MTG Salvation

This set is basically a standard set. Futuresight 2.0.

Kaya's guile is the only card that has been spoiled that I really think I could play due to the flexibility. Archmage charm is flexible but way more prohibitive to cast.

I'm glad you guys love it. So far still disappointed.

Quote from Arkmer »

I'm fairly certain that if they print Snow Duals the Flying Draw Snake is better than Strix. Needing 3 other snow permanents gives it Deathtouch the same time that Strix would have it but you get to play this a turn earlier and while holding up mana.

If they print snow duals then they get sued. Not gonna happen.

I'm laughing because all we are getting are *****ty versions of legacy cards with the exception of astral drift which is better. Ice fang coatl? Force of negation? Bleh.

Force of Negation is a sideboard in card at best, whereas force of will is a sideboard out card in most situations. It's true power will be in a brainstorm format as probably a two-of.

In modern, that card is very costly and all your combo opponent has to do is just play pact of negation as it's free and doesn't pitch a card if they are playing combo. Or in the case of the majority of decks in modern simply put creatures and merc you while you stare at your fancy force of will wannabe.

For people being like, "Oh don't sell your stuff." I get discouraged at the fact that the one card that I was really looking forward to is now most likely gone out of the set. I really didn't want force of will or force of negation.

If no swords or counterspell then **** it I'm out.

If no counterspell I think it's time to sell my stuff. Prohibit is just ***** by comparison.

Quote from ElectricEye »

Only card from Phoenix I would want under a watchlist is Manamorphose, not Faithless Looting. It's really the card that enables the fast phoenix starts, quick Awoken Horrors, and makes Pyromancer's Ascension go crazy. Deck is still perfectly viable without Manamorphose, just slower.

Besides, I'd rather kill only storm than kill off dredge, mardu pyromancer, griselbrand decks, UR Livind End, Hollow One and the many other decks that currently or may in the future use looting.

And even then, storm always seems to bounce back from getting its cards banned (Rite of Flame, Seething Song, Ponder + Preordain, Gitaxian Probe).

Again, just something for the watchlist. I think it's too soon for any action to be taken yet.

Very good eye (pun painfully intended). Manamorphose is a very good card for what it does in both storm and izzet Phoenix. I would even claim in storm's case it is more powerful than preordain and possibly even more powerful than ponder especially when there is a cost reducer on the field.

This isn't to say that those cards should be released into modern, just that Manamorphose is subtly way more powerful than it leads someone to believe at face value.

Quote from Lear_the_cat »

I think they predicted uprising of dredge and risks with Phoenix.
I think that the main reason they unleashed the Dredhe was bcs before second Ravnica set UW Miracles were dominating metagame (it was summer 2018) and they fast reanimated dredge as counterdeck.

The funny thing about creating a "counter deck" to control is that it's really easy considering how control is a meta dependent pick at best and doesn't stay reigning for long.

Every time Jeskai, Grixis, or UW do well they immediately get hated out. It has at best a month or two before being returned to the gulag. I love control doesn't mean it's a dominating choice.

EDIT: Maybe gulag is a bad choice of words, not trying to be that dramatic. However, there is no equivalent to SDT miracle or Grixis control equivalent in modern. Nothing has ever been that dominant for a prolonged period of time which isn't bad just the reality.

I'd say that it's effect is less degeneracy and more that it makes decks partially homogenized. Basically, unless there's a very good reason not to, you should be starting every deck with 4 Chrome Mox, if it's legal. If anything though, it makes traditionally "fair" decks (aggro, control, ramp, and midrange) better against "unfair" (combo) decks. Admittedly, I think labeling decks "fair" or "unfair" is a bit loaded, but it's how the developers seem to think of things.

No, not all decks would run a chrome mox. However, ramping in that manner only really suits combo decks and ramp decks towards early powerful spells. The loss of a card in hand would mean that aggro wouldn't want it since it's trying to just race on curve, and control would only use it in a prison tezzerator build at best. Being able to be possibly two turns up on mana can lead to virtual locks. Either way, what is being accomplished with having this unbanned eludes me.

After reading the past few posts on chrome mox, I can say that if it were legal nothing good would come of it. If the goal is to slow down the format, chrome mox being unbanned is a step in the other direction.

One card for an additional mana source? Yep definitely not broken lol.

EDIT: Just so we're clear yes I understand with the chrome mox it's two cards out of your hand, still leads to degeneracy though.

The redirect spell redirects the counterspell to the redirect spell not the counterspell itself.

Cabal Therapist is a good card. Not saying it's the most OP discard spell, but in the correct shell it can do some damage. I think it will end up in black midrange strategies to fight things like storm where there needs to be a good number of spells to go off.

In a bw tokens build that may be better than paths for fighting combo/control strategies that just sit on cards.

Are you saying that UR Phoenix, and decks like it, are good, healthy, and necessary additions to the format?

I think the OP was just trying to insinuate phoenix may keep people honest at least because of thing in the ice. Obviously, it's doing insane right now and we may even discuss bans.

No need to be incredulous at this point, since most users are in the category that a ban may be necessary. There are just a few who think it's not necessary yet and are positing the format may correct itself given time, WAR and MH. I think we should just give the people who are in the no ban camp some credibility that given time and some good cards to be introduced into the format that it may correct itself.

No need to ask pointed questions on the subject, I'm hoping it gets better even if June is a long time away.

This is why I hope modern horizons actually gives us good cards. I am still unsure why we are not allowed swords to plowshares, counterspell, containment priest and baleful strix.

I also think we may have over estimated the reprints in this set.

Based on watching the announcement video and how the Wotc employees reacted when counterspell was mentioned was very interesting. During mentions of wasteland and TNN they just nodded and smiled.

When counterspell was brought up, the Wotc employee immediately was like, "we're not promising this is in the set." and went on an explanation.

Now that could be for a multitude of reasons. Some would say this is to not leak additional cards and keep expectations low. However it could be the opposite.

It could be that counterspell isn't there and other legacy reprints are things like oubliette.

This means that the set has a high chance of being a dud IF they
they decide not to push it too much.