I have a playset of scalding tarns and 3x arid mesas
With fetches going up in price, should I wait or try to sell now? What would be a good price to try to sell, and do you think they are going to keep going up?
My question, is, is anyone's sideboard/mainboard changing at all with the new bans/unbans and predicted new meta? From what I gather on the latest page, probably not, but it is something I am curious of.
I was wondering if taking out pack rat would be the right call, going forward in the meta, or if Pack rat is just that good.
I was thinking of a removal suite of 4x drown in sorrow, 4x bile blight, 4x devour flesh, 4x hero's downfall in the main deck, or is that too much?
You'd be left with Gary, Nightveil, and Desecration to pick up the weight, maybe putting back in a whip or two.
I haven't had much problems with getting double red on like turn 4, but I may have gotten lucky. I've also wanted to add in warleader's helix but can't find room. Same with boros reckoner in the sideboard to be more aggressive if I need to be due to time. These may just be wishful thinking from last standard. I might up the count of red sources, maybe put in some izzet and boros guildgate because I am worried about hitting double red now
So here is something I have sleeved up. I don't know if it's any good, want to take it to FNM. Your thoughts/comments/criticisms from those more experienced? I'm sure it could use more work, especially the sideboard
what about underworld cereberus since we don't play whip anymore, and we can get back all the things we pitched to pack rat, or all the grey merchants that died.
pharika's cure is probably the best SB card vs mono red since it hit almost everything except for a reckoner and you gain 2 life. After board unless they have a crazy BTE hand, the matchup is usually pretty good in my experience.
Thought's onthe 4 Devour Flesh & 1 Pharika's Cure vs 2 Devour Flesh, 2 Ultimate Price, and 1 Doom Blade in the MB of the Mono-B decks?
I think that it is a very important meta call and people should be careful to not blindly go with the 4 devour flesh route if there is a decent amount of green run in your area. I think devour flesh is sometimes pretty bad card against the G/R devotion decks.
I think that's a good point to bring up (mainly because there's a lot of green devotion in my area)
I played in a 4 round FNM. Here is how it went
Game 1 I was against UW deck. Game 1 I won with well timed thoughtseizes, in game 2 I lost to double aetherling and a bunch of detention spheres. In game 3, it went to time, and I was able to get a draw but really I would have lost because I thoughtseized an aetherling from him, but then he used elixer of immortality and got one off the top on his next draw that I couldn't deal with.
I don't know, in this match, it just seemed like I had to hope to strip aetherling and elspeth was very annoying but managable with whip of erebos.
So I drew in round 1.
In round 2 I played against RG devotion. I went 2-0, I basically killed off as much stuff as possible early and was able to hero's downfall or attack his planeswalkers, making sure his board state never got out of control.
In round 3, I played against an esper deck. I lost game 1, but after boarding in erebos's and duresses and LBZ I was able to strip BBoV and keep him from gaining life with sphinx's. Game 3 I drew timely far/away's to deal with BBoV and won.
In round 4, I went up against mono red devotion. I barely won game 1 off of whip of erebos regaining me life and nightveil specter pulling mountains and then additional blockers for me. In game 2, I drew 3 pharika's cures which helped me stall for such a long time and let me win.
So I ended up going 3-0-1. I really wish I would have considered gainsay. I think it might have been nice at countering detention sphere and aetherling. I don't know, those feel like the worst cards for me to play against.
I have been thinking of going 4 temple of silence and just playing sin collector. But I'm not sure. I don't like the fact that I essentially have 8 CIPT lands (watery grave, I feel like I usually want it to CIPT). I really like splashing a color because mono black, while powerful, feels like it has glaring weaknesses, but I don't like the inconsistency of not having blue or so many different lands that pain me or cipt. Maybe I'm just hard to please haha.
However, I do think that I will try out gainsay. I hate that I feel that UWx feels like my hardest uphill matchup every time all the time. I really just want my SB to be 4 duress 4 gainsay but I know that I need the SB slots for other things.
I tested the blue splash this week and liked it a lot. I was inspired by brad nelson but I didn't go as deep into the blue splash as he did.
Took out the devour fleshes for far/away. Took out pharika's cure and 1 ultimate price for dimir charms. Played 4x watery grave, 4x temple of deceit, 4x mutavault, and the rest swamps. Never had an issue with blue mana, and felt like I was winning more esper games. Even using dimir charm's fateseal ability didn't seem too bad after an opponent would scry. I might try this tomorrow at FNM instead of just testing and let you guys know how I do.
So I have a PTQ this weekend and am pretty much set on Mono B Devotion (Owen Turtenwald's current version). However, there are a couple of things a I am still debating:
1. Is it possible to move 1 Underworld Connections to the sideboard? I definitely want 4 total, but is this a reasonable move? Or is the card just too important vs Mirror/Esper/UW?
2. Are some number of Temple of Silence worth it? The most reasonable approach would seem to be a 2/2 split between it and Temple of Deceit.
3. I feel like I want 2-3 Doom Blade in the board because it kills annoying creatures which Ultimate Price/Pharika's Cure cannot kill. Is this really necessary?
4. With UW, Esper, Mono B and BW Control all having strong finishes, is it perhaps necessary to have access to the full 12 of 4 Thoughtseize / 4 Duress / 4 Lifebane Zombie?
5. The most important question of all: Is it reasonable to play 3-4 Lifebane Zombies main deck? If so, what to cut? Should the Nightveil Specters just be moved to the sideboard?
What do you guys think?
I don't think I have as much experience with the deck as some of the other forum posters, but I have been playing it for the past month and can offer my own opinions.
1. I think underworld connections is just too good. Its one of the best cards in the deck, getting the turn 3 UC is just backbreaking, especially in owen's deck with 4x pack rats. I mean you would be siding in that 4th in pretty much every game anyway outside of rakdos aggro/white weenie right?
2. I think the temple question is just what you expect (off of what you think you might hit with nightveil specter)
3. I agree with the doom blade in the board. In any matchup that isn't mono black or esper you pretty much want them in.
4. I don't know if you want that much. Even the orzhov control deck that won last GP didn't have so many hand disruptions post sideboard. You also don't want to be top decking a duress. I think owen's numbers are right on that one. It's something you want to test for sure, but in my experience, 2-3 duress in board and 3 LBZ has been the sweet spot for me
5. I think it's reasonable to try out LBZ in the main (again dependant on your meta) however, I think nightveil specter is just so good that you should keep him in.
With fetches going up in price, should I wait or try to sell now? What would be a good price to try to sell, and do you think they are going to keep going up?
I was thinking of a removal suite of 4x drown in sorrow, 4x bile blight, 4x devour flesh, 4x hero's downfall in the main deck, or is that too much?
You'd be left with Gary, Nightveil, and Desecration to pick up the weight, maybe putting back in a whip or two.
I mean if you hate losing to top decks...
I've also wanted to add in warleader's helix but can't find room. Same with boros reckoner in the sideboard to be more aggressive if I need to be due to time. These may just be wishful thinking from last standard. I might up the count of red sources, maybe put in some izzet and boros guildgate because I am worried about hitting double red now
4 hallowed fountain
4 steam vents
4 sacred foundry
4 temple of triumph
4 azorius guildgate
1 mutavault
3 island
2 plains
//spells
1 aetherling
1 elspeth, sun's champion
4 detention sphere
2 quicken
4 divination
3 sphinx's revelation
4 supreme verdict
2 anger of the gods
1 elixer of immortality
2 last breath
4 counterflux
2 izzet charm
4 jace, architect of thought
2 anger of the gods
2 wear/tear
2 celestial flare
1 assemble the legion
1 turn/burn
2 last breath
2 mizzium mortars
1 pithing needle
2 jace, memory adept
I think that's a good point to bring up (mainly because there's a lot of green devotion in my area)
Game 1 I was against UW deck. Game 1 I won with well timed thoughtseizes, in game 2 I lost to double aetherling and a bunch of detention spheres. In game 3, it went to time, and I was able to get a draw but really I would have lost because I thoughtseized an aetherling from him, but then he used elixer of immortality and got one off the top on his next draw that I couldn't deal with.
I don't know, in this match, it just seemed like I had to hope to strip aetherling and elspeth was very annoying but managable with whip of erebos.
So I drew in round 1.
In round 2 I played against RG devotion. I went 2-0, I basically killed off as much stuff as possible early and was able to hero's downfall or attack his planeswalkers, making sure his board state never got out of control.
In round 3, I played against an esper deck. I lost game 1, but after boarding in erebos's and duresses and LBZ I was able to strip BBoV and keep him from gaining life with sphinx's. Game 3 I drew timely far/away's to deal with BBoV and won.
In round 4, I went up against mono red devotion. I barely won game 1 off of whip of erebos regaining me life and nightveil specter pulling mountains and then additional blockers for me. In game 2, I drew 3 pharika's cures which helped me stall for such a long time and let me win.
So I ended up going 3-0-1. I really wish I would have considered gainsay. I think it might have been nice at countering detention sphere and aetherling. I don't know, those feel like the worst cards for me to play against.
I have been thinking of going 4 temple of silence and just playing sin collector. But I'm not sure. I don't like the fact that I essentially have 8 CIPT lands (watery grave, I feel like I usually want it to CIPT). I really like splashing a color because mono black, while powerful, feels like it has glaring weaknesses, but I don't like the inconsistency of not having blue or so many different lands that pain me or cipt. Maybe I'm just hard to please haha.
However, I do think that I will try out gainsay. I hate that I feel that UWx feels like my hardest uphill matchup every time all the time. I really just want my SB to be 4 duress 4 gainsay but I know that I need the SB slots for other things.
Took out the devour fleshes for far/away. Took out pharika's cure and 1 ultimate price for dimir charms. Played 4x watery grave, 4x temple of deceit, 4x mutavault, and the rest swamps. Never had an issue with blue mana, and felt like I was winning more esper games. Even using dimir charm's fateseal ability didn't seem too bad after an opponent would scry. I might try this tomorrow at FNM instead of just testing and let you guys know how I do.
edit: the decklist
13 swamp
4 mutavault
4 watery grave
4 temple of deceit
//creatures
4 gray merchant of asphodel
3 desecration demon
4 pack rat
4 nightveil specter
1 erebos, god of the dead
2 dimir charm
4 thoughtseize
4 hero's downfall
1 ultimate price
1 whip of erebos
4 underworld connections
3 far//away
4 pharika's cure
4 lifebane zombie
1 doom blade
1 dark betrayal
1 far//away
2 duress
2 erebos, god of the dead
I don't think I have as much experience with the deck as some of the other forum posters, but I have been playing it for the past month and can offer my own opinions.
1. I think underworld connections is just too good. Its one of the best cards in the deck, getting the turn 3 UC is just backbreaking, especially in owen's deck with 4x pack rats. I mean you would be siding in that 4th in pretty much every game anyway outside of rakdos aggro/white weenie right?
2. I think the temple question is just what you expect (off of what you think you might hit with nightveil specter)
3. I agree with the doom blade in the board. In any matchup that isn't mono black or esper you pretty much want them in.
4. I don't know if you want that much. Even the orzhov control deck that won last GP didn't have so many hand disruptions post sideboard. You also don't want to be top decking a duress. I think owen's numbers are right on that one. It's something you want to test for sure, but in my experience, 2-3 duress in board and 3 LBZ has been the sweet spot for me
5. I think it's reasonable to try out LBZ in the main (again dependant on your meta) however, I think nightveil specter is just so good that you should keep him in.