The best parts of Cast Out is that you can cycle it for a single white and it's abrupt proof but those aren't enough to get me to swap over without some serious testing done. 4 mana is just a lot for an Oblivion Ring effect.
I'm torn on Ancestral, on one hand if you're not suspending one on turn one or two it's a feel bad draw against a fair number of matchups, on the other hand in any fair game it's straight gas for most of the game. The list I'm playing around with has 4 AV, 4 Serum, 3 Spreading Seas, and 2 Jace AoT, its a bunch of draw. Mainly doing this to see how low the land count can go and still feel like I can hit land drops for the first 6+ turns and it works out pretty well, 23 land is pretty reasonable here, althought I still prefer 24.
I think AV is a fine card, I wouldn't say it's a requirement to playing UW control by any stretch but depending on your build and preferred way to play, can be very potent.
I'm a fan of Gideon AoZ as well, I play two in my UW Stoneblade Legacy deck and he's a straight house against any fair decks, I have reservations about modern though. Modern has so much reach that is played it's hard to spend several turns just producing tokens without him just getting burned out. I'm also not a big fan of Deprive in a dedicated control list. Control wants two things in life, mana and cards, playing 4 ways to reduce one of the things we need the most seems bad to me. I can understand one, MAYBE two, but more than that you're just hurting yourself IMO.
I think starting with any new card at 4 of is probably the what you want to do, I'd just stay away from the cycling lands since they ONLY come into play tapped.
My thing is we have a shell that is decent, being methodical about new cards is the best way to determine if they're good enough or better than options. Jamming a ton of new things, to me, isn't the best way to test if cards are good enough. By all means play a compleatly new deck based on trying to take advantage of cycling. But in modern I don't think playing that fair is the way to go.
I wouldn't try jamming all the new cards at once, my recommendation would be to find one card you're interested in and test a "standard shell" and see how it plays. I dont like Irrigated Farmland in our deck since it only comes in tapped, Moorland Haunt seems bad if you're only playing 6 creatures as well.
Cast out is the only card in the list I'm actually interested in trying but with it being 4 mana it seems pretty costly.
I'd say just go with a creature light version, drop the walls and restos and play more instants, theres some lists floating around in the last few pages of the thread that should be a good starting place.
Why not both? I've ran 4 AV with 2 sphinx's before and its a blast. Currently I'd rather just run AV with serum visions to have more incremental and low investment card advantage/selection. I'd say you need 6 mana before casting sphinx becomes an attractive option and by then you can already have resolved one if not two visions depending on your draw.
On a general level there's no hard rule that says you can't play both, play around with builds and play what feels good to you.
So I've only used Porphyry Nodes once in a game and that card is the real deal, I just ordered my playset actually. I saw it used over GP San Antonio and it has some crazy power against decks that want to go wide like Bant knightfall and Abzan company. If I'm not mistaken it goes through hexproof as well since it doesn't target a creature so cards like Etched Champion and any boggle should be hit although I'm not great with rules so I could be totally wrong.
I'm just not big on think twice as a modern card personally, I've tried it a bunch when I played Esper Draw-go and I've tried playing with it in UW and it's just not my card. Being able to trigger Myth Realized is nice but I'd rather have the raw power of fueling up my hand and triggering the Myth once. The way I see it we're playing the standard control game and using Myth as a faster Celestial Colonnade so being able to refuel is huge.
I'd love to run Crucible of Worlds but man that card is so expensive for no reason other than it hasn't been printed in a decade. I've thought about getting some and if I did I'd just bite the bullet and get the masterpiece version since they're not that much more expensive than the original. I normally just hope that 2 Surgical Extraction and the 4 maindeck Ghost Quarter can punish greedy mana decks.
I rarely use D-Sphere to hit creatures, normally it's just the catchall for any on board problem, like resolved aplaneswalker or bitterblossom.
Logic Knot is really just being used due to my dislike of mana leak, it can be iffy early game and I've gone up to 6 fetches before and honestly I still wouldn't be against that just to help fuel them. They can be a non dead draw against big mana decks which is enough of a reason for me to want them over mana leak.
So I've been playing around with Myth Realized a bit in the past few days and I've gotta say it's some sweetness. I'm 5-0 so far beating Amulet Titan, Bant Eldrazi, Jeskai Control, GW Tron, and UW Control. If anyone plays on Xmage and plays Death's Shadow builds, affinity, burn, and Ad Naus I'd love to play some games against them since so far I'd say I'm playing mostly even or favored matchups.
Yeah if that works with AV that's a pretty sweet card. It works with any spell as well so free planeswalkers on curve with permission backup sounds pretty awesome. It's a bit slow and I'm not sure how many matchups we can take a turn off on turn 3 to cast this. Worth trying for sure.
I'd say there's no hard rule on either but personally I'd play Ojutai with Minamo/Blessed Alliance in a full control build and the planeswalkers in a more midrangey build with finks/resto. Reasons being is that in full control you want a hard to kill finisher that you can protect so having more permission and protection to help close out the game is ideal. For the planeswalkers you want a way to be able to protect them on board and being able to force creatures to attack your finks/walls into a Gideon Jura is very strong.
You can throw as many walkers as you'd like, people are starting to go up to two Jace, Architect of Thought in the main and I'd also support that, going a 2/2 split of Gideon and Jace is pretty potent from what I've played and would never be sad to see them more consistently. Keep in mind modern is fast and planeswalkers are slow so just jamming 10 walkers is gonna be hard but I'm sure 5 is doable, perhaps more depending on your meta.
I definitely agree, main boarding dispel sounds like a fun time.
Also looking at the lists from GP San Antonio the one that was on the winning team has some sweet ideas in it including only 23 lands. How much of this is influenced by a more "predictable" GP meta since it was Team unified are we thinking?
The best parts of Cast Out is that you can cycle it for a single white and it's abrupt proof but those aren't enough to get me to swap over without some serious testing done. 4 mana is just a lot for an Oblivion Ring effect.
I think AV is a fine card, I wouldn't say it's a requirement to playing UW control by any stretch but depending on your build and preferred way to play, can be very potent.
Cast out is the only card in the list I'm actually interested in trying but with it being 4 mana it seems pretty costly.
On a general level there's no hard rule that says you can't play both, play around with builds and play what feels good to you.
I'm just not big on think twice as a modern card personally, I've tried it a bunch when I played Esper Draw-go and I've tried playing with it in UW and it's just not my card. Being able to trigger Myth Realized is nice but I'd rather have the raw power of fueling up my hand and triggering the Myth once. The way I see it we're playing the standard control game and using Myth as a faster Celestial Colonnade so being able to refuel is huge.
I'd love to run Crucible of Worlds but man that card is so expensive for no reason other than it hasn't been printed in a decade. I've thought about getting some and if I did I'd just bite the bullet and get the masterpiece version since they're not that much more expensive than the original. I normally just hope that 2 Surgical Extraction and the 4 maindeck Ghost Quarter can punish greedy mana decks.
I rarely use D-Sphere to hit creatures, normally it's just the catchall for any on board problem, like resolved aplaneswalker or bitterblossom.
Logic Knot is really just being used due to my dislike of mana leak, it can be iffy early game and I've gone up to 6 fetches before and honestly I still wouldn't be against that just to help fuel them. They can be a non dead draw against big mana decks which is enough of a reason for me to want them over mana leak.
Here's the list I've been running.
You can throw as many walkers as you'd like, people are starting to go up to two Jace, Architect of Thought in the main and I'd also support that, going a 2/2 split of Gideon and Jace is pretty potent from what I've played and would never be sad to see them more consistently. Keep in mind modern is fast and planeswalkers are slow so just jamming 10 walkers is gonna be hard but I'm sure 5 is doable, perhaps more depending on your meta.
Going into esper for mainboard discard sounds appealing as well
Also looking at the lists from GP San Antonio the one that was on the winning team has some sweet ideas in it including only 23 lands. How much of this is influenced by a more "predictable" GP meta since it was Team unified are we thinking?
Also is there any way to easily import a deck list here without having to actually copy and paste the list and then organize it?