So I was looking for an easy deck to play that wasn't crazy expensive and I stumbled across this thread. I read a good 30 pages or so and landed on Buckjunt's list.
I've been winning alot of matchups on mtgo. There's not a whole lot of RDW/boros or white weenie which seems to be where it struggles. It's been strong against both mono devotion decks and great against control.
Buck i don't understand when your ever bringing in slaughter games or assemble? I've never brought either of them. I think pithing needle is a must. Alot of people have brought in Jace Memory Adept in against me and you have to have an immediate answer for that or they can mill your win cons out quick.
It's not that there aren't good cards, but you rarely wheel anything relevant, maybe an Urborg Uprising or Llanowar Dead. Most of the packs dry up after like 4 packs, which is very AVR-esque.
Whereas Planeshift is ridiculously deep, as you can get solid gating creatures like Cavern Harpy or ok sideboard cards like Singe on the wheel, as well as some of the best fixing and things like Flametongue Kavu.
Not trying to troll ya here but I disagree. The difference is AVR is a solid two color format so the packs do dry up. IPA is 3-5 colors every deck I've drafted which means even in the shallowest packs I still get plenty of payables. I've yet to draft a deck where I didn't have 26 solid payables with about 2-3 sb cards.
Im on my 10th draft and Ive tabled temporal springs, many of the disciples, bloodfire dwarf which is underrated IMO, Gaeas merfolk, gerrards verdict and quite a few of the tribal guys that let you look at 4 cards and pick one of like creature type. Maybe we evaluate cards differently?
Hmm that's interesting. Apoc is by far my favorite pack. I often draft bug and just get the complete nuts in apoc. People pass temporal springs and consume spirits like candy...
IPA is an amazing draft format for sure sooooo skill intensive.
You could should commission those things. People in the cube forum would pay a nice price for them; especially if the front engravings could be customized.
Thanks brother. The carvings could definitely be customized some what...but I mean you couldn't do full blown MTG card art. It's a wood carving. Simpler shapes, logos, titles etc. could be done though. If it's an image that could go into a children's coloring book...it'd probably work.
Haha...thanks for the compliments guys. I would love to say that this was easily done and I just whipped it out...but there were a few mistakes made and I did some of it on the fly so I'm not sure I can give a full breakdown of how it's built. You obviously have to have the tools to do something like this but here are some more pictures and I can give you some tips and lessons learned.
First things first. The sidewalls are made out of poplar which you can get at Lowes/Home Depot. The sidewalls are a 4" high, 1/2" thick wood. I bought two 4 foot sections of that. Now you can obviously use a harder wood like oak but keep in mind you're box will get heavy! I wanted a lighter wood that still looked good.
The dividers and center columns are the same poplar but only about 3" high (I did have to rip those down they came in 4" high panels too) and 1/4" thick wood (so a little thinner). That too was bought in two 4 foot sections.
The bottom and lid/top are made out of wood I can't even explain. It's a really thin sheet of wood you can buy at Lowes/Home Depot maybe 1/8" thick and it comes in 2'x4' foot panels. I'll get the exact name of it next time I'm in the store, but it's by all the nicer polished woods you can buy back in the lumber.
These are the original blueprints I started with. These were drawn in Google Sketch-Up and I'll gladly provide the actual sketchup file to anyone that wants it. In this picture you'll see I have the height at around 3" but I didn't actually build it at that height because when I went to Lowes they sold the wood in a 4" by 4' sheet and I didn't want to rip the board to cut it down so it's actually a little higher. The other thing I'd recommend is making a little wider then I ended up going. Mines a little short and the cards fit a little tiny bit tighter then I would've liked.
The actual box is put together using a small brad nailer, and a bunch of wood glue. The center columns are actually just glued with no nails at all because it's only 1/4" thick wood. And as you can see the only divider that is actually secured is the one in the middle between where my cube and dice would go. I simply glued that one down to add a little strength to my two columns. All the rest of my dividers are just free floating. I thought about gluing them all down, but I wanted to test out a bit first. I may find I want more or less room.
The carving was something last minute that my friend wanted to add. He has woodcarving tools. We simply went online and found a high res graphic of the Magic logo. Adjusted the size in Corel Draw but you could use GIMP which is free to do this part. Then you just print it out, and transfer it onto the lid with graphite paper and start carving it out with tools.
The sliding lid is quite the trick. You have to have a router to create the grooves in the wood to slide the lid in and out. The bottom is actually made the same way. There are grooves in all 4 sides and the bottom panel just sits in the grooves. Another little trick is to take a sander and sand away the edges of the lid to form a little point. Like a trapezoid so that it slides really easily in and out.
Finally there is a clear polyurethane stain over the thing to protect it from the elements etc. Like I said I started with the Google Sketchup drawing but kind of just used the cards while building it to modify the measurements a bit a here and there to get the final product. Not sure if this helped at all or just made it worse haha...
My friend helped me make it and he may be interested in doing some on the side, but I can't imagine he wouldn't want a 100 plus for them especially with the customization and wood carving on the top. And I know alot of people are getting em for 30-40 from that other guy posted a couple pages back. It took about 5 hours to make. The materials cost somewhere around 30-40 bucks. But if anyone is interested and has the money let me know and I'll see.
I made this one myself. I decided to go with a sliding lid that I can permanently just take off and keep my box open when I'm actually at a shop. Did a little wood carving on the top to give it a little something special. I love the way it turned out. The pictures are a little blurry but you get the point.
Also Geistflame >> Gutshot. Leaving 1 mana up is NOT a big deal. Getting to remove 2 Inkmoths/Birds/whatever with 1 spell is clutch.
We can debate the act of aggression and emissary points but i do strongly disagree with this above quote. Red isn't always available and gutshot allows me to go t1 birds kill their birds in the mirror. One mana is a big deal as I'm almost always trying to tap out in the first 3-4 turns on ramp etc. Which is the turns in which the spell is the most important. I like gutshot better...
Couple things to consider. I’m playing this on modo right now where the meta develops a lot more quickly. The metagame is heavy on ancient grudge and arty hate right now thus why I got rid of the two copper myr and moved to an addtl. Birds and Virdian Emissary. One thing I’ve been toying with is swapping 1 Myr Battlesphere for 1 Karn Liberated. I’m also not sure if Blasphemous Act is better than Ratchet Bomb. I’m still testing. I’ve only got about 15 games under my belt, but the deck is winning A LOT of games.
I don't actually like either list. They both have the potential to do powerful things, but I don't like them. Just because those are the lists that did well, does not mean we should immitate them. However, there are strong points with both lists.
First, UWG is viable. I've been interested in a Bant version of the deck, and this is a very good starting point.
Second, the Wurm in the board is very nice. It provides a potential "polymorph" target that also serves as an instant plus against Red, and something you dont' mind drawing and casting OR morphing into. Not sure if he sided out his morphs here or not, but, it seems like it could/should be for real.
I agree with this the Pelakka Wurm in the sb is absoutely amazing sideboard against fast aggro or mono red. I really like the wurm idea.
One thing I think most of you have wrong though and I already know I'll feel the wrath on this but I've played tons of games both in solo mode and against others on MWS and just by myself with proxies. I think 4 Jace are just plain wrong. Yea yea I get it...the card is bonkers but I can't stand having 2 in my hand and there's been several times where I end up with three in my hand three jace is more than suffucient imo. I'm still not sure if growth spasm or awakening zone is the way to go. All the pros and people that have posted good results (Not FNM wins) are playing growth spasm over awakening zone.
I don't really like the SB yet, but maindeck I think this list is awesome.
Hmm I find this list to be pretty interesting actually. I just can't get behind the 4 of planeswalkers though a 3/3 split seems right to me not a 4/4. No spreading seas or see beyond. See I'd rather cut planeswalkers and play see beyond to get to them, that way I can get to other combo pieces as well instead. I don't think this build is as great as you put off. It's almost a ug planeswalker control deck...
You all talk about using ultimate on garruk and jace but I don't honestly understand how you all are staying alive that long to do so. Have you guys actually done this? Against Jund or Naya there to fast for you to build some monster army to win with. You have no removal or anything to clear the board if they build it up 2nd turn putrid leech, 3rd turn thrinax, 4th turn bloodbraid into ANYTHING...hmm good luck building that army up to overrun before you die?
The Iona option that depending on opinion people run main or sb beat MB and Vamps
Oh duh...obviously Iona is pretty tough on Mono black I clearly wasn't thinking. What about the other part of my post? You pretty much never want to play polymorph with no backup counters right? If they kill your token in response polymorph just fizzles right?
So i'm new to this thread and I need the know how on playing this deck. The basic name of the game is get a token in play to play polymorph on it and then use your counterspells to protect them from killing the token in response? Is that pretty much the name of the game?
How does this deck beat vamps or mono black? I don't understand how everyone with emrakul's beat gatekeeper which I see alot of still?
Boros isn't as unwinnable as everyone thinks. This deck can beat any deck. I think I've played just about EVERY single deck in the format with this deck at least 5 times. I've beat everything. Life management is key in boros. You can't afford to even take 2 life from a painland. I consistently see people beat themselves up with lands when playing Living End and you can't do that. It's ok to crack a fetchland and just fetch for a basic...you dont' have to get a shockland everytime. It's ok not to cycle your deadshot minotaur on the 1st time if you need that 2 life. I usually don't start cycling street wraiths, and cracking fetches and stuff until I see what kinda land is played on the other side.
Now if your playing something like dark depths, fae, the mirror, hypergensis, etc. life management isn't as important.
I honestly think FAST creatureless combo decks like storm, hivemind or scapeshift are the biggest decks to worry about in the meta right now. Fast combo that is creatureless is tough for us to beat. Everything is certainly winnable. There's some control decks that are also popping up online that are tough but I don't think there seeing play in the PTQ's like they are online.
I can't understand why NOSB is in people's decks still. I'm pretty confident that's being pulled from Travis Woo's original list and I just think it's wrong. That card is not that good. Travis Woo himself in a SCG article said it was the wrong card to play. Plug shriekmaw MD in that spot or even blood moon. I think both are better.
I'm also not completely convinced that kitchen finks or spike feeder are even needed. Boros is dead guys. I hardly ever see any boros decks anymore and mono red has never really been good in extended. Zoo is certainly winnable without kitchen finks.
Oh and one last thing...Faerie Macabre is also just wrong. Play ravenous trap or leyline of the void. Faerie Macabre isn't so cool when you living end, and then your own deadshot minotaur kills it. Why would you wanna just remove 2 cards when you can remove them all...removing just 2 against living end or even dredge isn't all that great.
Seems like a complete "win-more" card, and at 4 mana no thank you. However, I do think we need to look back at blood moon. Alot of control decks are starting to pop up and ricochet trap isn't quite cutting it.
I've been winning alot of matchups on mtgo. There's not a whole lot of RDW/boros or white weenie which seems to be where it struggles. It's been strong against both mono devotion decks and great against control.
Buck i don't understand when your ever bringing in slaughter games or assemble? I've never brought either of them. I think pithing needle is a must. Alot of people have brought in Jace Memory Adept in against me and you have to have an immediate answer for that or they can mill your win cons out quick.
Not trying to troll ya here but I disagree. The difference is AVR is a solid two color format so the packs do dry up. IPA is 3-5 colors every deck I've drafted which means even in the shallowest packs I still get plenty of payables. I've yet to draft a deck where I didn't have 26 solid payables with about 2-3 sb cards.
Im on my 10th draft and Ive tabled temporal springs, many of the disciples, bloodfire dwarf which is underrated IMO, Gaeas merfolk, gerrards verdict and quite a few of the tribal guys that let you look at 4 cards and pick one of like creature type. Maybe we evaluate cards differently?
IPA is an amazing draft format for sure sooooo skill intensive.
Thanks brother. The carvings could definitely be customized some what...but I mean you couldn't do full blown MTG card art. It's a wood carving. Simpler shapes, logos, titles etc. could be done though. If it's an image that could go into a children's coloring book...it'd probably work.
First things first. The sidewalls are made out of poplar which you can get at Lowes/Home Depot. The sidewalls are a 4" high, 1/2" thick wood. I bought two 4 foot sections of that. Now you can obviously use a harder wood like oak but keep in mind you're box will get heavy! I wanted a lighter wood that still looked good.
The dividers and center columns are the same poplar but only about 3" high (I did have to rip those down they came in 4" high panels too) and 1/4" thick wood (so a little thinner). That too was bought in two 4 foot sections.
The bottom and lid/top are made out of wood I can't even explain. It's a really thin sheet of wood you can buy at Lowes/Home Depot maybe 1/8" thick and it comes in 2'x4' foot panels. I'll get the exact name of it next time I'm in the store, but it's by all the nicer polished woods you can buy back in the lumber.
These are the original blueprints I started with. These were drawn in Google Sketch-Up and I'll gladly provide the actual sketchup file to anyone that wants it. In this picture you'll see I have the height at around 3" but I didn't actually build it at that height because when I went to Lowes they sold the wood in a 4" by 4' sheet and I didn't want to rip the board to cut it down so it's actually a little higher. The other thing I'd recommend is making a little wider then I ended up going. Mines a little short and the cards fit a little tiny bit tighter then I would've liked.
The actual box is put together using a small brad nailer, and a bunch of wood glue. The center columns are actually just glued with no nails at all because it's only 1/4" thick wood. And as you can see the only divider that is actually secured is the one in the middle between where my cube and dice would go. I simply glued that one down to add a little strength to my two columns. All the rest of my dividers are just free floating. I thought about gluing them all down, but I wanted to test out a bit first. I may find I want more or less room.
The carving was something last minute that my friend wanted to add. He has woodcarving tools. We simply went online and found a high res graphic of the Magic logo. Adjusted the size in Corel Draw but you could use GIMP which is free to do this part. Then you just print it out, and transfer it onto the lid with graphite paper and start carving it out with tools.
The sliding lid is quite the trick. You have to have a router to create the grooves in the wood to slide the lid in and out. The bottom is actually made the same way. There are grooves in all 4 sides and the bottom panel just sits in the grooves. Another little trick is to take a sander and sand away the edges of the lid to form a little point. Like a trapezoid so that it slides really easily in and out.
Finally there is a clear polyurethane stain over the thing to protect it from the elements etc. Like I said I started with the Google Sketchup drawing but kind of just used the cards while building it to modify the measurements a bit a here and there to get the final product. Not sure if this helped at all or just made it worse haha...
My friend helped me make it and he may be interested in doing some on the side, but I can't imagine he wouldn't want a 100 plus for them especially with the customization and wood carving on the top. And I know alot of people are getting em for 30-40 from that other guy posted a couple pages back. It took about 5 hours to make. The materials cost somewhere around 30-40 bucks. But if anyone is interested and has the money let me know and I'll see.
We can debate the act of aggression and emissary points but i do strongly disagree with this above quote. Red isn't always available and gutshot allows me to go t1 birds kill their birds in the mirror. One mana is a big deal as I'm almost always trying to tap out in the first 3-4 turns on ramp etc. Which is the turns in which the spell is the most important. I like gutshot better...
4 Primeval Titan
2 Birds of Paradise
2 Viridian Emissary
4 Solemn Simulucrum
4 Palladium Myr
3 Myr Battlesphere
3 Wurmcoil Engine
Ramp
4 Rampant Growth
4 Sphere of the Suns
4 Green Sun's Zenith
Lands
4 Glimmerpost
4 Inkmoth Nexus
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Buried Ruin
4 Kessig Wolf Run
10 Forest
1 Moutain
1 Rootbound Crag
1 Melira, Sylvok Outcast
3 Gutshot
3 Ghost Quarter
4 Ancient Grudge
2 Act of Aggression
2 Blasphemous Act
Couple things to consider. I’m playing this on modo right now where the meta develops a lot more quickly. The metagame is heavy on ancient grudge and arty hate right now thus why I got rid of the two copper myr and moved to an addtl. Birds and Virdian Emissary. One thing I’ve been toying with is swapping 1 Myr Battlesphere for 1 Karn Liberated. I’m also not sure if Blasphemous Act is better than Ratchet Bomb. I’m still testing. I’ve only got about 15 games under my belt, but the deck is winning A LOT of games.
I agree with this the Pelakka Wurm in the sb is absoutely amazing sideboard against fast aggro or mono red. I really like the wurm idea.
One thing I think most of you have wrong though and I already know I'll feel the wrath on this but I've played tons of games both in solo mode and against others on MWS and just by myself with proxies. I think 4 Jace are just plain wrong. Yea yea I get it...the card is bonkers but I can't stand having 2 in my hand and there's been several times where I end up with three in my hand three jace is more than suffucient imo. I'm still not sure if growth spasm or awakening zone is the way to go. All the pros and people that have posted good results (Not FNM wins) are playing growth spasm over awakening zone.
Hmm I find this list to be pretty interesting actually. I just can't get behind the 4 of planeswalkers though a 3/3 split seems right to me not a 4/4. No spreading seas or see beyond. See I'd rather cut planeswalkers and play see beyond to get to them, that way I can get to other combo pieces as well instead. I don't think this build is as great as you put off. It's almost a ug planeswalker control deck...
You all talk about using ultimate on garruk and jace but I don't honestly understand how you all are staying alive that long to do so. Have you guys actually done this? Against Jund or Naya there to fast for you to build some monster army to win with. You have no removal or anything to clear the board if they build it up 2nd turn putrid leech, 3rd turn thrinax, 4th turn bloodbraid into ANYTHING...hmm good luck building that army up to overrun before you die?
Oh duh...obviously Iona is pretty tough on Mono black I clearly wasn't thinking. What about the other part of my post? You pretty much never want to play polymorph with no backup counters right? If they kill your token in response polymorph just fizzles right?
How does this deck beat vamps or mono black? I don't understand how everyone with emrakul's beat gatekeeper which I see alot of still?
Now if your playing something like dark depths, fae, the mirror, hypergensis, etc. life management isn't as important.
I honestly think FAST creatureless combo decks like storm, hivemind or scapeshift are the biggest decks to worry about in the meta right now. Fast combo that is creatureless is tough for us to beat. Everything is certainly winnable. There's some control decks that are also popping up online that are tough but I don't think there seeing play in the PTQ's like they are online.
I can't understand why NOSB is in people's decks still. I'm pretty confident that's being pulled from Travis Woo's original list and I just think it's wrong. That card is not that good. Travis Woo himself in a SCG article said it was the wrong card to play. Plug shriekmaw MD in that spot or even blood moon. I think both are better.
I'm also not completely convinced that kitchen finks or spike feeder are even needed. Boros is dead guys. I hardly ever see any boros decks anymore and mono red has never really been good in extended. Zoo is certainly winnable without kitchen finks.
Oh and one last thing...Faerie Macabre is also just wrong. Play ravenous trap or leyline of the void. Faerie Macabre isn't so cool when you living end, and then your own deadshot minotaur kills it. Why would you wanna just remove 2 cards when you can remove them all...removing just 2 against living end or even dredge isn't all that great.
Seems like a complete "win-more" card, and at 4 mana no thank you. However, I do think we need to look back at blood moon. Alot of control decks are starting to pop up and ricochet trap isn't quite cutting it.