Ixalan gives us a new rack of sorts, in the form of Raiders' Wake. It is more of a machine gun rack as it is repeatable, giving a shock effect for each discard spell you play and successfully land. It also works when you attack. The only downside, the cost. Four mana might be too prohibitive for the current builds of 8Rack.
Ammit Eternal is a potential extra rack for the deck or a large damage dealer that can reset itself.
Again, what's the advantage of Ammit over Nyxathid?
Ammit is less resilient - URx can potentially cantrip Ammit into bolt range and finish it, but not Nyxathid. An opponent topdecking dismember can kill Ammit but not nyxathid. Apart from that they die to the same spells.
Ammit has less power - its maxed at 5. Nyxathid is often 6 or 7 in our deck.
The only upside Ammit has over Nyxathid is Afflict, and that's not impressive because there aren't many things that can block Nyxathid more than once.
Well if your opponent is going to resort to that to get rid of your threat, just makes your discard spells more stronger as they have wasted a turn to deal with it. Also Ammit helps out Liliana against bolts as it it now a second target.
Seriously, people are debating whether this could be good for our deck on the facebook page (Smallpox Invasion).
It's not. Not at all. It's just a bad variant of Bloodghast.
Anyone at least agrees in here?
Agree with this. It is way too slow to be useful, add to the fact that you are basically losing a turn to bring it back onto the battlefield is too much of a cost. The new card Doomed Dissenter is a more better fit and offers more value for the 8-Rack deck style where you are trying to to buy turns most of the time.
I would firstly change the keyword name, Forget is already taken as a card name. Maybe change it to: Bemused - exile N cards from hand or twice that many cards from the top of your library. At end of turn, return one card exiled by bemused effect to the bottom of your library.
The last line I added was to make the ability isn't completely broken.
Any chance that the new card Molten Vortex be considered for this deck. For it to work effectively here the land count would possibly be have to be upped to 24-25 and also splashing green for Life form the Loam be added.
The problem is not that 1 drops cannot be made, it is the current volume of them in modern. Do we really need to have more new ones made? The only way for modern to get new ones is for it to die and be replaced like with "extended". I would give this around 5 years, then we could gave a format with just the new current card frame, then new 1 drop mana dorks can be made.
Good effect made bad, Wizards drops the ball just to make it flashy.
First the casting cost is way to high to be playable. By the time you need it the game is nearly the end and you will probably not get the card you want stopped.
Second, why have an out-clause to end the effect. You are paying seven mana, there should be no out-clause for your opponent.
I would rather have a 1/1 for three cost that did the same thing (that is where an out-clause should be).
For a more zombie-feel deck add Ghoulcaller's Chant to grab back two zombies from the yard to make more token zombies. Also if you decide to use more zombies, Zombie Apocalypse would be efficient way to get them back.
I see that you have added Blackmail, maybe subliminally you took in my idea of using them. I don't get the idea of using a single Slaughter Pact. You may get lucky against Infect deck (if you draw it), but it does become a bad top draw late in the game. That might as well be another Lightning Bolt or a Blackmail.
I do like the inclusion of Desecration Demon, maybe it can be increased to 2 or 3.
You do not need creatures to win the game. The deck is all about establishing control and keeping it. As soon as the game goes into top deck mode, Liliana controls the game. The Rack then does it thing, dealing damage or being a virtual timewalk. If you opponent is not playing anything, that is where the double discard cards are most effective.
Why do you even post here if you're just going to refute every piece of criticism you deck gets?
You don't need creatures to win, but in this deck, it makes you a hell of a lot more likely to win. Your deck is little different in terms of winning than the original 8rack, you just lack the protection of bridge, run half the number of your intended win-con,and rely on full playsets of removal spells to do damage if you can't get rack online.
If you have success with it kudos, but I highly doubt it.
You are not understanding the flow of the game. There are 19 sources of creature control in the deck (not counting the discards), why would you need Bridge if you are already controlling what they play. Looking at 8Rack, the most it ran was 8 (with 4 being Liliana). That is why it has Bridge. Coming against token decks is difficult, that is why we have a sideboard.
As I said previously, once you establish top deck mode, you have controlled the game. One Rack and Liliana is all the pressure you need.
If you still want creatures in the deck, please suggest some that you think can fit this strategy without weakening the deck.
The deck you listed doesn't have any creatures in it. Relying solely on discard to keep them in check is not a dependendable way to win since they can topdeck something. It doesn't help that you're only running 4 of your intended wincon.
You do not need creatures to win the game. The deck is all about establishing control and keeping it. As soon as the game goes into top deck mode, Liliana controls the game. The Rack then does it thing, dealing damage or being a virtual timewalk. If you opponent is not playing anything, that is where the double discard cards are most effective.
Relying on topdecking full playsets of bolt and command is hardly a good wincon. Especially when you don't have a bridge or some blockers to hold them back.
The idea of the deck is to control your opponent from the beginning gaining you turns. That is why there is a high level amount of discard cards. When these run out, your creature kill take over. Bridge is not needed as there is a high level of these as well. Bridge can be in the sideboard for when you encounter token decks. It is at this point where The Rack does its work.
@hotgoat: It's a synergistic idea that has some promise: smallpox blightning rack. I love the idea of hitting someone with a Blackmail, as you said, robbing them of their land, and then smallpoxing. Smashpacman astutely observed that smallpox is made for Delve creatures. The ensuing scenario becomes a nonbo: you have 1 Gurmag Angler. So, you can't cast another Smallpox.
It's just that I believe smallpox to be a 'trap card'. You'll have that scenario where it wrecked, but mostly....you slowed them a little, and you gained little forward progress. Smallpox Vs. Discard = Rock and a Hard Place. On the one hand you're choking their resources which makes their hand fill. On the other hand, you're trying to empty an increasingly filling hand with non-targeted discard (wrench mind / blightning / liliana of the veil / rix maadi, dungeon palace). The result is very muddled. My overarching concern with your deck is the total lack of creatures. Where is the win? You can't bring home the bacon with (4) racks. And, since you run no bridge, I fear for eventually being overrun. If there were 70 card deck minimums, then I think we'd have something. Just my humble. Every time I consider dropping my Phyrexian Obliterator count (again, I think it's being cast, about, as reliably as a nyxathid or gurmag angler with the few extra land I've dedicated to the build and doing sooooo much more). When I consider dropping my creature count below 4, I have to check myself: Am I going to win because I laid a 3rd swamp? Nope, I need some firepower.
I prefer to empty their hands and leave them with resources that feed nothing. The clean up squad, of what does eke itself out, is liliana of the veil, terminate, and ensnaring bridge. That's why I don't run Blood Moon or Fulminator Mage. Our guns can only point in so many directions.
This all depends on how you play Smallpox. You could go for the controlling play on turn 2 if you have nabbed a land with Blackmail. This will give you at least two turns to rebuild from Smallpox before they can do anything. Or you can wait a turn and play Smallpox after a creature is played, thereby maximising the return from playing it.
Also you ask "where is the win". The Rack is not the only card that does damage. Smallpox chips in for 1 damage, then you have the Commands if you choose to do 2 damage, Blightning and Lightening Bolt each can do 3. There is enough built in damage to easily do 20 damage. You have all the resources that you need, it just comes to player skill to use them effectively.
What kind of ending is this in the article. You make a big deal on the clues, yet make no decks that have them. What is the point of ending it like that?
Well if your opponent is going to resort to that to get rid of your threat, just makes your discard spells more stronger as they have wasted a turn to deal with it. Also Ammit helps out Liliana against bolts as it it now a second target.
Agree with this. It is way too slow to be useful, add to the fact that you are basically losing a turn to bring it back onto the battlefield is too much of a cost. The new card Doomed Dissenter is a more better fit and offers more value for the 8-Rack deck style where you are trying to to buy turns most of the time.
The last line I added was to make the ability isn't completely broken.
Also add in Congregate into the mix. It could be the most cost-efficient damage for mana cost of all the life gain cards if used correctly.
First the casting cost is way to high to be playable. By the time you need it the game is nearly the end and you will probably not get the card you want stopped.
Second, why have an out-clause to end the effect. You are paying seven mana, there should be no out-clause for your opponent.
I would rather have a 1/1 for three cost that did the same thing (that is where an out-clause should be).
I see that you have added Blackmail, maybe subliminally you took in my idea of using them. I don't get the idea of using a single Slaughter Pact. You may get lucky against Infect deck (if you draw it), but it does become a bad top draw late in the game. That might as well be another Lightning Bolt or a Blackmail.
I do like the inclusion of Desecration Demon, maybe it can be increased to 2 or 3.
You are not understanding the flow of the game. There are 19 sources of creature control in the deck (not counting the discards), why would you need Bridge if you are already controlling what they play. Looking at 8Rack, the most it ran was 8 (with 4 being Liliana). That is why it has Bridge. Coming against token decks is difficult, that is why we have a sideboard.
As I said previously, once you establish top deck mode, you have controlled the game. One Rack and Liliana is all the pressure you need.
If you still want creatures in the deck, please suggest some that you think can fit this strategy without weakening the deck.
You do not need creatures to win the game. The deck is all about establishing control and keeping it. As soon as the game goes into top deck mode, Liliana controls the game. The Rack then does it thing, dealing damage or being a virtual timewalk. If you opponent is not playing anything, that is where the double discard cards are most effective.
The idea of the deck is to control your opponent from the beginning gaining you turns. That is why there is a high level amount of discard cards. When these run out, your creature kill take over. Bridge is not needed as there is a high level of these as well. Bridge can be in the sideboard for when you encounter token decks. It is at this point where The Rack does its work.
This all depends on how you play Smallpox. You could go for the controlling play on turn 2 if you have nabbed a land with Blackmail. This will give you at least two turns to rebuild from Smallpox before they can do anything. Or you can wait a turn and play Smallpox after a creature is played, thereby maximising the return from playing it.
Also you ask "where is the win". The Rack is not the only card that does damage. Smallpox chips in for 1 damage, then you have the Commands if you choose to do 2 damage, Blightning and Lightening Bolt each can do 3. There is enough built in damage to easily do 20 damage. You have all the resources that you need, it just comes to player skill to use them effectively.