I would like your Protean Slime much better, Rudyard, if there wasn't bounce in the opposing deck. I wanted it to be a good answer to removal. Maybe: "When Protean Slime leaves the battlefield, that stuff happens."?
Or even:
Protean Slime1GG
Creature - Ooze [R]
Heroic - Whenever Protean Slime becomes the target of a spell you control, put a +1/+1 counter on it, then put an X/X green Ooze creature token onto the battlefield, where X is the number of +1/+1 counters on Protean Slime.
1/1
I also agree that Rebound is sweet and should stay, just in low amounts to not overshadow the major themes.
While Whitemane Tiger works with Bestow, it's a pretty big nombo when you have to bounce your heroic dude that's been building up +1/+1 counters. I don't think the +1/+1 counters need to be a huge theme or anything, I just think the combat tricks work a bit better when they are doing something permanent. I think the best way to answer muddling up the themes is to remove anything that currently cares about +1/+1 counters on other cards.
I have some rather bold thoughts on directions to take this take in, so bare with me while I elaborate.
These decks don't hate eachother yet. They don't have a reason to fight. They don't have a reason to be dual decks together. What if instead of "Random Heroic Keyword Guy versus Random Graveyard Artifact Guy" it became "Cares About Enchantments Deck versus Cares About Artifacts Deck". Enchantments and Artifacts both support different philosophies. Enchantments come across as much more natural uses of mana which serves as a good conflict for our respective Legends. I'm not suggesting changing the Legend because he still works very well in a deck full of them.
This would mean more Bestow and less Rebound. Bestow is the bridge between Enchantments and Heroic, where Rebound only serves Heroic. More Bestow also deals with the creature count problem. Perfecting the ratio of creatures to enchantments becomes a much easier task when a percentage of them are both. I'd like to see more cards that push themes, preferably while giving us more creatures. Cards like:
*Replacing Nature's Bounty* Heroic Anthem2GW
Enchantment [R]
When ~ enters the battlefield, put a 1/1 green and white Spirit creature token onto the battlefield.
Creatures you control get +1/+1.
*Replacing Hydra of Immortality* 2W
Enchantment Creature - Spirit [U]
Bestow 4W
~ and enchanted creature get +X/+X, where X is the number of enchantments you control.
0/0
XW
Sorcery [U]
Search your library for an Aura card with converted mana cost X and put it onto the battlefield attached to target permanent it could enchant. Then shuffle your library.
Cards that I would like to see changed immediately are:
Hero's Sacrifice - This could just as easily give +1/+1 and not die. I understand that it's flavorful, but it's just a really weird fog + giant growth. This card should also definitely be uncommon.
Aura of Awe - It should just be: "When Aura of Awe enters the battlefield, exile target creature until Aura of Awe leaves the battlefield.". Again, I understand the flavor but I really dislike when flavor trumps a clean and simple design. I mean, why can't the opposing creature just be in awe of the aura?
Crusader for the Lost - I'd like to see this changed to more of a bridge card between heroic and auras. "Whenever you cast a spell that targets Crusader for the Lost, you may return target Aura card from your graveyard to the battlefield attached to target permanent it could enchant.". If so, the name should probably be changed as well.
Enduring Resolve - I'd rather this cost G and put a +1/+1 counter on the creature. I think the name would resonate with the card more if this were the case. It would also be a good way to axe Travel Preparations.
Possibility Elemental - The name sounds too blue. I suggest "Protean" instead of "Possibility" as a replacement name if were bent on keeping the card as is. I'm also not a huge fan of "Akroma Syndrome" cards. Perhaps:
Protean Slime1GG
Creature - Ooze
Heroic - Whenever Protean Slime becomes the target of a spell you control, put a +1/+1 counter on it.
Remove X +1/+1 counters from Protean Slime: Put an X/X green Ooze creature token onto the battlefield.
1/1
Supposedly this deck has a real weakness to spot removal, so here's a guy who's quite good against it. I really like how this interacts with the +1/+1 counters cards like Thrive, Triumphant Strike or my proposed Enduring Resolve. It's a cool card that creates a little sub-game while not being absurd at doing so.
Savage Insight - I don't think this deck needs a "draw X" and should instead focus it's advantage on creature tokens and Bestow. I'm fine with Keen Nymph beause it's a steady gain that fits the deck's themes. Also, there are a bunch of GG cards here and other tough mana costs for an aggressive deck to reliably pull off.
Superiority - Again, "Akroma Syndrome". A lot of the creatures in the Vizcon deck only have a few points of toughness, so deathtouch is out of place. I'd much prefer this as:
SuperiorityGW
Instant [U]
Put a +1/+1 counter on target creature. It gains hexproof and indestructible until end of turn.
Hydra of Immortality - It's been said twice that the card doesn't really fit into the deck.
I have about a thousand more ideas if any of this goes over well with anyone.
Megiddo isn't even in our group. He hasn't touched the set document. I attributed the card to him because he suggested it upon giving us the feedback and we still needed a common blue removal spell at the end of the night.
The overall lack of discussion on cards falls on the entire team, not just me. If no one comments and the deadline hits, a decision has to be made.
First of all, the second round started on page five meaning we've had exactly the same amount of discussion as the first round. There was plenty. Second of all, yes the decision has to be made, but not by you. Like in the first round, I compiled everything together about an hour before the due date so that everyone who wanted to say something had the chance to.
I don't like how Salvage is gone but it's a group project so I got over it. Moss didn't want Artifact lands but enough other people did. I'm sure everyone has at least something they don't like about the set but that's the nature of things. It doesn't fall on you to change cards and add your own to the set when people have been discussing and working to get to this point. Without Salvage we needed an artifact mechanic of some sort otherwise there's no reason any of our cards are artifacts. It just ended up that caring about artifacts in the graveyard was the way we went.
The rest of your post is a mess. I don't actually know what you're arguing or how to comment.
I don't have time to argue this right now. You've already gone into the set doc and edited a whole bunch of crap in and out and I now have 15 minutes to fix it all. I'm stepping my foot down and saying Chain Forger is insane. You edited out the open black uncommon slot that was being saved for either scrap or die or underficer's edict and put it Neuterizer which literally nobody commented on wanting in the set. You've changed Vizcon's Void back to rare which now means our clone has no spot. You've changed the land which once again nobody but myself commented on wanting, and not without a large change. I'm changing Chain Forger and you can explain to everyone else why their cards aren't in the set, despite being discussed.
@Svennilator: RE: Chain Forger
Drawing two cards would be too good at 2 CMC for a Mythic, but that's not the card I submitted as Chain Forger. When you cast an artifact spell, you either mill 1 or discard 1. Where are you getting "draw 2" from?
You draw a card, then mill a card. We have a bunch of flashback in the deck. Drawing a card every time you play an artifact is already too good. Possibly "drawing" a flashback card along with it is just crazy. The card is painfully above the curve right now.
RE: Underfice Repository
Making it a Legendary Artifact Land is fine. Pushing the activation cost to :2mana::symu::symb: is too far. Argivian Archaeologist lets you do the same thing without "losing" a land for mana. The cost should be at :1mana::symu::symb:.
Only a few hours left. I've updated the set skeleton to coincide with popular oppinions. We still need a couple cards decided on.
Scrap or Die versus Underficer's Edict
Two blue commons, a blue rare and a black common. Keep in mind that Chain Forger is still being talked about. It's an interesting card and we can find room.
Otherwise I don't see any rarity changes after going through the last 5 days of the google doc.
I didn't see the change to Dumpster Delving until last night, which combined with the change to Vizcon's Void is an effective four changes to rarities. It just irked me because people were still trying to design a blue clone and there randomly wasn't room.
"Whenever you cast an artifact spell, draw two cards." isn't even close to printable at 2 mana. Chain Forger needs some serious work. Maybe:
Chain Forger1UB
Artifact Creature - Human Wizard [U]
Whenever an artifact enters or leaves the battlefield, target player puts the top card of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
2/3
Or maybe just a mono blue version that only triggers on entering?
I'd prefer a clone for the blue rare and Vizcon's Void be moved to uncommon.
I think Vectis Unhallowed might be a bit too good. Maybe it could gain first strike when you sac an artifact? That way they can still get him with removal at least.
While I understand what Steelweave Barrier is trying to do, to me it comes off as clunky and long-winded for a common. I'm trying to come up with something similiar but I have nothing. Maybe a flash creature that gives you the option to return an artifact to your hand, similar to Moss's:
Escape Thopter3U
Artifact Creature - Thopter [C]
Flash
Flying
When Escape Thopter enters the battlefield, you may return another artifact you control to your hand.
2/2
What about a Howling Mine variant that's better for us instead of Mary Sue Looter?
1U
Artifact [U]
At the beginning of each player's upkeep, that player draws a card, then discards a card.
Or maybe just a simple version:
2U
Artifact Creature - Human Wizard [C] U, T: Each player draws a card, then discards a card.
1/3
Perhaps we could move Scrapflesh Imp down to 2B and lower it to a 1/1. If we do, what about a hasty version of Salvage Slasher to round things off:
Reckless Scavenger3B
Artifact Creature - Human Rogue [C]
Haste
Reckless Scavenger gets +1/+0 for each artifact card in your graveyard.
1/1
These are the cards in contention for slots. I've given my oppinion in each catagory:
Rare Land
Underfice Repository Legendary (Artifact?) Land {R}
Underfice Repository enters the battlefield tapped unless you sacrifice (exile?) an artifact.
:symtap:: Add to your mana pool.
:symu::symb:, :symtap:: Return target artifact card from your graveyard to your hand.
Academy Ruins
I think I'd be fine with this replacing Academy Ruins if the cost was changed to 2UB. It's essentially "2UB, T: Draw a card." which is powerful. I'd like it to be an artifact land so our opponent can interact with it.
Black Rare
Mortality Snap Sorcery {R} Each player sacrifices all tokens and all creatures with counters on it.
*Doombringer*
Yawning Abyss Sorcery (R) All creatures get -X/-X until end of turn, where X is equal to the number of cards in your graveyard. Flashback *Rudyard*
Maculate Craftsman :3mana::symb::symb:
Artifact Creature - Horror (R)
At the beginning of your upkeep, each player
discards a card. Then, each player who discarded
an artifact card this way draws a card. A brilliant and ruthless mind, contained in a
body not different from its own creations.
5/4
*Vertain*
I like the "artifacts in graveyard" angle we have going, so I'd like Yawning Abyss the best if it cared about artifacts. Could probably lower the flashback cost to 5BB if that were the case.
Common Black Removal Spell
Drag Enchantment - Aura [C]
Enchant creature Enchanted creature gets -1/-1 for each artifact card in your graveyard. (Maybe all cards in all graveyards would be betterer?) *Rudyard*
Bury Instant [C] Target creature gets -1/-1 until end of turn for each artifact card in your graveyard.
*Svennihilator*
Burial
Sorcery [C]
Target creature gets -1/-1 until end of turn for each card in your graveyard.
*Eventide Sojourner*
I prefer Bury here because I'd like to try and stay on theme with "black cares about artifacts in graveyard".
Uncommon Black Removal Spell
Scrap or Die Instant {C} Each player sacrifices an artifact or creature. Flashback
*Doomfish*
Underficer's Edict :2mana::symb:
Instant [U]
Each opponent sacrifices a creature.
Flashback :6mana::symb:
*Svennihilator*
I like Underficer's Edict. I think it needs to be instant-speed but I don't think we need to push this effect to the point where it needs a double black cost.
After these we need two common blue cards, an uncommon blue card and a common black card. When we cut salvage we lost both a common repeatable mill effect and an uncommon one. If we still want that to be a theme we need some repeatable common and uncommon effects.
Eventide Sojourner had some ideas a page back that nobody has really commented on yet and as did I.
By the end of the night I'll be compiling all the suggested cards and their variations into this post. If you want to give thoughts, now would be the time to do so.
the deck seems to being having a slight identity crisis
Why are so many cards being added or changed in the set doc without discussion? This is getting out of control. I was carefully picking through cards last round and adding the ones that worked. We can't just add every idea we have and hope it all fits together.
Why has "+1/+0 for each artifact card in your graveyard" been keyworded? Scavenge is already a keyword even.
It's my job to make sure we end up with a cohesive final product. Please submit cards here and we can add to the set skeleton when we've agreed on things.
Wailing Drake Replacement Artifact Creature - Human Rogue (Drake!?) [U] When Wailing Drake Replacement enters the battlefield, each player puts the top five cards of his or her library into his or her graveyard. Wailing Drake Replacement gets +1/+0 for each artifact card in your graveyard. 2/2 *Svennihilator*
Filtersmith Artifact Creature - Human Artificer (U) Whenever an artifact enters the battlefield under your control, you may draw a card. If you do, discard a card. 1/2 *Rudyard*
Quicksilver Statue Artifact Creature - Shapeshifter [R] You may have Quicksilver Statue enter the battlefield as a copy of any creature on the battlefield or any creature card in any graveyard, except it's an artifact in addition to its other types. 0/0 *Rudyard*
Scrap or Die Instant {C} Each player sacrifices an artifact or creature. Flashback
*Doomfish*
or Underficer's Edict :2mana::symb:
Instant [U]
Each opponent sacrifices a creature.
Flashback :6mana::symb:
Bury Instant [U] Target creature gets -X/-X until end of turn, where X is the number of artifact cards in your graveyard.
*Svennihilator*
alternatively: Drag Enchantment - Aura [U]
Enchant creature Enchanted creature gets -X/-X, where X is the number of artifact cards in your graveyard. (Maybe all cards in all graveyards would be betterer?) *Rudyard*
Mortality Snap Sorcery {R} Each player sacrifices all tokens and all creatures with counters on it.
*Doombringer*
suggested alternative: Yawning Abyss Sorcery (R) All creatures get -X/-X until end of turn, where X is equal to the number of cards in your graveyard. Flashback *Rudyard*
Steelweave Barrier Artifact Creature - Wall {C} , Return another artifact you control to your hand: Steelweave Barrier gains protection from nonartifact creatures until end of turn. 0/4
*Doombringer*
Also is everyone ok with changing Wayfarer's Bauble with Prophetic Prism? This will work well with both Esperzoa and Steelweave Barrier while filling the same mana fixing role.
I think we could get away with going one and one. Bauble ramps, prism fixes. I like the variety.
I think Mortality Snap might be too good. It's practically Plague Wind against the other deck. I liked Aether Snap because it did something tangible and relevant but wasn't too overpowering at it's job.
The update to Vizcon looks good.
About the sacrifice: Scrap or Die :symb::symb:
Instant {C}
Each player sacrifices an artifact or creature.
Flashback :5mana::symb:
Could this just be Chainer's Edict? The name is ambiguous enough that it doesn't have to be about Chainer, but rather some weird artifact called a "Chainer". I just don't like how it's black artifact destruction if they or we don't have a creature.
Maybe just a 3 mana instant-speed variant:
Underficer's Edict2B
Instant [U]
Each opponent sacrifices a creature.
Flashback 6B
Alright, let's get this ball rolling. I think I'm the only holdout on Salvage, so I'll take one for the team and say we should get rid of it. I don't think Vizcon should change and I don't think the ability should be un-keyworded. It's hard to word his abilities without Salvage being a keyword given the space.
I really think we should keep most of the mill symmetrical and aim to have a few cards like Increasing Confusion that turn it into a win condition. Making the mill targeted is only ever going to give the illusion of choice. We're almost always going to be milling ourselves and then cards like Increasing Confusion just look weird when we've been milling ourselves the whole game to turn our deck on. Making all the mill target just splits our avenues of attack, like having infect and normal creatures in the same deck. I think Mind-Numbing Miasma, Underfice Bauble and Whetstone should stay symmetrical and we fill the holes created by removing Scrapyard Savant and Wailing Drake with targeted mill.
If we go in this direction we'd be removing:
Portable Hole
Scrayard Savant
Wailing Drake
Magnetic Mage
Relentless Replica
Cylinder of Plagues
Vectis Unhallowed
Ironfang Vampire
Scrapflesh Imp
I think Magnetic Mage and Scrapflesh Imp are still cards without the Salvage, so I recommend keeping them around. It's been brought up that Maculate Craftsman is too weird, so we probably need a black rare as well. This leaves two blue commons, one blue uncommon, one blue rare, two black commons, one black uncommon and one black rare that need to be filled. Also, now that we're past the first round and have a skeleton to work with we can probably shift around the numbers on colors. We don't have to be limited to a straight 50/50 split on blue and black or by the number of multicolored cards or artifacts.
I think if we're going to try and turn the deck into a Salvage Slasher deck, having two copies of the namesake card for a bit more consistency is a good idea. I'll submit some cards dedicated to the theme:
Wailing Drake Replacement3UB
Artifact Creature - Human Rogue (Drake!?) [U]
When Wailing Drake Replacement enters the battlefield, each player puts the top five cards of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
Wailing Drake Replacement gets +1/+0 for each artifact card in your graveyard.
2/2
BuryB
Instant [U]
Target creature gets -X/-X until end of turn, where X is the number of artifact cards in your graveyard.
My last thought to bring forward is to possibly cut Stagnation and replace Maculate Craftsman with Aether Snap. They have a bunch of counters floating around and it's a difficult thing for us to answer. They also have a few tokens here and there. Aether Snap would serve as a powerful utility card with a chance of not being that great which adds some diversity to play. We also need an effect that makes the opponent sacrifice a creature somewhere in the deck. They have a lot of protection/hexproof/bestow, so preferably something instant-speed.
I would like your Protean Slime much better, Rudyard, if there wasn't bounce in the opposing deck. I wanted it to be a good answer to removal. Maybe: "When Protean Slime leaves the battlefield, that stuff happens."?
Or even:
Protean Slime 1GG
Creature - Ooze [R]
Heroic - Whenever Protean Slime becomes the target of a spell you control, put a +1/+1 counter on it, then put an X/X green Ooze creature token onto the battlefield, where X is the number of +1/+1 counters on Protean Slime.
1/1
I also agree that Rebound is sweet and should stay, just in low amounts to not overshadow the major themes.
While Whitemane Tiger works with Bestow, it's a pretty big nombo when you have to bounce your heroic dude that's been building up +1/+1 counters. I don't think the +1/+1 counters need to be a huge theme or anything, I just think the combat tricks work a bit better when they are doing something permanent. I think the best way to answer muddling up the themes is to remove anything that currently cares about +1/+1 counters on other cards.
I have some rather bold thoughts on directions to take this take in, so bare with me while I elaborate.
These decks don't hate eachother yet. They don't have a reason to fight. They don't have a reason to be dual decks together. What if instead of "Random Heroic Keyword Guy versus Random Graveyard Artifact Guy" it became "Cares About Enchantments Deck versus Cares About Artifacts Deck". Enchantments and Artifacts both support different philosophies. Enchantments come across as much more natural uses of mana which serves as a good conflict for our respective Legends. I'm not suggesting changing the Legend because he still works very well in a deck full of them.
This would mean more Bestow and less Rebound. Bestow is the bridge between Enchantments and Heroic, where Rebound only serves Heroic. More Bestow also deals with the creature count problem. Perfecting the ratio of creatures to enchantments becomes a much easier task when a percentage of them are both. I'd like to see more cards that push themes, preferably while giving us more creatures. Cards like:
*Replacing Nature's Bounty*
Heroic Anthem 2GW
Enchantment [R]
When ~ enters the battlefield, put a 1/1 green and white Spirit creature token onto the battlefield.
Creatures you control get +1/+1.
*Replacing Hydra of Immortality*
2W
Enchantment Creature - Spirit [U]
Bestow 4W
~ and enchanted creature get +X/+X, where X is the number of enchantments you control.
0/0
XW
Sorcery [U]
Search your library for an Aura card with converted mana cost X and put it onto the battlefield attached to target permanent it could enchant. Then shuffle your library.
W
Enchantment Creature - Spirit [C]
Flash
Bestow 2W
Enchanted creature gets +1/+1.
1/1
Cards that I would like to see changed immediately are:
Hero's Sacrifice - This could just as easily give +1/+1 and not die. I understand that it's flavorful, but it's just a really weird fog + giant growth. This card should also definitely be uncommon.
Aura of Awe - It should just be: "When Aura of Awe enters the battlefield, exile target creature until Aura of Awe leaves the battlefield.". Again, I understand the flavor but I really dislike when flavor trumps a clean and simple design. I mean, why can't the opposing creature just be in awe of the aura?
Crusader for the Lost - I'd like to see this changed to more of a bridge card between heroic and auras. "Whenever you cast a spell that targets Crusader for the Lost, you may return target Aura card from your graveyard to the battlefield attached to target permanent it could enchant.". If so, the name should probably be changed as well.
Enduring Resolve - I'd rather this cost G and put a +1/+1 counter on the creature. I think the name would resonate with the card more if this were the case. It would also be a good way to axe Travel Preparations.
Possibility Elemental - The name sounds too blue. I suggest "Protean" instead of "Possibility" as a replacement name if were bent on keeping the card as is. I'm also not a huge fan of "Akroma Syndrome" cards. Perhaps:
Protean Slime 1GG
Creature - Ooze
Heroic - Whenever Protean Slime becomes the target of a spell you control, put a +1/+1 counter on it.
Remove X +1/+1 counters from Protean Slime: Put an X/X green Ooze creature token onto the battlefield.
1/1
Supposedly this deck has a real weakness to spot removal, so here's a guy who's quite good against it. I really like how this interacts with the +1/+1 counters cards like Thrive, Triumphant Strike or my proposed Enduring Resolve. It's a cool card that creates a little sub-game while not being absurd at doing so.
Savage Insight - I don't think this deck needs a "draw X" and should instead focus it's advantage on creature tokens and Bestow. I'm fine with Keen Nymph beause it's a steady gain that fits the deck's themes. Also, there are a bunch of GG cards here and other tough mana costs for an aggressive deck to reliably pull off.
Superiority - Again, "Akroma Syndrome". A lot of the creatures in the Vizcon deck only have a few points of toughness, so deathtouch is out of place. I'd much prefer this as:
Superiority GW
Instant [U]
Put a +1/+1 counter on target creature. It gains hexproof and indestructible until end of turn.
Hydra of Immortality - It's been said twice that the card doesn't really fit into the deck.
I have about a thousand more ideas if any of this goes over well with anyone.
Set
First of all, the second round started on page five meaning we've had exactly the same amount of discussion as the first round. There was plenty. Second of all, yes the decision has to be made, but not by you. Like in the first round, I compiled everything together about an hour before the due date so that everyone who wanted to say something had the chance to.
I don't like how Salvage is gone but it's a group project so I got over it. Moss didn't want Artifact lands but enough other people did. I'm sure everyone has at least something they don't like about the set but that's the nature of things. It doesn't fall on you to change cards and add your own to the set when people have been discussing and working to get to this point. Without Salvage we needed an artifact mechanic of some sort otherwise there's no reason any of our cards are artifacts. It just ended up that caring about artifacts in the graveyard was the way we went.
The rest of your post is a mess. I don't actually know what you're arguing or how to comment.
Desolate Lighthouse Grim Backwoods
It's reaaaaaaally good to tack "draw a card" on a land as an activated ability.
Scrap or Die versus Underficer's Edict
Two blue commons, a blue rare and a black common. Keep in mind that Chain Forger is still being talked about. It's an interesting card and we can find room.
"Whenever you cast an artifact spell, draw two cards." isn't even close to printable at 2 mana. Chain Forger needs some serious work. Maybe:
Chain Forger 1UB
Artifact Creature - Human Wizard [U]
Whenever an artifact enters or leaves the battlefield, target player puts the top card of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
2/3
Or maybe just a mono blue version that only triggers on entering?
I'd prefer a clone for the blue rare and Vizcon's Void be moved to uncommon.
I think Vectis Unhallowed might be a bit too good. Maybe it could gain first strike when you sac an artifact? That way they can still get him with removal at least.
While I understand what Steelweave Barrier is trying to do, to me it comes off as clunky and long-winded for a common. I'm trying to come up with something similiar but I have nothing. Maybe a flash creature that gives you the option to return an artifact to your hand, similar to Moss's:
Escape Thopter 3U
Artifact Creature - Thopter [C]
Flash
Flying
When Escape Thopter enters the battlefield, you may return another artifact you control to your hand.
2/2
What about a Howling Mine variant that's better for us instead of Mary Sue Looter?
1U
Artifact [U]
At the beginning of each player's upkeep, that player draws a card, then discards a card.
Or maybe just a simple version:
2U
Artifact Creature - Human Wizard [C]
U, T: Each player draws a card, then discards a card.
1/3
Perhaps we could move Scrapflesh Imp down to 2B and lower it to a 1/1. If we do, what about a hasty version of Salvage Slasher to round things off:
Reckless Scavenger 3B
Artifact Creature - Human Rogue [C]
Haste
Reckless Scavenger gets +1/+0 for each artifact card in your graveyard.
1/1
Rare Land
Legendary (Artifact?) Land {R}
Underfice Repository enters the battlefield tapped unless you sacrifice (exile?) an artifact.
:symtap:: Add
:symu::symb:, :symtap:: Return target artifact card from your graveyard to your hand.
Academy Ruins
I think I'd be fine with this replacing Academy Ruins if the cost was changed to 2UB. It's essentially "2UB, T: Draw a card." which is powerful. I'd like it to be an artifact land so our opponent can interact with it.
Black Rare
Sorcery {R}
Each player sacrifices all tokens and all creatures with counters on it.
*Doombringer*
Yawning Abyss
Sorcery (R)
All creatures get -X/-X until end of turn, where X is equal to the number of cards in your graveyard.
Flashback
*Rudyard*
Maculate Craftsman :3mana::symb::symb:
Artifact Creature - Horror (R)
At the beginning of your upkeep, each player
discards a card. Then, each player who discarded
an artifact card this way draws a card.
A brilliant and ruthless mind, contained in a
body not different from its own creations.
5/4
*Vertain*
or Aether Snap
I like the "artifacts in graveyard" angle we have going, so I'd like Yawning Abyss the best if it cared about artifacts. Could probably lower the flashback cost to 5BB if that were the case.
Common Black Removal Spell
Drag
Enchantment - Aura [C]
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature gets -1/-1 for each artifact card in your graveyard. (Maybe all cards in all graveyards would be betterer?)
*Rudyard*
Bury
Instant [C]
Target creature gets -1/-1 until end of turn for each artifact card in your graveyard.
*Svennihilator*
Burial
Sorcery [C]
Target creature gets -1/-1 until end of turn for each card in your graveyard.
*Eventide Sojourner*
I prefer Bury here because I'd like to try and stay on theme with "black cares about artifacts in graveyard".
Uncommon Black Removal Spell
Instant {C}
Each player sacrifices an artifact or creature.
Flashback
*Doomfish*
Underficer's Edict :2mana::symb:
Instant [U]
Each opponent sacrifices a creature.
Flashback :6mana::symb:
*Svennihilator*
or Chainer's Edict
or Far/Away
I like Underficer's Edict. I think it needs to be instant-speed but I don't think we need to push this effect to the point where it needs a double black cost.
After these we need two common blue cards, an uncommon blue card and a common black card. When we cut salvage we lost both a common repeatable mill effect and an uncommon one. If we still want that to be a theme we need some repeatable common and uncommon effects.
Eventide Sojourner had some ideas a page back that nobody has really commented on yet and as did I.
Why has "+1/+0 for each artifact card in your graveyard" been keyworded? Scavenge is already a keyword even.
It's my job to make sure we end up with a cohesive final product. Please submit cards here and we can add to the set skeleton when we've agreed on things.
Artifact Creature - Human Rogue (Drake!?) [U]
When Wailing Drake Replacement enters the battlefield, each player puts the top five cards of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
Wailing Drake Replacement gets +1/+0 for each artifact card in your graveyard.
2/2
*Svennihilator*
Artifact Creature - Human Artificer (U)
Whenever an artifact enters the battlefield under your control, you may draw a card. If you do, discard a card.
1/2
*Rudyard*
Artifact Creature - Shapeshifter [R]
You may have Quicksilver Statue enter the battlefield as a copy of any creature on the battlefield or any creature card in any graveyard, except it's an artifact in addition to its other types.
0/0
*Rudyard*
Instant {C}
Each player sacrifices an artifact or creature.
Flashback
*Doomfish*
or Chainer's Edict
or
Underficer's Edict :2mana::symb:
Instant [U]
Each opponent sacrifices a creature.
Flashback :6mana::symb:
Instant [U]
Target creature gets -X/-X until end of turn, where X is the number of artifact cards in your graveyard.
*Svennihilator*
alternatively:
Drag
Enchantment - Aura [U]
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature gets -X/-X, where X is the number of artifact cards in your graveyard. (Maybe all cards in all graveyards would be betterer?)
*Rudyard*
Sorcery {R}
Each player sacrifices all tokens and all creatures with counters on it.
*Doombringer*
suggested alternative:
Yawning Abyss
Sorcery (R)
All creatures get -X/-X until end of turn, where X is equal to the number of cards in your graveyard.
Flashback
*Rudyard*
or Aether Snap
Artifact Creature - Wall {C}
0/4
*Doombringer*
or an artifact version of Fogbank? -Rudyard
I think Mortality Snap might be too good. It's practically Plague Wind against the other deck. I liked Aether Snap because it did something tangible and relevant but wasn't too overpowering at it's job.
The update to Vizcon looks good.
Could this just be Chainer's Edict? The name is ambiguous enough that it doesn't have to be about Chainer, but rather some weird artifact called a "Chainer". I just don't like how it's black artifact destruction if they or we don't have a creature.
Maybe just a 3 mana instant-speed variant:
Underficer's Edict 2B
Instant [U]
Each opponent sacrifices a creature.
Flashback 6B
I really think we should keep most of the mill symmetrical and aim to have a few cards like Increasing Confusion that turn it into a win condition. Making the mill targeted is only ever going to give the illusion of choice. We're almost always going to be milling ourselves and then cards like Increasing Confusion just look weird when we've been milling ourselves the whole game to turn our deck on. Making all the mill target just splits our avenues of attack, like having infect and normal creatures in the same deck. I think Mind-Numbing Miasma, Underfice Bauble and Whetstone should stay symmetrical and we fill the holes created by removing Scrapyard Savant and Wailing Drake with targeted mill.
If we go in this direction we'd be removing:
Portable Hole
Scrayard Savant
Wailing Drake
Magnetic Mage
Relentless Replica
Cylinder of Plagues
Vectis Unhallowed
Ironfang Vampire
Scrapflesh Imp
I think Magnetic Mage and Scrapflesh Imp are still cards without the Salvage, so I recommend keeping them around. It's been brought up that Maculate Craftsman is too weird, so we probably need a black rare as well. This leaves two blue commons, one blue uncommon, one blue rare, two black commons, one black uncommon and one black rare that need to be filled. Also, now that we're past the first round and have a skeleton to work with we can probably shift around the numbers on colors. We don't have to be limited to a straight 50/50 split on blue and black or by the number of multicolored cards or artifacts.
I think if we're going to try and turn the deck into a Salvage Slasher deck, having two copies of the namesake card for a bit more consistency is a good idea. I'll submit some cards dedicated to the theme:
Wailing Drake Replacement 3UB
Artifact Creature - Human Rogue (Drake!?) [U]
When Wailing Drake Replacement enters the battlefield, each player puts the top five cards of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
Wailing Drake Replacement gets +1/+0 for each artifact card in your graveyard.
2/2
Bury B
Instant [U]
Target creature gets -X/-X until end of turn, where X is the number of artifact cards in your graveyard.
My last thought to bring forward is to possibly cut Stagnation and replace Maculate Craftsman with Aether Snap. They have a bunch of counters floating around and it's a difficult thing for us to answer. They also have a few tokens here and there. Aether Snap would serve as a powerful utility card with a chance of not being that great which adds some diversity to play. We also need an effect that makes the opponent sacrifice a creature somewhere in the deck. They have a lot of protection/hexproof/bestow, so preferably something instant-speed.