For those playing Rakdos Prison (not me because after buying Chalices and Bridges the last thing I want to do is buy Lilianas), do you think the new ashiok will make it in? I’ve been keeping up on the talk in this forum and you guys are very close to dropping most things that are double black, it’s also at three mana which I know as much as anyone is a tough spot, but this thing is like a super charged Leonin arbiter combined with graveyard hate in a format where most decks benefit in some way from the graveyard, and some rely on it completely. Just wanted to bring it up Incase it was somehow missed, I’m rooting for all versions of Pyro Prison even if it’s not my version
Is it just me or is new Karn an amazing piece for our deck. Along with the static ability shutting down Affinity, his -2 to get any artifact from our board or exile seems just like what we want. Need a Sorcerous Spyglass or Damping sphere or Grafdigger's cage or Trinisphere or or or or or ... Can certainly keep an ensnaring bridge in the board too... I can't wait to test with this!
I’m excited for him too! Watching his preorder price waiting for it to go down a bit before I order. I imagine he will be a one of in the sideboard, but the mainboad potential is very interesting!
Now, I really enjoy this deck, and have watched you and FluffyWolf stream it a ton. And you do very well online, but the results for the deck (not your performances per say) in tournaments has been lacking. Why do you think that is? Doesn't get played very much and so there just aren't that many to choose from? Doesn't do very well against a large field? I must admit, it doesn't seem like a Tier 1 or even 2 deck, so not sure why we keep touting its greatness. No trying to be critical, just trying to see why we keep believing in it when the results (on paper) at least don't translate in bigger tournaments.
Hey Erik, to answer your question about why our results are lacking. It’s entirely due to a lack of players playing the deck. Recently there’s been more than usual, and we’re actually a percentage of the field, but still not many. At GP LA 1.5% of people played our deck, about 15 individuals. We don’t know how much experience these 15 have with our deck, and since there’s so few, every loss hits our percentage hard. Compare that to Izzet Phoenix that had 10% of the field, 103 people. A single one of them doing poorly has much less impact on how the deck as a whole looks than it does for us, and it gives the 88 more chances than us to get someone into day 2/top 8.
To your question about it doing well at a huge field, at GP LA specifically, the top 8 consisted of 2 Phoenix decks, 2 Dredge decks, 2 Hardened Scales decks, and Deaths Shadow. Phoenix and Dredge in my eyes are 50/50 matchups game 1, with Dredge becoming 75/25 us game two (I run 2 grafdiggers and 4 angers side) and Phoenix becoming 60/40 us. Hardened Scales is apparently a tough matchup I’m hearing??? I’ve only played against it once and won so I can’t speak on that. Deaths shadow is a great matchup for us hands down. So if you replace a Hardened scales deck with Fluffy or Russ in that top 8 I can all but guarantee the win.
So yes we have the potential to do well at a large field, we tend to have a lot more 50/50 matchups than most decks do, but we don’t really have any unwinable matchups like some decks do, e.g. Tron can’t beat infect game 1 more often than not. And we have some matchups that are tough to lose e.g. A blindfolded toddler can beat boggles with our deck game 1
To your last two questions, I have faith in this deck because of my own results in my local meta. And why don’t you think we seem like a tier 1 or 2 deck? What’s your definition of a tier deck?
Re Humans matchup: really not sure the matchup is good in my limited testing. Yes before sideboard, they are cold to Bridge and Moon.
But meddling mage, thalia all makes reducing hand sizes difficult.
Also humans usually has either Noble or Vial to start with and thus not completely dead to Blood Moon.
I believe the matchup to be slightly less favorable
Hey Avalanche!
So yes Humans have a lot of disruption, no question, but you also noted they’re cold to bridge and moon. Thalia and meddling mage make reducing hand size difficult, but usually we can drop one of our lock pieces before they can drop both of there’s, and in my decklist at least, I have 7 removal spells (if you count Chandra) that can deal with Thalia or meddling mage, while they can’t do anything to our pieces! On the play, chalice on 1 into moon or bridge means “I win.” Turn one moon also just means “I win” because even though they can cast vial, you usually have time to kill with rabblemaster before they can get to vialing, or if you run Abrades those work too! f they spend all they’re time locking your pieces up with mage it only takes one sweeper to get out of it. I can’t prove to you that this matchup is favorable for us, I can only mention my own results. I’ve played Pyro Prison for a little over a year now and while I’ve lost a few games to Humans, I’ve never lost a best-of-3 Round to them. If you’re worried about them torpor orb is good sideboard tech, and I almost lost a round to a Humans player but won off the back of Pia and Kiran Nalaar with some well placed blocks and shocks!
Wish you luck in your future matchups and I hope this helped!
Sorry, new to the deck, why is Eidonlon good against burn?
Am afraid that your own eidolon may end up locking up yourself?
Would some kind of sweepers better in its place?
I’m glad you asked AvalancheRiders! You’re right in questioning the Eidolons against burn. The reason it works is that they won’t lose us the game unless we play an ensnaring bridge, but in a situation where you have an eidolon out against burn you wouldn’t play the bridge anyway! Eidolon gives us more pressure against burn since every single spell in their deck will become a shock to their face, and also allows us to have a blocker when It gets close. At the very worst it gets hit with a lightning bolt or they have to block it with a goblin guide or an eidolon of their own, which essentially turns it into a 3 for 1, as it shocks them, and reduces the amount our face would’ve taken. At the very best against burn, it can win us the game, either by providing a win con or by giving us time to find a chalice or moon to lock them out further.
Any Office fans? We can call it Prison Mike! Otherwise I came up with “Blood and Bone” and “Strawberries and Cream” very different names but both have merit!
Don’t worry Ray, always reading and commenting whenever I feel I have decent input. Playing when I can, but life gets busy as I’m sure you guys know. I try to make all the bigger tournaments in my area and I usually top 4! You guys’ll be happy to hear I’ve practically paid off the price of the deck with my winnings! Playing a 6 Rabble list with the 4 eidolons main and I’m having great results. 2 slagstorms and 2 abrades main because I’m not as ballsy as Showtime yet. And 3 Hazorets in the 75 is the TRUTH since my meta is full of Jund. I’ll post my list if anyone is interested!
Combust is favored because you don't want to end up countering your own spells with Vial. It's kind of a nonbo with one of our main lock pieces, especially since one of the best plays we can make in general is a turn one Chalice on one.
You are correct, Joker, that nonbos with Chalice should be avoided if at all possible, but just to note, rending volley cannot be countered by spells or abilities. So as well as a warm welcome to Gimps, if 4 is the magic toughness number in the current meta then Rending Volley is better than Combust. Combust does kill the angels from control sideboard and as far as I can see from mtgtop8s list, those are the only creatures really played in modern that rending volley can’t kill but combust can.
So this is my attempt on the deck and it plays really good vs moderndecks - beside that I lost every match vs Standarddecks (Jeskai Control, Grixis Control) which wasnt that great... but I had a lot of fun
I have some questions:
- Ensnaring Bridge vs the 4 Goblins // Hazoret // Sarkhan Ultimate
makes me feel quite uncomfortable... does it work?
- is the Eidolon really that great? Used to run in in my Burnlist where it was really good but in this deck i dont know.
- One of Pyretic Ritual - whats the benefit of it?
Hello Walker! First off it’s awesome you picked up the deck and welcome! So now let me see if I can answer some of your concerns. You have 8 Goblins, a Hazoret,and two Sarkhans that can all attack, your question about the bridge is warrented. But with the way bridge was created, if you’re empty handed your goblins aren’t forced to attack, and when you eventually have a critical mass of them, you can save the card in your hand during combat, and then swing with all the goblins for the win. Hazoret plays like a planeswalker and slowly kills the opp while also being incredibly hard to kill, the only major cards able to kill it being path to exile or lilianna of the veil. And since path decks are on the downswing, and we have goblins to sacrifice to liliana, you can usually assume she’ll ride out the game. Sarkhan is a different story. He’s mostly their to fix your draws into something better, but if you do find yourself ulting him behind the bridge, you can keep using his rummage ability to find one of your two Abrades to destroy our own bridge and swing with lethal!
Eidolons are basically the 4th lock piece. They help us against Storm, KCI, Burn, Tron, any deck that runs Arclight Phoenix or Thing in the Ice, and any deck we want to be aggressive against, (control). It is a great card until you’re behind a bridge, but most of the decks we bring it in against we will cut some or all bridges.
The one of Pyretic looks out of place, but in reality it’s ritual number 9, it simply gives us another copy of Desperate Ritual and Simian Spirit Guide, and helps with explosive turn 1 and turn 2 plays. The one of Gemstone Caverns you’re does less in the deck than the Pyretic Ritual does, abd I’d highly upping the Genstone count to (3).
I hope this answered all of your questions and I highly recommend going back and reading past posts, all of your questions have been answered a few times and many more questions you haven’t even asked yet. There are also other decklists and cards to test, and sideboard discussions and guides to help with bad matchups!
hi prisioners i have a question, how u resolve against phyrexian unlife and solemnity ?
Dreadscabal, the long and short of it is that in most of the current builds we do not run a way to kill someone with solemnity and unlife out. Your best bet when you see this deck is to not draw anything with Chandra and try to mill them out game 1, then kill them fast game 2/3. Following the Rayfathers footsteps, I ran 1 Word of Seizing for a little bit in the board, it can take a Phyrexian Unlife while they’re at 0 life and they’ll die instantly. I added it mostly because I have 2 white devotion decks that are played once in a while in my area, but I never found a reason to bring it in most games so it got cut.
On a random note, can someone offer some advice on when I should mull with this deck? My experience with Skred has taught me to keep a hand with some form of interaction in it, but Pyro Prison seems more concerned with amassing lockdown pieces.
Hey Joker, so to answer your question, in the blind you always mull a one land hand. My one exception is unless it’s a turn 1 chandra. My reasoning on that is that dreadbore and assassin’s trophy are the premium planeswalkers removal spells in the format. Both cost two, so they give you at least a turn with chandra out, trophy is by far more popular and will give you a land, and depending on your build, everything you’d ever want to cast (besides second chandra) costs 3, chandra ticks up for the mana to cast the things. Second rule of thumb is always mull a hand that does nothing. In the blind 4 lands SSG Ritual bridge is a snap mull in my opinion. In that scenario if it was blood moon I’d be a little more tempted but I still would mulligan. I would personally keep that hand if my action card was Chandra, but that’s probably incorrect, I just have a soft spot for my red headed girl. Another scenario of a hand that does nothing is 2 lands 2 chandra Bridge Moon Slagstorm. This looks like it may have everything you want, and I’ll admit that I keep hands like this, but I usually get punished. Best case my humans opponent over extends with meddling mages and Mantis Riders, you top deck a land and slagstorm (could be bridge depending on the situation) into Moon. Worst case your infect/storm opponent kills you on turn 2. You are not doing anything before turn 3, usually you want to keep a hand with a turn 2 play. Modern is a very fast format and hands that do nothing will lose you the game regardless what you’re playing. Hope this helps in learning how to mulligan!
Ray, Grab the Reins looks amazing. Fits in well with the turn 4 rabblemaster kill, providing exactly 20 damage if we turn 2 rabblemaster turn 4 grab the reins after attacks, or turn 3 kill if we turn one rabble turn 3 reins. Obviously we need to fade blocks and kill spells, but that’s the type of game you play against tron and combo. Just based on a quick analysis this seems like a bomb against a lot of decks, providing a faster kill against combo where one turn can change the outcome of a game, or against control where we need to be fast. Against aggro it can be nuts too, I notice humans and value town LOVE pumping up their creatures while they’re stuck behind a bridge, little do they know they’re just giving us a plump win con for 7 mana. Also in niche cases provides reach to hit planeswalkers. I’m going to start testing this card soon for sure!
Howdy, new to the deck. How well does this deck mulligan? Is a slower hand (one without ramp) good when it has the answer you're looking for? And what's our best way of attacking Tron besides early Blood moons?
Personally I don’t see this deck as free win at all, when I play for big events or cash prizes (the only time I put in 100% effort and I’m hyper focused) I think through every line and that thought process is, in my opinion, skill based. Knowing your deck and knowing your opponents deck will win you more games than anything else. Id say I mulligan well, I never keep a one land hand in the blind game 1 unless it’s a turn one Chandra for future mana purposes. Without ramp turn 2 chalice on 1 turn three moon/rabble into turn 4 hazoret/planeswalker/avaricious dragon is a strong curve and I’ve won many games without the fast start. All that being said, in the blind I don’t mulligan for any given card. I don’t remember who said it on this forum, but sometimes you gotta trust the deck. It’s not about mulliganing agressively it’s about mulliganing into a playable hand. I’ve beat tron and infect on a mull to 5 (only decks I remember doing this to). Against tron you need a fast rabble into a fast moon, play draw really matters here. Game one is possible but I usually expect to lose pre sideboard. Games 2 and 3 you want moon and either spyglass on o-stone or damping matrix which is just a house against o-stone and the other problem card ballista. If you don’t have matrix or spyglass you’re going to want to hold abrade. Abrade is also nice because it takes out a wurmcoil. Additionally chalice on 1 and eidolon of the great revel are fine in this matchup but if not paired with moon they seem to be too cute to be of any real consequence. Moon by itself will never cut it, they either get to 5 mana and o-stone, 6 mana and wurmcoil, or 7 mana and karn, even though as Fluffy pointed out on his stream, they only run 18 lands. Hope this answered all your questions lonen00b!
I personally think it’s great, if the start playing this instead of abrupt decay then it will make chalice on 2 more viable, and it’s still two non-red colors so blood moon turn 1 stops it. That being said, chalice on 2 still dies to kholagans command and this new card could lead to more decks running basics... all in all I’m personally optimistic about it
Hello friends and fellow mountainfolk. I spent all day Friday and Saturday at GP Detroit right in my own backyard doing every single Modern side event available (6) I’m happy to announce I went 11-6 in games throughout my time there, which isn’t that great, but I went 3-0 in both of the double prize events I played in, good enough to reimburse me for my time there! At the event I played Tron 4 times out of my 17 rounds (24%, but I think across the side events it was closer to 40%), and I won two and lost two.
Quote from mrjayngles » url="/forums/the-game/modern/established-modern/control/663335-pyro-prison-goblinized-mono-red-control-the?comment=3055 »
I wanted to ask about the Tron matchup which I'm finding quite tricky. I followed the advice of this thread and my plan was -4 Ensnaring Bridge, -2 Anger, -2 Goblin Chainwhirler, +4 Eidolon, +2 Damping Matrix, +2 Sorcerous Spyglass...
I'm wondering what your thoughts are on maybe going a different direction with the sideboard.
All four games I lost game 1, whether it be, as Russ says, “mulling to 5 and not even knowing it” due to keeping a bridge heavy hand, or just not being able to close out the game before Ugin or O-stone came down. One of the games he got down thragtusk but I abraded in response to blocks and finished out the game from there, another game I abraded in response to blocks on a wurmcoil, and he still closed it out, keep in mind I had had two Eidolons that game and he took no damage from them all game. When I did beat them I had blood moon before turn 3, a way to stop O stone before turn 4, and a clock before they played a real card. My list for almost every event follows, I did buy 2 copies of Sarkhan at the event and for 1 event played the exact 75 Ray had as his “current list” for trash dragons a few days ago but Ill talk about that more in a sec:
I have 3 angers side but I never played Hollow One, Dredge, or BridgeVine. I did see them at the events and I brought them in for a lot of aggro matches like spirits humans and burn, so I didn’t change out, but there wasn’t a huge showing of any graveyard decks or any coco decks, so I didn’t add in grafdiggers either. Faerie Macabre was the only card I never brought in, but not knocking the card because I wouldn’t have brought in any other type of graveyard hate card. Uba Mask came in a few times (I played three different versions of control) but only stuck once, and it got quickly Cryptic bounced into a loss, I like the card a lot but sometimes it feels too late, and while boil has never quite done it for me I think it is better in this slot. I can’t remember all my matches, but Jund and U/W control still seem abysmal, humans and bogles make me smile because I can just kick back and stomp on them, Bant Spirits seems just as easy as humans, while U/W spirits seems a little more 55/45 us throughout the three games. The event I played trash dragons in I was impressed by how efficient Sarkhan is at getting rid of land drops 5+ and giving me impact cards, I even put him out turn 1 vs Elves and he got me to the torpor orb bridge lock. On the other hand I often found myself looking for removal I didn’t have, so I think Rays newest build might be better for me and I will be testing it soon. The trash dragons event was the event I played against Jund, and that was the only round I drew avaricious, I didn’t want to cast him though because discarding my hand meant giving his goyfs +2/+2, another thing to consider if Jund becomes big again. I saw a few people on Skred dragons and one guy on a pyro prison deck he adapted directly from free win red and nothing else, rabblemasters and abrades, it seems that he has grown to similar conclusions and inclusions as us, so I told him about our forum. Thank you all for reading this long post, any and all comments or questions are welcome.
I’m excited for him too! Watching his preorder price waiting for it to go down a bit before I order. I imagine he will be a one of in the sideboard, but the mainboad potential is very interesting!
Hey Erik, to answer your question about why our results are lacking. It’s entirely due to a lack of players playing the deck. Recently there’s been more than usual, and we’re actually a percentage of the field, but still not many. At GP LA 1.5% of people played our deck, about 15 individuals. We don’t know how much experience these 15 have with our deck, and since there’s so few, every loss hits our percentage hard. Compare that to Izzet Phoenix that had 10% of the field, 103 people. A single one of them doing poorly has much less impact on how the deck as a whole looks than it does for us, and it gives the 88 more chances than us to get someone into day 2/top 8.
To your question about it doing well at a huge field, at GP LA specifically, the top 8 consisted of 2 Phoenix decks, 2 Dredge decks, 2 Hardened Scales decks, and Deaths Shadow. Phoenix and Dredge in my eyes are 50/50 matchups game 1, with Dredge becoming 75/25 us game two (I run 2 grafdiggers and 4 angers side) and Phoenix becoming 60/40 us. Hardened Scales is apparently a tough matchup I’m hearing??? I’ve only played against it once and won so I can’t speak on that. Deaths shadow is a great matchup for us hands down. So if you replace a Hardened scales deck with Fluffy or Russ in that top 8 I can all but guarantee the win.
So yes we have the potential to do well at a large field, we tend to have a lot more 50/50 matchups than most decks do, but we don’t really have any unwinable matchups like some decks do, e.g. Tron can’t beat infect game 1 more often than not. And we have some matchups that are tough to lose e.g. A blindfolded toddler can beat boggles with our deck game 1
To your last two questions, I have faith in this deck because of my own results in my local meta. And why don’t you think we seem like a tier 1 or 2 deck? What’s your definition of a tier deck?
Hey Avalanche!
So yes Humans have a lot of disruption, no question, but you also noted they’re cold to bridge and moon. Thalia and meddling mage make reducing hand size difficult, but usually we can drop one of our lock pieces before they can drop both of there’s, and in my decklist at least, I have 7 removal spells (if you count Chandra) that can deal with Thalia or meddling mage, while they can’t do anything to our pieces! On the play, chalice on 1 into moon or bridge means “I win.” Turn one moon also just means “I win” because even though they can cast vial, you usually have time to kill with rabblemaster before they can get to vialing, or if you run Abrades those work too! f they spend all they’re time locking your pieces up with mage it only takes one sweeper to get out of it. I can’t prove to you that this matchup is favorable for us, I can only mention my own results. I’ve played Pyro Prison for a little over a year now and while I’ve lost a few games to Humans, I’ve never lost a best-of-3 Round to them. If you’re worried about them torpor orb is good sideboard tech, and I almost lost a round to a Humans player but won off the back of Pia and Kiran Nalaar with some well placed blocks and shocks!
Wish you luck in your future matchups and I hope this helped!
I’m glad you asked AvalancheRiders! You’re right in questioning the Eidolons against burn. The reason it works is that they won’t lose us the game unless we play an ensnaring bridge, but in a situation where you have an eidolon out against burn you wouldn’t play the bridge anyway! Eidolon gives us more pressure against burn since every single spell in their deck will become a shock to their face, and also allows us to have a blocker when It gets close. At the very worst it gets hit with a lightning bolt or they have to block it with a goblin guide or an eidolon of their own, which essentially turns it into a 3 for 1, as it shocks them, and reduces the amount our face would’ve taken. At the very best against burn, it can win us the game, either by providing a win con or by giving us time to find a chalice or moon to lock them out further.
You are correct, Joker, that nonbos with Chalice should be avoided if at all possible, but just to note, rending volley cannot be countered by spells or abilities. So as well as a warm welcome to Gimps, if 4 is the magic toughness number in the current meta then Rending Volley is better than Combust. Combust does kill the angels from control sideboard and as far as I can see from mtgtop8s list, those are the only creatures really played in modern that rending volley can’t kill but combust can.
Hello Walker! First off it’s awesome you picked up the deck and welcome! So now let me see if I can answer some of your concerns. You have 8 Goblins, a Hazoret,and two Sarkhans that can all attack, your question about the bridge is warrented. But with the way bridge was created, if you’re empty handed your goblins aren’t forced to attack, and when you eventually have a critical mass of them, you can save the card in your hand during combat, and then swing with all the goblins for the win. Hazoret plays like a planeswalker and slowly kills the opp while also being incredibly hard to kill, the only major cards able to kill it being path to exile or lilianna of the veil. And since path decks are on the downswing, and we have goblins to sacrifice to liliana, you can usually assume she’ll ride out the game. Sarkhan is a different story. He’s mostly their to fix your draws into something better, but if you do find yourself ulting him behind the bridge, you can keep using his rummage ability to find one of your two Abrades to destroy our own bridge and swing with lethal!
Eidolons are basically the 4th lock piece. They help us against Storm, KCI, Burn, Tron, any deck that runs Arclight Phoenix or Thing in the Ice, and any deck we want to be aggressive against, (control). It is a great card until you’re behind a bridge, but most of the decks we bring it in against we will cut some or all bridges.
The one of Pyretic looks out of place, but in reality it’s ritual number 9, it simply gives us another copy of Desperate Ritual and Simian Spirit Guide, and helps with explosive turn 1 and turn 2 plays. The one of Gemstone Caverns you’re does less in the deck than the Pyretic Ritual does, abd I’d highly upping the Genstone count to (3).
I hope this answered all of your questions and I highly recommend going back and reading past posts, all of your questions have been answered a few times and many more questions you haven’t even asked yet. There are also other decklists and cards to test, and sideboard discussions and guides to help with bad matchups!
Dreadscabal, the long and short of it is that in most of the current builds we do not run a way to kill someone with solemnity and unlife out. Your best bet when you see this deck is to not draw anything with Chandra and try to mill them out game 1, then kill them fast game 2/3. Following the Rayfathers footsteps, I ran 1 Word of Seizing for a little bit in the board, it can take a Phyrexian Unlife while they’re at 0 life and they’ll die instantly. I added it mostly because I have 2 white devotion decks that are played once in a while in my area, but I never found a reason to bring it in most games so it got cut.
Hey Joker, so to answer your question, in the blind you always mull a one land hand. My one exception is unless it’s a turn 1 chandra. My reasoning on that is that dreadbore and assassin’s trophy are the premium planeswalkers removal spells in the format. Both cost two, so they give you at least a turn with chandra out, trophy is by far more popular and will give you a land, and depending on your build, everything you’d ever want to cast (besides second chandra) costs 3, chandra ticks up for the mana to cast the things. Second rule of thumb is always mull a hand that does nothing. In the blind 4 lands SSG Ritual bridge is a snap mull in my opinion. In that scenario if it was blood moon I’d be a little more tempted but I still would mulligan. I would personally keep that hand if my action card was Chandra, but that’s probably incorrect, I just have a soft spot for my red headed girl. Another scenario of a hand that does nothing is 2 lands 2 chandra Bridge Moon Slagstorm. This looks like it may have everything you want, and I’ll admit that I keep hands like this, but I usually get punished. Best case my humans opponent over extends with meddling mages and Mantis Riders, you top deck a land and slagstorm (could be bridge depending on the situation) into Moon. Worst case your infect/storm opponent kills you on turn 2. You are not doing anything before turn 3, usually you want to keep a hand with a turn 2 play. Modern is a very fast format and hands that do nothing will lose you the game regardless what you’re playing. Hope this helps in learning how to mulligan!
Personally I don’t see this deck as free win at all, when I play for big events or cash prizes (the only time I put in 100% effort and I’m hyper focused) I think through every line and that thought process is, in my opinion, skill based. Knowing your deck and knowing your opponents deck will win you more games than anything else. Id say I mulligan well, I never keep a one land hand in the blind game 1 unless it’s a turn one Chandra for future mana purposes. Without ramp turn 2 chalice on 1 turn three moon/rabble into turn 4 hazoret/planeswalker/avaricious dragon is a strong curve and I’ve won many games without the fast start. All that being said, in the blind I don’t mulligan for any given card. I don’t remember who said it on this forum, but sometimes you gotta trust the deck. It’s not about mulliganing agressively it’s about mulliganing into a playable hand. I’ve beat tron and infect on a mull to 5 (only decks I remember doing this to). Against tron you need a fast rabble into a fast moon, play draw really matters here. Game one is possible but I usually expect to lose pre sideboard. Games 2 and 3 you want moon and either spyglass on o-stone or damping matrix which is just a house against o-stone and the other problem card ballista. If you don’t have matrix or spyglass you’re going to want to hold abrade. Abrade is also nice because it takes out a wurmcoil. Additionally chalice on 1 and eidolon of the great revel are fine in this matchup but if not paired with moon they seem to be too cute to be of any real consequence. Moon by itself will never cut it, they either get to 5 mana and o-stone, 6 mana and wurmcoil, or 7 mana and karn, even though as Fluffy pointed out on his stream, they only run 18 lands. Hope this answered all your questions lonen00b!
All four games I lost game 1, whether it be, as Russ says, “mulling to 5 and not even knowing it” due to keeping a bridge heavy hand, or just not being able to close out the game before Ugin or O-stone came down. One of the games he got down thragtusk but I abraded in response to blocks and finished out the game from there, another game I abraded in response to blocks on a wurmcoil, and he still closed it out, keep in mind I had had two Eidolons that game and he took no damage from them all game. When I did beat them I had blood moon before turn 3, a way to stop O stone before turn 4, and a clock before they played a real card. My list for almost every event follows, I did buy 2 copies of Sarkhan at the event and for 1 event played the exact 75 Ray had as his “current list” for trash dragons a few days ago but Ill talk about that more in a sec:
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Blood Moon
4x Ensnaring Bridge
Planeswalkers
4x Chandra, Torch of Defiance
1x Koth of the Hammer
Creatures
4x Goblin Rabblemaster
2x Goblin Chainwhirler
1x Pia and Kiran Nalaar
1x Hazoret the Fervent
1x Walking Ballista
2x Slagstorm
3x Abrade
Acceleration
4x Desperate Ritual
4x Simian Spirit Guide
Lands
13x Mountain
3x Ranunap Ruins
3x Gemstone Caverns
1x Mutavault
1x Scavenger Grounds
3x Eidolon of the Great Revel
3x Anger of the Gods
1x Damping Matrix
1x Sorcerous Spyglass
1x Spellskite
1x Torpor Orb
1x Shattering Spree
2x Uba Mask
2x Faerie Macabre
I have 3 angers side but I never played Hollow One, Dredge, or BridgeVine. I did see them at the events and I brought them in for a lot of aggro matches like spirits humans and burn, so I didn’t change out, but there wasn’t a huge showing of any graveyard decks or any coco decks, so I didn’t add in grafdiggers either. Faerie Macabre was the only card I never brought in, but not knocking the card because I wouldn’t have brought in any other type of graveyard hate card. Uba Mask came in a few times (I played three different versions of control) but only stuck once, and it got quickly Cryptic bounced into a loss, I like the card a lot but sometimes it feels too late, and while boil has never quite done it for me I think it is better in this slot. I can’t remember all my matches, but Jund and U/W control still seem abysmal, humans and bogles make me smile because I can just kick back and stomp on them, Bant Spirits seems just as easy as humans, while U/W spirits seems a little more 55/45 us throughout the three games. The event I played trash dragons in I was impressed by how efficient Sarkhan is at getting rid of land drops 5+ and giving me impact cards, I even put him out turn 1 vs Elves and he got me to the torpor orb bridge lock. On the other hand I often found myself looking for removal I didn’t have, so I think Rays newest build might be better for me and I will be testing it soon. The trash dragons event was the event I played against Jund, and that was the only round I drew avaricious, I didn’t want to cast him though because discarding my hand meant giving his goyfs +2/+2, another thing to consider if Jund becomes big again. I saw a few people on Skred dragons and one guy on a pyro prison deck he adapted directly from free win red and nothing else, rabblemasters and abrades, it seems that he has grown to similar conclusions and inclusions as us, so I told him about our forum. Thank you all for reading this long post, any and all comments or questions are welcome.