I have a *flash* deck that runs everything at instant speed, Mystic Snake is gonna love having Frilled Mystic in there too.
Gonna love just saying lizard wizard
Eyes Everwhere is an interesting design - I like the art!
Ok, so I'm assuming you're looking for cheap versions, and that a battlebox isn't just for duels, that you're looking for multiplayer too?
Fair?
Yeah I would assume Goblins or Burn would be the go-to for budget red mono-coloured pursuit.
Suicide Black / Gate isn't where I would want to be.
I would consider the Pox or Reanimator archetype's. Budget versions are both possible here, and if you play multiplayer they will both have options that stand up. Waste Not combo (think Ill-Gotten Gains etc.) in MP discard is ridiculously good, like too good. And Reanimator simply has to field creatures that care about many opponents like Caller of the Pack etc.
For mono-white, I would consider soldiers. They're surprisingly effective given some have in-built taxing effects, and white does have the best perm-based hate to stop or slow down combo, storm and grave strategy.
And with blue you have so many different options.
Mono-blue Omnitell is a thing, Merfolk is strong but can be pricey. There are so many combo options here.
So I took out my manaless deck recently, with the idea of running it at the local on legacy night. But I didn't.
(sigh) It's too slow. Gitaxian Probe leaving has meant the blue version with Force of Will & W-Rider is now officially dead for me, the blue count is too low. Without Probe the deck is slower than it was before.
For me, whether you decide to run with Giant or Flayer doesn't matter much, as winning with a Dread Return isn't too common.
Is it just me, or has the banning of DRS resulted in more people running terminal hate like Rest In peace, Leyline etc.?
My local has been taking gravehate very seriously lately....
I run an aura deck with 4x Spiritdancer, 2x Sram (I tried 4, it wasn't a great idea) and loads of aura's.
My aura deck runs a lot of the same stuff you do, only I run blue aswell for Control Magic.
What I learned trying to run aura's with few creatures in MP; Heliod's Pilgrim in small numbers isn't the worst thing you can do, I like them to grab Eldrazi Conscription. Academy Researchers & Pilgrim aren't bad.
Run a Replenish if you have one.
Something hard to kill like Thrun, the last troll, is useful sometimes, but not necessary. Flickering Ward is a house. The ALL-IN nature of aura's is offset by FW's ability to draw cards quickly, not to mention what else it can do. FW works pretty well with Sigil of the Empty Throne.
A $40 deck that had genuine power was easy 10 years ago. It's getting more difficult....
I assume this means degenerate combo is where everyone is looking at for sheer speed and power, but I'm goin to leave that to the guys who like playing it.
(we don't play degenerate combo)
I'm going to suggest Mono-R Goblins, with basic mountains & 4 Sandstone Needle's for a speed increase.
Not the most powerful option, but it plays the attrition game better than most, and the core won't change if you decide to spend more money.
All the core cards in Goblin Matron, Goblin Warchief & Goblin Ringleader are relatively cheap, plus with a no-holds-barred approach you could play with 4x Goblin Recruiter. Something like Impact Tremors could work too.
An optimal version of the deck would play with more expensive options, but goblins is one of the best supported tribes in MTG, they even have non-creature goblin cards that work with Recruiter, Ringleader & Matron.
Given how fast your manabase is, is PotP really a deal-breaker here?
....or are you just wanting to play with gold cards?
So I looked up the price of DRS not that long ago (cos I never ended up buying them due to price) and it's fallen quite a bit.
Think I might pick up a set...
Fair point, but I've always been pretty happy with the rhino's in MP.
Prid3 - I think I've mentioned previously - I will steal idea's without remorse Credit where it's due of course (tips hat)
I agree with you, but I might resist running it for now. I run that fella in a mean deck with Ankh of Mishra, Bloodchief Ascension, Tariff and drain stuff, it's not a popular one. "Alpha-strike" comes to mind....
FWIW, your list like it might benefit from 1 or 2 Torment of Hailfire.
Ghave? Hmm... I've not played with Ghave before, mainly because a mate of mine does.
He runs Managorger Hydra types with Kamahl, Fist of Krosa etc. ...it gets silly. Ramos, Dragon Engine with Ghave might be too silly to chase...
Pyromancer's Goggles might get in there if I decide to cut creatures and go with more spells.
I've owned Genju for years but never played it. A big beatstick post-boardwipe is my thinking.
The Mimeoplasm works well with Crackling Doom, nuf sed.
I'm seriously considering 2 Bloodbraid Elf, given it works to fetch up Knight, LA & Doom.
Honestly, I think I'm going to run quite a few different versions and see what I have fun with.
Yeah I'm still tinkering with a few idea's. A lot of them.... still haven't figured out what I like.
I have a few to think about - a artifact build, domain, the regular 5c choices like Last Stand etc., Slivers and a few more.
I don't think I'll pursue Global Ruin, LD isn't popular lately, a certain someone has been abusing Wildfire a bit.... (he he)
But the one I'm liking most, even without any sort of synergy is simply goodstuffs.
For me, I wanna play with Baleful Strix, Crackling Doom & Dark Intimations cos they rock in MP.
By running these above, Pyromancer's Goggles does tempt me to lean on red a bit more...
Thanks again everyone.
I have a pretty embarrassingly large card collection of MP staples, and a few good legacy choices too, so any suggestions are welcome.
Aforementioned options, but also:
Control, steal .... big plays.
I like the sound of these. I actually run a few decks that use a LOT of stealing & cloning card choices, like Phantasmal Image, Control Magic etc.
As far as control goes, I have quite a few great cards like Pernicious Deed, Blasphemous Act, Supreme Verdict etc.
I used to run a BUG deck a while back with Deed and thievery effects - Deed would kill the weenies, and then I'd steal the biggest threats. Fun times.
Usually those 5 color goodstuff decks arent made because "I want to play 5 colors" they are made because. "I need (awesome cards are awesome)
This is where I want to be. I'm thinking of just simply playing with big-value cards (not necessarily big-cmc), no matter what the colours happen to be.
If you want to build a 5C control deck I would consider building around bring to light.
....
Or you could just crackling doom repeatedly until everyone concedes or dies.
So far I'm considering whether I should build a good-stuffs deck including Global Ruin.
GR would demand running mostly basics, probz half forests with a small number of spells like Farseek, fetches & Evolving Wilds-types, to grab the other lands. This approach would demand I concentrate on card choices 5-cmc and below.
Keeping the manabase basics I think hurts, more than it adds value, so I'm not sure about this one.
If I was going to concentrate on creatures, I'm thinking value creatures like Siege Rhino, Mantis Rider, Anafenza, the Foremost, Voice of Resurgence etc. would be the way to go, but I'm not sure I want to go that way...
5 color control. A control deck that takes the best spells from every color.
Yeah this is kind of where I'm leaning towards - a good-stuffs deck - but I'm not sure how I want it to look.
Cards like Door to Nothingness, Coalition Victory, Bringers and the like don't inspire me at all.
Global Ruin looks like a powerful card to build around. I'm not sure I want to necessarily, given everyone hates land destruction, but being able to effectively shut down Cloudpost, Tron, mono-coloured decks or people who don't play with basics, is enticing.
My manabase consists of a combination of a small number of rainbow, fetches, basics and tri-lands. Obviously my manabase would need a few tweaks to work with this card, which I'm sure is going to hurt my consistency, probably even creating mana-screw. Not sure it's worth it....
So I thought I'd change things up my 5-colour deck.
My (current) 5-colour deck runs a Cascade-build into Hypergenesis, with fatties that care about multiplayer, like Hydra Omnivore, Caller of the Pack etc. It's quick, gets the whole table involved and usually ensures a bit of chaos for all involved.
Another previous version ran Dream Halls, with Conflux and bombs.
Question is;
If I'm going to pursue a 5-colour deck, what other worthy build options could I consider?
Note - we don't play with infinite combo's. Not considering Nephilims Cheers
Considering blue has access to High Tide to drop bombs, this card seems flaky.
Summoning sickness makes this card a touch too expensive for what it does, although to be fair, a dying-trigger or ETB-trigger would be too powerful.
For me this card looks like an EDH option, I can't think of a single constructed deck that might want 4 of these.
I have a *flash* deck that runs everything at instant speed, Mystic Snake is gonna love having Frilled Mystic in there too.
Gonna love just saying lizard wizard
Eyes Everwhere is an interesting design - I like the art!
Awaken the Erstwhile looks like a fun card to build around.
Gutterbones I like too.
Kaya's Wrath looks good at 4-cmc. I'll definitely be picking up these.
Mirror March looks like fun. Gonna get me a couple of these. How about multiple Caller of the Pack with haste? LOL
I'm looking forward to trying this out with Demigod of Revenge and recursive threats like Bloodghast too.
Fair?
Yeah I would assume Goblins or Burn would be the go-to for budget red mono-coloured pursuit.
Suicide Black / Gate isn't where I would want to be.
I would consider the Pox or Reanimator archetype's. Budget versions are both possible here, and if you play multiplayer they will both have options that stand up. Waste Not combo (think Ill-Gotten Gains etc.) in MP discard is ridiculously good, like too good. And Reanimator simply has to field creatures that care about many opponents like Caller of the Pack etc.
For mono-white, I would consider soldiers. They're surprisingly effective given some have in-built taxing effects, and white does have the best perm-based hate to stop or slow down combo, storm and grave strategy.
And with blue you have so many different options.
Mono-blue Omnitell is a thing, Merfolk is strong but can be pricey. There are so many combo options here.
(sigh) It's too slow. Gitaxian Probe leaving has meant the blue version with Force of Will & W-Rider is now officially dead for me, the blue count is too low. Without Probe the deck is slower than it was before.
For me, whether you decide to run with Giant or Flayer doesn't matter much, as winning with a Dread Return isn't too common.
Is it just me, or has the banning of DRS resulted in more people running terminal hate like Rest In peace, Leyline etc.?
My local has been taking gravehate very seriously lately....
My aura deck runs a lot of the same stuff you do, only I run blue aswell for Control Magic.
What I learned trying to run aura's with few creatures in MP;
Heliod's Pilgrim in small numbers isn't the worst thing you can do, I like them to grab Eldrazi Conscription.
Academy Researchers & Pilgrim aren't bad.
Run a Replenish if you have one.
Something hard to kill like Thrun, the last troll, is useful sometimes, but not necessary.
Flickering Ward is a house. The ALL-IN nature of aura's is offset by FW's ability to draw cards quickly, not to mention what else it can do. FW works pretty well with Sigil of the Empty Throne.
Avatar of Growth might only cost GG in some groups (like mine), but giving everyone a speed boost is questionable.
I assume this means degenerate combo is where everyone is looking at for sheer speed and power, but I'm goin to leave that to the guys who like playing it.
(we don't play degenerate combo)
I'm going to suggest Mono-R Goblins, with basic mountains & 4 Sandstone Needle's for a speed increase.
Not the most powerful option, but it plays the attrition game better than most, and the core won't change if you decide to spend more money.
All the core cards in Goblin Matron, Goblin Warchief & Goblin Ringleader are relatively cheap, plus with a no-holds-barred approach you could play with 4x Goblin Recruiter. Something like Impact Tremors could work too.
An optimal version of the deck would play with more expensive options, but goblins is one of the best supported tribes in MTG, they even have non-creature goblin cards that work with Recruiter, Ringleader & Matron.
Given how fast your manabase is, is PotP really a deal-breaker here?
....or are you just wanting to play with gold cards?
So I looked up the price of DRS not that long ago (cos I never ended up buying them due to price) and it's fallen quite a bit.
Think I might pick up a set...
Fair point, but I've always been pretty happy with the rhino's in MP.
Prid3 - I think I've mentioned previously - I will steal idea's without remorse Credit where it's due of course (tips hat)
Control Magic, Dack's Duplicate, Rite of Replication etc. for copy effects are always good.
Havengul Lich isn't one I was thinking of - works pretty well with Doom & Intimations. Thanks
I agree with you, but I might resist running it for now. I run that fella in a mean deck with Ankh of Mishra, Bloodchief Ascension, Tariff and drain stuff, it's not a popular one. "Alpha-strike" comes to mind....
FWIW, your list like it might benefit from 1 or 2 Torment of Hailfire.
He runs Managorger Hydra types with Kamahl, Fist of Krosa etc. ...it gets silly.
Ramos, Dragon Engine with Ghave might be too silly to chase...
So far I'm thinking;
4x Fellwar Stone
4x Baleful Strix
4x Siege Rhino
2x Knight of Autumn
1x Wasitora, Nekoru Queen
1x Yidris, Maelstrom Wielder
1x The Mimeoplasm
2x Luminarch Ascension
4x Crackling Doom
4x Dark Intimations
It's short a few cards, I'm gettin there. Pernicious Deed & Deathreap Ritual will probably get in there.
Pyromancer's Goggles might get in there if I decide to cut creatures and go with more spells.
I've owned Genju for years but never played it. A big beatstick post-boardwipe is my thinking.
The Mimeoplasm works well with Crackling Doom, nuf sed.
I'm seriously considering 2 Bloodbraid Elf, given it works to fetch up Knight, LA & Doom.
Honestly, I think I'm going to run quite a few different versions and see what I have fun with.
I have a few to think about - a artifact build, domain, the regular 5c choices like Last Stand etc., Slivers and a few more.
I don't think I'll pursue Global Ruin, LD isn't popular lately, a certain someone has been abusing Wildfire a bit.... (he he)
But the one I'm liking most, even without any sort of synergy is simply goodstuffs.
For me, I wanna play with Baleful Strix, Crackling Doom & Dark Intimations cos they rock in MP.
By running these above, Pyromancer's Goggles does tempt me to lean on red a bit more...
But really I'm leaning in a few directions.
So far, I'm thinking these above with Luminarch Ascension and Deathreap Ritual, with value creatures like Siege Rhino, and small numbers of stuff like Knight of Autumn and Weathered Wayfarer (ramp is common in my group).
As far as a genuine win-con goes, I'm yet to make my mind up.
I have a pretty embarrassingly large card collection of MP staples, and a few good legacy choices too, so any suggestions are welcome.
I like the sound of these. I actually run a few decks that use a LOT of stealing & cloning card choices, like Phantasmal Image, Control Magic etc.
As far as control goes, I have quite a few great cards like Pernicious Deed, Blasphemous Act, Supreme Verdict etc.
I used to run a BUG deck a while back with Deed and thievery effects - Deed would kill the weenies, and then I'd steal the biggest threats. Fun times.
This is where I want to be. I'm thinking of just simply playing with big-value cards (not necessarily big-cmc), no matter what the colours happen to be.
Bring to Light isn't a card I remember. Thanks!
Crackling Doom is exactly the kind of card I want to play with. Consider it a 4-of in the deck.
I like the look of Legacy Weapon, Yidris, Maelstrom Wielder & Chromanticore as 1-of's.
Maelstrom Nexus looks cool, but it's out of my price range.
So far I'm considering whether I should build a good-stuffs deck including Global Ruin.
GR would demand running mostly basics, probz half forests with a small number of spells like Farseek, fetches & Evolving Wilds-types, to grab the other lands. This approach would demand I concentrate on card choices 5-cmc and below.
Keeping the manabase basics I think hurts, more than it adds value, so I'm not sure about this one.
If I was going to concentrate on creatures, I'm thinking value creatures like Siege Rhino, Mantis Rider, Anafenza, the Foremost, Voice of Resurgence etc. would be the way to go, but I'm not sure I want to go that way...
Yeah this is kind of where I'm leaning towards - a good-stuffs deck - but I'm not sure how I want it to look.
Cards like Door to Nothingness, Coalition Victory, Bringers and the like don't inspire me at all.
Global Ruin looks like a powerful card to build around. I'm not sure I want to necessarily, given everyone hates land destruction, but being able to effectively shut down Cloudpost, Tron, mono-coloured decks or people who don't play with basics, is enticing.
My manabase consists of a combination of a small number of rainbow, fetches, basics and tri-lands. Obviously my manabase would need a few tweaks to work with this card, which I'm sure is going to hurt my consistency, probably even creating mana-screw. Not sure it's worth it....
So I thought I'd change things up my 5-colour deck.
My (current) 5-colour deck runs a Cascade-build into Hypergenesis, with fatties that care about multiplayer, like Hydra Omnivore, Caller of the Pack etc. It's quick, gets the whole table involved and usually ensures a bit of chaos for all involved.
Another previous version ran Dream Halls, with Conflux and bombs.
Question is;
If I'm going to pursue a 5-colour deck, what other worthy build options could I consider?
Note - we don't play with infinite combo's. Not considering Nephilims Cheers
Summoning sickness makes this card a touch too expensive for what it does, although to be fair, a dying-trigger or ETB-trigger would be too powerful.
For me this card looks like an EDH option, I can't think of a single constructed deck that might want 4 of these.