I'm sure some people who play MTG have also thought of ideas for their own card game. And if they've noticed, like I have, there are limitations because it's a table top game. That's why magic releases cards in sets. Because the abilities of cards from other generations have the potential to put an exponential amount of power in a player's hand very fast.
I'm exploring the possibility to have an app where people can collaborate on the abilities of cards and how they interact with each other. They would each vote on the ability of the card.
I looked into this a while ago, but I didn't really organize my research around it very well.
There's a lot of problems I run into when it comes to verifying no conflicts between cards, no room for ambiguity, and handling infinite loops.
Generalizing the language of a card's abilities. Simple and common card effects or formats, and then more complex ones
Let me know your thoughts
Honestly, I probably came here a little too excited. I found a more flexible image board with an equally active community.
My concept is probably far from magic. The only thing similar is that they are card games.
My game is "frameworkless". It's not a combat game necessarily. It's a mashing of "imagination".
It is quite a bit to explain, so I'll try to be concise with some key examples. A card(single card stack)/stack on the field that is turned horizontally doesn't mean anything without the context of other cards. It may be entirely meaningless for that card to be turned horizontally. But let's just say it is, and let's say it's the following card:
Slumber Jump this one will be horizontal
<dream> //<these> containers represent "passive" effects. <-these> rep damage/debuffs. <+these> rep health/defense/buffs.
When this card is returned to your hand from the field, move the stack to the back of the row. (this whole description is marked up w/ glyphs too. it has to be. I'm worried a little about elegance, but I'm hoping for the best. right now this card's ability is irrelevant)
Snap
{hypnosis} // {these} are for "meta" aspects
Requires active/on-field (Any-"livingcard"){hypnosis}: When cast, burry all Dream glyphs under a target stack, but not the face card.
//hold up I forgot to actually add a "horizontal" condition... I'll just invent another card. Lucid Prodigy
(Psychic){hypnosis}
When a <-+Dream> card is flipped horizontally, you may flip the stack back vertically (yes, there is something to resolve infinite trigger loops)
It may seem too conditional, but these cards are also used as ammo/fuel themselves. Honestly, I've yet to experiment with how frequently abilities can be triggered. I need a good deck first. That's why I'm reaching out. I don't think there is anyway to really test this unless I get 200 cards done. Actually isn't that hard if I do just a few everyday.
side-note (These) circle containers describe living organic-ish creatures. You can target (any-"living creature"). (not machines or golems which can be described in other ways)
This game isn't necessarily about "battle". It can be "competitive" most of the time. I'm actually hoping to popularize a new concept into TCG's. You collect cards you like, and sure, they have special effects, but they aren't all really focused on "beating" someone. Theoretically, you could meet up with some other player, not establish a winning condition and just let your cards play out. See what they do. See what you try to take control of, notice what you're willing to give up. It's a way to learn about someone new.
How do you guys feel about cards that need specific other cards. I thought only yugioh and pokemon did this.
It really feels like it doesn't scale very well.
I've resolved infinite combos for my game.
I saw lots of potential for infinity loops with the abilities my creatures had.
A lot of great abilities seemed to also promote infinity loops. So every time an ability starts an "effect chain" you start counting cards from the bottom of your deck onto the table for every effect that is triggered. Once you run to the top of your deck effects just stop working and there will be a law to prevent any card from making a rule against this "deck counting"
the engine should keep track of every state, action, and event ever happened. otherwise, players can't undo actions. memory shouldn't be problem unless there are many players. even then, you log the game in a file, which can be read if you want to find stuff that happened on older turns (or something that happened through the entire game. although these stuff can tracked with small memory footprint.) logging also allows you to replay a game.
There are no "undos" in my game. Not yet at least, I don't think I'll need these.
I don't want the computer to do that (manage memory for complex cards) because this game should also be played in real life.
I'm really impressed with how many people are interested in creating their own cards with their own unique abilities. I hope this doesn't sound too spammy, but I'd love to jump on a group call with a good handful of people here and see what they think about a different set of rules for a new card game. I feel like there are limitations in MTG, understandable ones. I'm also completely avoiding tokens and counters & keeping track of information that can't be represented by a card.
I like the way you guys think, and I'd love to see what ideas you'd come up with for this new idea. It also needs a lot of help getting the rules refined.
Wow, I'd actually like to pull the core members of my team from here.
Demonic Pact That's an interesting card and I wonder how I'd replicate the same effect (other than losing) in my game.
Another thing I want to solve is endless trigger loops. Is this possible in Magic? If there's a smooth way to avoid these, that'd be fantastic. The only way I can think of is "everything costs energy".
Ah. It's powerful because it reveals your cards and their order.
I'm looking for cards with complexish rules. They may sound concise in english, but require some complex "memory" management (different piles, as "fact or fiction" puts it)
I am working on my own digital card game so I'm exploring others so I can experiment with the creative rules and abilities others have come up with and see if it's compatible with an actual game that can be programmed.
There are some abilities I'm cutting out, such as "if your opponent <did something> *last turn*". This requires the computer to keep data about the last turn.
I don't want the computer to do that because this game should also be played in real life. You should be able to start a game, stop it, and continue it and all information should be available with the cards, counters & their placement. (I am looking for a lot of creative help for this game)
What are some of the most creative rules you've seen in magic? Did they require "memory storage" outside of the cards themselves?
I'm exploring the possibility to have an app where people can collaborate on the abilities of cards and how they interact with each other. They would each vote on the ability of the card.
I looked into this a while ago, but I didn't really organize my research around it very well.
There's a lot of problems I run into when it comes to verifying no conflicts between cards, no room for ambiguity, and handling infinite loops.
Generalizing the language of a card's abilities. Simple and common card effects or formats, and then more complex ones
Let me know your thoughts
I will be making the most of all resources though.
It's hard to get a good flushed out test run with a new game and now friends.
My concept is probably far from magic. The only thing similar is that they are card games.
My game is "frameworkless". It's not a combat game necessarily. It's a mashing of "imagination".
It is quite a bit to explain, so I'll try to be concise with some key examples. A card(single card stack)/stack on the field that is turned horizontally doesn't mean anything without the context of other cards. It may be entirely meaningless for that card to be turned horizontally. But let's just say it is, and let's say it's the following card:
Slumber Jump this one will be horizontal
<dream> //<these> containers represent "passive" effects. <-these> rep damage/debuffs. <+these> rep health/defense/buffs.
When this card is returned to your hand from the field, move the stack to the back of the row. (this whole description is marked up w/ glyphs too. it has to be. I'm worried a little about elegance, but I'm hoping for the best. right now this card's ability is irrelevant)
Snap
{hypnosis} // {these} are for "meta" aspects
Requires active/on-field (Any-"livingcard"){hypnosis}: When cast, burry all Dream glyphs under a target stack, but not the face card.
//hold up I forgot to actually add a "horizontal" condition... I'll just invent another card.
Lucid Prodigy
(Psychic){hypnosis}
When a <-+Dream> card is flipped horizontally, you may flip the stack back vertically (yes, there is something to resolve infinite trigger loops)
It may seem too conditional, but these cards are also used as ammo/fuel themselves. Honestly, I've yet to experiment with how frequently abilities can be triggered. I need a good deck first. That's why I'm reaching out. I don't think there is anyway to really test this unless I get 200 cards done. Actually isn't that hard if I do just a few everyday.
side-note (These) circle containers describe living organic-ish creatures. You can target (any-"living creature"). (not machines or golems which can be described in other ways)
This game isn't necessarily about "battle". It can be "competitive" most of the time. I'm actually hoping to popularize a new concept into TCG's. You collect cards you like, and sure, they have special effects, but they aren't all really focused on "beating" someone. Theoretically, you could meet up with some other player, not establish a winning condition and just let your cards play out. See what they do. See what you try to take control of, notice what you're willing to give up. It's a way to learn about someone new.
How do you guys feel about cards that need specific other cards. I thought only yugioh and pokemon did this.
It really feels like it doesn't scale very well.
I saw lots of potential for infinity loops with the abilities my creatures had.
A lot of great abilities seemed to also promote infinity loops. So every time an ability starts an "effect chain" you start counting cards from the bottom of your deck onto the table for every effect that is triggered. Once you run to the top of your deck effects just stop working and there will be a law to prevent any card from making a rule against this "deck counting"
There are no "undos" in my game. Not yet at least, I don't think I'll need these.
I don't want the computer to do that (manage memory for complex cards) because this game should also be played in real life.
I like the way you guys think, and I'd love to see what ideas you'd come up with for this new idea. It also needs a lot of help getting the rules refined.
Wow, I'd actually like to pull the core members of my team from here.
Demonic Pact That's an interesting card and I wonder how I'd replicate the same effect (other than losing) in my game.
Another thing I want to solve is endless trigger loops. Is this possible in Magic? If there's a smooth way to avoid these, that'd be fantastic. The only way I can think of is "everything costs energy".
I'm looking for cards with complexish rules. They may sound concise in english, but require some complex "memory" management (different piles, as "fact or fiction" puts it)
There are some abilities I'm cutting out, such as "if your opponent <did something> *last turn*". This requires the computer to keep data about the last turn.
I don't want the computer to do that because this game should also be played in real life. You should be able to start a game, stop it, and continue it and all information should be available with the cards, counters & their placement. (I am looking for a lot of creative help for this game)
What are some of the most creative rules you've seen in magic? Did they require "memory storage" outside of the cards themselves?