I hope Flarg is a Serial Killer, because at least it'll mean he isn't a one-shot vig.
idk, like why doesnt he just kill Zion here? if Zion is a wolf, its looks great, if Zion is town, its still ok because he erased all doubt of the counter wagon's alignment
instead he opts to shoot Grape, which looks like a wolf trying push a shot that doesnt look as wolfy
This is my issue with this gamestate what people are doing makes no sense tbh. Instead we get stuck in faction war all game.
I don't see ZDS as wolf because I have no idea what his end goal is here. That being said I have no idea why he is certain of everything if he is town so maybe I'm just wrong on this slot. At any rate whoever wolfs are here are clearly doing the powerwolf attempt considering how faction based this game has being since the start. The only people I'm really happy with atm are people on off wagons which is normally something I would scumread so this game is in a weird place for me.
I'm even starting to come around to a world where Wisp is a wolf with Tom which goes aganist my view from a couple of days ago.
Rodemy made a mess so I'm going to explain what happened behind the scenes, so people can reach their own conclusions without WIFOM or wild guesses.
After he first refused to claim, Rodemy whispered to me he was vanilla pretending to be a PR (and said he doesn't trust Jackrito and left him out of the loop).
I bought the claim and tried to buy him some time. I also sent Jackrito a cryptic whisper saying I knew Rod's role and asking him for help (I figured he wouldn't care for the actual, vanilla claim).
Then, unexpectedly, the same guy who has been in a constant state of panic since entering the game turned out not to have enough composure to go along with his own plan, and spilled the beans.
This resulted in some mild chaos where, as far as I can see, everyone reached whatever conclusions happened to be convenient to them or their world view. This will be worth reviewing when I have more time.
Anyway, my personal conclusion after this ordeal is that I like Rodemy even more now, I like his constant inability to settle down, it seems natural for a townie in his situation; whereas if he were scum, I assume he would either rely on his buddies for help, or resign himself more if they are already bussing him. I'm not even mad he lied to me about why he didn't contact Jackrito (what would he even say to one of the players trying to get him lynched?), you gotta try what you gotta try.
So now I don't want him to die at all.
I will say this checks out I did get a message from ZDS telling me to stop the lynch because Rod was a role that can't claim, which it seems was a lie, but I'm not mad. It just confused the hell out of me when I logged in and he claimed VT. I still don't see a reason to townread him though, even though doubts are entering my mind. The only other lynch I would do is Rhand maybe Vaimes. Still not really sold on Zion but I gave reasons before. This day has just turned into a mess tbh.
I'm good if we want to lynch Rhand today since he has being pretty bad today, but having Zion and Rod alive tomorrow is just going to mean we keep carrying over these doubts which if we are wrong on means we are setting up easy mislynches down the line. We need to come to a conclusion on them sooner then later. I just don't understand what Rod's play today was in aid of though it makes no sense if vanilla.
I still have no idea where I stand on Wisp starting to move him more into the scum pile though. Actually getting a red flip would help a hell of a lot in my read of him. His play here is just so passive and not caring at times, but I do agree with a lot of the points he makes at the same time.
I hope it's not too late for that kind of request, but if the rest of you are set on wanting RodemyCupCake dead (or being fine with it), could we let Flarg take care of him toNight and lynch someone else for now?
My townread on that slot is not strong enough to ask we dont off him at all, but it definitely is strong enough that I want to give Rod a safe-ish space (our Night chat) to express his thoughts without pressure (@Jack I hope it's fine with you).
You can also think of it as a compromise between lynching him and giving him a breather after he just replaced in.
Then after Flarg kills him, Jack & I do your best to give a neutral and complete summary of anything he said, and we analyse it depending on the flip.
If instead Flarg decides to "hero shoot" again, we get rid of the green ****er.
My suggestions for a non-Rod lynch are Zionite, Vaimes, and definitely not tom.
1 & 2) It's not so tied up like this. The reads on each player are independent, and where they cross was when GJ's pushed on Rhand. Things like that are useful for solving. So these questions already don't seem right because my read is not dependent on Rhand being town/scum. But yeah, if GJ made a bad push I'd definitely reconsider and dive deeper, try to see if it was intentional or if there were signs I missed before. You know, playing the game. I never tried to set up a lynch and if you think anyone is listening to what I have to say anyways, well you're giving me wayy too much credit. Many players are sure I'm scum so I don't know why they'd go for my devious plan to set up a lynch on GJ, who I've been solidly town reading for the majority of the game.
You are right people aren't listening to you, although I'd say it has less to do with your scumminess than with you diluting whatever points you are making down to homeopathic levels with your quote walls. I know you are responding to a lot of stuff but maybe after all these years you should learn to be lazy and handwave unimportant *****, while separating whatever's important better.
Anyway, back on track, the bolded is actually a good defense, with a big caveat that makes it fall flat: can't you just pull that kind of excuse at any time to get out of jail free whenever you get called out like I did?
Also, I'm roughly fine with the non-bolded part (it's a generic NAI answer), but there's another problem. Either you say you are analysing Johnny & Rhand separately or you dismiss the idea you'd have any credibility if you did tie them up. The first half makes the second moot. Overall you come off as more concerned with countering every single argument than with being internally coherent.
Re me admitting I could be wrong, how the **** did you interpret my line like this?
@Jack & @YWF, don't vote if your vote might be the hammer. It's too easy for scum to make that kind of "mistake" on purpose. I've been townreading you two so far so I'm not angry, but pull that crap again and I'm gonna do like a salmon and flip on you.
Re Slothful's #2082
On you not being paranoid: Conspiracy theories like
Quote from Slothful »
Another player was about to dig into what he set up. Tubba's case on KJ was not as confident or solid, but tom jumps in to capitalize in it because (1) if he doesn't, and could potentially bite him with his cellmates; and (2) now tubba's technically the one that started the wagon, and is a built-in fall guy
don't come from a sane mind.
On KCC: The way you put it, your theory had no failsafe, no way for KCC to prove herself in your eyes except maybe by acting in whatever highly specific way would have gotten you to reconsider your read, if such a thing even exists. Did you, at any point, give any serious thought to the perspective where this slot is town and she did everything exactly as she did? Because I did and her actions did not disprove that perspective.
On Vaimes: You are smart so I know you can figure it out on your own. Here's a hint: Vaimes is scum.
Do we even know for sure flarg has shots and if he did would even listen to us, they is multi ways to frame a vig or for a vig to lie about a kill not happening.
I also don't know what you expect Rod to say in our chat if he knows we both want him dead and vig will kill him anyway. He has had enough time today to put his views across and show why I don't see his approach changing much in our chat. I could agree to it if others agreed but I think this is a bad idea and could lead to more issues tomorrow.
I could get behind a Vaimes lynch tbh or Rhand not sure on Zion I would much rather a vig shot there if Rod flipped town since I think one of the two is scum. I'm not really feeling a lynch on them today. Agree on Tom for today at least though.
My vote was not close to being hammer and when I thought it was by mistake I took it away in the same min.
Pretty obv I have being wanting to do this for a while. His play is just not as great here as he thinks it is, But to be fair it would have to be amazing. Not really explained their scum reads are now just being defeatist.
I already gave my reason on why I'm not voting Tom today, maybe I'm wrong but his play today I see as town and the way that wagon build feels like a mislynch to me at least.
On Zion really not sure where I stand on him part of me wants him to just doe since I'm sick of the discussion around him this whole game and his play not really selling me on him as town. My main concern though is that my main scum read spend all of the night phase saying there were scum with Grape. I don't see that as bussing tbh. So in my view one of Zion and KCC/Rodemy is scum but not both. So just going with my stronger read.
Since this has came up a couple of times, I will give my piece KCC at no point in this game felt pressure until day imo. So this whole she came into day ready to die thing I find weird I was in a cell chat with her, and she was as far as possible from being defeatist. The pressure only came because of her reaction to ZDS in my view. It can be agrued the vote on KJ yesterday was part but you sort of expect pressure from that, and she was not overly bothered in our chat by it.
On the Tom thing do I think he could be scum here yeah sure, I'm townreading him atm but that is more because of what other people say and my own personal feeling that yesterday felt like to me a town who believed he was right rather then a scum pretending. I have heard today that he has a scum range to be able to fake that sort of thing so the town read goes down. That being said he is not someone I would take a punt on today. Since I think he seems to be a pretty good player so would rather believe he is town for now at least then just take a chance on him being scum today and losing a good player.
This is my issue with this gamestate what people are doing makes no sense tbh. Instead we get stuck in faction war all game.
My vote has being on Rod most of this stupid day, I only unvoted to avoid a early hammer regret that now though since this became a mess
Vote Rodemy
If you want to take the basic world view and ignore the reasons why I unvoted sure.
I'm even starting to come around to a world where Wisp is a wolf with Tom which goes aganist my view from a couple of days ago.
I will say this checks out I did get a message from ZDS telling me to stop the lynch because Rod was a role that can't claim, which it seems was a lie, but I'm not mad. It just confused the hell out of me when I logged in and he claimed VT. I still don't see a reason to townread him though, even though doubts are entering my mind. The only other lynch I would do is Rhand maybe Vaimes. Still not really sold on Zion but I gave reasons before. This day has just turned into a mess tbh.
I want to see what he has to say now, so to avoid any hammers before it.
Do we even know for sure flarg has shots and if he did would even listen to us, they is multi ways to frame a vig or for a vig to lie about a kill not happening.
I also don't know what you expect Rod to say in our chat if he knows we both want him dead and vig will kill him anyway. He has had enough time today to put his views across and show why I don't see his approach changing much in our chat. I could agree to it if others agreed but I think this is a bad idea and could lead to more issues tomorrow.
I could get behind a Vaimes lynch tbh or Rhand not sure on Zion I would much rather a vig shot there if Rod flipped town since I think one of the two is scum. I'm not really feeling a lynch on them today. Agree on Tom for today at least though.
My vote was not close to being hammer and when I thought it was by mistake I took it away in the same min.
Vote : Rodemy
Pretty obv I have being wanting to do this for a while. His play is just not as great here as he thinks it is, But to be fair it would have to be amazing. Not really explained their scum reads are now just being defeatist.
I already gave my reason on why I'm not voting Tom today, maybe I'm wrong but his play today I see as town and the way that wagon build feels like a mislynch to me at least.
On Zion really not sure where I stand on him part of me wants him to just doe since I'm sick of the discussion around him this whole game and his play not really selling me on him as town. My main concern though is that my main scum read spend all of the night phase saying there were scum with Grape. I don't see that as bussing tbh. So in my view one of Zion and KCC/Rodemy is scum but not both. So just going with my stronger read.
On the Tom thing do I think he could be scum here yeah sure, I'm townreading him atm but that is more because of what other people say and my own personal feeling that yesterday felt like to me a town who believed he was right rather then a scum pretending. I have heard today that he has a scum range to be able to fake that sort of thing so the town read goes down. That being said he is not someone I would take a punt on today. Since I think he seems to be a pretty good player so would rather believe he is town for now at least then just take a chance on him being scum today and losing a good player.