Magic Market Index for Aug 17th, 2018
 
Magic Market Index for Aug 10, 2018
 
Treasure Cruisin' Modern Big Red
  • posted a message on How Much Longer Will Wizards Support Paper Magic?
    Quote from Greyimp »
    To the Op, the destruction of standard started about 3 1/2 years ago now where the design model for standard was intentionally changed from overall card balance to a new fancy 'print cards people want to buy' and nerf counters and kill spells because 'no one likes their fatty countered or removed'. Standard has been falling apart and a dumpster fire the whole time. Thus the bans, the lack of participation, the utterly crappy standard metas we've seen since.

    Thanks Maro and team.

    They still haven't sworn off all this philosophy. It's why we're still seeing the pushed cards and why they still resist ban hammering them. They like to say 'lesson learned' but it looks more like 'lesson interpreted the way we want to'.

    Promos out then in, rotation shortened then walked back, don't play on Friday play when we want you to, 40+ dollar cards, Kaladesh (nuff said), BaB disaster, it's like they're trying to screw themselves but really they're just bumbling while trying to make more money for the Hasbro overlords. Sometimes you have to do things better (the traditional way) to make more money not just push out more product. This is one of those cases.



    I don't think we will be out of the doldrums until after Ravnica rotates out. That is when the new-new-new Standard will fully be here, with sets wholly designed in the new 3-Sets-and-a-Core-Set design philosophy. Until then, we will still be hobbled by WotC's years' long meddling with how Standard works.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on What do people use to repreent The Scarab God tokens
    Put the actual card into game but upside down with some kind of bead on it.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on [GRN] Inspiring Captain (reprint)
    There are a slew of old cards that are standard legal that most people never even realized were standard legal. Like Wing Snare, Victory's Herald, Garruk's Horde, Inspiration, etc. All Standard legal right now.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on How Much Longer Will Wizards Support Paper Magic?
    Quote from R_Lancer »
    Quote from R_Lancer »
    In the end... You either have a physical card you can touch, hold, scrape junk off a grill (Spongebob reference) or a digital card that's only good as long as you keep the account active.

    I had a World of War craft account 10 years ago, I had high level characters and epic weapons too, I had not seen that account for 9 years. On the other hand, I have magic cards since 1996. I had not looked at my cards almost all of 2017 and up to a few weeks ago... and I still have my cards.

    I don't see how any virtual game can beat that!


    But World of Warcraft is still around. If you sign in, you can play with your characters.

    The time when this becomes applicable is when a digital game dies and you lose access to your character.


    Sure if I want to play a monthly fee, and I only have fun with those characters as long as I keep paying the monthly fee...


    Well, you can farm gold and sell it for game time now, so I mean you don't "need" to pay a subscription to play.

    The subscription also pays for a dynamically updated and hot fixed game, which evolves and grows over time. If you never invest in Magic Cards again (the equivalent of not paying for a subscription), then you will only every be able to play with what you have. Eventually, that will get boring (hence the need/desire to pay for more content (i.e. new cards)).



    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on How Much Longer Will Wizards Support Paper Magic?
    Quote from R_Lancer »
    In the end... You either have a physical card you can touch, hold, scrape junk off a grill (Spongebob reference) or a digital card that's only good as long as you keep the account active.

    I had a World of War craft account 10 years ago, I had high level characters and epic weapons too, I had not seen that account for 9 years. On the other hand, I have magic cards since 1996. I had not looked at my cards almost all of 2017 and up to a few weeks ago... and I still have my cards.

    I don't see how any virtual game can beat that!


    But World of Warcraft is still around. If you sign in, you can play with your characters.

    The time when this becomes applicable is when a digital game dies and you lose access to your character.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on Best set for gold cards.
    Ravnica sets are the gold standard.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on [[Official]] Reserved List Discussion
    Step 1: Print cards that are similar in power and effect to all relevant Reserved List cards (like the dual lands). These cannot be functional reprints but WotC can make cards that are on a similar power scale.

    Step 2: Loudly state that WotC will never, ever reprint a Reserved List card ever again.

    Step 3; Ban all Reserved List cards from all formats citing the fact that the Reserved List is a huge detriment to several popular Magic formats, preventing the formats from growing and evolving.

    This is the easiest way to solve this problem. It preserves the secondary market value of all Reserved List cards and it removes any and all impetus that might nudge WotC to changing, altering or eliminating the Reserved List. This also ensures that those with Reserved List cards cannot "double dip" with the Reserved List cards and the newly-printed replacement cards.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on How Much Longer Will Wizards Support Paper Magic?
    I have had no issue with card stock since Dominaria. I have Amonkhet cards that are super duper warped, even right out of the pack. This was doubly true for foil cards. My cards since Dominaria have been really straight and nice, even the foils.

    Standard attendance and interest is down because Kaladesh warped Standard. Period, end of story. Standard just was not as fun as it used to be. I would also argue that Standard suffered mightily under WotC's desire to constantly push limited over constructed. I definitely think the addition of the Play Design team will help balance things out and eventually return Standard to its former glory. Having said that, it could also very well be that Standard is also suffering from an increased interest in Modern and Commander, both of which seem to be gaining a lot of steam over the last few years.

    WotC will not get rid of Paper Magic any time soon, they do not have a viable vehicle to deliver online Magic to the masses. Sure WotC earns more money from Magic Online than it does from Paper Magic but no one wants to sit down and watch Magic Online. It is clunk and tired, forever trapped i nthe aestetics of the early 2000's. Arena has the potential to blow Magic up online but who knows if it will pan out. Paper Magic is a loss leader (well, not a loss since Paper Magic is still profitable but you know what I mean). Paper magic draws a lot of people into the hobby and gets them playing. Even if they migrate to online, I think most people would have started either directly or tangentially (watching people play) paper magic. In the future, streaming Magic Arena may change that but for now Paper Magic has a much deeper and wider reach.

    Quote from Melkor »
    Wizards doesn't give a damn about the players, they remind us of that every chance they get. The card quality, all good cards being mythics, etc. That said, I don't think they will get rid of paper Magic. they know plenty of people, myself included will never bother with online. I will play in person as much as I can, I will buy old cards on the secondary market, I will play FNM if it still exists, but if I cannot buy a physical box, for all intents and purposes to Wizards, I will have stopped playing the game.


    The reason so many good cards are mythics is because WotC's primary goals are to appeal card shops who buy heaps of cases, rip them all open and then sell the individual cards to us, the consumers. Making ideal cards for constructed Mythic means those retailers have to crack more packs to get enough stock. Card sellers are the whales that keep paper magic afloat these days.

    WotC also cares a lot more about Drafting than constructed because Drafting incentivizes players to crack way more packs than they otherwise would be willing to crack. Big, splashy cards often warp a drafting environment. WotC has to include big, bomb cards that are good for constructed (or else card sellers will not buy as much) but they also do not want those bomb cards to warp too many draft experiences. The only way to do that is to make those bomb cards rarer to crack (hence mythic rare).

    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on Coldsnap Appreciation Thread (Yes, Really)
    I loved Coldsnap limited, and Standard when Coldsnap was legal. So much fun. Easily one of my favorite sets ever.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on [[Official]] Reserved List Discussion
    Quote from FreezingPoint »
    Maybe Wizards will say something about the RL when Magic turns 30?

    Idiot's Dual
    Land - Plains Swamp
    When ~ enters the battlefield, you gain 2 life.
    When ~ leaves the battlefield, you lose 2 life.

    That or swap the order or life gain and loss.


    How often do lands exit the battlefield? Not super often. So now you are gaining to life off a fetchable dual land that does not come into play tapped. That's crazy good.

    There's no way to designed not-functional-but-effectively-is reprint for a dual land that does not simply mean those with the old dual lands are not effectively doubling the number of dual lands they have in their decks.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on Big Creatures
    You need spells that remove your opponent's creatures. You can bounce them back to their hand, kill them outright, permanently stop them from attacking or blocking, or exile them. You could also start using land destruction spells to destroy his ability to summon big creatures. You could also run a deck with lots of burn spells. You could also run a blue deck filled to the brim with counter spells.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on [[Official]] Reserved List Discussion
    Quote from BlueTronFTW »
    Quote from EvincarCrovax »
    I've never come across any player that was for the reserve list. It seems to be mostly the investors who want it and they are not important for the game. Actually not only are they unimportant they are detrimental, driving up prices, doing buyouts and hoarding cards.

    WOTC just needs to smarten up and get rid of it already.



    Yeah those bolded items that you hate so much have another name in economics: generating demand. If only players bought the cards, WOTC sales would be far lower. Collectors also buy singles and sealed product. They are one demographic to which WOTC sells.

    People bought boxes of MM17 just to sit on them for three years and resell at a profit. WOTC doesn't really care why someone buys the box or case, just that they bought it. And honestly, collectors often have way more cash than players.


    No, WotC's demographic are stores, be they brick and mortar or online.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on So was there just no new art for Commander 18?
    Did C17 have any new art for reprinted cards?
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on [[Official]] Reserved List Discussion
    Quote from NierAutomata »
    I hope that Wizards never abolishes the reserve list.

    I played through the chronicles disaster. The problem with the reserve list is that people can only see the most immediate thing blocking the path of picking up their desirable cards. What they fail to see is that the reserve list is a big reason why the cards are desirable in the first place.

    Chronicles came out in 1995. 23 years ago.
    You can still see the legacy of the damage Chronicles caused today.
    This is a listing of Arcades Sabboth, Chronicles version. 4 for $2.20. A playset for $2.20!
    23 years ago, prior to the reprint, in 1995, Arcaddes Sabboth went for about $40. How many of you remember that?
    Only now has the price of Arcaddes Sabboth English Legends recovered its price.

    I used Arcaddes Sabboth as an example, but you can look at the rest of the trash here.
    http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Search/Default.aspx?page=0&set=[%22Chronicles%22]

    How many of yall are clamoring to collect these?

    My old magic collection is littered with junk chronicles. Prior to Chronicles, every kid coveted the elder dragon-the most powerful creatures in magic at the time. After the reprint, no one wanted it. Or perhaps more accurately, we wanted it. We got it. Elder dragons were about $5 after the reprint and then said meh. And went on to do other things in life. We quit magic, finished school, read comics, passed on magic for the dozens of other fun things mtg has always competed with.

    The reserve list creates the scarcity responsible for the desirability of mtg in the first place.

    Even today, the cards of chronicles are mostly junk with a few exceptions that have gained notable value--blood moon, concordant crossroads, etc.
    Chronicles didn't do it alone however. That same year, 4th edition also reprinted a ton of old cards from antiquities and legends. The real issue though was that the damage was done.

    After seeing some of the most coveted cards reprinted, MTG lost its desirability as a collectible.

    Once mtg loses it's desirability, people wake up. They realize they don't want to spend 3 bucks a pack. They realizes it's just another game.
    And if it's just another game with no collectible value, then its a ridiculously expensive form of entertainment that wont compete favorably with the thousands of other forms of entertainment.


    1. The Elder Dragons were coveted because they were rare, not because they were uber powerful. Nicol Bolas is the only one who is playable. I would rather field a Shivan Dragon then pretty much any of the OG Elder Dragons.

    2. Most people just want access to the good cards, so they can play eternal formats in print. No one cares about the junk rares that are only valuable due to artificial scarcity.

    3. Look at Hearthstone. There is no collectivity in that game. You get cards to play cards. When they rotate out, you stop playing with them. Hearthstone makes a billion dollars a year. The argument that people only play Magic due to the investment opportunities is silly.

    4. The original versions of cards will ALWAYS hold better value than newer versions, especially if older versions had small print runs.

    Regardless, it is probably easier for WotC to just make cards like the new Battlebond lands, which are functional reprints of Reserved List cards but limited to one type of play.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on Full spoiler up
    Quote from Dontrike »
    I really feel like WotC should not have revealed the deck themes in that video. I think a lot of people latched on to that idea and let their imaginations get the best of them. They should have just revealed some art and left it at that. Then, the next week, start the previews.

    Problem is that with the Jund deck, and even the Esper one, if you can't call it the "Land deck" then what do you call it? That's my biggest issue. If you can't call it that then what is the deck? Jund and Esper just seem like....well a Jund and Esper deck with no real synergies nor cohesion.

    Bant? Enchantments, easily
    U/R? It deals with artifacts, but also has a token subtheme.

    You can call these two decks what they are, but for Jund and Esper apparently they really aren't what we were told, but instead they are.....?


    Jund and Esper good stuff?
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
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