I would expect and metagame against Flash, GAT and Bomberman. These are the 3 main decks that put up results at Waterbury. I would also account for budget Fish decks given that it is a zero proxy metagame. For large events like Gencon looking at local results to metagame is not very helpful, just look at what performed at Waterbury and what less proven decks are getting hype (Goblins).
GAT doesn't need to bother answering Leyline, the only thing it affects is will. Ichorid uses Chain of Vapor, Emerald Charm or Reverent Silence, as mentioned above.
So I finally made the deck and I love it. Also anyone think dredge would work well with this?
Dredge decks and GAT have virtually no cards in common and are trying for entirely different roles in the game, so I don't think they would work well together.
I like sickening shoal as a sideboard answer for yixlid jailer. No matter how you cut it a card that requires no mana will take up less of the sideboard!
Contagion is better, because it can handle multiple jailers. I still like Darkblast though because you can maindeck it and still have it be good there Game 1.
With all the creatures in your metagame you are going to need some creature hate. Waterfront Bouncer, Exalted Angel and Serra Avenger are all strong choices. Cut Aura of Silence for Chalice of the Void, Silence comes down so late that it can't do anything useful. Cut Counterspell for Daze, again Counterspell is too slow. You might consider Ninja of the Deep Hours, which has really nice synergy with Standstill.
As for your mana base, run some basic lands and fetchlands if you can afford them. Mishra's Factory is the only man land worth running, cut the others for Wasteland/Strip Mine. Good luck with the deck.
I think boiling the format down to only 3 decks based on their particular hype at the moment is unwise. Flash and GAT have proven themselves at waterbury to be strong decks, but they were not the only ones performing. Look at the T16 for Day 1,
4 GAT
3 Flash
3 Bomberman
2 Stax
1 Fish
1 Oath
1 Tog
1 Gush Tendrils
These results make it obvious that other decks besides Flash and GAT exist. I would agree that Gush and Flash are powerful cards, worthy of restriction but they are not the only viable decks in the format.
Goblins has been putting up good results recently and has gotten a lot of hype; but I don't think it has proven itself anywhere near to one of the top three decks.
As for Angel Stax, that particular deck isn't competitive but the concept of a Fish/Stax hybrid has been proven to be strong
Urza's Bauble/Mishra's Bauble are a nice way to speed up your deck, but I would much rather have disruption like Unmask or Leyline of the Void which can significantly slow down your opponent.
Currently my board is,
4 Chain of Vapor
4 Emerald Charm
4 City of Brass
3 Gemstone Mine
My maindeck runs both Unmask and Leyline, I recently added Leyline because of the large amount of Flash decks present. The other main difference in my maindeck is 3 Darkblast, which are great. They dredge Game 1, and post board answers Yixlid Jailer.
The resurgence of Flash has actually made the sideboard easier to build. People have been running just Leyline to answer both Flash and not running several different Ichorid hate cards in their sideboard. Because of this I have been tempted to cut Chain of Vapor and just devote my entire sideboard to enchantment hate, but I don't know if thats correct yet.
I usually play Vintage, but the only format that is really played locally is limited so I am trying to learn more about it. Here is my recent MTGO draft, I would be appreciate your suggestions on how to improve. Thanks in advance for the help.
Draft:
Pack 1:
Slipstream Serpent, Gaze of Justice, Strangling Soot, Fathom Seer, Flamecore Elemental, Two-Headed Sliver, Blazing Blade Askari, Shadow Sliver, Ophidian Eye, Ignite Memories, Saltcrusted Steppe, Clockwork Hydra, Ith, High Arcanist, Lord of Atlantis, Spirit Loop
Pick: Clockwork Hydra
Pack 2:
Goblin Skycutter, Cancel, Penumbra Spider, Pentarch Ward, Assassinate, Call to the Netherworld, Cyclopean Giant, Brass Gnat, Savage Thallid, Screeching Sliver, Phantom Wurm, Outrider en-Kor, Molten Slagheap, Walk the Aeons
Pack 17:
Whitemane Lion, Mire Boa, Utopia Vow, Dash Hopes, Shade of Trokair, Vitaspore Thallid, Brain Gorgers, Fury Charm, Seal of Primordium, Healing Leaves, Simian Spirit Guide, Circle of Affliction
Pack 34:
Cutthroat il-Dal, Gift of Granite, Quiet Disrepair, Rift Elemental, Grave Scrabbler, Lumithread Field, Mesmeric Sliver, Deepcavern Imp, Flowstone Embrace, Sword of the Meek, Even the Odds, Mystic Speculation
If you're going to add that effect, then just run Necropotence and Yawgmoth's Bargain. Necropotence is the same effect but for less (castable off a ritual), with the drawback of removing discards from the game (oooooh noes), and Bargain is the same cost and almost strictly superior (considering you can draw one at a time, over and over, losing only how much you need and seeing each draw as it comes).
Obviously you run Necro and Bargain as well. Necro is already in there, and you can run Bargain once you get more Rituals in there to support it.
Something I liked back when I messed around with False Cure was Necrologia. You basically win the turn after you cast it, but you need Ritual effects to support it. Besides that I would get rid of your random 1 ofs and 2 ofs, you want to make the deck to be as consistent as possible.
L
You say Petrified Field is too slow, but Pithing Needle does the same thing as a Wasteland does to Bazaar. I think Pithing Needles, Wastelands, and Crypts fall into the "manageable hate" category.
Pithing Needle and Wasteland are totally different. Wasteland is played Game 1, while Pithing Needle is boarded in Games 2 and 3. Ichorid is much faster Game 1 because it hasn't boarded out the Dread Return combo for anti grave hate. After Ichorid boards out the combo it becomes slower and therefore more susceptible to Tormod's Crypt and Wasteland, cards you can easily win through Game 1.
Secondly Wasteland lets you get off one Bazaar activation while Needle stops any use of Bazaar at all. For this reason I am much more concerned with answering Needle, Crypt and other hate then answering Wasteland.
Is there any other hate besides Leyline of the Void that the deck has trouble with? I think it's resilient enough to go through against even 2 Crypt activations... And Jailer isn't seeing enough play...
Some more questions:
1. Why do I see more Ichorid decks not running Leyline of the Void MD? The decks that go faster than this all rely on the graveyard, with Yawgmoth's Will shenanigans or Flash as the main culprits.
2. Dryad Arbor MD opens up to 8 (!) anti-Leyline slots in the SB (4 Reverent Silence, 4 Emerald Charm), with 7 more for something else.
3. What happened to Petrified Field? Getting back Wastelanded or dredged Bazaars can be really game-breaking, even if you have to wait a turn to play it.
4. Also, I see less Ichorid decks running Unmask. I think it's a perfectly great card for tripping up the opponent a turn before you explode with your Flaming Zombies from the Bridge.
What hate sees play depends on your metagame. Overall I have noticed a shift away from Leyline to other kinds of hate in response to Dryad Arbor, Emerald Charm and Reverent Silence. Ichorid can win through some of the hate like Tormod's Crypt but not when the opponent starts to tutor up multiple Crypts or Needles with Trinket Mage.
I might start running Leyline again in Ichorid if Flash makes a comeback. I wouldn't run it just to try answer Yawg Will though. Petrified Field is too slow for the maindeck by the time you can replay Bazaar you should have Dredged enough just off Draw steps to win. Unmask is a really strong card. It can answer grave hate before its even played and it clears away the opponents counters to hit grave hate on the board.
Some people run Dryad Arbor because it is not dead Game 1, allowing you to cast Dread Return more easily and it opens up sideboard slots Game 2. Personally I dislike it because it locks you into Green hate cards which can only deal with Leyline of the Void but none of the other hate you might see.
Dakmor Salvage is interesting but Dredging for 2 is very weak. Like Arbor it locks into one color making it harder to deal with different kinds of hate. That said even if you play 5 color lands answering different kinds of hate cards remains a problem.
The deck is easy to play and cheap. The one thing going against the deck is it's susceptibility to grave hate. If your metagame is very prepared to hate out Ichorid; Fish might be a better deck choice.
Dredge decks and GAT have virtually no cards in common and are trying for entirely different roles in the game, so I don't think they would work well together.
Contagion is better, because it can handle multiple jailers. I still like Darkblast though because you can maindeck it and still have it be good there Game 1.
As for your mana base, run some basic lands and fetchlands if you can afford them. Mishra's Factory is the only man land worth running, cut the others for Wasteland/Strip Mine. Good luck with the deck.
4 GAT
3 Flash
3 Bomberman
2 Stax
1 Fish
1 Oath
1 Tog
1 Gush Tendrils
These results make it obvious that other decks besides Flash and GAT exist. I would agree that Gush and Flash are powerful cards, worthy of restriction but they are not the only viable decks in the format.
Goblins has been putting up good results recently and has gotten a lot of hype; but I don't think it has proven itself anywhere near to one of the top three decks.
As for Angel Stax, that particular deck isn't competitive but the concept of a Fish/Stax hybrid has been proven to be strong
Currently my board is,
4 Chain of Vapor
4 Emerald Charm
4 City of Brass
3 Gemstone Mine
My maindeck runs both Unmask and Leyline, I recently added Leyline because of the large amount of Flash decks present. The other main difference in my maindeck is 3 Darkblast, which are great. They dredge Game 1, and post board answers Yixlid Jailer.
The resurgence of Flash has actually made the sideboard easier to build. People have been running just Leyline to answer both Flash and not running several different Ichorid hate cards in their sideboard. Because of this I have been tempted to cut Chain of Vapor and just devote my entire sideboard to enchantment hate, but I don't know if thats correct yet.
Draft:
Pack 1:
Slipstream Serpent, Gaze of Justice, Strangling Soot, Fathom Seer, Flamecore Elemental, Two-Headed Sliver, Blazing Blade Askari, Shadow Sliver, Ophidian Eye, Ignite Memories, Saltcrusted Steppe, Clockwork Hydra, Ith, High Arcanist, Lord of Atlantis, Spirit Loop
Pick: Clockwork Hydra
Pack 2:
Goblin Skycutter, Cancel, Penumbra Spider, Pentarch Ward, Assassinate, Call to the Netherworld, Cyclopean Giant, Brass Gnat, Savage Thallid, Screeching Sliver, Phantom Wurm, Outrider en-Kor, Molten Slagheap, Walk the Aeons
Pick: Walk the Aeons
Pack 3:
Urborg Syphon-Mage, Snapback, Aether Web, Lightning Axe, Cloudchaser Kestrel, Drudge Reavers, Aetherflame Wall, Detainment Spell, Thallid Shell-Dweller, Bewilder, Griffin Guide
Pick: Lightning Axe
Pack 4:
Nantuko Shaman, Benalish Cavalry, Feebleness, Plunder, Eternity Snare, Molder, Venser's Sliver, Fallen Ideal, Firewake Sliver, Calciform Pools, Gauntlet of Power, *
Pick: Gauntlet of Power
Pack 5:
Trespasser il-Vec, Fortify, Flamecore Elemental, Watcher Sliver, Blazing Blade Askari, Glass Asp, Traitor's Clutch, Durkwood Tracker, Plated Pegasus, Undying Rage, Whispers of the Muse
Pick: Undying Rage
Pack 6:
Temporal Eddy, Momentary Blink, Ancient Grudge, Greenseeker, Foriysian Interceptor, Telekinetic Sliver, Thick-Skinned Goblin, Spell Burst, Coalition Victory
Pick: Temporal Eddy
Pack 7:
Flowstone Channeler, Thrill of the Hunt, Plunder, Skulking Knight, Brass Gnat, Harmonic Sliver, Skittering Monstrosity, Chronosavant
Pick: Flowstone Channeler
Pack 8:
Strength in Numbers, Zealot il-Vec, Screeching Sliver, Psychotic Episode, Jedit's Dragoons, Foriysian Interceptor, Cavalry Master, Fool's Demise
Pick: Fool's Demise
Pack 9:
Gaze of Justice, Two-Headed Sliver, Shadow Sliver, Ophidian Eye, Ignite Memories, Saltcrusted Steppe, Lord of Atlantis
Pick: Gaze of Justice
Pack 10:
Pentarch Ward, Call to the Netherworld, Cyclopean Giant, Brass Gnat, Screeching Sliver, Outrider en-Kor
Pick: Outrider en-Kor
Pack 11:
Drudge Reavers, Aetherflame Wall, Detainment Spell, Bewilder, Volcanic Awakening
Pick: Aetherflame Wall
Pack 12:
Plunder, Eternity Snare, Fallen Ideal, Firewake Sliver
Pick: Eternity Snare
Pack 13:
Blazing Blade Askari, Traitor's Clutch, Plated Pegasus
Pick: Plated Pegasus
Pack 14:
Ancient Grudge, Foriysian Interceptor
Pick: Foriysian Interceptor
Pack 15:
Plunder
Pick: Plunder
Pack 16:
Poultice Sliver, Spitting Sliver, Veiling Oddity, Synchronous Sliver, Giant Dustwasp, Pallid Mycoderm, Keldon Marauders, Revered Dead, Rathi Trapper, Fa'adiyah Seer, Mantle of Leadership, *, *, Magus of the Coffers, Melancholy
Pick: Veiling Oddity
Pack 17:
Whitemane Lion, Mire Boa, Utopia Vow, Dash Hopes, Shade of Trokair, Vitaspore Thallid, Brain Gorgers, Fury Charm, Seal of Primordium, Healing Leaves, Simian Spirit Guide, Circle of Affliction
Pick: Shade of Trokair
Pack 18:
Cradle to Grave, Dead / Gone, Ghost Tactician, Wistful Thinking, Dash Hopes, Reality Acid, Citanul Woodreaders, Vampiric Link, Skirk Shaman, Pouncing Wurm, *, Pyrohemia, Braids, Conjurer Adept
Pick: Dead / Gone
Pack 19:
Spitting Sliver, Aven Riftwatcher, Stingscourger, Dash Hopes, Aquamorph Entity, Uktabi Drake, Ghost Tactician, Healing Leaves, Sunlance, Prodigal Pyromancer, Muck Drubb, Aether Membrane
Pick: Sunlance
Pack 20:
Veiling Oddity, Midnight Charm, Battering Sliver, Firefright Mage, Wistful Thinking, Keldon Marauders, Melancholy, Piracy Charm, Ana Battlemage, Frenetic Sliver, Ovinize
Pick: Keldon Marauders
Pack 21:
Dawn Charm, Stingscourger, Uktabi Drake, Aquamorph Entity, Evolution Charm, Merfolk Thaumaturgist, Mana Tithe, Hammerheim Deadeye, Pouncing Wurm, Benalish Commander
Pick: Hammerheim Deadeye
Pack 22:
Erratic Mutation, Needlepeak Spider, Brain Gorgers, Dust Corona, Vitaspore Thallid, Simian Spirit Guide, Merfolk Thaumaturgist, Cautery Sliver, Serra's Boon
Pick: Needlepeak Spider
Pack 23:
Synchronous Sliver, Needlepeak Spider, Dreamscape Artist, Keldon Marauders, Primal Plasma, Waning Wurm, Timecrafting, Shrouded Lore
Pick: Primal Plasma
Pack 24:
Spitting Sliver, Revered Dead, Fa'adiyah Seer, Mantle of Leadership, Phantasmagorian, Riptide Pilferer, Melancholy
Pick: Riptide Pilferer
Pack 25:
Dash Hopes, Vitaspore Thallid, Fury Charm, Seal of Primordium, Healing Leaves, Circle of Affliction
Pick: Fury Charm
Pack 26:
Ghost Tactician, Wistful Thinking, Dash Hopes, Reality Acid, Vampiric Link
Pick: Reality Acid
Pack 27:
Spitting Sliver, Dash Hopes, Ghost Tactician, Muck Drubb
Pick: Ghost Tactician
Pack 28:
Midnight Charm, Firefright Mage, Wistful Thinking
Pick: Firefright Mage
Pack 29:
Mana Tithe, Benalish Commander
Pick: Mana Tithe
Pack 30:
Dust Corona
Pick: Dust Corona
Pack 31:
Cutthroat il-Dal, Gathan Raiders, Llanowar Augur, Augur of Skulls, Sprout Swarm, Thornweald Archer, Flowstone Embrace, Frenzy Sliver, Mesmeric Sliver, Patrician's Scorn, Utopia Mycon, Haze of Rage, Dakmor Salvage, Pyromancer's Swath, Magus of the Moat
Pick: Magus of the Moat
Pack 32:
Llanowar Empath, Marshaling Cry, Unblinking Bleb, Lost Hours, Riddle of Lightning, Wrap in Vigor, Lucent Liminid, Vedalken Aethermage, Virulent Sliver, Frenzy Sliver, Ghostfire, Soultether Golem, Lost Auramancers, Magus of the Moat
Pick: Magus of the Moat
Pack 33:
Bogardan Lancer, Venser's Diffusion, Oblivion Crown, Saltskitter, Infiltrator il-Kor, Blade of the Sixth Pride, Sporoloth Ancient, Grinning Ignus, Whip-Spine Drake, Cloudseeder, Skirk Ridge Exhumer, Llanowar Reborn, Zoetic Cavern
Pick: Cloudseeder
Pack 34:
Cutthroat il-Dal, Gift of Granite, Quiet Disrepair, Rift Elemental, Grave Scrabbler, Lumithread Field, Mesmeric Sliver, Deepcavern Imp, Flowstone Embrace, Sword of the Meek, Even the Odds, Mystic Speculation
Pick: Even the Odds
Pack 35:
Wrap in Vigor, Samite Censer-Bearer, Putrid Cyclops, Rift Elemental, Lumithread Field, Grinning Ignus, Edge of Autumn, Logic Knot, Keldon Megaliths, Ravaging Riftwurm, Shivan Sand-Mage
Pick: Logic Knot
Pack 36:
Samite Censer-Bearer, Bogardan Lancer, Knight of Sursi, Grave Peril, Sarcomite Myr, Henchfiend of Ukor, Dust of Moments, Reality Strobe, Festering March, Force of Savagery
Pick: Knight of Sursi
Pack 37:
Augur il-Vec, Grave Peril, Marshaling Cry, Blade of the Sixth Pride, Homing Sliver, Stronghold Rats, New Benalia, Shivan Sand-Mage, Scout's Warning
Pick: New Benalia
Pack 38:
Putrid Cyclops, Augur il-Vec, Lymph Sliver, Blind Phantasm, Virulent Sliver, Mass of Ghouls, Vedalken Aethermage, Cyclical Evolution
Pick: Vedalken Aethermage
Pack 39:
Llanowar Augur, Frenzy Sliver, Mesmeric Sliver, Patrician's Scorn, Utopia Mycon, Haze of Rage, Dakmor Salvage
Pick: Mesmeric Sliver
Pack 40:
Marshaling Cry, Unblinking Bleb, Wrap in Vigor, Vedalken Aethermage, Virulent Sliver, Frenzy Sliver
Pick: Unblinking Bleb
Pack 41:
Bogardan Lancer, Oblivion Crown, Saltskitter, Grinning Ignus, Llanowar Reborn
Pick: Bogardan Lancer
Pack 42:
Gift of Granite, Quiet Disrepair, Rift Elemental, Mesmeric Sliver
Pick: Rift Elemental
Pack 43:
Wrap in Vigor, Samite Censer-Bearer, Rift Elemental
Pick: Rift Elemental
Pack 44:
Samite Censer-Bearer, Grave Peril
Pick: Grave Peril
Pack 45:
*
Pick: *
Final Decklist:
Maindeck:
1 Magus of the Moat [FOIL]
1 Clockwork Hydra
1 Dead // Gone
1 Even the Odds
1 Plated Pegasus
1 Sunlance
1 New Benalia
1 Undying Rage
1 Lightning Axe
1 Shade of Trokair
1 Veiling Oddity
1 Outrider en-Kor
1 Magus of the Moat
1 Knight of Sursi
1 Riptide Pilferer
1 Cloudseeder
1 Logic Knot
1 Temporal Eddy
1 Bogardan Lancer
1 Reality Acid
1 Aetherflame Wall
1 Mana Tithe
1 Primal Plasma
1 Gaze of Justice
6 Plains
6 Island
3 Mountain
1 Hammerheim Deadeye
Sideboard:
1 Dust Corona
1 Eternity Snare
1 Firefright Mage
1 Flowstone Channeler
1 Fool's Demise
1 Foriysian Interceptor
1 Fury Charm
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Ghost Tactician
1 Homing Sliver
1 Keldon Marauders
1 Mesmeric Sliver
1 Needlepeak Spider
1 Plains
1 Plunder
2 Rift Elemental
1 Samite Censer-Bearer
1 Unblinking Bleb
1 Vedalken Aethermage
1 Walk the Aeons
Obviously you run Necro and Bargain as well. Necro is already in there, and you can run Bargain once you get more Rituals in there to support it.
Pithing Needle and Wasteland are totally different. Wasteland is played Game 1, while Pithing Needle is boarded in Games 2 and 3. Ichorid is much faster Game 1 because it hasn't boarded out the Dread Return combo for anti grave hate. After Ichorid boards out the combo it becomes slower and therefore more susceptible to Tormod's Crypt and Wasteland, cards you can easily win through Game 1.
Secondly Wasteland lets you get off one Bazaar activation while Needle stops any use of Bazaar at all. For this reason I am much more concerned with answering Needle, Crypt and other hate then answering Wasteland.
What hate sees play depends on your metagame. Overall I have noticed a shift away from Leyline to other kinds of hate in response to Dryad Arbor, Emerald Charm and Reverent Silence. Ichorid can win through some of the hate like Tormod's Crypt but not when the opponent starts to tutor up multiple Crypts or Needles with Trinket Mage.
I might start running Leyline again in Ichorid if Flash makes a comeback. I wouldn't run it just to try answer Yawg Will though. Petrified Field is too slow for the maindeck by the time you can replay Bazaar you should have Dredged enough just off Draw steps to win. Unmask is a really strong card. It can answer grave hate before its even played and it clears away the opponents counters to hit grave hate on the board.
Dakmor Salvage is interesting but Dredging for 2 is very weak. Like Arbor it locks into one color making it harder to deal with different kinds of hate. That said even if you play 5 color lands answering different kinds of hate cards remains a problem.