The only card that sticks out to me is Concentrate. It’s neither a creature nor a classic instant-speed draw spell, nor is it a harder-to remove permanent like Rhystic Study.
Breaking news: I finally got to play TWO games with this deck last night! Here are the highlights:
Game 1, vs Yasova Dragonclaw, Saheeli, the Gifted, and Pir/Toothy.
- This game was mostly about trying to prevent the Yasova player from taking our stuff and either sacrificing it or blinking it so it stayed on his side.
- Raff did a great job of pressuring early planeswalkers from Saheeli.
- Azami, Lady of Scrolls effectively drew a bunch of cards.
- Platinum Emperion was mostly effective at preserving my life total, but only lived because there were other things to steal (like my Avacyn, who I had to Path).
- Crystal Shard was incredible at keeping others honest about tapping out and at protecting Raff.
- In Bolas's Clutches nearly got me a Mind’s Dilation, but unfortunately ate a Spell Swindle instead.
- Elspeth, Sun's Champion was mainly just a board wipe, but she at least allowed Raff to live.
- Blackblade Reforged was a big hit late-game, almost giving Raff a one-hit kill. Props to whoever suggested it; the table was pretty shocked that it almost didn’t make the cut.
- Unfortunately, I ended up losing to a large Comet Storm just as I was about to stabilize.
Game 2, vs Maelstrom Wanderer, Ramos, Dragon Engine, and Zacama, Primal Calamity.
- This game was nucking futs. Everyone except Zacama was doing all sorts of broken plays.
- I had a T4 Smothering Tithe, the first time I’ve ever cast that card. Boy, did it ever live up to the hype! At one point, there was a Rhystic Study and two Nezahal on the table, so I had all the mana I could ever want.
- I also stole a Maelstrom Nexus with In Bolas's Clutches, which later allowed me to find a Counterspell off the top in response to a Nexus of Fate.
- Unfortunately, the MW player had way too much value from his cascades and overwhelmed us in extra turns.
Update: made a few small changes, lowered the average CMC a bit and added some more utility. Endless Atlas didn't quite make the cut due to not enough basics.
Lots of good feedback from the Random Deck of the Week thread inspired a lot of changes to this list, detailed above in the change log. Overall, I decreased the average CMC from 3.98 to 3.68, which is quite good.
Some notes on other cards that didn't make it:
- I'm not real interested in the Sagas. Fall of the Thran fits squarely in the "bad form" category next to other mass LD spells. Time will tell if The Antiquities War is worthwhile.
- Marit Lage's Slumber will almost certainly come in at some point. Urza, Lord High Artificer will go right into the wishlist pile next to the newTeferis that are way too expensive to acquire. Many other Modern Horizons cards will also find their way here based on their cash prices.
- Empress Galina should probably be on the testing list.
- The last addition came down to Tezzeret the Seeker, Commander's Sphere, and Baird, Steward of Argive. Went with Tezz due to lack of tutors and shuffles.
Thanks again to everyone for all the feedback, and keep it coming!
Wow, lots of great feedback! Thanks everyone for the advice!
While I still have not played a real game with this deck, I did try to goldfish it a few times. The "results" were pretty glaring:
- There were way too many clunky expensive spells, as others have suggested.
- Both Top and Jace were largely ineffective due to the lack of shuffle effects.
- Most of the random legendary creatures want to do their own thing and have the rest of the deck conform to them, but they aren't too good at sharing the spotlight.
My gut tells me that something just isn't right with this list, and that the lack of cohesion is going to force me to re-do it. I've been putting a lot of effort into Lord Windgrace lately, and the top three legends in the list (Gitrog, Omnath, and Titania) all work extremely well together. I think the same could be said for Hanna, Padeem, Arcum, Muzzio, Sai, etc.
Much like Yeva, [c]Raff Capashen. Ship's Mage is a commander dedicated to playing things when you're not meant to. In this case, artifacts and legendary spells. The question I ask is how ought flash be? It's like Elton John's "I Guess That's Why They Call It the Blues". Why do they call it the blues? The song never tells you, it just guesses "that"'s why. So why is Raff flash like it oughta be? We may never know why, only that it is.
For the record, I stole the title from a slogan of a minor league baseball team. I've had my Yeva flash deck forever, and when Raff came around, I thought he would be a good choice for a commander that was "supposed" to be about the flash keyword.
Unfortunately, while I have sleeved this deck up, I still haven't been able to actually play the list. I hope to get back to the table once our house is done being renovated, but for now my appetite has to be satiated by Arena. Still, I try to keep up with all of the latest spoilers and things, so the feedback is always appreciated.
As for this particular deck, it feels a bit heavy on the four-drops. Hanna is certainly worth considering given the density of artifacts.
Agreed...looks like a pretty solid list for the most part.
The only card that stuck out at first glance was Jet Medallion, only because it’s a two-color deck that doesn’t seem to have a huge curve. I'd probably rather have a MirageDiamond or an Orzhov Locket, but I’m honestly just nitpicking as this sort of deck practically builds itself.
This is a really cool take on a commander that is otherwise pretty linear in terms of building.
I'll go the opposite route and suggest a few cuts. Apologies if you've already discussed one or more of these elsewhere.
- Deathsprout: Ramping on four needs to be extra special to warrant a spot, and removal needs to be flexible enough to target multipletypes of problems.
- End-Raze Forerunners: not Craterhoof Behemoth?
- Lord of Extinction: it's a big body, but it has no evasion or special abilities on it, and I don't see anything like a Warstorm Surge that gives you a benefit for just sheer size.
- Forbidden Orchard: You play green, so you have access to the best fixing there is. Do you really need to give someone else a body just to fix your mana? Where's the Overgrown Tomb? It just got reprinted, so money shouldn't be much of an issue.
- Fellwar Stone: Normally I wouldn't run artifacts in a green deck, but Glissa is the clear exception. That being said, I'd rather guarantee my colors with Golgari Signet, Charcoal Diamond, Moss Diamond, or Golgari Locket.
- Journey to Eternity: It just feels like too many things have to go right for it to work. You need the target creature to survive its casting, then you need the creature to die (not bounce or exile), then you need to spend five more mana to get back your own thing (not someone else's).
This deck seems tailor-made for a Training Grounds. Didn't see any discussion of it in your thread, but it does serious work for me in Scarab God.
Lastly, a friend of mine used to have a Roon deck and he mentioned that one of his most underrated cards was Loxodon Warhammer. He said that it solved a lot of specific problems and shored up a lot of weaknesses. Might be something to try out.
Speaking as a primer authour, I don't think primer status should be a disqualifer from discussion honestly. Yes, we've worked for years, (for some of us a near decade even) on the deck so the likelihood of missing obvious cards is pretty low, but that doesn't absolve us of any margin for error. This thread also doesn't have to be about card selection, but also on the strategy of the deck in question. Play rate, good match ups/bad match ups, and ways for improvement on said bad matches. I.e. I know I've pretty well given up on improving my sub10% win rate vs Esper inside of Kaalia, but I still value the possible avenues of attack I never considered from others. Even if they end up not making it into the deck (for whatever reason), having something I never considered is an appreciated last chance.
I second this. Having my deck recently featured gave me some great new perspective, even on something I've had for years. Nothing wrong with taking a new look at an old favorite.
Roon, the flicker rhino. One may question how exactly they decided a rhinoceros with a basketball sized fist was the appropriate character to give the dainty ability to flicker things to and fro, but I would remind you that flickering cards is typically quite literally picking things up and putting them down. Gotta have those rhino biceps. Personally, my favorite card here is Venser, the Sojourner: the plus is on theme, and the ult terrifies people so much, they often (in my experience with Venser) forget that his -1 just sucker punches people to death. And the thread does claim it typically wins through combat.
The one card that sticks out to me in this list is Armada Wurm. I understand its purpose, but I find it difficult to believe that a pair of mostly vanilla bodies is worthy of a slot in a three-color deck with access to so many different possible cards. Also, that casting cost seems a little tricky for my taste. Can't think of a better replacement at this time, but one has to be out there...
Everything is better with flash, and green creatures are very far from an exception to that rule. And if your opponents are as flighty as I am when playing magic, they will never ever remember not to attack into a commander that's an Ambush Viper. I've attacked into a Yeva's "empty board" an embarrassing number of times.
Aw man, this is what I get for taking a few days off from this wonderful site.
- This is the oldest current deck in my box, and the second one I ever created, so it's great to get it featured here.
- I try to focus as much as possible on the speed advantage of Yeva's flash ability.
- It's about 90% "flashy" (foiled). Missing Cavern of Souls, Gaea's Cradle, and Yavimaya Hollow cuz they're all insanely expensive.
- It's biggest weakness is flyers, which is a bit ironic given the original name of this format.
- My best memory with this deck is putting 16 creatures on the stack in response to a Gather Specimens on the blue player's own upkeep.
- Finally, wanted to send a shoutout to Iansisle for maintaining an excellent thread on this commander, and for giving me so many good ideas I hadn't thought of (looking at you, Timbermare).
- I finally got a Beast Whisperer the other day. I'll update the list shortly (and change some of the maybes that I don't have yet to acquires).
- I've never been a fan of Elvish Mystic, but then I tried Joraga Treespeaker after it overperformed in my cube, and it was like a green Sol Ring, so I kept it. The next one on my list is Karametra's Acolyte, but four mana is not a great spot on the curve for ramping. Probably need to re-evaluate my position on these ramp guys.
- The final level of Joraga Treespeaker was never really a goal, but the more I think about it, that just makes it a Wayfarer's Bauble or Diligent Farmhand, which are both still fine cards.
- Verdant Sun's Avatar was appealing for the fact that it gives life for every creature, and the deck can always respond to removal by putting a bunch of guys on the board and gaining a lot of life. I used to have a problem with life-gain, and this card solved that specific problem.
- Patron of the Orochi is here because it can untap everything on everyone else's turn, so it's almost a slightly lesser copy of Seedborn Muse, which is one of the best green cards in the format, and especially good here.
- I don't know why I haven't put a Dryad Arbor in here.
- Because I can play creatures whenever I want, Duskwatch Recruiter is really easy to flip. Even when it's not flipped, it's still a fine place to stick extra mana and refill.
- Magus of the Library was a recent addition, and unfortunately I don't get to play as much as I used to anymore, so I haven't actually cast it here yet.
- Primordial Sage was already on my cut list. Zendikar Resurgent hasn't made it in yet because I try to cram as many creatures as possible to take fullest advantage of Yeva.
- Lotus Cobra never really came up on my radar because it always felt like an inconsistent way to gain extra mana, and I don't run many fetches in here.
- Ulvenwald Hydra has three jobs: find Cradle and Nykthos, help out against flyers, and beat face. It does all three very well.
- Bramble Sovereign would probably be a solid addition. Cloudstone Curio and Panharmonicon are not creatures, so as good as they are, it will be harder to justify them. Wirewood Symbiote feels like more of a safety blanket for Yeva than anything else.
- Shamanic Revelation is neither a creature nor an instant, so it doesn't really fit in a deck built on speed.
- Thunderfoot Baloth is there for the power boost and the trample in a single card. There are other global anthems out there, but most of them only last for one turn, and there are other global trample effects out there, but none of them do both.
- Garruk Wildspeaker is always relevant, and gets to Overrun after just one turn. I did just pick up a Garruk, Caller of Beasts, at the suggestion of Iansisle, so I'll probably try that out in the near future (in place of Primordial Sage).
- Manglehorn is kind of a meta call. There isn't a dedicated artifact deck in my local group right now, so I feel like I have enough removal.
Thanks to everyone for the feedback! At the very least, I need to take another look at my stance on ramp creatures.
Hedron Archive: Another fine card, flexible enough to give you mana early and cash out for two cards later. But, I hate artifact ramp when you can play green non-artifact ramp. Wood Elves, Nature's Lore and Farseek get you duals, Farhaven Elf and Rampant Growth are always solid. Furthermore, none of these options will break the bank. If you must have an artifact, Selesnya Locket is one mana cheaper, which means it falls under the Sun Titan umbrella.
Looks like you chose Heliod to replace Odric. If so, great choice! Heliod is really solid.
I second the notion of adding Bear Umbra. Your commander's built-in hexproof will mitigate some of the downside of auras in this format, and as mentioned you can always make use of the extra untaps. If you can afford it, I would look into some other mass-untap effects as well. Sword of Feast and Famine might be a bit too expensive, but it's really strong if you can get ahold of one. Nature's Will is an older card that could allow you to get multiple untaps per turn. Wilderness Reclamation is probably the cheapest one of all, and still pretty effective. All of these also circle back to my prior point about land-based ramp over artifacts or creatures.
Some things to keep an eye on as you play a few games:
- Karn, the Great Creator and The Wanderer feel almost like sideboard cards to me. They could very easily be do-nothings, or they could be game-wreckers depending on who sits down across from you.
- How many times does Tocatli Honor Guard hurt your own ETB triggers?
One other small change: Martyr for the Cause is not very strong because you don't have full control of its proliferate trigger. Evolution Sage gives you more control and the upside of potentially getting more than one trigger.
Game 1, vs Yasova Dragonclaw, Saheeli, the Gifted, and Pir/Toothy.
- This game was mostly about trying to prevent the Yasova player from taking our stuff and either sacrificing it or blinking it so it stayed on his side.
- Raff did a great job of pressuring early planeswalkers from Saheeli.
- Azami, Lady of Scrolls effectively drew a bunch of cards.
- Platinum Emperion was mostly effective at preserving my life total, but only lived because there were other things to steal (like my Avacyn, who I had to Path).
- Crystal Shard was incredible at keeping others honest about tapping out and at protecting Raff.
- In Bolas's Clutches nearly got me a Mind’s Dilation, but unfortunately ate a Spell Swindle instead.
- Elspeth, Sun's Champion was mainly just a board wipe, but she at least allowed Raff to live.
- Blackblade Reforged was a big hit late-game, almost giving Raff a one-hit kill. Props to whoever suggested it; the table was pretty shocked that it almost didn’t make the cut.
- Unfortunately, I ended up losing to a large Comet Storm just as I was about to stabilize.
Game 2, vs Maelstrom Wanderer, Ramos, Dragon Engine, and Zacama, Primal Calamity.
- This game was nucking futs. Everyone except Zacama was doing all sorts of broken plays.
- I had a T4 Smothering Tithe, the first time I’ve ever cast that card. Boy, did it ever live up to the hype! At one point, there was a Rhystic Study and two Nezahal on the table, so I had all the mana I could ever want.
- I also stole a Maelstrom Nexus with In Bolas's Clutches, which later allowed me to find a Counterspell off the top in response to a Nexus of Fate.
- Unfortunately, the MW player had way too much value from his cascades and overwhelmed us in extra turns.
Going forward, this deck was a lot of fun, but just a bit too bulky. Some of the more expensive stuff will probably get cut. New cards coming in:
- Hall of Heliod's Generosity
- Enlightened Tutor
- Ugin, the Ineffable
- Endless Atlas
Update: made a few small changes, lowered the average CMC a bit and added some more utility. Endless Atlas didn't quite make the cut due to not enough basics.
Some notes on other cards that didn't make it:
- I'm not real interested in the Sagas. Fall of the Thran fits squarely in the "bad form" category next to other mass LD spells. Time will tell if The Antiquities War is worthwhile.
- Marit Lage's Slumber will almost certainly come in at some point. Urza, Lord High Artificer will go right into the wishlist pile next to the new Teferis that are way too expensive to acquire. Many other Modern Horizons cards will also find their way here based on their cash prices.
- Empress Galina should probably be on the testing list.
- The last addition came down to Tezzeret the Seeker, Commander's Sphere, and Baird, Steward of Argive. Went with Tezz due to lack of tutors and shuffles.
Thanks again to everyone for all the feedback, and keep it coming!
While I still have not played a real game with this deck, I did try to goldfish it a few times. The "results" were pretty glaring:
- There were way too many clunky expensive spells, as others have suggested.
- Both Top and Jace were largely ineffective due to the lack of shuffle effects.
- Most of the random legendary creatures want to do their own thing and have the rest of the deck conform to them, but they aren't too good at sharing the spotlight.
My gut tells me that something just isn't right with this list, and that the lack of cohesion is going to force me to re-do it. I've been putting a lot of effort into Lord Windgrace lately, and the top three legends in the list (Gitrog, Omnath, and Titania) all work extremely well together. I think the same could be said for Hanna, Padeem, Arcum, Muzzio, Sai, etc.
For the record, I stole the title from a slogan of a minor league baseball team. I've had my Yeva flash deck forever, and when Raff came around, I thought he would be a good choice for a commander that was "supposed" to be about the flash keyword.
Unfortunately, while I have sleeved this deck up, I still haven't been able to actually play the list. I hope to get back to the table once our house is done being renovated, but for now my appetite has to be satiated by Arena. Still, I try to keep up with all of the latest spoilers and things, so the feedback is always appreciated.
As for this particular deck, it feels a bit heavy on the four-drops. Hanna is certainly worth considering given the density of artifacts.
The only card that stuck out at first glance was Jet Medallion, only because it’s a two-color deck that doesn’t seem to have a huge curve. I'd probably rather have a Mirage Diamond or an Orzhov Locket, but I’m honestly just nitpicking as this sort of deck practically builds itself.
I'll go the opposite route and suggest a few cuts. Apologies if you've already discussed one or more of these elsewhere.
- End-Raze Forerunners: not Craterhoof Behemoth?
- Lord of Extinction: it's a big body, but it has no evasion or special abilities on it, and I don't see anything like a Warstorm Surge that gives you a benefit for just sheer size.
- Forbidden Orchard: You play green, so you have access to the best fixing there is. Do you really need to give someone else a body just to fix your mana? Where's the Overgrown Tomb? It just got reprinted, so money shouldn't be much of an issue.
- Fellwar Stone: Normally I wouldn't run artifacts in a green deck, but Glissa is the clear exception. That being said, I'd rather guarantee my colors with Golgari Signet, Charcoal Diamond, Moss Diamond, or Golgari Locket.
- Journey to Eternity: It just feels like too many things have to go right for it to work. You need the target creature to survive its casting, then you need the creature to die (not bounce or exile), then you need to spend five more mana to get back your own thing (not someone else's).
This deck seems tailor-made for a Training Grounds. Didn't see any discussion of it in your thread, but it does serious work for me in Scarab God.
Lastly, a friend of mine used to have a Roon deck and he mentioned that one of his most underrated cards was Loxodon Warhammer. He said that it solved a lot of specific problems and shored up a lot of weaknesses. Might be something to try out.
I second this. Having my deck recently featured gave me some great new perspective, even on something I've had for years. Nothing wrong with taking a new look at an old favorite.
The one card that sticks out to me in this list is Armada Wurm. I understand its purpose, but I find it difficult to believe that a pair of mostly vanilla bodies is worthy of a slot in a three-color deck with access to so many different possible cards. Also, that casting cost seems a little tricky for my taste. Can't think of a better replacement at this time, but one has to be out there...
- This is the oldest current deck in my box, and the second one I ever created, so it's great to get it featured here.
- I try to focus as much as possible on the speed advantage of Yeva's flash ability.
- It's about 90% "flashy" (foiled). Missing Cavern of Souls, Gaea's Cradle, and Yavimaya Hollow cuz they're all insanely expensive.
- It's biggest weakness is flyers, which is a bit ironic given the original name of this format.
- My best memory with this deck is putting 16 creatures on the stack in response to a Gather Specimens on the blue player's own upkeep.
- Finally, wanted to send a shoutout to Iansisle for maintaining an excellent thread on this commander, and for giving me so many good ideas I hadn't thought of (looking at you, Timbermare).
- I finally got a Beast Whisperer the other day. I'll update the list shortly (and change some of the maybes that I don't have yet to acquires).
- I've never been a fan of Elvish Mystic, but then I tried Joraga Treespeaker after it overperformed in my cube, and it was like a green Sol Ring, so I kept it. The next one on my list is Karametra's Acolyte, but four mana is not a great spot on the curve for ramping. Probably need to re-evaluate my position on these ramp guys.
- The final level of Joraga Treespeaker was never really a goal, but the more I think about it, that just makes it a Wayfarer's Bauble or Diligent Farmhand, which are both still fine cards.
- Verdant Sun's Avatar was appealing for the fact that it gives life for every creature, and the deck can always respond to removal by putting a bunch of guys on the board and gaining a lot of life. I used to have a problem with life-gain, and this card solved that specific problem.
- Patron of the Orochi is here because it can untap everything on everyone else's turn, so it's almost a slightly lesser copy of Seedborn Muse, which is one of the best green cards in the format, and especially good here.
- I don't know why I haven't put a Dryad Arbor in here.
- Because I can play creatures whenever I want, Duskwatch Recruiter is really easy to flip. Even when it's not flipped, it's still a fine place to stick extra mana and refill.
- Magus of the Library was a recent addition, and unfortunately I don't get to play as much as I used to anymore, so I haven't actually cast it here yet.
- Primordial Sage was already on my cut list. Zendikar Resurgent hasn't made it in yet because I try to cram as many creatures as possible to take fullest advantage of Yeva.
- Lotus Cobra never really came up on my radar because it always felt like an inconsistent way to gain extra mana, and I don't run many fetches in here.
- Ulvenwald Hydra has three jobs: find Cradle and Nykthos, help out against flyers, and beat face. It does all three very well.
- Bramble Sovereign would probably be a solid addition. Cloudstone Curio and Panharmonicon are not creatures, so as good as they are, it will be harder to justify them. Wirewood Symbiote feels like more of a safety blanket for Yeva than anything else.
- Shamanic Revelation is neither a creature nor an instant, so it doesn't really fit in a deck built on speed.
- Thunderfoot Baloth is there for the power boost and the trample in a single card. There are other global anthems out there, but most of them only last for one turn, and there are other global trample effects out there, but none of them do both.
- Garruk Wildspeaker is always relevant, and gets to Overrun after just one turn. I did just pick up a Garruk, Caller of Beasts, at the suggestion of Iansisle, so I'll probably try that out in the near future (in place of Primordial Sage).
- Manglehorn is kind of a meta call. There isn't a dedicated artifact deck in my local group right now, so I feel like I have enough removal.
All of this applies to Mind Stone and Paradise Druid as well.
Looks like you chose Heliod to replace Odric. If so, great choice! Heliod is really solid.
I second the notion of adding Bear Umbra. Your commander's built-in hexproof will mitigate some of the downside of auras in this format, and as mentioned you can always make use of the extra untaps. If you can afford it, I would look into some other mass-untap effects as well. Sword of Feast and Famine might be a bit too expensive, but it's really strong if you can get ahold of one. Nature's Will is an older card that could allow you to get multiple untaps per turn. Wilderness Reclamation is probably the cheapest one of all, and still pretty effective. All of these also circle back to my prior point about land-based ramp over artifacts or creatures.
Some things to keep an eye on as you play a few games:
- Karn, the Great Creator and The Wanderer feel almost like sideboard cards to me. They could very easily be do-nothings, or they could be game-wreckers depending on who sits down across from you.
- How many times does Tocatli Honor Guard hurt your own ETB triggers?
One other small change: Martyr for the Cause is not very strong because you don't have full control of its proliferate trigger. Evolution Sage gives you more control and the upside of potentially getting more than one trigger.