I found Force of despair very weird. It's not a real wrath/removal and it does not exile. You exile a black card (often a discard spell) that doesn't fuel reveler. 2 cards (one exiled) to kill something that can return. It's very particular, maybe I am mistaking. Have you found other MU in which you want it?
Never faced Dredge; with Bridgevine kaya's guile has been pretty good. Turn 3 sac and exile can be relevant. Consider that I play also 2xpath to exile so I have more answer to this kind of decks. It's a particular GY hate, it doesn't work always the same way: for example against thopter foundry deck I prefer ashiok rather than kaya for 2 reasons: ashiok's ability stops whir of invention; kaya's other abilities are useless against thopters.
Nevertheless the instant speed allows some unexpected tricks (end of oppo turn, in response to etb creatures).
I agree with you that we dont want 2 reveler in hand but consider that having 1x reveler and 1x spyro is different: discarding spyro is more impactful for his flashback ability, but playing spyro discarding reveler can be risky. Maybe we can arrive at 3x spyro 2x reveler to be more GY resilient.
Testing some variants on cockatrice with my "budget" list https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/mardu-killem-all/?cb=1560468219.
This is what I can say:
- seasoned pyromancer (2xMB)is very nice but also hard to handle in some situations, discard first can be a difficult choise; great chumpblocker, flashback usefull in lategame;
- kaya's guile (1xMB 1xSB) strong gy hate, sac/exile or sac/4life are the main options, never choose the token; against burn/phoenix can win the game;
- smiting helix (0x, maybe 1xMB) apparently feels good when you can pitch it with spyro or looting but sorcery speed makes it useless at the right moment; if you can't discard it, you will hate it; can not replace lightning helix;
- ashiok, dream render (2x SB) versatile against combo and grave, tested MB but then put it in SB because in some game is a dead card and doesn't fuel bedlam;
- sunbaked canyon (2x MB) needs more testing: sometimes is great in late game and I always wanted it in play but my manabase already hurts me so idk; lifegain from helix and guile help in this case;
- alternative shell with 4xunearth, 2xmonastery mentor and 2xmanamorphose only for joking (I'm a mentor's fun) but jund unearth can play better recursion/threats with eternal witness, kitchen finks, tarmogoyf.
Any suggestions on the list will be appreciated. Anyone tryed something else?
Hi guys! I follow this topic from the begin, also the old Primer Mardu Dega. I play Mardu since 5 years with some budget limits (no blackcleave, lotv, last hope, EE, bridge, surgical, leyline) and I buy one fetch at a time. I decide to dodge these lacks by playing more white spells and trying to adapt them to the local meta (BG rock, Humans, Jund, UW control, Burn, UR Phoenix, Whir). Last 2 FNM I notice that pte and helix, in some situation, are better than terminate and push. Opponents think about the BR list and don't consider white aspects of this deck. Now I read that you are talking about pte/white spells so I share my current list, maybe can help someone.
Creatures (9)
4x Bedlam Reveler
4x Young Pyromancer
1x Hazoret, the fervent
Thinking about remove 1xfatal push because there are only 5 fetch so it's more difficult to trigger revolt (and 3x pte can do quite the same job!). The 3rd helix SB can be very versatile; Rakdos Charm is not so good, feels like it's worst than nihil. Now I will give a try to Ashiok and Nahiri to be more midrange and less grave reliant. I know that Ashiok MB is a bit strange but considering the local meta it can do something nice.
First comment here and my english is not so great, so be patient any suggestion will be appreciated, specially in function of this "budget" version.
Stay Mardu!
Nevertheless the instant speed allows some unexpected tricks (end of oppo turn, in response to etb creatures).
I agree with you that we dont want 2 reveler in hand but consider that having 1x reveler and 1x spyro is different: discarding spyro is more impactful for his flashback ability, but playing spyro discarding reveler can be risky. Maybe we can arrive at 3x spyro 2x reveler to be more GY resilient.
Anyone thinking about a more midrange list? 22 lands, more threats, less GY cards?
See this https://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/modern-mardu-octomancer#paper
Considerations/test on Yawgmoth, thran physician and plague engineer?
This is what I can say:
- seasoned pyromancer (2xMB)is very nice but also hard to handle in some situations, discard first can be a difficult choise; great chumpblocker, flashback usefull in lategame;
- kaya's guile (1xMB 1xSB) strong gy hate, sac/exile or sac/4life are the main options, never choose the token; against burn/phoenix can win the game;
- smiting helix (0x, maybe 1xMB) apparently feels good when you can pitch it with spyro or looting but sorcery speed makes it useless at the right moment; if you can't discard it, you will hate it; can not replace lightning helix;
- ashiok, dream render (2x SB) versatile against combo and grave, tested MB but then put it in SB because in some game is a dead card and doesn't fuel bedlam;
- sunbaked canyon (2x MB) needs more testing: sometimes is great in late game and I always wanted it in play but my manabase already hurts me so idk; lifegain from helix and guile help in this case;
- alternative shell with 4xunearth, 2xmonastery mentor and 2xmanamorphose only for joking (I'm a mentor's fun) but jund unearth can play better recursion/threats with eternal witness, kitchen finks, tarmogoyf.
Any suggestions on the list will be appreciated. Anyone tryed something else?
Creatures (9)
4x Bedlam Reveler
4x Young Pyromancer
1x Hazoret, the fervent
Spells ( 31)
4x Faithless Looting
4x Lingering Souls
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
3x Thoughtseize
1x Collective Brutality
2x Dreadbore
2x Fatal Push
2x Kolaghan's Command
4x Lightning Bolt
2x Lightning Helix
3x Path to Exile
Land (20)
4x Bloodstained Mire
2x Blood Crypt
1x Sacred Foundry
1x Godless Shrine
2x Concealed Courtyard
1x Inspiring Vantage
2x Dragonskull Summit
1x Marsh Flats
3x Mountain
2x Swamp
1x Plains
Side
1x Anger of the Gods
1x Crackling Doom
1x Grafdigger's Cage
1x Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2x Kambal, Consul of Allocation
1x Lightning Helix
2x Molten Rain
1x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Pithing Needle
1x Rakdos Charm
1x Stony Silence
2x Wear
MAIN: -1x bedlam, -1x hazoret, -1x push, +2x Ashiok, +1x Nahiri;
SIDE: -1x molten rain, -1x rakdos charm, +1x hazoret, +1x stony silence;
Thinking about remove 1xfatal push because there are only 5 fetch so it's more difficult to trigger revolt (and 3x pte can do quite the same job!). The 3rd helix SB can be very versatile; Rakdos Charm is not so good, feels like it's worst than nihil. Now I will give a try to Ashiok and Nahiri to be more midrange and less grave reliant. I know that Ashiok MB is a bit strange but considering the local meta it can do something nice.
First comment here and my english is not so great, so be patient
Stay Mardu!