I don't know. It's a decent card and I know it was played back in the day, but I doubt it would be that popular anymore. We had the same combo in Ravinica for only 1 more mana and I never saw it played. I doubt Wall of Blossoms was liked that much on its own merits, as much as it played as a 5/4 trample + draw a card every turn, for an upkeep of 1G.
If I went down to my local shop, I bet the only person that could tell me what Fog Bank is would be the owner and that's only because he has it in his oldschool counterspell deck with all the best counterspells from Alpha to Urza block. I haven't ever heard much love for it and serveral of those people have Beta or revised duals since they've been playing forever.
Going down to your local shop is hardly a good litmus test on this. Having those cards and "playing forever" at this point could mean something like playing since Mirrodin came out. And either way, that's still just some random dudes from one shop.
Also, quit hating on Wall of Blossoms. That guy was and is a solid little wall. And manages to be worth a couple bucks.
That this should be in speculation. That's the word through the grapevine, at least.
Also, I would not expect an Ajani vs. Bolas set, especially if the inspiration is Alara's storyline. If they were gonna do that, I have a feeling it would have happened while Alara block was still the big new thing.
I like leveler, but I'm already scared of keeping track of those counters in the decks I build. I already love +1/+1 counter shenanigans, so I see my board getting wonky quite fast.
I'm kinda eh on the common Eldrazi. I wish he was uncommon. I get that the theme of this set has it make some sense that they would put this dude in a common slot, but I dunno, he just doesn't feel like he should be at common.
Is there any way we know for sure that there are four tribal spells, and not something like two cards with the word tribal in their names that reference themselves by title once in their card text?
Thats not just inflation there are other factors like you said but if you believe that that inflation is only gone up that much since 1997 your foolin yourself.
Even if we have suffered worse inflation than that given by the government, we have not undergone hyperinflation. If we had none of us would be having this discussion right now, because Wizards would most likely not be able to exist through such inflation.
I'm a collector, I own a complete set from Arabian nights to worldwake, including Portal series, Beatdown, Duel Decks, FTVs etc. And I'm so sad about this decision.
Those who upset about those reprints of the reserved cards, are not a collector but just a speculator (and maybe a very big retailers that also happens to own hasbro stocks).
Collectors would love to see those classic cards in the new frame and and especially with new art.
I'm glad to see wheel of fortune will be in a new fram at last, but so sad to know that we won't have the chance to see a better artwork Recurring nightmare, Orim samite healer or Eladamri, lord of leaves.
Oh well... if only they also put Sliver Queen on that list, together with Thawing and Wheel of fortune....
Wow, someone who actually collects cards for some sort of aesthetic value? From what I'd read from most collectors in this thread, primarily one's hailing this ill announcement, it seemed as though all of the "collectors" were actually more invested in buying cards only to sell them again, or to sit around in smoking jackets sipping brandy while discussing how wonderful it is to own cards worth a lot of money.
My problem with this announcement is how sudden it is on the heels of the more recent announcement about the reprinting of cards such as Phyrexian Negator and Masticore. This was done with much less tact than the gradual rolling back of more and more reprints from the reserved list we'd been seeing. If a company is going to announce a significant policy change that will anger a large part of their customer base (which this clearly has), it is very, very bad to unveil it as fast as a slap in the face.
I don't think a discussion of Urza coming back, or any particular storyline element, helps us who don't care much about the storyline to understand the implication of the Lights hint.
Truth be told, Time Spiral and Planar Chaos didn't do all that well sales-wise. They did better than most of Shards block, but one of the things that hurt the block was 'too much too soon' for the new and returning players.
This level of nostalgia was not only lost on the new players, but the sheer number of rehashed keyword mechanics confused a lot of people. For those of us who have been playing more or less continuously since ABUR, the return of Mangara, Crovax, Norin the Wary, etc. was cute at best, and a disappointment at worst. A few outstanding examples did well in constructed and EDH: Jhoira, Dralnu, Saffi Eriksdotter, the new Elder Dragons, and Teferi. Aside from that, the block flavour failed to add significantly to the cachet of the old characters, or set up a nostalgic feel for new players.
If Lights is anywhere near the level of compulsive namedropping nostalgia as Time Spiral block turned out to be, it will be poorly received. Urza is dead, Yawgmoth is dead, Gix is dead, the crew of the Weatherlight has dispersed, Karn is perhaps the only likely candidate for a PW and a new relevant storyline. This last bit is exciting, because it gives us (theoretically) our first colourless PW Karn is also an interesting character because he's been to both Phyrexia and Mirrodin, and is currently in big trouble dealing with something from one or the other of those planes.
Urza, Mishra, Karn, Yawgy- those are some pretty big shoes to fill. Mirrodin is also a pretty hard act to follow, despite people from the flavour camp groaning in dismay at the awkward art styles and people from the mechanics camp groaning at the big mistakes made with Skullclamp, nonlegednary artifact lands, and Vault Ninja.
Let's hope Lights follows up Mirrodin without borrowing too much nostalgia.
Just curious, but were there any actual polls or anything done by Wizards showing that the nostalgia didn't go over well with the older players? Because I as an older player did enjoy it, as did a good number of the people I know who'd been playing a long time. And how did the sales compare to, say, Kamigawa?
The only possibilities for FS duals in RotE left are Grove of the Burnwillows and Nimbus Maze, and as much as I love those cards, it just doesn't seem like it'll happen.
Oh, you're right, that must be why Graven Cairns was set on Shadowmoor in its Future Sight incarnation. Thank you for pointing out this obvious flaw in my logical processes. I must have forgotten them next to the dead horse I was beating.
Let's see... Core Sets are setting neutral, with no specific plane.
Legends are a specific person tied to a specific plane. Far from generic.
Planeswalkers are a specific person that can go wherever they want. Including the plane (block) that the Core Set happens to be superimposed over at the time.
Fair enough, no one had quite put it that way, or I missed anyone doing it before this.
Since the core set is more or less supposed to focus around Dominaria anyway, though, I don't see the big deal of including a cycle of five from Dominaria anyway. You're supposed to be summoning your own army from wherever and making your own story/duel with each game you play anyway, so what's the big deal?
I think maybe the Onslaught CCC3 legends - Arcanis the Omnipotent, Rorix Bladewing, Silvos, Rogue Elemental, Visara the Dreadful and Jareth, Leonine Titan would be nice in a Core Set, they were all well conceived, balanced cards and I think they were relatively underrated. I started playing magic when Onslaught was released and I remember loving these guys (although it took me a while to understand why Arcanis was good :P). I think a set of legends like these in a core set would be great - they teach new players how legends work; but they aren't too complicated; nor are they too weak to be immediately discounted by more experienced players (I know they weren't played too much, but still...). They also each completely embody the nature of their colour on the colour pie and provide a great generic fantasy flavour, which Wizards are going for in M11.
I, too, really like this notion, especially now that I realize for the first time that those five were a cycle. Surprised I missed that.
The Time Spiral storyline represents a "break" in the timeline. While individual sets aren't always in order, every set released before TSP takes place before the Mending and every set released afterwards takes place after the Mending, in the world of neo-planeswalkers.
I'm not really too up on Lorwyn/Shadowmoor stuff, but didn't those actually take place kind of around the Mending, as it is speculated that the Mending is what caused the Great Aurora or something?
As for it being too soon to see Tezz again, we saw a new Ajani the block right after his debut, and now we've seen new Chandra and Jace only two blocks after their debuts.
There's a subtle difference between nostalgia (what we saw in Time Spiral) and this new sense of resonance. In Time Spiral, you had to be in on the joke to get it. (Based on what MaRo promises,) in "Lights," if you're in on the joke, you'll appreciate it better, but everyone will at least have a chuckle.
I actually don't think the difference is subtle at all, since TSP was supposed to shove nostalgia down our throats, and this will likely be a blending of old storyline tidbits with all the new stuff. However, seeing as the closest we've had in the past three blocks to any sort of nostalgia is randomly tossing Bolas into Alara, it's gonna be nice to have the old storylines matter again. Because really, Bolas could have just as well have been some unknown planeswalker who had his spark downgraded and is now trying to use Alara to "reignite."
Going down to your local shop is hardly a good litmus test on this. Having those cards and "playing forever" at this point could mean something like playing since Mirrodin came out. And either way, that's still just some random dudes from one shop.
Also, quit hating on Wall of Blossoms. That guy was and is a solid little wall. And manages to be worth a couple bucks.
That this should be in speculation. That's the word through the grapevine, at least.
Also, I would not expect an Ajani vs. Bolas set, especially if the inspiration is Alara's storyline. If they were gonna do that, I have a feeling it would have happened while Alara block was still the big new thing.
The standard that already has Birds of Paradise, Noble Hierarch, Lotus Cobra, Harabaz Druid, Llanowar Elves, Rampant Growth, etc. in it?
I like leveler, but I'm already scared of keeping track of those counters in the decks I build. I already love +1/+1 counter shenanigans, so I see my board getting wonky quite fast.
I'm kinda eh on the common Eldrazi. I wish he was uncommon. I get that the theme of this set has it make some sense that they would put this dude in a common slot, but I dunno, he just doesn't feel like he should be at common.
Even if we have suffered worse inflation than that given by the government, we have not undergone hyperinflation. If we had none of us would be having this discussion right now, because Wizards would most likely not be able to exist through such inflation.
Wow, someone who actually collects cards for some sort of aesthetic value? From what I'd read from most collectors in this thread, primarily one's hailing this ill announcement, it seemed as though all of the "collectors" were actually more invested in buying cards only to sell them again, or to sit around in smoking jackets sipping brandy while discussing how wonderful it is to own cards worth a lot of money.
My problem with this announcement is how sudden it is on the heels of the more recent announcement about the reprinting of cards such as Phyrexian Negator and Masticore. This was done with much less tact than the gradual rolling back of more and more reprints from the reserved list we'd been seeing. If a company is going to announce a significant policy change that will anger a large part of their customer base (which this clearly has), it is very, very bad to unveil it as fast as a slap in the face.
I took what he said as references to Mirrodin and Urza's blocks, since Alara's artifacts were a subtheme.
Although, they kinda were in Urza's as well, which more of had a couple larger subthemes.
Because that would require the spell to be tribal; Eldrazi is a creature subtype and not a sorcery subtype.
Just curious, but were there any actual polls or anything done by Wizards showing that the nostalgia didn't go over well with the older players? Because I as an older player did enjoy it, as did a good number of the people I know who'd been playing a long time. And how did the sales compare to, say, Kamigawa?
Well, technically speaking, The Dark was caused by Urza.
Oh, you're right, that must be why Graven Cairns was set on Shadowmoor in its Future Sight incarnation. Thank you for pointing out this obvious flaw in my logical processes. I must have forgotten them next to the dead horse I was beating.
Fair enough, no one had quite put it that way, or I missed anyone doing it before this.
Since the core set is more or less supposed to focus around Dominaria anyway, though, I don't see the big deal of including a cycle of five from Dominaria anyway. You're supposed to be summoning your own army from wherever and making your own story/duel with each game you play anyway, so what's the big deal?
I, too, really like this notion, especially now that I realize for the first time that those five were a cycle. Surprised I missed that.
Lol, yeah, introduce legends by printing them all as Homelands reprints at uncommon. Ihsan's Shade for black, Hazduhr the Abbot for white, Autumn Willow for green, Reveka, Wizard Savant for blue, and Eron the Relentless for red. I would be very, very amused.
I get what you're trying to say, but unfortunately 10th edition was not part of TSP block, so this argument is rather flawed.
I'm not really too up on Lorwyn/Shadowmoor stuff, but didn't those actually take place kind of around the Mending, as it is speculated that the Mending is what caused the Great Aurora or something?
As for it being too soon to see Tezz again, we saw a new Ajani the block right after his debut, and now we've seen new Chandra and Jace only two blocks after their debuts.
I actually don't think the difference is subtle at all, since TSP was supposed to shove nostalgia down our throats, and this will likely be a blending of old storyline tidbits with all the new stuff. However, seeing as the closest we've had in the past three blocks to any sort of nostalgia is randomly tossing Bolas into Alara, it's gonna be nice to have the old storylines matter again. Because really, Bolas could have just as well have been some unknown planeswalker who had his spark downgraded and is now trying to use Alara to "reignite."