I'd drop the Elves and 2 Nihiliths for 4 Greater Gargadon. It works well in a pinch, and right after a final Balance, you can go all in and put them on a 2 turn clock.
I know its a clock when the bored is clear, but frankly I've found nhilith works just fine simply because it gets in a few free hits before an answer is usually found. Granted if I played vs more white and had to worry about pte that'd probably change. Gargadon for me just isnt worth it. I like the deck just not him.
This is what I'm playing around with atm. Its been working pretty well, though right now I'm a bit stuck. I like bloodbraid simply because its either mana accel into a possible jura next turn or restorebalance
Sorry, it wasn't meant as sarcasm, it just gets thrown around a lot. And I can definitely understand not wanting to buy/trade for the cards. As i'm trying to piece together a Dreadstill build right now (Underground Seas = Fun) and it's really a pain.
I've understood the fetching thing to be sort of a deck-thinning tactic, but I've also heard of figures/people who have proven that any advantage gained from it is negligible. So, in a mono, there probably isn't a point.
But most mono decks with fetches usually have a SB splash, ergo fetches for easier access to mana.
I completely understand possible sb splashes, and sorry if I came off harsh, I was at work when posting and its been a rough day. I'm working on 2 lists right now, one is more tool box-ish and one is more a standard gobo eats your face deck. I'll be posting the lists soon-ish for feedback
It most likely is, but the most competitive builds will the the ones branching out into other colors so they have access to SB or possible MB hate against decks that Goblins is initially weak against.
Also, the usual, "Blah blah blah, nothing against budget play, but this is the competitive/proven forum, people here design to win with all possible resources, blah blah"
thanks for the response, as for the "blah blah blah" that wasn't really needed Its not that I cant afford to go buy the cards, I just simply don't want to. Which is why I was wondering the viability of mono red to see if I could get away with not going out and buy more duals. Fetches are fine but I'm one of those people who is kinda 50/50 on the overall benefit of fetches in a mono colored deck.
The issue with Suppression Field is that it taxes cycling. Enlightened Tutor allows us to run main-deck answers to these types of threats, like Oblivion Ring, Engineered Explosives, etc.
@poppeleseed how does running etutor make running suppression field worse? I could see running fetch lands as making it worse. I could see it being a bad card if its ability effects cycling but I don't know that it does. Was just wondering otherwise great deck, and love playing a variant of it myself
honestly, looking at that, it looks explosive, but semi inconsistent. It seems loosely based on casual liquimetal decks and welder stax from vintage. Have you considered upping the welders to 4 ofs? Or , using something like solemn simulacrum for continuous card advantage? Beyond that, I'd consider using just the heretics+coatings unless there's some serious combo around for the shamans to come in and be useful. Heretic+coating=blow up a permanent and get some damage. Beyond that, it's probably not a good enough combo for competitive play.
i agree with the bumping of welders up to 4 but i do not agree with the mox monkey coming out of the deck. Though I doubt it would happen often I could see the games where you truly get to be happy as starting turn 2 you start going "i blow up your land" lol
I'm not sure if this will help, but this is a G/W deck I've been tweaking alongside a few other decks and it has done fairly well so far. Its got a bit more control aspect to it while still maintaining a pretty strong aggro presence.
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my g/w list retardo stomped a some friends for a few games i'll post an updated list soon
I'm going to be starting a new thread for my G/W deck as I feel it has gotten further away from the core idea of the Suppression deck. I'll still pop in here if I get ideas that may help, but other then that good luck!
While this may look similar to Dark Boros, Tombstalker makes a huge difference. Right off the bat, I'm going to say that 4 Stalker + 4 Bob is a no-no. Sure, if you Bob one up, you take 8 and have an amazing creature in grip, but you sometimes just can't afford that sort of hit to the face. I'd suggest cutting them to 3 to drop your chances of biting it a bit. On top of that, what do you do with two in an early grip? Lavamancer will be competing with him for cards to recycle, thus reducing his cost efficiency. With 3, I figure you'd be able to draw one when you need one without getting stuck with him costing BB3 or such a similar higher than BB unhappy amount.
On that note, if you can get ahold of a set of WaStEland, I'd highly consider stuffing those in along with moving your two Terminates into Vindicates. The Wastes have a shot at screwing your opp over, as well as fueling two of your critters. With Vial and Survival running wild, Vindicate >>> Terminate to more permanently stall them out or be able to capitalize on a manascrew seems worth it to me.
Blightning sounds interesting to me, but the use of such almost wants me to suggest pushing for something Rit or Moxpowered to better cough out Hymn, IoK, and it faster than making them discard two more cards on T3/T4. Considering that the key difference I see here between this and Dark Boros is the `stalker, I'd rather play Verdict than the black-lightning. It hits you for a point less off a Bob trigger, and punishes them for choosing to discard extra lands by giving you the health you need to draw that `stalker. If they do discard lands, Wastes/Vindicates take their turn into making sure they can't cast what they tried to keep. I feel that a swing with `stalker is more potent than the extra 3 damage off Blightning and thus would rather make them pitch crap before they have a chance to cast it or empty their hand.
Any thoughts on a SB yet? Some number of Extirpate most definitely, Plagues, and possibly some Duress as well. Despite them being counter productive indeed, StP / PtE should be there for that cheap, instant speed bye-bye Dreadnought type of answer. Perhaps Prison might fare better than Plague though at holding back the onslaught.
Just some rambling thoughts of mine
~ Rith
with the holiday i still havent really had a chance to test and develop a sideboard. Verdict is a card i've considered and used to run in the past with my old b/w confidant deck. As far as cutting a tombstalker, i'd rather not, but if I did it would be for a 4th top so I could pick and choose what I draw with bob more often. So far I've only hit stalker once with bob. Do i need all 4 equipment, the answer to that is a resounding, no. Do i like having the versatility to fetch the ones I want, yes. As far as lavamancer / tombstalker being counterproductive yes it is a big pain at times and probably one of the larger annoyances I have with deck. But tomb stalker is a very key card to this deck I balance it by trying to only have 1 stalker out at a time and delve for as little as possible. The sword that would probably get axed would be body and mind, as I find the originals far to useful. I could see dropping jitte for collar. but one big question, how on earth should i fit wasteland in? My mana base is tight as is.
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Main list tweaked a bit, testing on changes has yet to happen.
I know its a clock when the bored is clear, but frankly I've found nhilith works just fine simply because it gets in a few free hits before an answer is usually found. Granted if I played vs more white and had to worry about pte that'd probably change. Gargadon for me just isnt worth it. I like the deck just not him.
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2 Ajani Vengeant
2 Gideon Jura
Creatures 6
2 Bloodbraid Elf
4 Nihilith
Spells 16
4 Violent Outburst
4 Restore Balance
4 Ardent Plea
4 Thirst for Knowledge
4 Wildfield Borderpost
4 Veinfire Borderpost
4 Fieldmist Borderpost
4 Firewild Borderpost
4 Mistvein Borderpost
Lands 10
1 Forest
2 Island
1 Mountain
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Terramorphic Expanse
2 Evolving Wilds
This is what I'm playing around with atm. Its been working pretty well, though right now I'm a bit stuck. I like bloodbraid simply because its either mana accel into a possible jura next turn or restorebalance
in all fairness, I was just teasing
does a reprint really count as "new"?
I completely understand possible sb splashes, and sorry if I came off harsh, I was at work when posting and its been a rough day. I'm working on 2 lists right now, one is more tool box-ish and one is more a standard gobo eats your face deck. I'll be posting the lists soon-ish for feedback
thanks for the response, as for the "blah blah blah" that wasn't really needed
gotcha ty for quick response
even with mana excel isn't 6 cc a bit much to ask especially if the card doesnt just go "i win'?
i agree with the bumping of welders up to 4 but i do not agree with the mox monkey coming out of the deck. Though I doubt it would happen often I could see the games where you truly get to be happy as starting turn 2 you start going "i blow up your land" lol
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4 Qasali Pridemage
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Gaddock Teeg
3 Wilt-Leaf Liege
2 Birds of Paradise
2 Eternal Witness
Spells 8
4 Enlightened Tutor
4 Swords to plowshares
3 Shield of the oversoul
2 Suppression Field
1 sterling grove
1 Runed halo
1 Oblivion Ring
1 dueling ground
Artifacts 6
4 Chrome Mox
1 Pithing Needle
4 savannah
4 Sunpetal Grove
4 Plains
4 Forest
3 Windswept Heath
I'm going to be starting a new thread for my G/W deck as I feel it has gotten further away from the core idea of the Suppression deck. I'll still pop in here if I get ideas that may help, but other then that good luck!
with the holiday i still havent really had a chance to test and develop a sideboard. Verdict is a card i've considered and used to run in the past with my old b/w confidant deck. As far as cutting a tombstalker, i'd rather not, but if I did it would be for a 4th top so I could pick and choose what I draw with bob more often. So far I've only hit stalker once with bob. Do i need all 4 equipment, the answer to that is a resounding, no. Do i like having the versatility to fetch the ones I want, yes. As far as lavamancer / tombstalker being counterproductive yes it is a big pain at times and probably one of the larger annoyances I have with deck. But tomb stalker is a very key card to this deck I balance it by trying to only have 1 stalker out at a time and delve for as little as possible. The sword that would probably get axed would be body and mind, as I find the originals far to useful. I could see dropping jitte for collar. but one big question, how on earth should i fit wasteland in? My mana base is tight as is.
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Main list tweaked a bit, testing on changes has yet to happen.