Of course I am. That's the entire benefit of the town in a small game: You are supposed to evaluate pairs, and there are things you can see or actions someone can do that makes it obvious that wolf players A and B don't interact like that.
Mockery aside, do something. Rhand is twiddling his thumbs waiting for I don't know what, and Johnny is so serious about his pairings he apparently believes HR and me could be a team.
Well if not's Grape, the only two teams I can see are you and Highroller, and you and Rhand. If you are actually town, and I am town, that's the only logical conclusion. That's the entire point of this tytpe of analysis as you bloody well know.
And it's not like people can't be wrong about indepenent town/wolf reads, as we have just witnessed. It's why I am grinding Grape into wine. Either he slips up and is a wolf, or I realize I am wrong, and it means the team is something else.
I didn't argue Grape was mafia because he was voting ZDS. I was arguing against YOU saying that Grape voting ZDS makes him unlikely to be mafia.
It's the same thing.
In ZDS/Grape wolf worlds, Grape doesn't ping him that early, and then immediately vote with other people. His vote is far more likely to be a town vote then saw what you did than a wolf vote that decided that you somehow found the smoking gun, and wanted early bus credit. That early. I'll ride or die on that non pairing all the way to the bank.
It is super ******* weird that I am startying to town read grape just becauise the number vo viable teams, I think I only have 1 that makess sense with him.
Not to rub it in and gloat though, but remember when you ride or died on me? Not sure why I have Rhand/ZDS crossed off either, other than two town reads, and I would fall into a depression if both of them are wolves.
You absolutely fooled me. I am not above getting fooled. I don't think HR is capable of it. If I'm wrong I will eat all of the crow but to me he is very obviously exactly his normal self. I found all the arguments about him not pursuing things as forcefully or not having as strong of reasoning completely unfounded/unpersuasive.
Anyway going to try to reread the whole game now.
Why I am falling on HR a bit is that I feel like in his town games, I won't agree with his logic, but at least I can follow it. What bothers me is how he read you as an obvious busser to ZDS. A few other things as well that just annoy me, but that's the one thing I can't follow. What did you make of his response to your vote? I am a littl tipsy, so if tyou did respond to that and I missed it, I apologize
I mean, I think it's just understanding at this type of game that a lot of things can happen.
I am starting to wonder if I was wrong about one of ZDS or Rhand, because some of the other pairings don't make sense to me.
Definitely, but I'm very confident in my HR read. Maybe I shouldn't be but I am pretty much at a ride or die stage on it.
Question on your team pairings: what made you decide me/ZDS was a viable team after all? The strongest take I remember from you recently is that you don't believe I could have pulled off bussing ZDS like that.
Which is why I am trying to figure out who I got wrong.
Not to rub it in and gloat though, but remember when you ride or died on me? Not sure why I have Rhand/ZDS crossed off either, other than two town reads, and I would fall into a depression if both of them are wolves.
His posts and his trains of thought match mine. I know I’m town. I can bring up specific posts and quotes I like - I know we have the same opinion of ZDS’ #78. But I don’t think that would do much more than simply saying he reads genuine and I like his posts so far.
Having trouble focusing toDay but following GJ's lead to me the possible teams are: HR/ZDS
HR/GJ
HR/Rhand
ZDS/GJ
ZDS/Rhand
GJ/Rhand
I don't think that ZDS/Rhand makes a ton of sense but I need to reread.
His posts and his trains of thought match mine. I know I’m town. I can bring up specific posts and quotes I like - I know we have the same opinion of ZDS’ #78. But I don’t think that would do much more than simply saying he reads genuine and I like his posts so far.
Having trouble focusing toDay but following GJ's lead to me the possible teams are: HR/ZDS
HR/GJ
HR/Rhand
ZDS/GJ
ZDS/Rhand
GJ/Rhand
I don't think that ZDS/Rhand makes a ton of sense but I need to reread.
I had a dream that I asked this to you. Maybe I am mixing you up with the question I just asked Rhand, but why can't HR be a wolf with anyone else?
In mafia!HR worlds this means he’s mafia with exactly ZDS. Mafia don’t connect two townies for no reason because lynching one destroys the scum read on the other. That means if HR is mafia, one of ZDS and Grape is too.
They do like to link a buddy to a townie to create a chainlynch on town when the buddy flips.
HR is clearly convinced that what ZDS did should get him lynched. That is true in town! And mafia!HR worlds.
So if he is mafia, he is assuming that out of ZDS and Grape, ZDS will flip first.
To make the chainlynch work, that means Grape is the town in the pairing that he wants to lynch after the ZDS flip.
I can see HR going for a bus here.
Turning that around, ZDS is voting HR. In a 7 player game, voting each other on Day 1 is terrible unless they think that getting towncred on each other’s lynch is the best way to win. Which is... bad play and not what I would ever see ZDS agreeing to. So while I can see HR making this play, I do not see ZDS go for it. Ever.
Conclusion: HR is not mafia with ZDS and not without ZDS so he is town.
Thanks Wisp
Walk me through this logic. Why couldn't HR be wolves with anyone not named ZDS or Grape? ELI5
Otherwise, mostly nothing really caught my eye. Doesn't help the majority of posts I went through are from dead players.
The game is based on rock-paper-scissors, there being 3 sides would not be that surprising. Whether the game can have three sides and be balanced and not-bastard is another question and I am not willing to bet on the answer.
Re: the message: It makes me believe Grape is town (more than I already did), is it more clear that way?
Not really. It's Lynch or lose, and now doesn't seem to be the time to be so tight lipped.
I don't think I have ever used the term town siding in my entire wolf or 3rd party career. And no, of course I am not a third party in a 7 player game. If this is anything other than 5 town 2 wolves, I am going to dismiss this as a bastard game.
I don't doubt that's what the actual definition is. I am just telling you that's what I said
I will reveal the message's contents if Grape asks. All I can say for now is it was a townie message.
Sorry about the pointless taunt Johnny, my imagination goes haywire when I don't understand something.
You did not address the elephant in the room, so please do. What's that about "town siding"?
Wut.
Elephent in the room? That was just me saying I was town siding on you at the time of highroller's vote. As a further justification of why I don't think Grape's vote on you is ever a bus. Is something unclear about that?
Poke still hadn't posted at that time, nor had I (about ZDS, but from before I was town siding so unless he thinks HR really red handed you, safe to assume where I would stick).
The pronouns are all weird. Why his "ZDS" in the third person? Who is "you", if not me? What's that about town siding?
I'm confused, did you mean to post this in scumchat???
This is the type of tainting that makes me wolf read people, and if I remember correctly, you did this to me in Prison Block.
I don't know why I went crazy pronouns. I am trying to do 10,000 things at once.
My point was that at least two town players had not commented about HR's "point/vote" towards you. That would have been a lighting fast bus on page 2 that I don't think Grape is capable of. I don't even think I am capable of it, and said so at the time if not mistaken
What shifted your read on me?
@Rhand:
What ever happened to your ZDS read? How did it fare with Poke?
Of course I am. That's the entire benefit of the town in a small game: You are supposed to evaluate pairs, and there are things you can see or actions someone can do that makes it obvious that wolf players A and B don't interact like that.
Well if not's Grape, the only two teams I can see are you and Highroller, and you and Rhand. If you are actually town, and I am town, that's the only logical conclusion. That's the entire point of this tytpe of analysis as you bloody well know.
And it's not like people can't be wrong about indepenent town/wolf reads, as we have just witnessed. It's why I am grinding Grape into wine. Either he slips up and is a wolf, or I realize I am wrong, and it means the team is something else.
It's the same thing.
In ZDS/Grape wolf worlds, Grape doesn't ping him that early, and then immediately vote with other people. His vote is far more likely to be a town vote then saw what you did than a wolf vote that decided that you somehow found the smoking gun, and wanted early bus credit. That early. I'll ride or die on that non pairing all the way to the bank.
It is super ******* weird that I am startying to town read grape just becauise the number vo viable teams, I think I only have 1 that makess sense with him.
Why I am falling on HR a bit is that I feel like in his town games, I won't agree with his logic, but at least I can follow it. What bothers me is how he read you as an obvious busser to ZDS. A few other things as well that just annoy me, but that's the one thing I can't follow. What did you make of his response to your vote? I am a littl tipsy, so if tyou did respond to that and I missed it, I apologize
That's a mistake on my end. Should be:
ZDS/HR
ZDS/GrapeZDS/Rhand
Rhand/HR
Rhand/Grape
HR/GrapeWhich is why I am trying to figure out who I got wrong.
Not to rub it in and gloat though, but remember when you ride or died on me? Not sure why I have Rhand/ZDS crossed off either, other than two town reads, and I would fall into a depression if both of them are wolves.
I am starting to wonder if I was wrong about one of ZDS or Rhand, because some of the other pairings don't make sense to me.
I had a dream that I asked this to you. Maybe I am mixing you up with the question I just asked Rhand, but why can't HR be a wolf with anyone else?
I don't know. All Osie said was the upgrade makes my ability results will be better....but I got no results.
Walk me through this logic. Why couldn't HR be wolves with anyone not named ZDS or Grape? ELI5
Otherwise, mostly nothing really caught my eye. Doesn't help the majority of posts I went through are from dead players.
Still hedging like a ***** about Highroller
Not really. It's Lynch or lose, and now doesn't seem to be the time to be so tight lipped.
As far as the other part.....seriously?
I don't doubt that's what the actual definition is. I am just telling you that's what I said
Wait, what?
Wut.
Elephent in the room? That was just me saying I was town siding on you at the time of highroller's vote. As a further justification of why I don't think Grape's vote on you is ever a bus. Is something unclear about that?
This is the type of tainting that makes me wolf read people, and if I remember correctly, you did this to me in Prison Block.
I don't know why I went crazy pronouns. I am trying to do 10,000 things at once.
My point was that at least two town players had not commented about HR's "point/vote" towards you. That would have been a lighting fast bus on page 2 that I don't think Grape is capable of. I don't even think I am capable of it, and said so at the time if not mistaken
ZDS/Grape
ZDS/RhandRhand/HR
Rhand/Grape
HR/GrapePossible teams.
I need to reread the game as well. Should have bigger post tonight or tomorrow, depending on how work goes.