I am curious if cards such as Splendid Reclamation create multiple landfall triggers. If so, we could sac Bloodghast to one of the altars to create alot of mana in response to each trigger.
If Bloodghast is in your graveyard and you return, say, 11 lands with Splendid Reclamation then the ghast's landfall ability will trigger 11 times. However, because a card becomes a different object in the game when it changes zones, the first of those triggers that you resolve would bring it back to the battlefield and the other 10 will not be able to find the object they would return even if you sacrificed Bloodghast before they resolved. And once Bloodghast is back in the graveyard, the lands are already on the battlefield, so they won't trigger landfall again. What you'd have to do for the loop you're thinking of is a repeatable Restore-style effect and alternate it and Bloodghast to bring the lands back one at a time.
Quote from Gatherer »
10/1/2009 - Bloodghast’s landfall ability triggers only if it’s already in your graveyard at the time a land enters the battlefield under your control.
Shucks, thanks for clarifying.
Quote from DementedKirby »
Mazirek does lend itself to some pretty cruel and epic stax. It seems that you want a more devoted stax package than anything. In my case, stax is a secondary theme to the deck. I only use it as an engine to pump my creatures. It provides enough disruption to hinder opponents enough until I can overrun them with creatures or get a one-shot win with Mazirek. That being said, sometimes I get into situations where I can outright force scoops due to the insane stax. Though not the main focus of the deck, I like how I can different ways of piloting it depending on the cards I draw into. For example, I only run one tutor, which is Sidisi, Undead Vizier. And I just look for one piece I may need to complete a combo I pretty much have already set up save for one piece.
I am interested on how you'll manage a deck completely devoted to stax. I fear that it may be a bit slow due to the high casting cost of most cards, but with a lot of tutors and Necropotence you should be able to get into it more quickly. I suggest running Reliquary Tower and some ways to gain life in order to be able to draw ridiculous amounts of cards with Necropotence.
Initially, I also felt that stax was a secondary theme, and even in my list, it somewhat is. I am not running [card}Winter Orb[/card] like effects, but I do prioritize keeping ahead of my opponents by denying resources. I feel that this deck is at its best when we can stay ahead on resources and never let our opponents get a chance to get off the ground. I would prefer not to morph this deck into a devoted stax build; much of my local meta is fairly casual, and this deck already blows many decks out of the water. In fact, I have to refrain from playing this deck against certain playgroups as they have been vocal on how oppressive this deck can get.
I would love to reduce the amount of tutors, but my main playgroup is a bit more competitive than the majority of my local meta. Many decks run a plethora of boardwipes, removal, and disruption, so it is very rare that I can close out games with just combat damage. Reliquary Tower is quite good with Necropotence, but is a land I would rather not see in almost any other scenario. I do like to discard on occasion so i can reanimate targets later on, or bring cards back in some other ways.
Still have yet to draw into Possessed Portal; I am getting the sneaking suspicion it may just be win more but I will need to get a chance to actually play with it before I can decide.
I'm intrigue by the portal. Once things are going, stuff from the hand really doesn't matter. Shutting down other player's draw, even if it included my own is worth looking into. I usually have the strongest board-state and have been a tad more controlly.
This is my line of thought; once we have established control, the portal becomes a very powerful lock. We have access to numerous tutors in the deck to get round drawing such as Evolutionary Leap, the black sorcery tutors, GSZ, and chord. It also acts as an additional sac outlet which is great if Maz is on the field, or something like Titania, and as previously mentioned, Necropotence.
The cons that I see for running the portal is High CMC and it is a card that does nothing for us if we have no board presence, other than serve as a nuisance for other players. Still, I will be running some games with it to see if it deserved a slot.
More changes are abound with my list. I've kicked out Tempt with Discovery and thrown in Amulet of Vigor. People I play against have learned to never take the offer now as I can get absurd lands. My meta also has a few decks which run Kismet type effects, so it is really good at preventing being slowed down tremendously (fetchlands ETB tapped is really bad). This card is also absolutely busted with Scapeshift and Splendid Reclamation, leading to even more ways to have huge explosive turns. All for 1 mana, not too shabby.
I've been running into issues with other Reanimator decks, so I've kicked out one the 1 drop elves for Deathrite Shaman. I've also added in Scavenging Ooze to further prohibit such strategies. I've also had to give in and throw in Bojuka Bog. I really dislike ETB lands, but it can be tutored into play in a variety of ways, and possibly in response to a reanimation spell with Crop Rotation. This deck has enough ways to bring it back when it goes to GY, so it should prove to be useful, even if does enter in tapped.
I've been play testing Demon of Dark Schemes as it combos with Living Plane but i think it will be getting the boot. It is too slow, and surprisingly, I have not won most games where I have assembled the combo. More than likely due to misplays, but I feel Massacre Wurm is just better as it can kill opponents. Archfiend of Depravity is some pretty sweet tech, but slots are very tight in this list.
Finally, I need to find a slot for Bloodghast. This card is so bonkers it isn't even funny. It is excellent sac fodder as it keeps coming back due to landfall. With the amount of fetches being run, two landfall triggers is nothing to sneeze at when we have cards such as Skullclamp, and the altars for getting more mana.
I am curious if cards such as Splendid Reclamation create multiple landfall triggers. If so, we could sac Bloodghast to one of the altars to create alot of mana in response to each trigger. I think this card will be very key in this deck, and is definitely deserving of a spot. It is also very effective with Possessed Portal, especially so if we leave fetches open for each turn so we remain at card parity.
Will try to post an updated list once I get enough chances to play test the new additions.
Skyship Weatherlight seems like it would be flavorful and on theme for this type of deck. As far as ramp goes, why not add some of the typical green creatures that do so? Ex. Sakura-Tribe Elder, Farhaven Elf etc. An anthem or two would definitely be beneficial as it can help you close out games such as Cathars' Crusade or Akroma's Memorial. A really good closer that you may want to consider is Storm Herd. Your life total will be relatively high since you are wiping constantly so you will get a ton of tokens.
Are you planning to go for 1 shot kills or just get value over time? Some haste enablers would be nice here such as Concordant Crossroads.
Really like the theme of this deck, will keep watch to see how this list develops.
Been interested in trying out Possessed Portal....seems to be quite good in the artifact build as it can be tutored with our normal tutors as well as Inventor's Fair.
Would really push the stax theme further, anyone care to shed some light on why this card might be good/bad for this deck? I do happen to be running Necropotence so having both of these out would be very powerful.
Hi, nice list! This list looks like its heavily leaning towards enchantments, so you may wish to do lean towards the enchantresses that draw you cards such as Argothian Enchantress, Mesa Enchantress, and Enchantress's Presence. Herald of the Pantheon seems to fit in well here as it helps you offset any damage you are taking while reducing the cost of enchantments.
These cards will probably draw less ire from the table as opposed to running Consecrated Sphinx.
I see you have Open the Vaults, if it is in your budget, you should strongly consider Replenish, as the effect is asymmetrical and cheaper to cast.
I would probably cut Dirtcowl Wurm seeing as how it has no evasion, replace it with one of the enchantresses. Not sure what the function of Damping Engine and Howling Mine are; the former could hurt you since you will always be dropping lands and drawing a card, while the latter has no synergy with your overall strategy. Have similar feelings about Sands of Time, why not run Mana Web?
Of course, Serra's Sanctum would love a home here, but once again not sure what your budgetary restrictions for this deck are.
Living Plane is simply too broken. I'm forever grateful to Welgo for pointing it out to me. Even if it's out of one's budget, it can be substituted for Nature's Revolt. Including it is simply too broken. Granted, even though I don't run Titania, Protector of Argoth, I do run The Gitrog Monster. And yes, it gets ridiculous - especially if you run all the possible fetchlands and lands that sacrifice themselves as part of their ability.
Indeed, it dawned on me that it makes Gaea's Cradle even more busted.
So a card recently caught my attention that may be ripe for abuse: Amulet of Vigor. It is really quite good with lists running CIPT lands; but is just nutty when Scapeshift and Splendid Reclamation get resolved. I personally do not run any CIPT lands, but am running into some decks which force permanents to enter the battlefield tapped. This card may be more of a meta call, or decks revolving around a Lands Matter Strategy, but definitely something to consider!
I hope my thread can continue to serve as a guide to those looking into this commander and/or the many strategies it enables. I love this deck so I will definitely continue to work on it as more magic sets and new cards continue to come out. Mazirek is a very versatile commander so it took me quite a while to test so many things and compile even more things into the comprehensive primer you have before you. So I hope it's of good use to the community.
Once again, thanks to all those who've had any kind of interest and input in my thread!
Congratulations! Definitely well deserved; hope to see this primer grow as time passes.
My bad; will try to put it in spoiler tags. Good thing I got it wrong, lol.
No problem, I have edited the original post to include the answer. I would encourage everyone to try to figure out the answer on their own, as these situations may come up in your own builds. Certain choices can just let you win the game outright with this commander, it is just a matter of finding the right path.
You have infinite sacrifice triggers so infinite +1/+1 counters but nothing to attack with. Yet, you're blowing up everything on the battlefield. So your road to victory was scoop instead of life draining, combat damage, or commander damage?
Yes, that is correct, my opponents do not have enough of a board state t5 to deal with all their lands blowing up. I've included the scoop clause to the main post. It may be possible to combo off with life drain, let me think about this some more!
My bad; will try to put it in spoiler tags. Good thing I got it wrong, lol.
No problem, I have edited the original post to include the answer. I would encourage everyone to try to figure out the answer on their own, as these situations may come up in your own builds. Certain choices can just let you win the game outright with this commander, it is just a matter of finding the right path.
You can't tap a creature for convoke and also sacrifice it for mana on the same spell, because you have to pay all costs at the same time and the opportunity to activate the mana ability happens right before that.
EDIT2: For the sake of discussion, let's say that once you get Maz + Woodfall + sac outlet, that is enough for the win as your opponents will scoop. Let's also try to use spoilers so people can give this a shot without seeing potential answers.
How can we win using Maz + Woodfall Primus combo using my decklist?
This is from an actual game I played, I will add a spoiler in soon.
EDIT: For the sake of discussion, let's say that once you get Maz + Woodfall + sac outlet, that is enough for the win as your opponents will scoop.
EDIT2: Alright, spoiler added. Please try solving this on your own if you can. My only hint would be to study the decklist! It is possible there is more than answer, so please fire away!
Thanks so much for these suggestions! I actually ran Avenger of Zendikar for a brief interval, but I ended up taking it out because I never had enough mana to cast it.
Creature removal is definitely my main goal if I run Maelstrom Pulse, but I can't deny that the versatility it has makes it seem more appealing than a black Murder spell. The problem is that I'm trying to stay budget, and Maelstrom Pulse is WAAAAAAY beyond that.
Also, doesn't Toxic Deluge cause all creatures that reach a toughness below 0 to be sacrificed? Because if so, I definitely want to run it in my deck.
Sadly, Deluge does not work that way. Creatures hit 0 toughness and then hit the GY; they are not sacrificed. Pox, Smallpox, and Death Cloud are all what you are looking for if you want opponents (and yourself) to sacrifice things. Deluge was recommended since it is a low cost boardwipe with a the same CMC as Oath of Liliana, and can get around potential indestructible targets.
For Oath of Liliana It truly depends; are you afraid of wiping your own board? If not Toxic Deluge is certainly an option. Maelstrom Pulse is quite versatile, especially if you are fighting against other token decks. I think there are better budget options if you are look for removal against certain types of decks. Creature removal options are Go For the Throat and Snuff Out (my personal favorite, allows you to tap out as you will always be casting this for "free"). You could also consider Beast Within or Krosan Grip.
I am not dissuading you to use Maelstrom, it is really up to you to decide whats appropriate for your meta/budget. I think the lands you mentioned, as well as Squandered Resources should be thrown in if you are running Gitrog, as they would provide some great synergy.
Finally, some excellent advise thrown in by DementedKirby, I think the main problem your deck was facing was a) lack of mana ramp and b) lack of threat density. If you find there is not enough oompf still in closing out your games, we can take a look at adding in some cheap finishers (Avenger of Zendikar would seem to fit the bill here).
Ok, I understand now some of your choices - that's ok because you're piloting your own deck. You could add in Lotus Vale and not worry too much about it. You can also recur lands (and using it with The Gitrog Monster in play is awesome).
I suggested Necropotence to be cut because it's difficult to cast and you can add other methods of card draw that synergize better with the deck. Same goes for Sensei's Divining Top. Manipulating the top 3 cards is pretty useless if you're drawing more than 3 cards at a time per turn. It's just my opinion, but I base value on synergy as well as independent use. Only independent use is not enough for me. It has to have some degree of independent use but also combine with other things.
You'll see how evident those slight changes were in bettering the overall performance of your deck. Hopefully you'll be able to add the other changes and continue polishing it.
This deck has become a total nightmare for others to play against. The Gitrog Monster with all the land effects can be really brutal.
So a couple things, when Gitrog is not out, Necropotence and Top shine, especially in conjunction with Oracle of Mul Daya. In fact Necro + Oracle is a fantastic combo. With the amount of land tutoring, and my plan to add in every fetch I can, the cost should never be prohibitive (and for the 100s of games I've played, has rarely been so).
I am on the fence about including Lotus Vale. I don't run too many lands, and should anyone throw a damper into my strategy by running GY exile effects, I could be in a lot of trouble. I do agree that Lotus Bloom could be cut, and was thinking of adding in Mana Crypt since the price has come down quite a bit. I know its not "synergistic" persay, but it does offer alot in terms of early game development and improving my board state.
I haven't been feeling well, so I haven't had the energy to post up the combo puzzle. I will try my best to get that up next week.
I know that your overall strategy is lands matter because of what you mentioned but I don't really see a lot of support for lands in the deck - particularly due to the absence of The Gitrog Monster.
Sorry for the confusion, but my overall strategy does not revolve around lands matter specifically; I just wanted to have a small subtheme in the deck.
I don't want to make too many changes until I see how these cards play out, but I will probably sub Lotus Boom for Lotus Vale. One of my fears is that there are not enough lands in the deck to dedicate myself to more of a land based strat without changing the deck composition drastically, hence I see it hard to include Asuza.
Birthing Pod is a bit too good to cut, my curve has specifically been designed around it. I also can't see myself getting rid of Top and Necropotence as these cards provide too much value.
This deck likes playing out of the GY so cutting Yawgmoth's Will is also out of the question.
Shucks, thanks for clarifying.
Initially, I also felt that stax was a secondary theme, and even in my list, it somewhat is. I am not running [card}Winter Orb[/card] like effects, but I do prioritize keeping ahead of my opponents by denying resources. I feel that this deck is at its best when we can stay ahead on resources and never let our opponents get a chance to get off the ground. I would prefer not to morph this deck into a devoted stax build; much of my local meta is fairly casual, and this deck already blows many decks out of the water. In fact, I have to refrain from playing this deck against certain playgroups as they have been vocal on how oppressive this deck can get.
I would love to reduce the amount of tutors, but my main playgroup is a bit more competitive than the majority of my local meta. Many decks run a plethora of boardwipes, removal, and disruption, so it is very rare that I can close out games with just combat damage. Reliquary Tower is quite good with Necropotence, but is a land I would rather not see in almost any other scenario. I do like to discard on occasion so i can reanimate targets later on, or bring cards back in some other ways.
Still have yet to draw into Possessed Portal; I am getting the sneaking suspicion it may just be win more but I will need to get a chance to actually play with it before I can decide.
This is my line of thought; once we have established control, the portal becomes a very powerful lock. We have access to numerous tutors in the deck to get round drawing such as Evolutionary Leap, the black sorcery tutors, GSZ, and chord. It also acts as an additional sac outlet which is great if Maz is on the field, or something like Titania, and as previously mentioned, Necropotence.
The cons that I see for running the portal is High CMC and it is a card that does nothing for us if we have no board presence, other than serve as a nuisance for other players. Still, I will be running some games with it to see if it deserved a slot.
More changes are abound with my list. I've kicked out Tempt with Discovery and thrown in Amulet of Vigor. People I play against have learned to never take the offer now as I can get absurd lands. My meta also has a few decks which run Kismet type effects, so it is really good at preventing being slowed down tremendously (fetchlands ETB tapped is really bad). This card is also absolutely busted with Scapeshift and Splendid Reclamation, leading to even more ways to have huge explosive turns. All for 1 mana, not too shabby.
I've been running into issues with other Reanimator decks, so I've kicked out one the 1 drop elves for Deathrite Shaman. I've also added in Scavenging Ooze to further prohibit such strategies. I've also had to give in and throw in Bojuka Bog. I really dislike ETB lands, but it can be tutored into play in a variety of ways, and possibly in response to a reanimation spell with Crop Rotation. This deck has enough ways to bring it back when it goes to GY, so it should prove to be useful, even if does enter in tapped.
I've been play testing Demon of Dark Schemes as it combos with Living Plane but i think it will be getting the boot. It is too slow, and surprisingly, I have not won most games where I have assembled the combo. More than likely due to misplays, but I feel Massacre Wurm is just better as it can kill opponents. Archfiend of Depravity is some pretty sweet tech, but slots are very tight in this list.
Finally, I need to find a slot for Bloodghast. This card is so bonkers it isn't even funny. It is excellent sac fodder as it keeps coming back due to landfall. With the amount of fetches being run, two landfall triggers is nothing to sneeze at when we have cards such as Skullclamp, and the altars for getting more mana.
I am curious if cards such as Splendid Reclamation create multiple landfall triggers. If so, we could sac Bloodghast to one of the altars to create alot of mana in response to each trigger. I think this card will be very key in this deck, and is definitely deserving of a spot. It is also very effective with Possessed Portal, especially so if we leave fetches open for each turn so we remain at card parity.
Will try to post an updated list once I get enough chances to play test the new additions.
Are you planning to go for 1 shot kills or just get value over time? Some haste enablers would be nice here such as Concordant Crossroads.
Really like the theme of this deck, will keep watch to see how this list develops.
Would really push the stax theme further, anyone care to shed some light on why this card might be good/bad for this deck? I do happen to be running Necropotence so having both of these out would be very powerful.
These cards will probably draw less ire from the table as opposed to running Consecrated Sphinx.
If you want to go down a more pillowfort route, you could look into Collective Restraint and Sphere of Safety.
Need protection for your enchantments? Sterling Grove and Greater Auramancy can help you in that department.
I see you have Open the Vaults, if it is in your budget, you should strongly consider Replenish, as the effect is asymmetrical and cheaper to cast.
I would probably cut Dirtcowl Wurm seeing as how it has no evasion, replace it with one of the enchantresses. Not sure what the function of Damping Engine and Howling Mine are; the former could hurt you since you will always be dropping lands and drawing a card, while the latter has no synergy with your overall strategy. Have similar feelings about Sands of Time, why not run Mana Web?
Of course, Serra's Sanctum would love a home here, but once again not sure what your budgetary restrictions for this deck are.
Happy brewing!
Indeed, it dawned on me that it makes Gaea's Cradle even more busted.
So a card recently caught my attention that may be ripe for abuse: Amulet of Vigor. It is really quite good with lists running CIPT lands; but is just nutty when Scapeshift and Splendid Reclamation get resolved. I personally do not run any CIPT lands, but am running into some decks which force permanents to enter the battlefield tapped. This card may be more of a meta call, or decks revolving around a Lands Matter Strategy, but definitely something to consider!
Congratulations! Definitely well deserved; hope to see this primer grow as time passes.
So I am currently in the process of testing out Living Plane. This card is just bonkers if I can ever get counters on the lands and cast something like Toxic Deluge, or have backup such as Splendid Reclamation. Even without backup, having Titania, Protector of Argoth or The Gitrog Monster on the field can make the effect quite asymmetrical.
Will report back on how this works out.
Yes, that is correct, my opponents do not have enough of a board state t5 to deal with all their lands blowing up. I've included the scoop clause to the main post. It may be possible to combo off with life drain, let me think about this some more!
No problem, I have edited the original post to include the answer. I would encourage everyone to try to figure out the answer on their own, as these situations may come up in your own builds. Certain choices can just let you win the game outright with this commander, it is just a matter of finding the right path.
You can't tap a creature for convoke and also sacrifice it for mana on the same spell, because you have to pay all costs at the same time and the opportunity to activate the mana ability happens right before that.
EDIT: Here is the rules page I found it from: http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-rulings/magic-rulings-archives/292947-convoke
EDIT2: For the sake of discussion, let's say that once you get Maz + Woodfall + sac outlet, that is enough for the win as your opponents will scoop. Let's also try to use spoilers so people can give this a shot without seeing potential answers.
Ok puzzle time:
The decklist:
1 Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest
Artifacts (10)
1 Lotus Bloom
1 Mana Vault
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Skullclamp
1 Sol Ring
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Ashnod's Altar
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Phyrexian Altar
1 Birthing Pod
Creatures (24)
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Fyndhorn Elves
1 Llanowar Elves
1 Blood Artist
1 Lotus Cobra
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Burnished Hart
1 Eternal Witness
1 Fleshbag Marauder
1 Wood Elves
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
1 Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder
1 Puppeteer Clique
1 Sidisi, Undead Vizier
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth
1 Bane of Progress
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Avenger of Zendikar
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One
1 Craterhoof Behemoth
1 Woodfall Primus
1 Bitterblossom
1 Evolutionary Leap
1 Khalni Heart Expedition
1 Survival of the Fittest
1 Sylvan Library
1 Awakening Zone
1 Necropotence
1 Grave Pact
1 Greater Good
Sorceries (15)
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Reanimate
1 Diabolic Intent
1 Smallpox
1 Sylvan Scrying
1 Death Cloud
1 Eldritch Evolution
1 Genesis Wave
1 Pox
1 Search for Tomorrow
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Damnation
1 Scapeshift
1 Tempt with Discovery
Instants (5)
1 Crop Rotation
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Chord of Calling
1 Krosan Grip
1 Snuff Out
1 Ancient Tomb
1 Bayou
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Command Beacon
1 Command Tower
1 Deserted Temple
1 Dryad Arbor
7 Forest
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 High Market
1 Lake of the Dead
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Petrified Field
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Polluted Delta
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Strip Mine
6 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Wasteland
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Yavimaya Hollow
Our hand/boardstate:
http://imgur.com/wmGzrb3
It is turn 5, and our opponents are tapped out. We flipped over Cabal Coffers and Wasteland from Oracle of Mul Daya, triggering Lotus Cobra landfall ability.
How can we win using Maz + Woodfall Primus combo using my decklist?
This is from an actual game I played, I will add a spoiler in soon.
EDIT: For the sake of discussion, let's say that once you get Maz + Woodfall + sac outlet, that is enough for the win as your opponents will scoop.
EDIT: Looks like the embedded imgur link is broken, trying to find a fix.
Ok puzzle time:
The decklist:
1 Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest
Artifacts (10)
1 Lotus Bloom
1 Mana Vault
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Skullclamp
1 Sol Ring
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Ashnod's Altar
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Phyrexian Altar
1 Birthing Pod
Creatures (24)
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Fyndhorn Elves
1 Llanowar Elves
1 Blood Artist
1 Lotus Cobra
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Burnished Hart
1 Eternal Witness
1 Fleshbag Marauder
1 Wood Elves
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
1 Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder
1 Puppeteer Clique
1 Sidisi, Undead Vizier
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth
1 Bane of Progress
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Avenger of Zendikar
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One
1 Craterhoof Behemoth
1 Woodfall Primus
1 Bitterblossom
1 Evolutionary Leap
1 Khalni Heart Expedition
1 Survival of the Fittest
1 Sylvan Library
1 Awakening Zone
1 Necropotence
1 Grave Pact
1 Greater Good
Sorceries (15)
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Reanimate
1 Diabolic Intent
1 Smallpox
1 Sylvan Scrying
1 Death Cloud
1 Eldritch Evolution
1 Genesis Wave
1 Pox
1 Search for Tomorrow
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Damnation
1 Scapeshift
1 Tempt with Discovery
Instants (5)
1 Crop Rotation
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Chord of Calling
1 Krosan Grip
1 Snuff Out
1 Ancient Tomb
1 Bayou
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Command Beacon
1 Command Tower
1 Deserted Temple
1 Dryad Arbor
7 Forest
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 High Market
1 Lake of the Dead
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Petrified Field
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Polluted Delta
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Strip Mine
6 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Wasteland
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Yavimaya Hollow
Our hand/boardstate:
http://imgur.com/wmGzrb3
It is turn 5, and our opponents are tapped out. We flipped over Cabal Coffers and Wasteland from Oracle of Mul Daya, triggering Lotus Cobra landfall ability.
How can we win using Maz + Woodfall Primus combo using my decklist?
This is from an actual game I played, I will add a spoiler in soon.
EDIT: For the sake of discussion, let's say that once you get Maz + Woodfall + sac outlet, that is enough for the win as your opponents will scoop.
EDIT2: Alright, spoiler added. Please try solving this on your own if you can. My only hint would be to study the decklist! It is possible there is more than answer, so please fire away!
Tap Ancient tomb and Wasteland to cast Ashnod's Altar.
Tap Birds of Paradise to add either G or B (I think it should not matter here). Mana pool now is GGG.
Sacrifice Birds of Paradise, Lotus cobra, and Eldrazi Spawn token to Ashnod's Altar. Mana pool now is 6GGG.
Tap Oracle of Mul Daya to add 1 via convoke, cast Chord of Calling where X=7. Mana pool is now empty.
Choose Avenger of Zendikar. Avenger of Zendikar. ETB, creating 5 plant tokens.
Sac two plant tokens to Ashnod's Altar to add 4 to your mana pool.
Use 3 and pay two life to cast Birthing Pod.
Use the remaining 1 and pay two life to activate Birthing Pod, sacrificing Avenger of Zendikar and bringing out Woodfall Primus.
Sac two more plant tokens to Ashnod's Altar, adding 4 to mana pool. Tap Forest and Lake of Dead to add BG. Cast Maz with 1 left over, gg.
Sadly, Deluge does not work that way. Creatures hit 0 toughness and then hit the GY; they are not sacrificed. Pox, Smallpox, and Death Cloud are all what you are looking for if you want opponents (and yourself) to sacrifice things. Deluge was recommended since it is a low cost boardwipe with a the same CMC as Oath of Liliana, and can get around potential indestructible targets.
For Oath of Liliana It truly depends; are you afraid of wiping your own board? If not Toxic Deluge is certainly an option. Maelstrom Pulse is quite versatile, especially if you are fighting against other token decks. I think there are better budget options if you are look for removal against certain types of decks. Creature removal options are Go For the Throat and Snuff Out (my personal favorite, allows you to tap out as you will always be casting this for "free"). You could also consider Beast Within or Krosan Grip.
I am not dissuading you to use Maelstrom, it is really up to you to decide whats appropriate for your meta/budget. I think the lands you mentioned, as well as Squandered Resources should be thrown in if you are running Gitrog, as they would provide some great synergy.
Finally, some excellent advise thrown in by DementedKirby, I think the main problem your deck was facing was a) lack of mana ramp and b) lack of threat density. If you find there is not enough oompf still in closing out your games, we can take a look at adding in some cheap finishers (Avenger of Zendikar would seem to fit the bill here).
Happy brewing!
This deck has become a total nightmare for others to play against. The Gitrog Monster with all the land effects can be really brutal.
So a couple things, when Gitrog is not out, Necropotence and Top shine, especially in conjunction with Oracle of Mul Daya. In fact Necro + Oracle is a fantastic combo. With the amount of land tutoring, and my plan to add in every fetch I can, the cost should never be prohibitive (and for the 100s of games I've played, has rarely been so).
I am on the fence about including Lotus Vale. I don't run too many lands, and should anyone throw a damper into my strategy by running GY exile effects, I could be in a lot of trouble. I do agree that Lotus Bloom could be cut, and was thinking of adding in Mana Crypt since the price has come down quite a bit. I know its not "synergistic" persay, but it does offer alot in terms of early game development and improving my board state.
I haven't been feeling well, so I haven't had the energy to post up the combo puzzle. I will try my best to get that up next week.
Cheers for all the good work!
Sorry for the confusion, but my overall strategy does not revolve around lands matter specifically; I just wanted to have a small subtheme in the deck.
However:
The Gitrog Monster
Fantastic recommendation! This is exactly what this deck needed, as it provides something that it had been lacking: card draw. I've taken out Endrek Sahr and Burnished Hart and threw in Gitrog as well as Life From the Loam. I also took out Khalni Heart Expedition and threw in Splendid Reclamation.
I don't want to make too many changes until I see how these cards play out, but I will probably sub Lotus Boom for Lotus Vale. One of my fears is that there are not enough lands in the deck to dedicate myself to more of a land based strat without changing the deck composition drastically, hence I see it hard to include Asuza.
Birthing Pod is a bit too good to cut, my curve has specifically been designed around it. I also can't see myself getting rid of Top and Necropotence as these cards provide too much value.
This deck likes playing out of the GY so cutting Yawgmoth's Will is also out of the question.
Search for Tomorrow was included to have something to do t1, but may be dropped for Harrow. Need to find room for Burgeoning and Exploration as they become especially brutal with Crucible of Worlds and Gitrog.
If I have some time, I would like to post a bit of a puzzle for those who are planning to use the Combo of Maz + Woodfall Primus + sac outlet.
Once again, thanks for all the help!