Time to move on. UW control will be the new things. Standstill was a monster draw engine. Over time, everyone else got broken and streamlined. Landstill gained next to nothing. The best and worst thing for this deck was SFM-Batterskull. That ended the deck right there. To continue to shoehorn standstill + mishra into this deck only further holds it down. It's okay though....I had a good time with it. Lots of fun and outrageous memories. Also a lot of frustration.
The discussion of UW-miracle is the same as UWx Thopters. These decks will take a foundation of UWx Landstill and move on. They all realize standstill + mishra is old.
I came back to the thread after a long time, and this is the first post I read. Sad day, especially since I've always respected your opinion Warden, haha. In a quick nutshell, has Landstill really become that outclassed by everything else? What're you running these days? Would love to hear it. Just started lurking around here again, and am considering a jump to UWx ThopterBalance.
I am liking expedition map and a crucible after trying it out. Replaying fetches for extra shuffle effects has proven nice. I've only ran into the problem of having it in my hand a few times. Also- finally talked myself into it.
No more proxies in this deck. Yay!
Sexy.
@ Anus: What would you drop for it, and why would you run it? Granted, Land Tax will grab you whatever colors you need, make you resistant to Wasteland, and help balance out the card disadvantage from E. Tutor, but that's dependent upon you getting it up and running early.
We're trying to establish our combo pieces ASAP, and it just doesn't jibe, plus it doesn't play well with tech such like Ensnaring Bridge. Its been a while since I've been around, so if there's a valid argument to run LT, I'd love to hear it.
@ crs: Why wouldn't it be? Similar to what Warden said, 1.5 at the moment is VERY open. I don't remember there being this many varied decks that were competitive in a long time. That being said, is this deck Tier 1, or the most powerful? Arguably not. But it definitely is a deck that plays better the more experience you have, and isn't something you just go, "Oops, I win," with.
Well I dont think its a bad thing for Landstill at all, it counters all the stuff I was afraid of: VIAL(on the draw!),discard,t1 critters/stifle..and the best thing is it will make combo go down in popularity as now every deck has answers for it. CB will come back and there will be alot of tempo/midrange/aggro decks which LS should take care of.
This means the counter ur 1drop-drop standstill play just got alot better as before u had to spend an extra turn removing their t1 play before dropping a standstill.
The only downside I see is stp getting slightly worse,but I'll probably play BUG-still as pernicious deed is going to be a powerhouse in the new meta for sure.
Grtz
Warden addressed this. Normally, you would be right, but the fact that ANY deck can play the card FOR FREE, hurts us a helluva lot more than it helps us.
Fish can play their Vial with outrageous amounts of protection, Zoo can drop their beaters fearlessly, knowing most quick removal can be snuffed out. Tempo in general gets a huge boost with this card, and it pretty much neuters an entire archetype (see Dreadstill).
It's fantastic FOR us but even worse AGAINST us. And anyone can run it. If it was just U....not a crime. But it's [2 life] for most decks. Most spells are 1-2cc in cost. Merfolk just got that much better. Hell, Zoo got that much better.
Off the top of my head, some tempo deck can go:
4 FoW / 4 Mental / 3 Snare / 3 Daze / critters and win out from there.[/color]
[color="purple"]
This...this, so much.
Haha, so much for Legacy being the last bastion of "true" control decks...[/color]
@ Duke: Yea, that's pretty much my gameplan on Cockatrice. A tag like "Competitive Legacy" would help a bit though. With the list I threw together last page, 23 lands should be a good number, anything more than that, and I feel like you're starting to eat into slots needed for crucial things...as much as I want to fit in some more draw/filtering power. And yea, there are some pretty damn good/experienced LS pilots who inhabit this thread, Warden being one of them. Quite literally, all of the knowledge that I haven't gained from personal experience piloting LS comes from the same people in this thread (in other words, I suck at piloting LS compared to them)
@ Arnnaria: Yea, CoW is the shiz. How many you running? Are you running E. Tutor support with it, or no? And wow, I wish I ran into decks packing GftT Every black deck I run into online has been packing Smother lately. As for developing other decks, I completely understand...it's why I (try to) do silly things like pack ThopterSword into LS, or play UW Tempo online for a change of pace. I'm liking that deck the more I play it.
@ "Core Philosophy" of LS: I put philosophy instead of cards, because I believe understanding what the deck is trying to do is far more important than knowing what it runs.
LS wins through wars of attrition. It doesn't win fast. It doesn't win cleverly. It just wins. To do this, the deck relies on:
1.) Stopping_____.dek'sgameplan
2.) Establishingequality, and then inequality & locks
3.) Generatingcardadvantage
4.) Applyingpressure
5a.) Repeat step #4 until opponent is dead, or concedes.
5b.) If opponent tries to do something, see step #1
The difficulty of the deck arises from not only understanding your own deck, but of any other deck you may possibly sit across from. It seems easy, but I assure you, this is the hardest deck I've tried to pilot competently.
@ Duke: Warden is absolutely 110% correct with what he says about CB/Top. It just doesn't work in LS. And Welcome to Legacy
While the concept of a "big finisher" is intriguing in LS, keep in mind it does seem like something that is more viable in dedicated CB/Top shells - similar to the issues I have with developing the ThopterSword package in LS, and the StifleNought package (what Warden's been kicking around) are.
Also, Warden has a good question in what you've been testing against before I put stock in the "shortening games/reducing draws" claim.
Lastly, I'd sooner put in a 4th EE over a 3rd *** - more flexible, and make note of my initial post, it was edited - I was thinking about it a little more.
@ Duke: Interesting build you got there, very interesting. The "Polymorph ftw" idea is one I've tinkered with, but have never actually tested. What have the results looked like? Inc. wall of text -->
Some things I'm wondering about:
1.) Counterbalance/Top in LS. This has come up again and again, and plenty of people have tried it (myself, and other pilots FAR better than myself). The common consensus is that it simply doesn't work out very well in the traditional LS shell of "lots of hard denial/removal + Standstill + big finisher". It usually takes far too long to set up, is clunky and prevents you from reactively clearing the board in the first turns of the game, which are crucial to the decks success. Getting to four lands with a clear board usually means we can win. Being able to consistently get it started also pushes the deck in a direction that is no longer fundamentally LS, which brings me to...
2.) 4x Enlightened Tutor. This is part of what I mean, when CB/Top pushes LS away from being LS. Don't get me wrong, I love this card (no really, ask around this thread), but when you see 4x E. Tutor, you usually expect something like ThopterTop. As it stands, it only supports the development of CB/Top, maybe Wastelock...but that's it. Slots are tight in LS, and cards generally have to be god-like at what they're doing, or perform multiple roles to make the cut.
3.) No Humility. For obvious reasons, I can see why you're doing this, but this is one reason I didn't pursue the Polymorph line of play. It is quite the silly card to have on the board, moreso than Moat imo. Do you usually land the flying spaghetti monster before you get swarmed?
4.) 22 lands in LS seems...light to me, as ridiculous as that sounds, considering this is Legacy. I would highly prefer to see at least 23, but if it's working out for you, run with it. I do like the looks of the manabase, but I gotta ask why Academy Ruins over Tolaria West? The only creatures available to sac to Polymorph come from Elspeth, and Mishra's Factory. I get recurring them with Crucible would be nice, as are recurring EE, but T. West gives you the option of pulling those Factories when you don't have any, or EE when you need to blow something up.
It is sooo important to keep the board clean with cheap/flexible removal, and be able to stop things that you can't remove immediately. More cheap counters will allow you to protect Polymorph when you go for it. The DoJ will give you an alternate wincon, and also provide some token fodder as well to power your Polymorph, and E. Dragon could help out in stabilizing your manabase - I understand that it's a sub-par Polymorph target, but getting those 4 lands is important. Sorry this was so damn long, hope it helps.
TL;DR - CB/Top = no good, 4x E. Tutor = not doing enough, deck needs more ways to power up a Polymorph, more removal to keep you alive and Polymorph ftw.
EDIT: I'm thinking that if you were banking on Poly --> win more than anything, Crucible just gets in the way, since one you have the flying spaghetti monster out, you pretty much should win. No need to recur anything from the graveyard.
you youngins and your talk of drink and women :). I'm gonna be the sad guy just there to play magic and have a good time, with my wedding ring and non-drinking habits n all.
If I don't come off as a complete tool when I meet ya's, if there is any after tourney eat & drink going on, I'd be down. Don't worry I too am 6'5, well dressed (sometimes) not fat and in good shape. I'd try not to scare away all the honies for you college folk.
Landstill will be freaking exhausting to play a full 7+ rounds. But I'm gonna bring a hella aggresive landstill deck, chalked full of really ballsy tech.
You make us out to be such hooligans I'm not exactly a "drinker," but I do enjoy knocking a few back when the opportunity allows. And it's not quite the same, but I am very happy in the relationship with my gf of almost...1.5 years (true story, 16 months was two days ago).
Biographies aside, the issue I have with ThopterSword is pretty much what's been said. Despite all of the draw and filtering LS has to offer, I don't see the pieces consistently enough...the package begs for E. Tutor, and that is a very dicey proposal. In trying to get around that issue, I've tried a different approach to ThopterSword - using it as the finisher, as opposed to something to drop right away and protect. Results have been mixed at best playing this way. Finding and dropping the pieces on a clear board generally means game (G1), but getting to that point is tricky, since I feel like I have less answers overall to ______.dek in including the package. Finagling a Standstill on top of the package is just icing.
@ rsaunder: sounds hella legit. If I'm in the area, you guys will know, haha.
@ warden: grey goose, huh. I approve. Most definitely approve.
@ Tivon: ahaha...*click* Dunno what you guys do over there, but when someone trolls over here, they sign the damned table and date it for posterity and great justice. Dealing with finals...just study up, and you'll be fine, I'm sure. As far as DoJ goes...I suppose that at the moment, I'm a sinner :X
Questions are very rarely, if ever, stupid. The ones that go unasked are the stupid ones
1+3.) Looking at your question at a surface level, no, decks do not "lose their power" over time. Interactions such as those between Standstill and various manlands or cycling cards never strictly lose power - once those interactions are discovered, they're pretty much set. The second part of this answer is tied to your third question.
What DOES happen is that the environment those decks operate in change and adapt to those top decks. A LONG while back, a control deck called Landstill packed the above interactions, backed up with countermagic and was considered to be among the top decks. The interaction, the "power" itself hasn't changed, but the environment and the opposing decks Landstill faces has - Landstill is no longer considered as powerful as it used to be. That is what causes shifts in the "metagame," the generally expected placing of different decks. Decks with the strongest interactions or synergies tend to place well, and then the meta changes to try and beat those interactions and synergies.
2.) As mentioned above, Bant refers to the Shards of Alara block, when Tricolor groups were given names, and were associated with a particular Plane iirc.
Bant: :GWU, Rhox War Monk
Esper: WUB, Sphinx of the Steel Wind
Grixis: UBR, Cruel Ultimatum
Jund: BRG, Broodmate Dragon
Naya: RGW, Naya Charm
Bant decks, of course, utilize GWU in order to do their thing, and so were named bant.
Mhm, would love to see what list you brought.
How many basics are you running? If you know you're gonna be fighting a lot of Fish, I'd suggest at least 6 basics. My own list could have gone up to 8 in hindsight, though that's only really only an option if you wanna do silly things that other decks won't expect.
And yea. This deck is definitely one that gets better with practice, so don't get discouraged! Eventually, you'll start seeing lines of play based on little nuances you wouldn't have noticed before
In case you missed it, Kevin posted this on the last page:
http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/eventcoverage/gpgnt12/welcome#1
It's very much a Landstill deck, that happens to abuse Miracle. No matter how you slice it, forcing your opponent to give you three cards anytime they want to do something useful is a good proposition. Combine it with the fact that you can abuse the "even" states caused by Standstill Humility, and you have an interaction that will be pretty hard to get rid of entirely. There's simply too much that Landstill can do under a Standstill to ignore its potential, and all of it is either card advantage, or card quality.
The problem there is "potential." Landstill is notoriously finicky when it comes to setting up the perfect lock and game state. That comes with time and experience, and even then, it's still a headache to pilot.
Don't give up on it though, it's oh so satisfying when it all works out.
Pretty much this. If you're more into the "silver bullets" approach to a matchup, instead of the general catch-all "read and react" plan, than You're probably going to want to try piloting Counterthopter first if you're on the fence. Thankfully, there's a lot of overlap in cards between the two decks, do that isn't too much of a problem if you already have the building blocks.
That being said, both decks represent very viable plans to any given tournament, and they both perform MUCH better when you have a lot of knowledge about the environment you'll be piloting in.
What's further compounding things at the moment is the viability of a deck that shares a lot of core cards with UWx Miracles: the Thoptertop/Thopterbalance/Counterthopter/etc.etc. deck. With the printing of Miracles, the upping the count of SDT to make certain cards more reliable was logical. When the SDT count went up, the use of other cards that played well with SDT also seemed logical. So what we're left with are two very distinct decks, in objective and playstyle, that are closely related to each other in terms of what they're actually built from. Personally, I've been lurking on both threads the most these days since they both contain a lot of great info.
@Spell Snare As crazy as it seems, I've thought about doing that (cutting them for Spell Pierce and/or Spell Snare). Have 'em in the board of course, but I keep going back and forth because of the games that are randomly blowouts because I had Spell Pierce/Spell Snare. *shrugs*
Honestly, I like the access R gives to Firespout, REB and Pyroblast, better than Fire/Ice. Sparki's spot on too with the random Blood Moon, just make sure you got the basics count to support it.
I came back to the thread after a long time, and this is the first post I read. Sad day, especially since I've always respected your opinion Warden, haha. In a quick nutshell, has Landstill really become that outclassed by everything else? What're you running these days? Would love to hear it. Just started lurking around here again, and am considering a jump to UWx ThopterBalance.
Oh yea, hi to you, kevinliu, and the others
Sexy.
@ Anus: What would you drop for it, and why would you run it? Granted, Land Tax will grab you whatever colors you need, make you resistant to Wasteland, and help balance out the card disadvantage from E. Tutor, but that's dependent upon you getting it up and running early.
We're trying to establish our combo pieces ASAP, and it just doesn't jibe, plus it doesn't play well with tech such like Ensnaring Bridge. Its been a while since I've been around, so if there's a valid argument to run LT, I'd love to hear it.
@ crs: Why wouldn't it be? Similar to what Warden said, 1.5 at the moment is VERY open. I don't remember there being this many varied decks that were competitive in a long time. That being said, is this deck Tier 1, or the most powerful? Arguably not. But it definitely is a deck that plays better the more experience you have, and isn't something you just go, "Oops, I win," with.
Warden addressed this. Normally, you would be right, but the fact that ANY deck can play the card FOR FREE, hurts us a helluva lot more than it helps us.
Fish can play their Vial with outrageous amounts of protection, Zoo can drop their beaters fearlessly, knowing most quick removal can be snuffed out. Tempo in general gets a huge boost with this card, and it pretty much neuters an entire archetype (see Dreadstill).
[color="purple"]
This...this, so much.
Haha, so much for Legacy being the last bastion of "true" control decks...[/color]
@ Mental Misstep: I thought people were trolling...ew. I mean...what...who...
This is just damn silly...
@ Duke: Yea, that's pretty much my gameplan on Cockatrice. A tag like "Competitive Legacy" would help a bit though. With the list I threw together last page, 23 lands should be a good number, anything more than that, and I feel like you're starting to eat into slots needed for crucial things...as much as I want to fit in some more draw/filtering power. And yea, there are some pretty damn good/experienced LS pilots who inhabit this thread, Warden being one of them. Quite literally, all of the knowledge that I haven't gained from personal experience piloting LS comes from the same people in this thread
@ Arnnaria: Yea, CoW is the shiz. How many you running? Are you running E. Tutor support with it, or no? And wow, I wish I ran into decks packing GftT
@ "Core Philosophy" of LS: I put philosophy instead of cards, because I believe understanding what the deck is trying to do is far more important than knowing what it runs.
LS wins through wars of attrition. It doesn't win fast. It doesn't win cleverly. It just wins. To do this, the deck relies on:
1.) Stopping _____.dek's gameplan
2.) Establishing equality, and then inequality & locks
3.) Generating card advantage
4.) Applying pressure
5a.) Repeat step #4 until opponent is dead, or concedes.
5b.) If opponent tries to do something, see step #1
The difficulty of the deck arises from not only understanding your own deck, but of any other deck you may possibly sit across from. It seems easy, but I assure you, this is the hardest deck I've tried to pilot competently.
@ Duke: Warden is absolutely 110% correct with what he says about CB/Top. It just doesn't work in LS. And Welcome to Legacy
While the concept of a "big finisher" is intriguing in LS, keep in mind it does seem like something that is more viable in dedicated CB/Top shells - similar to the issues I have with developing the ThopterSword package in LS, and the StifleNought package (what Warden's been kicking around) are.
Also, Warden has a good question in what you've been testing against before I put stock in the "shortening games/reducing draws" claim.
Lastly, I'd sooner put in a 4th EE over a 3rd *** - more flexible, and make note of my initial post, it was edited - I was thinking about it a little more.
@ Duke: Interesting build you got there, very interesting. The "Polymorph ftw" idea is one I've tinkered with, but have never actually tested. What have the results looked like? Inc. wall of text -->
Some things I'm wondering about:
1.) Counterbalance/Top in LS. This has come up again and again, and plenty of people have tried it (myself, and other pilots FAR better than myself). The common consensus is that it simply doesn't work out very well in the traditional LS shell of "lots of hard denial/removal + Standstill + big finisher". It usually takes far too long to set up, is clunky and prevents you from reactively clearing the board in the first turns of the game, which are crucial to the decks success. Getting to four lands with a clear board usually means we can win. Being able to consistently get it started also pushes the deck in a direction that is no longer fundamentally LS, which brings me to...
2.) 4x Enlightened Tutor. This is part of what I mean, when CB/Top pushes LS away from being LS. Don't get me wrong, I love this card (no really, ask around this thread), but when you see 4x E. Tutor, you usually expect something like ThopterTop. As it stands, it only supports the development of CB/Top, maybe Wastelock...but that's it. Slots are tight in LS, and cards generally have to be god-like at what they're doing, or perform multiple roles to make the cut.
3.) No Humility. For obvious reasons, I can see why you're doing this, but this is one reason I didn't pursue the Polymorph line of play. It is quite the silly card to have on the board, moreso than Moat imo. Do you usually land the flying spaghetti monster before you get swarmed?
4.) 22 lands in LS seems...light to me, as ridiculous as that sounds, considering this is Legacy. I would highly prefer to see at least 23, but if it's working out for you, run with it. I do like the looks of the manabase, but I gotta ask why Academy Ruins over Tolaria West? The only creatures available to sac to Polymorph come from Elspeth, and Mishra's Factory. I get recurring them with Crucible would be nice, as are recurring EE, but T. West gives you the option of pulling those Factories when you don't have any, or EE when you need to blow something up.
I would definitely do something along these lines:
- 2 Counterbalance
- 4 Enlightened Tutor
- 1 Academy Ruins
- 1 Crucible of Worlds
+ 1 Tolaria West
+ 1 Swords to Plowshares
+ 3 Spell Snare//Spell Pierce
+ 1 Engineered Explosives
+ 1 Decree of Justice//Eternal Dragon(?)
+ 1 Something else. In the sample, I tossed in another basic land.
It is sooo important to keep the board clean with cheap/flexible removal, and be able to stop things that you can't remove immediately. More cheap counters will allow you to protect Polymorph when you go for it. The DoJ will give you an alternate wincon, and also provide some token fodder as well to power your Polymorph, and E. Dragon could help out in stabilizing your manabase - I understand that it's a sub-par Polymorph target, but getting those 4 lands is important. Sorry this was so damn long, hope it helps.
TL;DR - CB/Top = no good, 4x E. Tutor = not doing enough, deck needs more ways to power up a Polymorph, more removal to keep you alive and Polymorph ftw.
EDIT: I'm thinking that if you were banking on Poly --> win more than anything, Crucible just gets in the way, since one you have the flying spaghetti monster out, you pretty much should win. No need to recur anything from the graveyard.
2x Tundra
1x Volcanic Island
1x Plateau
6x Fetchland
4x Mishra's Factory
1x Tolaria West
2x Wasteland
6x [card=Island]Basic [card=Plains]lands
3x Engineered Explosives
4x Swords to Plowshares
2x Wrath of God
Counters - 10
3x Counterspell
3x Spell Snare // Spell Pierce
4x Force of Will
Draw//Utility - 10
2x Sensei's Divining Top
4x Brainstorm
3x Standstill
1x Decree of Justice
3x Polymorph
2x Jace, the Mind Sculpter
2x Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
You make us out to be such hooligans
Biographies aside, the issue I have with ThopterSword is pretty much what's been said. Despite all of the draw and filtering LS has to offer, I don't see the pieces consistently enough...the package begs for E. Tutor, and that is a very dicey proposal. In trying to get around that issue, I've tried a different approach to ThopterSword - using it as the finisher, as opposed to something to drop right away and protect. Results have been mixed at best playing this way. Finding and dropping the pieces on a clear board generally means game (G1), but getting to that point is tricky, since I feel like I have less answers overall to ______.dek in including the package. Finagling a Standstill on top of the package is just icing.
@ rsaunder: sounds hella legit. If I'm in the area, you guys will know, haha.
@ warden: grey goose, huh. I approve. Most definitely approve.
@ Tivon: ahaha...*click* Dunno what you guys do over there, but when someone trolls over here, they sign the damned table and date it for posterity and great justice. Dealing with finals...just study up, and you'll be fine, I'm sure.
@ chacha: Landstill is like cowbell. Needs more.