It is called sun and moon becasue the sun emblem on the white pips + blood moon, our RW list has very little resemlance to it though so we are far enough away to be considered a separate deck.
Like Ray said Grafdiggers cage is a necessary evil, Though often times decks that want a grafdiggers you want chalice on 2 more than three weird how that works out.
Koth of the Hammer is a very powerful card yes. and playing +ulting him early is insane. but right now bolt is very highly played so getting him to stay out is the problem especially since we cant protect him with giving ourself hexproof anymore. plus you have to run atleat 14 mountains to make him practical as well.
It's been a long time since I've roamed these halls, been mainly in the discord and such and stopped by because I've heard showtime_ was here. I just want to say how stoked I am seeing jaya in the list and mainboard too!! I've been championing her for the last 7 months and she has been wonderful for me. Can you shed some light on why you like her in the list and why in the mainboard?
Stuff I've been mucking around with is Massive Raid as an exspensive but instant speed goblin war strike. It's been cute but sometimes it kills a goyf or other fatty and sometimes just comes the head for huge behind a bridge. I dont know if would consider it good but there.
Congrats and welcome on board. We hope to be hearing more of your finishes and thoughts on the deck in the future. If you have any questions at all we would be more than happy to help out the best we can. Welcome to the campfire mountain brother.
The daretti is a masterpiece series so wont br modern legal, and as Russ point out in the discord it is still a 4 turn clock and just 1 damage left over. Also he dosent force attacks. He looks very promising. Also Russ I told you not to be so hating on Ravnica having nothing for us just cause it is dual colored in nature.
Round 1: Infect
G1: Mull to 4 on the play did not see a single land in my 7,6,5 or 4, said eff it Ill keep it and hope they are a slow deck, pass my turn, Opponent plays t1 Glistener Elf. I play a t2 rabble from scryed land and die a few turns later before i can find a third mana to sweep the board.
Pull in Angers, Torpor, Chainwhirler, Spellskite and Jaya. Pull out Rabbles, and Sarkhans
G2 and game 3: both games I chalice on 1 turn 1, then a bridge helps seal the deal opp scoops to hellbent both times.
Round 2: Mardu
G1: Keep a decent hand, not familiar with this player and he turn 1 blackcleaves into faithless looting, I am putting him on Hollow one for now. I slide in a chalice on1, his turn 2 he plays land and passes, i land pass, t3 he plays Marshflats and I realize he is on Mardu, plays LotV upticks and I discard an irrevelant card, draw for turn nets me a hazoret which i deploy the next turn and kill his LotV, Much thanks for her helping me activate him, Grind him down with Dog Mom with a timely chandra to take care of a bedlam.
Pull in Eidolon, Stormbreath, Spyglass, Torpor, Chainwhirler, Spellskite and angers, pull out moons, Bridges, Pyretic and a desperate.
G2: Get another early chalice off on him followed by a sarkhan uptick slowly and Opp deploys a Bridge of his own, drop in Avaricious and start digging for an answer, Opp plays a few lingering souls and wittles away at a looming sarkhan ult, Eventually land a chandra and throw excess cards away with haz until I find an Abrade for the bridge and swing in with the team forcing my opp to have to deal with a chandra and a sarkhan ready to ult, they choose to focus on the chandra, sarkhan ults and they scoop to the power of the dragon man.
Round 3: Jund
G1: t1 thoughtseized lose my chalice he follows it up with more jund threats, Am able to sweep his board a few turns later but he recovers with a newly grown Goyf, I am at a position of do i play a moon to stop his lands or a bridge to stop his attacks, I opt for moon so he cant liliana or handhate me, he casts a BBE and gets lily from it I die a few turns later
In, angers, Spyglass, Eidolon, Stormbreath Spellskite. Out, Bridges, balista 2 ramp spells 1 sarkhan. (I am not sure my sideboard is correct for jund but I am trying to just jam threats and force my way through)
G2: turn 1 moon YAY they have a basic forest and play goyf followed by Scooze, take some slow beats as I try to get to 3 mana to wipe the board, they deploy another bigger goyf, I find a bridge then a 2nd moon think I have stablized. BBE flips over a Pulse gets my bridge and the tide comes crashing in to spell my demise. Jund does Jund things and shows why it is still one of our worse matchups unless we can just draw answer after answer.
Round 4: UW
G1: he plays island passes I t1 chalice with an Opt from Opp in response, plays a field of ruins but misses his 3rd and 4th land drop, I resolve a second rabblemaster and he scoops a turn later
In Jaya, Boil, Chainwhirler, Spyglass, Eidolon, Stormbreath Spellskite. Out, Bridges, Abrade, Ballista 1 slag ( i kept one in just in case he played secure the wastes plus it can atleast get in 3 damage) and pyretic
G2: I get a quick eidolon followed by a spellskite. After a few eidolon beats he gets a path for both of them and is able to counter my moon the following turn, In goes normal of deploy threat, threat is removed, Fought through 3 terminusus 1 jace and a Teferi but his card advantage gets me in the end with a 2nd Jace and a Dsphere on my KotH.
G3: i go first and play eidolon on t1 followed by a t2 SPyglass naming the jace in his hand. pass my turn turn 3 he plays Field of ruins passes, I dont get a land and just pass t4, EOT he fields my Ramunap ruins I tap it for mana fetch my mountain opp fetches basic island, then during eot i use my new land to tap for 4 total and boil away his island and Fountain leaving him with his plains. He plays a Glacial fortres and I reslove a moon, After a few fancy mountains of my opponents and a few threats he scoops.
This round Opp Wins Player of the night for me, He was real interactive and fun to talk to, He learned that Boil is a card and after the match he remarked that he had no chance in game 3 and that I played masterfully, (mainly due to the "3 land" boil play I think but still) Also he discussed Task mage and said he had fatesealed her to the bottom knowing if i resolved her my next turn he wouldnt of had an answer.
Round 5: Humans
G1: is a close one t2 thalia followed by a free booter for my slagstorm and a illusion on freebooter that wiffs, I barely able to justthrow blockers down to stem some damage before i double block with mana monkey/rabble to kill her and topdeck an abrade for my sweeper back, get knocked real low next turn from a thalia's lieutenant but sweep the board and Am Able to find a moon followed by bridge and opp scoops.
In Angers, Dampening, Chainwhirler, Jaya. Out: Rabbles and 1 Sarkhan
G2: I get greedy, could of t2 angered a champion and Noble but i hold off wanting a little more value and Sin collector comes down and takes it. I cut opp off 1 drops with chalice but a steadly growing Champion gets me in the end with no bridge in sight
G3: Chalice on 1 them and remove the 2drop then sarkhan, they drop a Mantis rider and go for sarkhan but not tell he is able to find me a moon. Moon them off then deploy Jaya take a hit from the rider then just use jaya's firsta bility to desroy him. Opp scoops to having fancy mountains with a creatrue that kills any threat they could play live on the board.
Round 6: bye but Opp is on UW Spirits. We play some friendly Pauper of him on Axebane gaurdian combo, me on BW Pestilence lifegain a list i've had for about 7 years with no changes or updates. fun times.
Quarterfinals of top 8, I am in 8th seed going up agiasnt the only undefeated of the night a good friend on Tron.
G1: He plays tron piece I deploy Hazoret on our respective turn 1s, cant swing but its okay. He plays 2nd tron piece and a map I play land and abrade the map and swing in for 5, He scowls and plays forest and fetches up his last piece with Sylvan scrying, I swllow hard and then top deck a mountain slam it and swing in again, next turn swing and throw the card in hand after he plays out an Ostone, Realizes even if he pops ostone on his turn he will die to haz not being removed and scoops
In Stormbreath, Eidolon spyglass, Shattering spree. Out Bridges, ballista and 1 slagstorm
g2 he plays tron map, Spree map and pass for me, plays 2nd tron piece and I play a rabble, he nat trons and has a wurmcoil which spells my doom quickly.
g3 On the paly t1 Rabble hit for 1, Opp plays tron piece. I play t2 rabble swing for 8 have him at 11. T3 he nat trons and has a wurmcoil floating a green mana from a sphere flounders a moment then decides to pass, I swing with the whole team for 21 total, blocks 1 rabble with a wurmcoil which I proceed to abrade in response and we shake hands after smashing in for 13 after blocks. Reveals he was deciding wether or not to Claim his own wurmcoil for 2 blockers when i reveal I had a shattering spree to take care of both of them had he done that line of play as well.
Top 4 Splits a box and its 2am so I drive home and pass out.
I run grid as a 3 of in my Ballbreaker list as my answer to control ( along with a choke but we dont have that option) and to use it as a parallel since we take the aggro route in the matchup it is like russ says. An early grid shuts off everything out opponent tries to do for the next 3-4 turns or forced them to play their answers on our turn which let's us continue to deploy threats. Whether or not it's a good sideboard card for us or not idk yet and remains to be tested still but the earlier we land it the better. Boil on the other hand can help us in more variety of matchups such as turns, GDS, storm, UR moon/breach/wizards ect.
I run grid as a 3 of in my Ballbreaker list as my answer to control ( along with a choke but we dont have that option) and to use it as a parallel since we take the aggro route in the matchup it is like russ says. An early grid shuts off everything out opponent tries to do for the next 3-4 turns or forced them to play their answers on our turn which let's us continue to deploy threats. Whether or not it's a good sideboard card for us or not idk yet and remains to be tested still but the earlier we land it the better. Boil on the other hand can help us in more variety of matchups such as turns, GDS, storm, UR moon/breach/wizards ect.
Is anyone else getting random error messages when trying to access this forum? sometimes it loads, and others, I get a runtime error. How are we to consult on taking over the Magic world when the server keeps going down!?!?
I've been having similar problems on and off. We keep telling you to get Discord as well most of those who post here post there as well and we have had the same discussion about the short comings of sarkhan where we have reached a consensus that yes he is great in a grindy meta but leaves much to be wanted in an aggro one.
Can you suspend rift bolt with a chalice on 1 since suspend is an ability?
Absolutely. The CMC remains what is printed on the card, not how much was paid to put it on the stack. Faitless Looting, for example, still gets countered by Chalice on 1 even if it's cast with flashback.
While playing at last GP side event I had a chalice on 2 while playing against hollow one. He played an ancient grudge, which got countered. Then he played it from the graveyard for the flashback cost. I told him that it was countered, and he called a judge. The lvl 2 judge explained that the cmc of a flashbacked card is the one showed on the flahback cost, so I should have had a chalice on 1 to counter it. That seemed very strange to me but you know, it's me against a judge so it was kinda pointless to argue
Local mountain slinging L1 here. That judge made the absolute wrong call. The cmc of a card is always its listed cmc. The only time that is different is when a card with an x in its cmc is on the stack then x will be x+other normal costs. Like a banefire for 3 will cost r+3 so its cmc will be 4
@Stickballruss. do you feel 2 Spree's or needed in the sideboard or would you possibly feel a 1/1 spree abrade is manageable? also you expressed dislike in the Whirlyboi would you think adding up to the 2nd cage is a proper replcement for him given the surge of graveyard based decks coming ot the forefront right now?.
Welcome welcome to the fireside WKASA1. congrats on your first place win and interesting Choices in sideboad. Currently some of us have been using avaricious dragon to do the same thing as flame for keld for the first 2 lore counters. Maybe flame ov keld is something to test out though hmmmm....
And for Dazza0187
Fluffywolf2 is Fluffywolf2 on twitch je streams pyroprison 3 times a week on Tuesday Wednesday and Friday. Sometimes Saturdays on mondays he does a for fun deck. Times starting at 6:30 central time he has a YouTube ad well though I dont know it.
Stickballruss is also the same on twitch yis schedule is more erratic both great to watch for learning lines and play for the deck and we welcome everyone in. I think rayatack streams too but I csnt recall his twitch name though I'm going to go with RayStacks
Like Ray said Grafdiggers cage is a necessary evil, Though often times decks that want a grafdiggers you want chalice on 2 more than three weird how that works out.
Koth of the Hammer is a very powerful card yes. and playing +ulting him early is insane. but right now bolt is very highly played so getting him to stay out is the problem especially since we cant protect him with giving ourself hexproof anymore. plus you have to run atleat 14 mountains to make him practical as well.
G1: Mull to 4 on the play did not see a single land in my 7,6,5 or 4, said eff it Ill keep it and hope they are a slow deck, pass my turn, Opponent plays t1 Glistener Elf. I play a t2 rabble from scryed land and die a few turns later before i can find a third mana to sweep the board.
Pull in Angers, Torpor, Chainwhirler, Spellskite and Jaya. Pull out Rabbles, and Sarkhans
G2 and game 3: both games I chalice on 1 turn 1, then a bridge helps seal the deal opp scoops to hellbent both times.
Round 2: Mardu
G1: Keep a decent hand, not familiar with this player and he turn 1 blackcleaves into faithless looting, I am putting him on Hollow one for now. I slide in a chalice on1, his turn 2 he plays land and passes, i land pass, t3 he plays Marshflats and I realize he is on Mardu, plays LotV upticks and I discard an irrevelant card, draw for turn nets me a hazoret which i deploy the next turn and kill his LotV, Much thanks for her helping me activate him, Grind him down with Dog Mom with a timely chandra to take care of a bedlam.
Pull in Eidolon, Stormbreath, Spyglass, Torpor, Chainwhirler, Spellskite and angers, pull out moons, Bridges, Pyretic and a desperate.
G2: Get another early chalice off on him followed by a sarkhan uptick slowly and Opp deploys a Bridge of his own, drop in Avaricious and start digging for an answer, Opp plays a few lingering souls and wittles away at a looming sarkhan ult, Eventually land a chandra and throw excess cards away with haz until I find an Abrade for the bridge and swing in with the team forcing my opp to have to deal with a chandra and a sarkhan ready to ult, they choose to focus on the chandra, sarkhan ults and they scoop to the power of the dragon man.
Round 3: Jund
G1: t1 thoughtseized lose my chalice he follows it up with more jund threats, Am able to sweep his board a few turns later but he recovers with a newly grown Goyf, I am at a position of do i play a moon to stop his lands or a bridge to stop his attacks, I opt for moon so he cant liliana or handhate me, he casts a BBE and gets lily from it I die a few turns later
In, angers, Spyglass, Eidolon, Stormbreath Spellskite. Out, Bridges, balista 2 ramp spells 1 sarkhan. (I am not sure my sideboard is correct for jund but I am trying to just jam threats and force my way through)
G2: turn 1 moon YAY they have a basic forest and play goyf followed by Scooze, take some slow beats as I try to get to 3 mana to wipe the board, they deploy another bigger goyf, I find a bridge then a 2nd moon think I have stablized. BBE flips over a Pulse gets my bridge and the tide comes crashing in to spell my demise. Jund does Jund things and shows why it is still one of our worse matchups unless we can just draw answer after answer.
Round 4: UW
G1: he plays island passes I t1 chalice with an Opt from Opp in response, plays a field of ruins but misses his 3rd and 4th land drop, I resolve a second rabblemaster and he scoops a turn later
In Jaya, Boil, Chainwhirler, Spyglass, Eidolon, Stormbreath Spellskite. Out, Bridges, Abrade, Ballista 1 slag ( i kept one in just in case he played secure the wastes plus it can atleast get in 3 damage) and pyretic
G2: I get a quick eidolon followed by a spellskite. After a few eidolon beats he gets a path for both of them and is able to counter my moon the following turn, In goes normal of deploy threat, threat is removed, Fought through 3 terminusus 1 jace and a Teferi but his card advantage gets me in the end with a 2nd Jace and a Dsphere on my KotH.
G3: i go first and play eidolon on t1 followed by a t2 SPyglass naming the jace in his hand. pass my turn turn 3 he plays Field of ruins passes, I dont get a land and just pass t4, EOT he fields my Ramunap ruins I tap it for mana fetch my mountain opp fetches basic island, then during eot i use my new land to tap for 4 total and boil away his island and Fountain leaving him with his plains. He plays a Glacial fortres and I reslove a moon, After a few fancy mountains of my opponents and a few threats he scoops.
This round Opp Wins Player of the night for me, He was real interactive and fun to talk to, He learned that Boil is a card and after the match he remarked that he had no chance in game 3 and that I played masterfully, (mainly due to the "3 land" boil play I think but still) Also he discussed Task mage and said he had fatesealed her to the bottom knowing if i resolved her my next turn he wouldnt of had an answer.
Round 5: Humans
G1: is a close one t2 thalia followed by a free booter for my slagstorm and a illusion on freebooter that wiffs, I barely able to justthrow blockers down to stem some damage before i double block with mana monkey/rabble to kill her and topdeck an abrade for my sweeper back, get knocked real low next turn from a thalia's lieutenant but sweep the board and Am Able to find a moon followed by bridge and opp scoops.
In Angers, Dampening, Chainwhirler, Jaya. Out: Rabbles and 1 Sarkhan
G2: I get greedy, could of t2 angered a champion and Noble but i hold off wanting a little more value and Sin collector comes down and takes it. I cut opp off 1 drops with chalice but a steadly growing Champion gets me in the end with no bridge in sight
G3: Chalice on 1 them and remove the 2drop then sarkhan, they drop a Mantis rider and go for sarkhan but not tell he is able to find me a moon. Moon them off then deploy Jaya take a hit from the rider then just use jaya's firsta bility to desroy him. Opp scoops to having fancy mountains with a creatrue that kills any threat they could play live on the board.
Round 6: bye but Opp is on UW Spirits. We play some friendly Pauper of him on Axebane gaurdian combo, me on BW Pestilence lifegain a list i've had for about 7 years with no changes or updates. fun times.
Quarterfinals of top 8, I am in 8th seed going up agiasnt the only undefeated of the night a good friend on Tron.
G1: He plays tron piece I deploy Hazoret on our respective turn 1s, cant swing but its okay. He plays 2nd tron piece and a map I play land and abrade the map and swing in for 5, He scowls and plays forest and fetches up his last piece with Sylvan scrying, I swllow hard and then top deck a mountain slam it and swing in again, next turn swing and throw the card in hand after he plays out an Ostone, Realizes even if he pops ostone on his turn he will die to haz not being removed and scoops
In Stormbreath, Eidolon spyglass, Shattering spree. Out Bridges, ballista and 1 slagstorm
g2 he plays tron map, Spree map and pass for me, plays 2nd tron piece and I play a rabble, he nat trons and has a wurmcoil which spells my doom quickly.
g3 On the paly t1 Rabble hit for 1, Opp plays tron piece. I play t2 rabble swing for 8 have him at 11. T3 he nat trons and has a wurmcoil floating a green mana from a sphere flounders a moment then decides to pass, I swing with the whole team for 21 total, blocks 1 rabble with a wurmcoil which I proceed to abrade in response and we shake hands after smashing in for 13 after blocks. Reveals he was deciding wether or not to Claim his own wurmcoil for 2 blockers when i reveal I had a shattering spree to take care of both of them had he done that line of play as well.
Top 4 Splits a box and its 2am so I drive home and pass out.
I've been having similar problems on and off. We keep telling you to get Discord as well most of those who post here post there as well and we have had the same discussion about the short comings of sarkhan where we have reached a consensus that yes he is great in a grindy meta but leaves much to be wanted in an aggro one.
Local mountain slinging L1 here. That judge made the absolute wrong call. The cmc of a card is always its listed cmc. The only time that is different is when a card with an x in its cmc is on the stack then x will be x+other normal costs. Like a banefire for 3 will cost r+3 so its cmc will be 4
0-3 then 3-2 he played like 4-5jund games.
And for Dazza0187
Fluffywolf2 is Fluffywolf2 on twitch je streams pyroprison 3 times a week on Tuesday Wednesday and Friday. Sometimes Saturdays on mondays he does a for fun deck. Times starting at 6:30 central time he has a YouTube ad well though I dont know it.
Stickballruss is also the same on twitch yis schedule is more erratic both great to watch for learning lines and play for the deck and we welcome everyone in. I think rayatack streams too but I csnt recall his twitch name though I'm going to go with RayStacks