I think 1 sword is too few to run. with no tutor effects, its a random draw. Id run an extra beast within/hero/thrun depending on your meta. Thrun against control, hero against quick aggro, and beast within against midrange.
Underextend or Underwhelm? And I'm not sure I count the win against a Flensermite.
What Stalker are you casting? (Round 2) Is it Traveller?
/harassment
What i consider "underextending," most call playing conservatively. Expecting the DoJ is different than playing your hand out. Granted, there are some times where it kills you, but other times it saves you as you have creatures to play after the wipe. I have yet to play a matchup where a player has both sweepers and targeted removal, so im not exactly sure what to do in such a situation, but i would assume play as normal.
As for the flensermite, that was not the only creature he played, but the only creature that tended to get through. he played both phyrexian crusaders and plague stingers as well, but never got the mana to play his skittles either game.
As for the stalker, It was actually a traveller. I must have accidentally typed stalker while talking to another player
well tournament report time. went 4-0 tonight. heres my results:
Round 1: G/U/b Spiders
Game one went pretty fast. I got an early abolisher out and he had to cast everything on his turn, thus slowing down his game and letting me win. Game 2, I get him down to 2 and he casts gnaw to the bone, with 6 creatures in the gy. He then flashes spider spawning in, making a bunch of spiders stopping me dead. My opponent sits and mills through his gy, looking for an edge, but never finds one, despite having 181 life, he decks himself while im down to 1.
Round 2: UW Aggro
Both games go fairly fast. Game 1, I overwhelm him due to him playing only 2 creatures(both invisible stalkers), and quickly get the win. Game 2 was a bit trickier. I cast a champion and a stalker and he plays a crusader. I then play my sword of war and peace and swing in with champion. he plays a sword and I o-ring his champion. He DOJs and i start swinging with the spirit token and play a mayor. He DOJs again, and i play my crusader and go to town.
It seems that in my meta, if I even see an opponent play White, its a goodoidea to under-extend because a DOJ might show up.
Round 3: Esper control
Game 1, I try to underextend, which helps a bit, but as i get him to about 10, he White sun's zenith for two cats and stops my 1/1s. He then plays an elesh norn, effectively wiping my board and swings for crazy amounts. Game 2, I attempt the same strategy but with better removal, but once i see that he doesnt have the day in hand, I go full force. I o-ring the gideon he plays, land a champion, play a blade splicer and a sword of body and mind, which forces him to counter both. He then doesn't have the removal to stop all of my guys and i win. Game 3, I get the nuts. my first three creatures are champion, champion, traveler. He gets mana screwed. I kill him on turn 5.
Round 4: Mono B Infect
Both games went pretty fast. game 1 he doom bladed and go for the throated my creatures and i o-ringed and beast within'd his creatures. I get a crusader with sword to out-race his flensermite with sword, that got stood down a 3/3 golem with first strike and the same sword. he kills it and gets me to 9 poison. I finish him off with crusader next turn.
Game 2, I board in gut shots and naturalizes, as well as a SoFaF. I end up taking out O-rings and some other things. I generally have control of the board and get a crusader out. He suprises me with a lashwrithe and gets me to 9 poison again, but I beat him out with crusader.
Honestly, I'm surprised Fiend Hunter being inefficient against Control was a surprise to you. They only have a couple things worth Hunting, and since they rely so much on board wipes, removing those few threats with a creature is a flat-out bad idea. I've actually found Fiend Hunter to be better against aggro decks, especially Illusions or ones that often make tokens or utilize counters (i.e. +1/+1). Otherwise, Oblivion Ring is better, since enchantments are notoriously difficult to get rid of for most decks. There's actually quite a bit of enchantment destruction available, especially in White, it's just that nobody really runs it.
I figured he wasn't great, I did not realize he was as bad in control matchups as he was. I don't even think hes that great against illusions. He can bin a few creatures, but more often than not, you want to get rid of lord of the unreal. depending on the build, It's quite easy for them to clone the fiend hunter to bring back their lord. G/W tokens is okay, but they still have board wipes usually and bringing back Geist-honored monk or elesh norn really hurts.
That being said, he is amazing in non-white matchups.
Well had meant to write a tournament report, but my computer froze halfway. I made a few findings.
I wasn't able to test with beast withins yesterday, so i used oblivion rings. With the amount of board wipe I ran into, I think that fiend hunter is sub-optimal against control. He is probably better suited for WU Humans where you have counter support.
So the changes to my list, currently are
-3 fiend hunter
+3oblivion ring
currently, the deck is 7-0-1 at fnms. My matchups yesterday were, G/W Tokens, Jund ramp, and two rounds of solar flare. I got a little pre-board tests in against some aggro decks.
B/x infect isnt hard to beat. Red deck can be rough depending on the build. theres a few other matchups where its practically a tossup
I hear you on mono-White. It seems like it'd be good, but it really kind of isn't yet. Soon, though...
Your build is quite different from those normally seen around here. Is there a particular reason you go with Ghost Quarter over the more commonly used Gavony Township? Are there a lot of lands around your area that need blown up? With Gut Shot in your sideboard, Inkmoth Nexus can't be hard to kill, and directly attacking Kessig Wolf Run and Moorland Haunt seems rather needless. I also take it WUB or... "Solar Flare" is popular in your area, since you have Purify the Grave? Since you're not running Shrine of Loyal Legions, though, I'd recommend just using Nihil Spellbomb. Kill the whole graveyard instead of just part of it.
I also wonder about the Sword of Feast and Famine. It's a good Sword, to be sure, but it's not one we around here would be quick to recommend, if you're willing to take suggestions. Same for Body and Mind, although most of us quite like War and Peace. It's probably the one Sword we'd choose to recommend.
What I find most interesting about your deck is the use of Beast Within instead of Oblivion Ring, and your inclusion of Blade Splicer. Beast Within is fine removal, especially against Phyrexian Crusader, since a deck like ours won't mind the 3/3 Beast. And how good has Blade Splicer been to you? I've been thinking about her myself lately, since her Golem is still a decent threat, and our deck can make even the usually ignorable Splicer a threat herself. I'd love to hear what she's done for you.
Shall I hazard a guess that B/x Infect and "Solar Flare" are decks you see a lot of, with perhaps a bit of Tempered Steel?
I tried real hard to run mono white, but there was just no versatility, and therefore, no reason not to run a 2nd color. As for the rather rogue questions, I'd be more than happy to share my results. First off, I think it should be said that while i play in a semi-competitive meta, it is not a defined meta. There is no telling what I could end up playing, so my sideboard is a tad all over the place. Mono B(and b/x to a lesser extent), 3+ color control, and G/W seem to be the more popular archetypes though.
I considered gavony township, which is an awesome card, but I also got a lot of testing in with ghost quarter when i was playing mono white and found it tough to cut the card. It does so much in this meta. I noticed that a lot of my competition, as well as national competition, focus a decent amount on non-basics. while gavony is better in the longer game, I try for a more aggro approach. Cutting people off their win conditions and/or mana definitely helps my game out better. Also, there are enough tri-color decks to warrant the use of ghost quarter.
I was originally planning on using nihil spellbomb, however, purify seemed better against mill strategies, which I saw as a side-strategy. I then cut both cards as I wasn't running into flare as much as i expected. Two weeks ago, I made a last minute change to my sideboard after hearing/seeing what some people were playing.
Im still 50/50 on my sword count. on one hand, having more consistency is a good thing, but on the other, diversity is just as good. pro red/white is good, but green/black are somewhat better colors. On top of this, against control, i can usually take out the sword of war and peaces for the swords in the side. 3 swords is definitely the right answer, its just that matter of consistency vs diversity.
As for beast within, that is mostly theorycraft and speculation. I have no actual testing with it, and truth be told, its placeholder is actually o-ring. It just seems like a better card, especially with being able to deal with threats on their turn. while the 3/3 is a drawback, It seems as though I've been through enough o-ring battles and disenchant heartbreaks to warrant the change.
Blade splicer came in to replace mentor of the meek and has been a good card. It gets around spellskites and puts two bodies on the ground. mentor often made me want to overextend which was bad.
Lime soon reached the fork in the path. In front of him were two paths that almost seemed to contrast themselves completely. Where one was vibrant and full of plant growth, the other was stagnant and dark.
He had thought of the random chatter he heard through the city and on the way to the fork and had deduced that route two led to a literal ghost town and route three led to a port town that seemed famous for fishing.
"Hmm, well I would think with the pokemon i just caught, fighting water types would be a cinch. I would think going to a ghost town would be somewhat dangerous. I mean if its deserted, that must mean the pokemon around it must be dangerous. Although I like challenges, I will save the tougher path for later....
As he went down the path, he had not thought to check the signs and began going down route two instead of the intended route three.
"...I just don't get why the paths are so misleading. You would think that the path to Newbloom Bay would be cheery..."
I think 1 sword is too few to run. with no tutor effects, its a random draw. Id run an extra beast within/hero/thrun depending on your meta. Thrun against control, hero against quick aggro, and beast within against midrange.
What i consider "underextending," most call playing conservatively. Expecting the DoJ is different than playing your hand out. Granted, there are some times where it kills you, but other times it saves you as you have creatures to play after the wipe. I have yet to play a matchup where a player has both sweepers and targeted removal, so im not exactly sure what to do in such a situation, but i would assume play as normal.
As for the flensermite, that was not the only creature he played, but the only creature that tended to get through. he played both phyrexian crusaders and plague stingers as well, but never got the mana to play his skittles either game.
As for the stalker, It was actually a traveller. I must have accidentally typed stalker while talking to another player
Round 1: G/U/b Spiders
Game one went pretty fast. I got an early abolisher out and he had to cast everything on his turn, thus slowing down his game and letting me win. Game 2, I get him down to 2 and he casts gnaw to the bone, with 6 creatures in the gy. He then flashes spider spawning in, making a bunch of spiders stopping me dead. My opponent sits and mills through his gy, looking for an edge, but never finds one, despite having 181 life, he decks himself while im down to 1.
Round 2: UW Aggro
Both games go fairly fast. Game 1, I overwhelm him due to him playing only 2 creatures(both invisible stalkers), and quickly get the win. Game 2 was a bit trickier. I cast a champion and a stalker and he plays a crusader. I then play my sword of war and peace and swing in with champion. he plays a sword and I o-ring his champion. He DOJs and i start swinging with the spirit token and play a mayor. He DOJs again, and i play my crusader and go to town.
It seems that in my meta, if I even see an opponent play White, its a goodoidea to under-extend because a DOJ might show up.
Round 3: Esper control
Game 1, I try to underextend, which helps a bit, but as i get him to about 10, he White sun's zenith for two cats and stops my 1/1s. He then plays an elesh norn, effectively wiping my board and swings for crazy amounts. Game 2, I attempt the same strategy but with better removal, but once i see that he doesnt have the day in hand, I go full force. I o-ring the gideon he plays, land a champion, play a blade splicer and a sword of body and mind, which forces him to counter both. He then doesn't have the removal to stop all of my guys and i win. Game 3, I get the nuts. my first three creatures are champion, champion, traveler. He gets mana screwed. I kill him on turn 5.
Round 4: Mono B Infect
Both games went pretty fast. game 1 he doom bladed and go for the throated my creatures and i o-ringed and beast within'd his creatures. I get a crusader with sword to out-race his flensermite with sword, that got stood down a 3/3 golem with first strike and the same sword. he kills it and gets me to 9 poison. I finish him off with crusader next turn.
Game 2, I board in gut shots and naturalizes, as well as a SoFaF. I end up taking out O-rings and some other things. I generally have control of the board and get a crusader out. He suprises me with a lashwrithe and gets me to 9 poison again, but I beat him out with crusader.
so far, 11-0-1 with this deck.
I figured he wasn't great, I did not realize he was as bad in control matchups as he was. I don't even think hes that great against illusions. He can bin a few creatures, but more often than not, you want to get rid of lord of the unreal. depending on the build, It's quite easy for them to clone the fiend hunter to bring back their lord. G/W tokens is okay, but they still have board wipes usually and bringing back Geist-honored monk or elesh norn really hurts.
That being said, he is amazing in non-white matchups.
I wasn't able to test with beast withins yesterday, so i used oblivion rings. With the amount of board wipe I ran into, I think that fiend hunter is sub-optimal against control. He is probably better suited for WU Humans where you have counter support.
So the changes to my list, currently are
-3 fiend hunter
+3oblivion ring
currently, the deck is 7-0-1 at fnms. My matchups yesterday were, G/W Tokens, Jund ramp, and two rounds of solar flare. I got a little pre-board tests in against some aggro decks.
B/x infect isnt hard to beat. Red deck can be rough depending on the build. theres a few other matchups where its practically a tossup
he is pretty sub-optimal. he doesnt pump himself and HotP is harder to kill and less conditional.
why not just run 3 naturalize? there doesnt seem to be that much artifact/enchantment recursion in standard atm.
I tried real hard to run mono white, but there was just no versatility, and therefore, no reason not to run a 2nd color. As for the rather rogue questions, I'd be more than happy to share my results. First off, I think it should be said that while i play in a semi-competitive meta, it is not a defined meta. There is no telling what I could end up playing, so my sideboard is a tad all over the place. Mono B(and b/x to a lesser extent), 3+ color control, and G/W seem to be the more popular archetypes though.
I considered gavony township, which is an awesome card, but I also got a lot of testing in with ghost quarter when i was playing mono white and found it tough to cut the card. It does so much in this meta. I noticed that a lot of my competition, as well as national competition, focus a decent amount on non-basics. while gavony is better in the longer game, I try for a more aggro approach. Cutting people off their win conditions and/or mana definitely helps my game out better. Also, there are enough tri-color decks to warrant the use of ghost quarter.
I was originally planning on using nihil spellbomb, however, purify seemed better against mill strategies, which I saw as a side-strategy. I then cut both cards as I wasn't running into flare as much as i expected. Two weeks ago, I made a last minute change to my sideboard after hearing/seeing what some people were playing.
Im still 50/50 on my sword count. on one hand, having more consistency is a good thing, but on the other, diversity is just as good. pro red/white is good, but green/black are somewhat better colors. On top of this, against control, i can usually take out the sword of war and peaces for the swords in the side. 3 swords is definitely the right answer, its just that matter of consistency vs diversity.
As for beast within, that is mostly theorycraft and speculation. I have no actual testing with it, and truth be told, its placeholder is actually o-ring. It just seems like a better card, especially with being able to deal with threats on their turn. while the 3/3 is a drawback, It seems as though I've been through enough o-ring battles and disenchant heartbreaks to warrant the change.
Blade splicer came in to replace mentor of the meek and has been a good card. It gets around spellskites and puts two bodies on the ground. mentor often made me want to overextend which was bad.
4 champion of the parish
4 doomed traveler
3 gideon's lawkeeper
4 mayor of avabruck
3 grand abolisher
4 mirran crusader
3 fiend hunter
2 blade splicer
2 hero of bladehold
2 angelic destiny
instant
4 beast within
artifacts
2 sword of war and peace
1 sword of feast and famine
lands
11 plains
4 razorverge thicket
4 sunpetal grove
3 ghost quarter
1 sword of body and mind
1 sword of feast and famine
4 naturalize
4 gut shot
4 purify the grave
1 melira, sylvok outcast
Yes, exactly.
also, would we be following the canon as sets come out or would we start off at a point and go from there?
[DICE]100[/DICE]
He had thought of the random chatter he heard through the city and on the way to the fork and had deduced that route two led to a literal ghost town and route three led to a port town that seemed famous for fishing.
"Hmm, well I would think with the pokemon i just caught, fighting water types would be a cinch. I would think going to a ghost town would be somewhat dangerous. I mean if its deserted, that must mean the pokemon around it must be dangerous. Although I like challenges, I will save the tougher path for later....
As he went down the path, he had not thought to check the signs and began going down route two instead of the intended route three.
"...I just don't get why the paths are so misleading. You would think that the path to Newbloom Bay would be cheery..."
[DICE]100[/DICE]
ooc: do i need to walk through the path again or can i go straight to the fork?