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  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    Seems like a very long stretch. Even people playing new Karns have pretty much settled on playing just 1.

    I like the card a ton (and the art is slick as hell) and I want to build around it alongside Karn really bad, but I don't think U Tron is the shell. The tron lands seem mostly pointless if your goal is to plus him into the ult anyway and you REALLY want to curve out Karn -> Tezz with him which will not happen often and means tapping out for two turns. I like new Karn a ton because I can just natural tron into him t3 (which is awesome with a talisman out for U mana/counter backup) and late-game I am not tapping down my U sources to drop a must-answer walker.

    I mean, I just like Tezzeret's style so I'm gonna grab one and jam it in there for funsies, but just like Jace I think he busts hard for us.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    He's fantastic if he's built around a little like you said, but he is by no means necessary. Depends what you want in that 4-drop slot. New Karn ends the game if he goes unchecked against midrange and control, but in some metas something like Thought-Knot Seer would be much more useful. Personally, I love the 3-rock, 1-2 New Karn builds and I'm gonna keep playing him but for example my last FNM was Burn, Bogles, Burn, Ad Nauseum, Drop Rnd 5 and I wished he was literally any other card in those matchups.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    I prefer not to play them at all because I'm liking the artifact heavy ramp/Karn strategy atm, BUT when I was playing TKS it felt great against Burn if you see a lot of it. Strips a burn spell and is a thicc enough body to absorb all their attackers. In order to remove it they have to point burn at it for a turn. As others said it's also good against combo and forces an answer from Control to potentially clear a path for your bigger things. Only matchup I don't like it in is the Hollow One/Affinity/Elves type decks that barf out their hand super fast. It's definitely a powerful and diverse card and has a place in the 75 if you're not scared of getting cut off of casting it (Blood Moon went from being a minor annoyance to a real problem when I main-decked 4 TKS).

    I'd vote 1 maindeck and some more in the board if you really like it.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    https://www.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/8qadma/m19_jugement_infernal/

    Tells Wurmcoil Engine to go to hell, but I don't think it will see much play. Of note in only hits colorless creatures so it doesn't hit other important pieces like walkers, O-stones, Mindslaver, etc.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    Thanks for the great info @Barrin. Love to see that winrate vs Mardu Pyro, it is probably the #1 most played deck at my shop outside of Burn.

    I've been keeping a spreadsheet with all my matchup info as well (currently on Shok's last posted 5-0 list) and hope to get it out soon. At only 10 leagues I just don't feel like it's enough data and my winrate with it is only 54% atm so I'm kind of burned out.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    Mindslaver is our inevitability against Midrange and Control and if you're able to stay alive a Slaver without the lock against Combo usually ends the game by disrupting them. People are scared of it too and spend resources to keep it at bay. It's only a liability against aggro, in which case just board it out for more removal and jam in some more Wurmcoils. I think it's 100% insane to not play at least one (I do 1 main/1 side) and I haven't seen anyone REALLY advocate for removing them entirely.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    It's not a bad card to use at all, it's just meta dependent. I loved it when shadow was a big deal and keep it sleeved up in my maybeboard. There's a lot of matchups where it's just not impactful though so I prefer to start with it in the board.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    There are some post-board matches where you might cut both so look at it on a case by case basis. Sometimes you have to go down wincons to board in all your removal just to stay alive and Platinum won't cut it in games 2-3 when they board in artifact removal (Destructive Revelry, Kolaghan's). I wouldn't go insane and drop every Wurmcoil/Mindslaver/Angel, but going down 1x Slaver 1x Angel isn't a bad idea. You should still have enough Gearhulks, Sundering Titan, boarded in Wurmcoils, Ugin etc. to finish the job.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    @ BloodyRabbit_01 - Dismember is still great removal and I wonder if the B splash for Damnation is still better than R or W. What sweepers did you have in min d for those colors? Something earlier like Pyroclasm? Probably too off-topic for straight U Tron but it's something I always want to just dabble with and I chicken out before starting a league because the manabase looks so bad with 2 colors.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    @ Jokersrwild - thanks for the continued information about your matchups in leagues. Definitely been high on Aetherspouts and glad it's back in, especially with Gearhulk. It's backbreaking to every single deck I have had trouble with since I started on the deck. I am still skeptical on Karn, but seeing you post specific matchups where he has won you games definitely makes me want to try him out. I am assuming you will continue to keep him at 1x so you don't get clogged up with him (same reasoning for Ugin) but at 4cmc maybe that's not a problem?
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    Man you guys just love jumping on Bloody. Weird I am and probably always will be a "Shok-type" player for most events, but if you've ever tried their list it really is more consistent at pooping on aggro and their card evaluation seems well thought out. Pie is probably my favorite card evaluator in U Tron and he wasn't high on Karn either, you gonna go after him too?

    Keep in mind Shok/joker/Agnara and the like are just really good players, period. Shok/Joker just posted great records with 1x Aetherspouts (now missing in the list but has personally won me more games than any other singleton in the last couple weeks) and I remember Agnara 5-0ing with 1x Jace. Sometimes these 1-of card choices pan out over time or are great in specific metas but they're often not going to make-or-break your deck, especially when not fetchable (praise be to Ugin, the GOAT). The real "innovation" (not really new, because tons of lists used to run 3+) are the 3 Talismans to power things out. On paper it feels too slow, but lately I have been able to take some beats on T2/T3 and then make a huge game-swinging T4/T5. Stony Silence is nowhere to be seen in my shop so I'm on that plan until it comes back in real numbers.

    I went ahead and grabbed 1x baby Karn just in case because I like that it can grind out games when people go after my tron pieces. I have seen him take over games FAST if left unchecked. Guy at my shop has whooped me on Affinity two weeks in a row solely because of Karn and the new angle of attack he gives them. Maybe he turns out to work for us too and gives us a reason to plop down some maps instead of pitching to Thirst.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    I really do dig Oblivion Sower as a fun-of. I don't think it's actually good, but it really is a reasonable body. Just comes down too late against the one deck you really care about (G Tron).

    Jokers where you at bb? Saw you put up another 5-0 with a stock-ish list. Do you remember your match-ups? Being able to rip off multiple 5-0 finishes is definitely impressive with the amount of Humans and Hollow One around so I'm wondering how you did it or if it's just volume. Did Damping Sphere do any work for you?
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    Quote from topkyle ยป
    Shok posted two 5-0 leagues yesterday with meta-calls Aetherspouts and Aetherize. With Boggles getting really popular I think it's nice to have a mass bounce spell mainboard and it also happens to be great against Affinity and Infect which are popular at my LGS so I'm gonna give it a try.

    https://www.twitch.tv/kharniverous/videos/all

    Those looking for the list:

    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    Shok posted two 5-0 leagues yesterday with meta-calls Aetherspouts and Aetherize. With Boggles getting really popular I think it's nice to have a mass bounce spell mainboard and it also happens to be great against Affinity and Infect which are popular at my LGS so I'm gonna give it a try.

    https://www.twitch.tv/kharniverous/videos/all
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    My land situation seemed fine and I didn't notice the lack of a 4th map, but there is only so much you can infer from 7 rounds of play. It's the first card I look at siding out in a lot of matchups so starting at 3 was kind of a non-issue for me although I like 4 to start since it keeps the artifact count up.

    I was surprised how much I enjoyed Supreme Will, but I don't know about 4x at the expense of TfK. My first instinct is to try out a 3/3 split and see where that takes me.

    2x Snapcaster seemed fine. I guess you look at what it's taking the place of. Compared to lists I usually run let's say that is Trinket Mage. This list is not running mainboard Chalice and just naturally finds Ballista since that is at 3x so Snapcaster is just better. I kind of wish 1 of the Snaps was an Obstructionist though. The flying is sometimes relevant.

    3x Dismember was critical in my wins. Maybe 3x is too many, but I dunno...felt fine. The 4 life doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things when that Hierarch or Devoted Druid needs to die immediately. I was happy with them. My gripe was not having things in the sideboard to replace them with in dead matchups. Dispel and Negate seem narrow when I think of a broad meta, but I sure wish I had them in the board on Saturday. 7 targeted removal in the 75 just nullified CoCO + Zoo but was useless against Scapeshift. I guess that's just a U Tron problem. It's hard to plan for everything. 4x Chalice in the board was a similar problem. When you want them you REALLY want them and when you don't you wish they were anything else. I'm really down on them atm.

    Overall, I like the shell and definitely appreciate it being shared with us. I think my favorite aspect is the multiple Ballista and River of Tears. Everything I would try and change is just tweaking numbers to see how it feels. I'll start with 3/3 Supreme/Thirst split, dropping a land to 24 (and 60 cards overall), going back to 4x Map and dropping either 1x Remand or Dismember. Probably toy around with 1x Nimble Obstructionist in the main.
    Posted in: Control
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