Quote from DanzBorin »I've actually thought about taking out the Swiftspears for Light Up the Stage.
I like Light Up the Stage in modern so it might be a good card in Legacy.
Path to Exile can only work once the target is on the battlefield. The reason it specifically does not work great against Marit lage is because they get the land they want as part of their engine, and they are playing wasteland. They can see you have the ability to get a white, and path it. Sometimes they figure out a way to hide, sometimes they figure out a way to discard, sometimes they figure out a way to remove the white source. Sylvan safekeeper, thoughtseize, wasteland. Path does not even deal damage. Losing to a never ending hammer is annoying as they sit behind a constantly renewed Glacial chasm.
Path is unreliable because it is a two part solution, with conditional requirements.
Part A, Then Part B, After occurrence C, provided X+Y+Z haven't happened.
Alpine Moon is just Part A
Chain of Vapor is extremely similar to Path. I am not understating the strength of Path , or chain.
But I do not believe they are the universal balm , the panacea, in this case.
Chain of vapor would be incredible. . . . Except it is blue
I have used Searing Blood, and it was OK as a sideboard card in a couple of cases. Delver, and grixis and Elves was good.
Wasn't good when their creature did not wanna die.
I still prefer the full 4 Swiftspears, and Lavamancers just a bit slow. I like playing Barbarian rings too, so threshold is something I value. I am happy to keep 4 land hands, if one is a Barbarian ring. And I am very happy when I see 2 lands, and one is a barbarian ring. The rings just seem good.
Quote from the n00b king »"Treated as a normal set, but twice as expensive. Why? Well...just because. Trust me, we had to hold ourselves back from charging 12$ because we know you're going to pay up no matter what!" - Business 101
Quote from TylerStegman »Isn't there a devoid card to answer it? Might cost too much to cast. I think it costs 3b
Quote from t0yb0x »Hmmm, legacy’s price issues seems to be affecting a lot of players the same way. I am a long time legacy player, I love the format. In my small group of friends, we play strictly legacy but we all have budgets. None of us have decks that can “go off” on turn 1 or 2, it’s a lot of fun. No one clan afford FoW or legit dual lands. And even if we could, we wouldn’t.
I feel like legacy’s prices are separating and pushing out a lot of would be legacy players. A lot of people are scared to even enter the format because of the prices. That’s sad. The legacy scene around me is pretty rough. 4-5 guys at my LGS have very expensive legacy decks. The “casual/budget” legacy player just can’t compete with that... usually.
Quote from GPash »LOL @ magic geek editing his post, removing the part where he asked me to post my decklist and then realizing his foot was in his mouth when I called his bluff. Classic.
Burn should never be playing a colorless land like Wak-Wak or Maze. Lands/Depths is just a bad matchup, as is most fast combo for Burn. Not sure why you're trying to dilute your sideboard to potentially assist a matchup that will still be bad.
Alpine Moon & Island of Wak-Wak are spicy, because Dark Depths sure seems unfair, and ubiquitous. Relabelling "combo" as 'Unfair' sounds odd, but, go ahead. But, it doesn't make FoW fair.
Believing you are going to deal 8 damage using Price of Progress seems extremely hopeful against decks playing Ponder. Price will be the first card discarded, and the spell counterspelled by FoW. At least, that's what happens to me.
Being "on the fairer end of the spectrum' sounds like Asperger's, not Burn.
My sideboard Does work against Dark Depth.
But I don't.
Game 1 I mulled to 6 and got him to 1 life
Game 2 I played an Alpine moon on turn 1, and the game went long...
I got him to 1, again, and the game stalled.
He played a Glacial Chasm, then copied it in his upkeep with a thespian stage so he did not have to pay for it.
Then he plays life from the loam drawing the Glacial chasm and junk
Then cycles a land, triggering the Life.
And the Glacial Chasm comes back into play.
This took some time.
Meanwhile, nothing is happening on my side of the fence.
After some turns of this he starts to deal me 2 damage with Punishing fire in my turn, and drawing it back into his hand by tapping a grove of Burnwilliows. Aethersworn Cannonist was slowing him down.
10 turns later, he is looking at me like, . . .Really? You are going to make me play this out?
He can never let the Chasm leave play, so he will never get to attack with a 20/20, even if he kills the Alpine moon.
And I draw Alpine Moon Number 2, name Glacial Chasm, and kill him.
Game 3, I stuff up royally.
Him - Land, Exploration, land
Me - Mountain Swiftspear
Him - Land, Thespian stage
Me - Barbarian Ring - Alpine Moon - Wait - Crop Rotation, Dark Depths, Win
Me - Mental anguish, looking at the second Alpine Moon in my hand, and the Island of Wak Wak I can't play because I played the Barbarian Ring
My deck gave me EXACTLY what I needed, and I did not play it.
All I had to do was first turn Alpine Moon, Turn 2 Alpine Moon & Island of Wak Wak then do the Happy dance.
Me so Dumb.
I allow myself to make each and every mistake once.
I aint doin' that again.
But, against the Red/Green version, Yep, That 8 card dedicated sideboard does work.
Well, It should, if you tap the mountain and play the freakin' card on turn 1.
Getting the answer card, and then getting spanked anyway, really gets me down.
And that is my problem. Discard in Legacy is common, especially facing those decks. They play discard to solve those problems.
The cheapest Thoughtseize is down to 15 bucks, Plateau is $180 (what, really?, no love for plateau compared with other Multi's)
Either way, I already got both, and that aint the issue.
* Not getting a white mana, blows
* Getting Path to exile hit by Inquiz & Thoughtseize also blows
* Them getting a second 20/20 also blows. (Now, sure, they absolutely should be dead before a second one)
Surgical wont work. (pretty sure)
Same with Traitor's roar. (too slow, and a sorcery, so no window).
Grab the reins is too expensive
Disharmony (&ActOfA) might work, but requires the 20/20 to exist in my main faze. And it often doesn't.
Backlash is perfect. Except its a black card.
As I said E-Bridge will get discarded, destroyed, or maybe be too slow. But it does have a definite plan.
Pia and ornithopter are one turn wonders that slow me down too, and might get destroyed.
Glacial Chasm will work, but seems strictly worse than Karakas, Maze of Ith and Island of Wak-Wak.
Weird to think Bitterblossom would work too. (if I had Black)
See how hard it is?
A singleton Alpine Moon seems hopeful.
Quote from lord_darkview »$10 for a even a basic Burn deck is a pretty good deal. Even Bolts go for $2ish these days.
We have some very powerful sideboard options against combo. The problem is that most of them are quite specific, and very few are unbeatable by a skilled opponent. Karakas and Ensnaring Bridge are the most flexible choices, having value against Reanimator, SnT decks, and Depths decks, but the former is often not quite sufficient and the latter is often too slow. Leyline of the Void, Surgical Extraction, Faerie Macabre, and Tormod's Crypt are options against graveyard-using decks, but they only work against these decks, and Crypt is the only one I find serviceable (Leyline forces you to mulligan far too much and leaves you with dead draws, while Surgical and Faerie often falter in the face of discard). Pyrostatic Pillar and Pithing Needle have some fringe utility, but often aren't quite powerful enough, or sufficiently effective in enough matches.
At the end of the day, bad matches against combo will rarely change from that state. Your sideboard cards probably aren't going to beat them. You're just trying to buy time. If a sideboard card buys you a single turn, given your damage output, that's often enough.