Daze vs. Miscalculation vs. Arcane Denial vs. Memory Lapse vs. Forbid vs. Mana Leak vs. Force Spike vs. Negate
at 405 the only 2 I don't run are Daze and Negate. I would run Daze over Negate myself. The rest I would probably run at even the smallest of cubes unless your cube has a different design than most other cubes on here. My cube is 405 right now just for reference. When my cube went from 360 to 405 I think Arcane Denial is the card that I found room for. Hope that helps you make a decision.
I really like the design of this card, and I really hate the mana cost. Not sure what the chance of this getting out on turn 4 is, but unless your fixing is really good, it seems like it won't come down until a few turns later, during which time you won't want to be casting your spells, but if you do get it out, it's cool that you can sort of go off with spells left in your hand since you can essentially cast any 1 mana red spells for free. Ultimately though I think this is good in a constructed card, and only decent in cubes and probably not the best choice for most cubes.
None of its abilities seem that great to me, but it is doing so many different things, it might get there for some medium size cubes.
Looks to be great in wildfire decks since it has 5 toughness, and benefits from your lands in your graveyards.
For those starting to build a lands matter theme or archetype this can play a role that way as well, also plays well into tokens since you can give your team haste and +1/+0 later in the game. The Looting plays well into any spells matter theme and is a decent reanimator target since you can start digging for other spells or creatures. Maybe not the best with through the breach, but plays pretty well with sneak attack since you can ditch excess lands and useless creatures to dig for the next few creatures you want to cheat into play.
All in all does not seem to be a rockstar in any specific deck, but it seems to have useful effects for most of the red decks provided you can swallow the RRR.
Am I missing something, I don't think this is very good.
Her first ability in cube probably does very little other than give her a counter,
Her second ability puts 2 1/1's on the board but they can't protect her, and her third ability while powerful, you still have to have the open mana to do so and there is a good chance she will come down, -2 her cast a spell from the graveyard, and then she will die the next turn. As a ceiling she will be able to do it 1 more time. I would be more interested in this if the tokens survived at least, but as is, seems really bad unless you are really deep on tokens or something.
Not saying this is going to be a staple or anything, but it deserves some testing at the least. This card can give red control decks a very versatile card. it is an answer to aggro decks as a sweeper, midrange decks by taking out there biggest threat. (for example there are only 9 creatures that she can't come into play and immediately shoot down. all 9 of these creatures cost more mana than Chandra). Against control decks, being un-counterable and having inevitability means your opponents have to take an active role once she comes down.
The overall power level of the card is only decent, but the flexibility on this card is really high and might allow her to make a cut into mid to larger cubes though.
This suffers from the problem where it does way too many things. A seven mana dude that Wildfires on ETB and survives would be cubeable as-is, even with a relatively middling body. Getting a loot four on top of that means this realistically would have to cost around nine mana. Getting the ability to also cast it as an okay on-curve body AND as a body with looting at every cost-point in between 3 and 7 means it's doing way too much in one package.
.
7 might be a little cheap, 9 feels like to much though. Ugin costs 8 generic and I don't think this is better than ugin.
The loot effect at higher values is a lot weaker since you probably don't have 4 cards in hand to loot away, it probably plays out that you get to keep 1 or 2 of those cards. In addition, whatever cards you do keep, won't be big and splashy since you are now down up to 4 lands, and I find even most of my wildfire decks often play at least a couple lands
Hmmm. Your card inspired me to create my own version.
I'm not an expert on oracle text etc, but here it goes
1RR
Legendary Human Wizard
3/2
Kicker X
When * ETB, you may Draw X cards then discard X cards.
If X is 4 or more * deals 4 damage to each other creature, and each player sacrifices 4 lands.
Allows for a beat down path, Spells matter, Graveyard shinanegens, Lands matter theme, extra wildfire varient, that while it costs 7, you get to loot, and keep a creature in play. Seems really powerful, and wouldn't go into a standard set, but maybe a commander product or something
My cube will starting making it's way to 450 soon but is at 405 right now.
Lands:
Canopy Cycle - Not going to cut anything. Probably just add for now and be at 410. I am not sure what I am going to do about uneven amounts of mana fixing right now. I don't think I am going to cut any manlands though for these. and just be a little off balance for a bit and see how it plays out.
Prismatic Vista - pithing Needle. I have three of these effects, Phyrexian Revoker is strapped to a body which I like, and Sorcerous Spyglass is easier to use. I often cube with people who don't know all the cards and so having the option to look at the opponents hand makes this card much more playable for them. 3 of these effects always seems like 1/2 card to many at my cube size.
Not sure if these will be my cut's for sure, but it's what I am currently contemplating. GGGGG Deep Forest Hermit > Kalonian Hydra - not sure what to say, but this really makes me hope they print a 4 drop that is squirrel themed good enough for cube. Even if it is a master of the wild hunt variant that creates 2 1/1 squirrel's would be really fun to have a small squirrel tribal.
HexDrinker > Sylvan Advocate. once I get closer to 450 I am going to add more Green aggro support back in and Sylvan Advocate will come back in at that time.
RRRRR
Seasoned Pyromancer > Hanweir Garrison These cards feel close to me, but pyromancer feels like he can still support an aggo plan, while also contributing to the beat down plan. With the recent addition of Krenko, Tin Street Kingpin I think having a card that might be slightly worse in the beat down plan, but has more utility overall is a worthwhile trade.
BBBBB - this is probably the hardest section for me to find cut's. I just like all the black cards. This is the change I am thinking right now though.
Force of Despair - going to keep an eye on this one. It may find a place, especially if we continue to get armies in a can.
Falkenrath has the weakness of only being able to discard a single card, which sometimes is all you need, but if your reanimate creature is removed, it can be rough trying to assemble the combo again. The more aggressive decks around here don't use it as much. I really like the card design wise, but alas... As far as Spawn of Mayhem over strike leader I really like giving black some aggressive options with a good density of flyers. I considered Vampire Nighthawk for a while, but having multiple flyers that can hit, and with life gain being pretty scarce in black is really important.
As far as Yawgmoth goes, he seems to be able to do so many different things that cutting a 187 creature for him seemed ok to do. the 187's are all so fun, but increasing the variety of threats is a trade I am willing to make.
UUUUU Urza, Lord High Artificer > Arcane Savant Arcane Savant is always fun, but is awkward when you play sealed, and it seems like every time someone picks this, 1/2 through the draft you forget about it, and realize you should have been considering cards that are off color. I will probably hold off on this one for $ reasons, and to make sure he finds a home and doesn't just spin wheels.
WWWWW Winds of Abandon > going to keep an eye on this. In theory I like Declaration in stone more but I will see how it does for others. Force of Virtue > also going to keep an eye on this. My cube doesn't have any anthems right now that are not strapped to a creature. being able to get highly aggressive with this might make it really playable. This may have to wait until I hit 450 though.
WUBGR Wrenn and Six > Sarkhan Vol - I will miss the last Fires support card in cube for now, but Sarkhan Vol, while up to this point my favorite RG PW, the haste ability always felt like I only ever wanted to pay 3 mana for him. In terms of cube design, they really needed to give Wren his first ability and ultimate, and a static, creatures you control gain haste.
Ultimately I think Wren will become a cube staple, at least for cubes with a land matter / Fetches go. The ability to go up to 4 loyalty on turn 2 is really powerful. The only cards in my cube that can take him down on turn 3 by themselves are Wild Mongrel / Noose Constrictor (and discarding 2 cards).
Doesn't make it into my cube, but not far off at all.
I think this card is quite insane. and yet it's sad, because if you ask yourself what else this would have to do inorder to make it into the guild slot, I am not even sure, it would probably have to have the same casting cost as a black lotus at this point
That is too bad. I wonder if we could host a similar form on manaburn.org? It's slowly becoming as good or better than cube tutor. I reached out to him and let's see if we get a response. I also found a few tools that allow for website forums to be easily generated. They cost a little bit to use as a monthly fee which is out of my budget right now, but it could be a start. If we want to make this happen, I am sure we can find a way to find a place. I really like having forums that are easy to search, and have old information on them compared to say reddit, where after 1 week the thread seems to get lost for ever and is way less organized.
Edit: Update So Far. Manaburn said they would be willing to do it if there is some value to it. Doesn't mean he will, if it's a place you would like to move the forums, maybe comment below to show your support of the community?
I think you are missing the fact that he can be a key part of multiple different decks to get them rolling, but it's not like you need 2 specific cards for him to be playable. He works with lot's of different cards in different ways.
Slightly off topic, but are Talismans/Signets better than the other generic 2-drop mana rocks? I'm not running any of them right now, but I am running Mind Stone, Coldsteel Heart, Everflowing Chalice, and Sphere of the Suns. At 360, it seems really difficult to find space for 10 2-drop mana rocks. Am I making a mistake?
At 360 I prefer the generic 2 mana cards. You can always argue both ways, but I think at 350, running 10 of them is 2 many for most cube designs.
Really cool card, with lot's of ways to abuse it. I might try this in place of skinrender. Both cards can affect things with the -1 counters, and skin renderer is obviously good with ways to flicker it, but all the different ways to abuse this guy if he sticks around make him a more interesting card. I will miss the art of Skin render and I like all the phyrexian foils in cube with the set symbol.
Even without a dedicated aristocrats theme this guy is interesting. Once you get a few creatures out as well, it makes it really hard for your opponent to do any combat math if you have mana open. plus I am really tempted to try and build a UB creature based deck around him. most of our UB decks are either artifact based, graveyard / reanimate based or straight control.
Also, it will feel really good when your opponent goes turn 3 Kitchen Finks, and you go turn 4, cast this guy, and add a counter to finks
at 405 the only 2 I don't run are Daze and Negate. I would run Daze over Negate myself. The rest I would probably run at even the smallest of cubes unless your cube has a different design than most other cubes on here. My cube is 405 right now just for reference. When my cube went from 360 to 405 I think Arcane Denial is the card that I found room for. Hope that helps you make a decision.
None of its abilities seem that great to me, but it is doing so many different things, it might get there for some medium size cubes.
Looks to be great in wildfire decks since it has 5 toughness, and benefits from your lands in your graveyards.
For those starting to build a lands matter theme or archetype this can play a role that way as well, also plays well into tokens since you can give your team haste and +1/+0 later in the game. The Looting plays well into any spells matter theme and is a decent reanimator target since you can start digging for other spells or creatures. Maybe not the best with through the breach, but plays pretty well with sneak attack since you can ditch excess lands and useless creatures to dig for the next few creatures you want to cheat into play.
All in all does not seem to be a rockstar in any specific deck, but it seems to have useful effects for most of the red decks provided you can swallow the
RRR.
Her first ability in cube probably does very little other than give her a counter,
Her second ability puts 2 1/1's on the board but they can't protect her, and her third ability while powerful, you still have to have the open mana to do so and there is a good chance she will come down, -2 her cast a spell from the graveyard, and then she will die the next turn. As a ceiling she will be able to do it 1 more time. I would be more interested in this if the tokens survived at least, but as is, seems really bad unless you are really deep on tokens or something.
Not saying this is going to be a staple or anything, but it deserves some testing at the least. This card can give red control decks a very versatile card. it is an answer to aggro decks as a sweeper, midrange decks by taking out there biggest threat. (for example there are only 9 creatures that she can't come into play and immediately shoot down. all 9 of these creatures cost more mana than Chandra). Against control decks, being un-counterable and having inevitability means your opponents have to take an active role once she comes down.
The overall power level of the card is only decent, but the flexibility on this card is really high and might allow her to make a cut into mid to larger cubes though.
7 might be a little cheap, 9 feels like to much though. Ugin costs 8 generic and I don't think this is better than ugin.
The loot effect at higher values is a lot weaker since you probably don't have 4 cards in hand to loot away, it probably plays out that you get to keep 1 or 2 of those cards. In addition, whatever cards you do keep, won't be big and splashy since you are now down up to 4 lands, and I find even most of my wildfire decks often play at least a couple lands
also, cards that do to much, you mean like Urza, Lord High Artificer
I'm not an expert on oracle text etc, but here it goes
1RR
Legendary Human Wizard
3/2
Kicker X
When * ETB, you may Draw X cards then discard X cards.
If X is 4 or more * deals 4 damage to each other creature, and each player sacrifices 4 lands.
Allows for a beat down path, Spells matter, Graveyard shinanegens, Lands matter theme, extra wildfire varient, that while it costs 7, you get to loot, and keep a creature in play. Seems really powerful, and wouldn't go into a standard set, but maybe a commander product or something
Lands:
Canopy Cycle - Not going to cut anything. Probably just add for now and be at 410. I am not sure what I am going to do about uneven amounts of mana fixing right now. I don't think I am going to cut any manlands though for these. and just be a little off balance for a bit and see how it plays out.
Prismatic Vista - pithing Needle. I have three of these effects, Phyrexian Revoker is strapped to a body which I like, and Sorcerous Spyglass is easier to use. I often cube with people who don't know all the cards and so having the option to look at the opponents hand makes this card much more playable for them. 3 of these effects always seems like 1/2 card to many at my cube size.
Not sure if these will be my cut's for sure, but it's what I am currently contemplating.
GGGGG
Deep Forest Hermit > Kalonian Hydra - not sure what to say, but this really makes me hope they print a 4 drop that is squirrel themed good enough for cube. Even if it is a master of the wild hunt variant that creates 2 1/1 squirrel's would be really fun to have a small squirrel tribal.
HexDrinker > Sylvan Advocate. once I get closer to 450 I am going to add more Green aggro support back in and Sylvan Advocate will come back in at that time.
RRRRR
Seasoned Pyromancer > Hanweir Garrison These cards feel close to me, but pyromancer feels like he can still support an aggo plan, while also contributing to the beat down plan. With the recent addition of Krenko, Tin Street Kingpin I think having a card that might be slightly worse in the beat down plan, but has more utility overall is a worthwhile trade.
BBBBB - this is probably the hardest section for me to find cut's. I just like all the black cards. This is the change I am thinking right now though.
Plague Engineer > Heir of Falkenrath
Yawgmoth, Thran Physician > Nekrataal
Spawn of Mayhem > Mardu Strike Leader or Vampire Nighthawk
Force of Despair - going to keep an eye on this one. It may find a place, especially if we continue to get armies in a can.
Falkenrath has the weakness of only being able to discard a single card, which sometimes is all you need, but if your reanimate creature is removed, it can be rough trying to assemble the combo again. The more aggressive decks around here don't use it as much. I really like the card design wise, but alas... As far as Spawn of Mayhem over strike leader I really like giving black some aggressive options with a good density of flyers. I considered Vampire Nighthawk for a while, but having multiple flyers that can hit, and with life gain being pretty scarce in black is really important.
As far as Yawgmoth goes, he seems to be able to do so many different things that cutting a 187 creature for him seemed ok to do. the 187's are all so fun, but increasing the variety of threats is a trade I am willing to make.
UUUUU
Urza, Lord High Artificer > Arcane Savant Arcane Savant is always fun, but is awkward when you play sealed, and it seems like every time someone picks this, 1/2 through the draft you forget about it, and realize you should have been considering cards that are off color. I will probably hold off on this one for $ reasons, and to make sure he finds a home and doesn't just spin wheels.
WWWWW
Winds of Abandon > going to keep an eye on this. In theory I like Declaration in stone more but I will see how it does for others.
Force of Virtue > also going to keep an eye on this. My cube doesn't have any anthems right now that are not strapped to a creature. being able to get highly aggressive with this might make it really playable. This may have to wait until I hit 450 though.
WUBGR
Wrenn and Six > Sarkhan Vol - I will miss the last Fires support card in cube for now, but Sarkhan Vol, while up to this point my favorite RG PW, the haste ability always felt like I only ever wanted to pay 3 mana for him. In terms of cube design, they really needed to give Wren his first ability and ultimate, and a static, creatures you control gain haste.
Ultimately I think Wren will become a cube staple, at least for cubes with a land matter / Fetches go. The ability to go up to 4 loyalty on turn 2 is really powerful. The only cards in my cube that can take him down on turn 3 by themselves are Wild Mongrel / Noose Constrictor (and discarding 2 cards).
Nature's Chant > Forsake the Worldly - Card is an obvious inclusion. See it's thread for discussion of how to account for hybrids.
Well, not sure what your budget is, but prices are starting to come down really quickly.
Also, have you seen the art series cards? Not sure what you would do with them, but cube being so casual, you could use them as filler if needed.
I think this card is quite insane. and yet it's sad, because if you ask yourself what else this would have to do inorder to make it into the guild slot, I am not even sure, it would probably have to have the same casting cost as a black lotus at this point
Edit: Update So Far. Manaburn said they would be willing to do it if there is some value to it. Doesn't mean he will, if it's a place you would like to move the forums, maybe comment below to show your support of the community?
At 360 I prefer the generic 2 mana cards. You can always argue both ways, but I think at 350, running 10 of them is 2 many for most cube designs.
Even without a dedicated aristocrats theme this guy is interesting. Once you get a few creatures out as well, it makes it really hard for your opponent to do any combat math if you have mana open. plus I am really tempted to try and build a UB creature based deck around him. most of our UB decks are either artifact based, graveyard / reanimate based or straight control.
Also, it will feel really good when your opponent goes turn 3 Kitchen Finks, and you go turn 4, cast this guy, and add a counter to finks