CharonsObol: So your're saying that arbiter is outclassed in decks like G/W and possibly B/W (Bob)(Sculler) but is likely still a go to in Mono-White and I would assume R/W because of the land hate.
I feel like Sunlance could be a good possibility considering that it works against so many other MU besides infect given that it works well against other overaggressive decks like suicide blue/zoo, and fast delver decks with not enough creatures.
This is more of a pet card of mine but Valorous Stance could work as well.
Your probably right about the UU casting cost being a problem, but I think Blade Splicer would be a great target, not to mention than I would never run a full playset. I could see a deck with 4 splicer, and like 2 finks running this card at about a 2 of The effect seems really power especially in DnT.
Could Elder Deep-Fiend be good in a blue white build? Tapping down four permanents seems very good against really and deck in modern right now effectively sacking a creature to tap all of their lands and the 5/6 body is nice as well.
@SpiderSpace
I would think that burn is a good enough MU to not worry about loss of life since we are a deck that is fast enough with low CMC creatures to stabilized more efficiently than other aggro decks.
I even considered running Horizon Canopy in a mono white list before taking it our for Sea Gate Wreckage. The Card advantage in the late game which DnT often gets to against everything from Control to Jund can turn what would normally be a dead draw into a viable card. In addition life doesn't Really matter against most combo decks meaning that fact that you won't go into the late-game mitigated.
If I was playing GW I would run 4, in my opinion it helps more Match-ups than it hurts.
I think we need to help the Matchups like Jund/Bant Eldrazi/Control more than we need to help match-ups like Burn/Affinity
What do you guys think of Spreading Seas in the main-board for Blue white DnT, and is it worth it to go with 1-3 Vendilion Clique for hand disruption or a lighter blue splash possibly including tech edge to have as much possible land hate.
I agree with Stabil0 Sea Gate Wreckage can help immensely in the late game because having cards in hand is rare. I personally play it and have had success with the card. Although Mutavault is great if you run a more beat down style mono-white.
I've thought about main/side-boarding more removal especially in mono white. I think that Dismember or even Journey to Nowhereis a better option because with more removal you can afford to hit cards like Bob anyway and Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet anyway, and in the late game pay no life to do so. It may not matter much in most match-ups but it could be advantageous against certain decks like burn.
If not for Bob and Kalitas I would agree with Vendetta but I believe we have access to better options.
I played Cloudshift for a while in a mono white variant mostly to get the 3/3 token off of Splicer, and I eventually cut it. Essence Flux is much better, as far as the utility it gains in a U/W deck versus the mono white. I would try it out because I think it has the potential to be a very good card in the right deck and spirit tribal may very well be it.
I didn't like Mangara too much. I can see its value in a slower metagame and would probably be my choice if it was filled more with control options. But right now, my meta is just more and more linear aggro. And getting a two for zero with Assassin has me smiling sometimes. Kill one, resto/flick, comes back, kill another. And I also like how people constantly try to play around it. I had a game where a guy had 2 7/8 goyfs and wouldn't attack just because the Assassin was out, and waited for an answer to the assassin before he did anything. I'll keep testing and see where it goes.
If your meta is filled with aggressive decks then more removal in the form of Journey to Nowhere and possibly Dismember could be an option. I see why you don't play Mangara, it's more potent/versatile but unless you flash it the effect is only used once whereas Assain can repeat the effect.
I've found the key difference between Restoration Angel and Thought-Knot Seer is that Seer in some cases is a much worse topdeck. If an opponent has no cards in hard he's a 4/4 for 4 with a large downside. Normally restoration angel at her worse ever without flashing anything is still better because if/when your opponent removes her they don't get extra advantage of drawing a card, and the flying helps to.
This has been my personal experience from trying to run him in a mono white deck, and a believe the only possible place for him is sideboard against combo.
@Underused Cards: I would replace Royal Assassin with Mangara of Corondor if you want to run a card like that.
These are the advantages it has over Royal Assassin.
- It can hit tapped creatures
- Exiles
- can hit walkers
- can hit lands (to further cripple a mana base)
- Reliable mana
Also if your playing the card I agree that the synergy with resto needs to be there, and that it should be a 2 of.
Interesting discussion on Serra Avenger, I originally abandoned it because I thought it was inconsistent but I think I'll try it again.
Jendo87: Isn't Intrepid Hero a strictly worse version of Mangara of Corondor and no one seems to play it. After testing it was in part good because of the land/other permanent destruction(or rather exiling) and has synergy with Resto.
That being said I see how Loyal Sentry is helpful. As far as Big Game Hunter the 2 black mana may make it hard to play kind of like clique in U/W.
As far as not playing with arbiter I would think that any deck doing so would at least by a 2 color if not 3 color deck. With the availability of as many fetch-lands as needed thinks like Bant D&T would we very successful. The problem is that as far as I can see arbiter is in a way the backbone of the hate package along with Thalia. If I'm cutting him, it means that cards like Vendilion Clique and other hard to reach cards become more available, therefore I'd play them, not stick with the same general list.
This is more of a pet card of mine but Valorous Stance could work as well.
I would think that burn is a good enough MU to not worry about loss of life since we are a deck that is fast enough with low CMC creatures to stabilized more efficiently than other aggro decks.
I even considered running Horizon Canopy in a mono white list before taking it our for Sea Gate Wreckage. The Card advantage in the late game which DnT often gets to against everything from Control to Jund can turn what would normally be a dead draw into a viable card. In addition life doesn't Really matter against most combo decks meaning that fact that you won't go into the late-game mitigated.
If I was playing GW I would run 4, in my opinion it helps more Match-ups than it hurts.
I think we need to help the Matchups like Jund/Bant Eldrazi/Control more than we need to help match-ups like Burn/Affinity
http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=13586&writer=Craig Wescoe&articledate=10-28-2016&utm_source=tcg-email&utm_medium=tcg-email&utm_term=&utm_content=magic&utm_campaign=tcg-email-11-03-2016-commander-states-decklists
Sorry I don't know how to shorten links.
Thoughts?
Sprite did a lot more work than I thought it would. Also Phyrexian Revoker is great against a lot of rouge decks.
If not for Bob and Kalitas I would agree with Vendetta but I believe we have access to better options.
If your meta is filled with aggressive decks then more removal in the form of Journey to Nowhere and possibly Dismember could be an option. I see why you don't play Mangara, it's more potent/versatile but unless you flash it the effect is only used once whereas Assain can repeat the effect.
This has been my personal experience from trying to run him in a mono white deck, and a believe the only possible place for him is sideboard against combo.
These are the advantages it has over Royal Assassin.
- It can hit tapped creatures
- Exiles
- can hit walkers
- can hit lands (to further cripple a mana base)
- Reliable mana
Also if your playing the card I agree that the synergy with resto needs to be there, and that it should be a 2 of.
Jendo87: Isn't Intrepid Hero a strictly worse version of Mangara of Corondor and no one seems to play it. After testing it was in part good because of the land/other permanent destruction(or rather exiling) and has synergy with Resto.
That being said I see how Loyal Sentry is helpful. As far as Big Game Hunter the 2 black mana may make it hard to play kind of like clique in U/W.
As far as not playing with arbiter I would think that any deck doing so would at least by a 2 color if not 3 color deck. With the availability of as many fetch-lands as needed thinks like Bant D&T would we very successful. The problem is that as far as I can see arbiter is in a way the backbone of the hate package along with Thalia. If I'm cutting him, it means that cards like Vendilion Clique and other hard to reach cards become more available, therefore I'd play them, not stick with the same general list.